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View Full Version : Possible suggestions for the 2v1 ganking problem....



ThePengwn
08-22-2015, 03:47 PM
I've been thinking a lot about the IGN video and how 2v1 battles work. I feel like there needs to be a system so that in a 2v1 situation, if the single person is very skilled, they can defend and WIN against the 2 players attacking them.


I'm thinking something along the lines of an "alert" so the single person is warned of an attack from behind while locked on another target, and is given the chance to block or dodge that attack.


I know in Chivalry, in a 2v1 situation, the single person gets murdered immediately and never saw it coming. In For Honor, with the lock on system, I feel like this could be an even BIGGER problem. And looking at the videos we've seen, it looks like a problem.


So if you are 1v1 against somebody, locked on to them, and one of their teammates approaches you from behind to gank an easy kill, I think the game should alert you and give you the chance to dodge or block that attack. Because it's not a sneak attack. It's a gank. There's no sneaking in this game. Then if the single player is successful in blocking/dodging, and they are skilled in the game, it should be possible for them to fight two guys at once using dodges and blocks, and even possibly win the 2v1 situation.
It's pretty clear that the game is going to be AMAZING in 1v1 battles, but I don't want to worry about getting ganked by the other person's teammate while locked on to him. Hopefully they have a system to help out with this, and even make it possible to win 2v1 battles.


Tldr: Need a way for the single person in a 2v1 battle to not only block or dodge attacks from both enemies, but also have a chance to WIN the battle.

Mr_Moonstone
08-22-2015, 06:32 PM
Take a closer look in the gameplay vids. There's a radar showing friendly and enemy player characters alike. Also all player characters have a marker always showing in which direction they are. My only concern for these markers is that they are on the outer border of the screen. It would be nice if we had the option to set them closer to the central hub.

In case of a gank I think the game fares pretty well like it is now. A situation like this requires fitting tactics: retreat, regroup, place yourself in a tight corridor to fight one enemy at a time (kind of like the spartans did in 300).

If these won't work then, and just then, there may be room to add a mechanic to slightly tip the scales.

Greets

ThePengwn
08-23-2015, 12:02 AM
I partially agree with the idea of retreating and regrouping if you are able to easily check the radar while concentrating on your opponent's stances and compensating for their movements.

But I also feel the game would benefit greatly if a player is VERY skilled (lots of practice) at blocking and countering they could POSSIBLY take on two players at once and win in an open area. I would love a system that could be mastered to do that. Only for a 2v1 option. For a 3v1 case, the lone person should rightly get murdered without much of a fight. :)

Altair_Snake
08-23-2015, 09:08 PM
The situation is much better than yu seem to think. Not only does the game let you know of opponent's trying to flank you, it gives you some "bonuses" so you can defend against flankers more easily.

* As you said, there are no sneak attacks. If a flanker surprise you, he will do normal damage. It won't be a 1-shot.

* The radar tells you of enemies' position.

* To parry a flanker, you need only put your stance in his direction, regardless of the direction of his attack.

* Right after you parry an attack, you automatically parry a following attack.

* If two attacks are almost simultaneous and you deflect the first one, you automaticlly dflect the second one, too, all in one motion.

* Guard Break moves (very useful in ganking) can be dodged and you are immune to them while you're attacking.

* You have some control over your footowork, while you are attacking. So, if you get an opnening to attack a guy, you can slightly circle away from the flanker, during your attacks.

So, I think very skilled players will have a chance. People just didn't have enough time with the game for there to be a big enough skill gap between players.

ThePengwn
08-25-2015, 12:13 AM
Awesome! I didn't know most of that info. I think that really about covers my concerns. You are right, with those tools a skilled player could win and that is what I was hoping for.

Thanks very much!!!!

Zercon.
08-26-2015, 08:06 PM
why would you leave your group? get some brains and listen to your group stay together and in 2 groups
let's don't dumb this game down... we can make it into a good E-sport game

MisterWillow
08-26-2015, 09:50 PM
why would you leave your group? get some brains and listen to your group stay together and in 2 groups
let's don't dumb this game down... we can make it into a good E-sport game

Because, in the context of the only mode we have knowledge of, if you pair off two-and-two, the chances are very slim for you controlling all the zones. You can cover more ground if you split up. It's just as sound a strategy as staying in groups, especially if you're good at defense and pick your strikes well. Between blocks, parries, dashes and guard breaks, it should be possible to win against two opponents if you properly combine them, and know when in combat to use them.

And in regard to E-sports, players that really grasp these mechanics and are able to fight effectively against two (or even more) opponents at once will be the most valued, famous, feared.

Zercon.
08-26-2015, 10:00 PM
Because, in the context of the only mode we have knowledge of, if you pair off two-and-two, the chances are very slim for you controlling all the zones. You can cover more ground if you split up. It's just as sound a strategy as staying in groups, especially if you're good at defense and pick your strikes well. Between blocks, parries, dashes and guard breaks, it should be possible to win against two opponents if you properly combine them, and know when in combat to use them.

And in regard to E-sports, players that really grasp these mechanics and are able to fight effectively against two (or even more) opponents at once will be the most valued, famous, feared.

yes people try this in most MOBA and they lose the match for their team going lone wolf it only helps your team to lose ///
you get points for holding areas and killing so just hold 2 of them ... then try for the 3'ed NEVER go at it as a lone wolf unless you like to lose all the time

MisterWillow
08-26-2015, 10:26 PM
yes people try this in most MOBA and they lose the match for their team going lone wolf it only helps your team to lose ///
you get points for holding areas and killing so just hold 2 of them ... then try for the 3'ed NEVER go at it as a lone wolf unless you like to lose all the time

Unless you're good enough with the combat mechanics that you can handle two opponents at once.

This isn't a MOBA. As far as we know, there aren't any AOE attacks (outside fourth level feats, which have huge cooldowns and you have to earn again if you die), or abilities that root someone to a spot (I don't know how that would work in context of the game world), or long-range attacks outside certain feats (which, again, you have to re-earn and have cooldowns). The combat is much different---focused on close-range dueling---the match mechanics are different (in the mode we've seen, anyway), and there really doesn't seem to be much in common other than the AI presence.

Willaguy2010
08-29-2015, 06:24 AM
I just got back from playing it at PAX, the 2v1 thing happens a few times, but my team was very communicative so we took advantage of the fact that there's two enemies distracted by one of our allies. If your in a 2v1 situation, it's best to run away or combine dodging with good blocking to distract the enemies. Not really an offensive thing that you could do, it would turn out pretty bad for the defender if he started trying to attack the offenders.

Edit: Also 3v1 really only happend once and that was in the center at A, it's a very bad thing for the attacking side as controlling the control points is the name of the game in Dominion. We would easily take C or B any time the enemy tried a 3v1.

Altair_Snake
08-29-2015, 06:46 PM
Some of us suspected as much. Cool to hear you confirm it. Thanks for sharing!