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HDinHB
08-18-2015, 10:52 PM
http://whatculture.com/gaming/assassins-creed-syndicate-8-major-overhauls-that-would-save-the-franchise.php


8 Lose The Open-World
7 Lose The Melee Combat
6 Remove Eagle Vision, Replace With A Reliable Map
5 Set The Whole Thing In The Present Day
4 Rebuild The Entire Animation System
3 Lose Character Abilities & Gadgets – Give Us Progression
2 More Mini-Games, But Make Them Worthwhile
1 Reboot The Series




What do you think?

8. While I agree this would certainly shake things up, eliminating the open world for tiny city-block sandboxes seems like a high price to pay. They could scale it back--I preferred several small cities like the first two games to the vast expanses of Rome or Paris, but I'm not sure how that would "save the franchise."

7. I don't see melee going away, but there are plenty of threads on AC combat. I don't have anything to add.

6. I don't see losing Eagle Vision altogether either. It's almost "iconic." But I wouldn't mind it going back to the simpler IFF system is used to be.

5. I always thought it should end this way, with the modern day gradually become a greater and greater part of the game until sometime in (what would have been) AC4 or AC5 would be all or mostly modern day, where Desmond, with all the bleeding-effect skills of his ancestors, would be a kick-*** Assassin, laying waste to Abstergo and culminating in amazing space-parkour as he frantically tries to disarm the POE satellite. Unfortunately, Ubi shoe-horned that grand vision into a not-as-good-as-it-should-have-been modern day in AC3, minus the space-parkour.

4. I completely agree with this part "There should be genuine accomplishment if you can make it all the way up some skyline-dominating tower, and also a sense of fear that if you’re not careful, you could fall off." I've missed that feeling for a long time.

3. He almost got this one completely right: "Why not keep the barest of essentials like climb-jumps or the aforementioned ledge-grabs (the assumption being the person we’re playing as has ‘learnt from the best’ and has a base level of athleticism), before unlocking the crazy new additions we’re seeing for Syndicate like going invisible or obtaining the grapple hook, after you’ve levelled up accordingly?" It sounds like at least Evie's "invisibility" will be a high-level skill, but I wouldn't mind if "climb-jumps" and "ledge-grabs" and some more advanced free-running skills took some skill. I never minded the "back-tracking" as it was done in the earlier games, but Edward and Arno had too much skill too soon. Arno started out the game being able to scamper up a church steeple and perform a leap of faith, but sitting on a bench was a skill that had to be unlocked?

2. I didn't play any of the mini-games in Rogue because there was no requirement to play them. I'm okay with that.

1. I don't think a reboot is required, but a little time off, a fresh look, and some sustantial tweaks could be enough. Especially a little time off--give the players a chance to reboot, to rediscover the tingly feelings of "I can't wait until the next AC game comes out."

SofaJockey
08-18-2015, 10:56 PM
I'd say no to 7 of those.
You don't save a franchise by throwing all of it away.

With the exception of a little 'time out'...

D.I.D.
08-18-2015, 11:38 PM
Going through the article one by one - all points are criticisms of the original writer, not the OP!

8. Interesting, but I would posit to AC that if you do this, Dishonored will kill you because they've won that already and D2 will stomp it into the ground.

7. Yeah, I'm with this one. The whole 'choice' thing is such a nonsense when 'choosing' to fight means 'winning very quickly and easily' and 'choosing' to avoid fighting is the decision to walk away from a fight you can easily win. I loved the extra difficulty in Unity and the way they'd forced people to work a lot more for their victories, but if Syndicate really is easier as some people have said then I'd like that to change. We don't need every assassin to be the same, for one thing. Give us one who is phenomenal at, say, climbing but melée is not his/her forté. I would love to see what that would do to the game, but of course strategic use of lights, stealth and general movement must be improved first.

6. I'd be interested in giving that a try too. I think we ought to get a visual cue in keeping with the circumstances, in response to sound. If there's an NPC walking normally on the floor above, I'd see a gentle fuzz of light moving across the ceiling. If a character talks or shouts, I'd see a stronger image briefly, showing me the person but quickly fading away when they go quiet. Forcing the NPCs to panic or follow lures would become tactical in providing us with glimmers of reasonably acquired info.

5. Ehhh, someone doesn't know much about history, hasn't noticed the series going both backwards and forwards in time...

4. Yeah, I really don't think this person is giving enough credit to the animators either. Also overestimating somewhat how unique these movements can possibly be. There's a good range across the series, and I've never had a problem with reuse tbh.

3. Disagree with this too. It's great if your game is built around inaccessible features that force you to make full use of one area before you can access the next, but I don't see how starting every game with good skills is any more monotonous than being forced through a tedious progression every time. These games come out every year.

2. *shrug* Barrel-scraping to get your 10 points [oops- eight points!], I think. Hardly "save the franchise" material, this, but if they want it, whatever.

1. I've suggested this one recently myself, but I don't think "reboot" is a magic bullet. For all our complaints, the series is still good if flawed. I'm starting to think it would be fine to keep rattling these slightly broken games out for a while until they've learned everything they can, and only then do the reboot - for a strict number of games, say five or six, where the story and game structure is 100% mapped out before any other work begins. The tightest AC games and story they can possibly make, and then gone, no extensions.

EmptyCrustacean
08-19-2015, 12:03 AM
I didn't go into the article because I read number 8 and laughed. Lose the open world? Ridiculous.

strigoi1958
08-19-2015, 12:18 AM
8. I kinda like the vastness of the city but the frontier and smaller towns were good... as long as I have somewhere to explore I'm good... a smaller area might lower the requirement specs and make a lot of people who cannot afford to upgrade happy. But I'm not against having cutscenes or animations while new areas are loaded... even though I enjoy saving those few precious seconds at my age ;)

7. As an assassin I always thought the idea is to get in and out unseen... so melee should be a last resort... but early games with chain kills were easy but some find the melee in Unity too difficult.... as many have asked before ... maybe an option to make the game easy to hard with some things able to be made easier.

6. the eagle vision is... well the thing that sets assassins apart from the normal people... but again an option to turn it off would help some... personally I used it to watch (and admire) fellow assassins inside buildings while I was outside... but it is not compulsory to use it... we can choose to not use it.

5. I've got/ had loads of MD shooters and there are loads around now... we don't need another one really.... I like the fact that AC is set in various historical times and can jump around... I'd still like to see an AC game with access to several protagonists and time periods via the animus... going back to play as Ezio or Edward or even anyone they came into contact with....

4. I like the animations but I never say no to anything new.

3. I like to progress as the game progresses..

2. mini games... I didn't mind them but I couldn't beat one game AC3 fanorama or something... and I NEVER say no to any free extras because someone deserves them and wants them.

1. I don't know about a reboot but I'd like to go back to the region near where it all began...

Altair1789
08-19-2015, 12:29 AM
The person who made this must have mistaken the word "save" with "replace"

100% NO to all of those things. "Losing open world" is particularly crazy

Sorrosyss
08-19-2015, 01:06 AM
Fun article. Here's my views;

8. Lose open world? Then it would be ridiculously linear. Open world as a genre is very popular, as the amount of top titles at E3 within this category proved.

7. So, replace melee with guns? Then it becomes like the plethora of other shooting games out there.

6. Eagle vision is fine, though I wish it would go back to being darker and just showing the auras.

5. The historical tourism is part of the franchise. You can't just cut it out like that. That being said, if the multiplayer portion of the game is expanded to a persistent space, the modern day makes sense if we play as ourselves.

4. For the most part I have no issue with the animations, save for some of the combat ones. And that Syndicate's looks too fast.

3. The progression cycle was always the same really. Whether you were purchasing armor in AC2, or abilities in Unity, it has always been about incremental improvements to your stats.

2. Previous games had more mini games it can't be denied. Card games are the obvious ones to include.

1. I don't want to see a reboot whilst the Juno and Eve subplots are unconcluded. After that we can talk. :p


As others have said, the majority of overhauls would fundamentally change the game to the point that it may as well be a rebranded IP. Changing too much can foolishly alienate your core player base that return for a similar experience each year. Reinventing the wheel is not necessarily needed. Just a smooth road without any holes to fall down. *nod* :p

VestigialLlama4
08-19-2015, 05:15 AM
Here are better overhauls.

1. Buy What!Culture and permanently bury that site and purge all bad advice from the Internet.
2. Stop listening to faddish fan requests.
3. Make a game that your developers are interested in making.
4. Make a good game. Write a good story, improve the gameplay and understand what made the franchise so special.

That's it. There's nothing else to do.

Jessigirl2013
08-19-2015, 01:17 PM
http://whatculture.com/gaming/assassins-creed-syndicate-8-major-overhauls-that-would-save-the-franchise.php


8 Lose The Open-World
7 Lose The Melee Combat
6 Remove Eagle Vision, Replace With A Reliable Map
5 Set The Whole Thing In The Present Day
4 Rebuild The Entire Animation System
3 Lose Character Abilities & Gadgets – Give Us Progression
2 More Mini-Games, But Make Them Worthwhile
1 Reboot The Series




What do you think?

8. While I agree this would certainly shake things up, eliminating the open world for tiny city-block sandboxes seems like a high price to pay. They could scale it back--I preferred several small cities like the first two games to the vast expanses of Rome or Paris, but I'm not sure how that would "save the franchise."

7. I don't see melee going away, but there are plenty of threads on AC combat. I don't have anything to add.

6. I don't see losing Eagle Vision altogether either. It's almost "iconic." But I wouldn't mind it going back to the simpler IFF system is used to be.

5. I always thought it should end this way, with the modern day gradually become a greater and greater part of the game until sometime in (what would have been) AC4 or AC5 would be all or mostly modern day, where Desmond, with all the bleeding-effect skills of his ancestors, would be a kick-*** Assassin, laying waste to Abstergo and culminating in amazing space-parkour as he frantically tries to disarm the POE satellite. Unfortunately, Ubi shoe-horned that grand vision into a not-as-good-as-it-should-have-been modern day in AC3, minus the space-parkour.

4. I completely agree with this part "There should be genuine accomplishment if you can make it all the way up some skyline-dominating tower, and also a sense of fear that if you’re not careful, you could fall off." I've missed that feeling for a long time.

3. He almost got this one completely right: "Why not keep the barest of essentials like climb-jumps or the aforementioned ledge-grabs (the assumption being the person we’re playing as has ‘learnt from the best’ and has a base level of athleticism), before unlocking the crazy new additions we’re seeing for Syndicate like going invisible or obtaining the grapple hook, after you’ve levelled up accordingly?" It sounds like at least Evie's "invisibility" will be a high-level skill, but I wouldn't mind if "climb-jumps" and "ledge-grabs" and some more advanced free-running skills took some skill. I never minded the "back-tracking" as it was done in the earlier games, but Edward and Arno had too much skill too soon. Arno started out the game being able to scamper up a church steeple and perform a leap of faith, but sitting on a bench was a skill that had to be unlocked?

2. I didn't play any of the mini-games in Rogue because there was no requirement to play them. I'm okay with that.

1. I don't think a reboot is required, but a little time off, a fresh look, and some sustantial tweaks could be enough. Especially a little time off--give the players a chance to reboot, to rediscover the tingly feelings of "I can't wait until the next AC game comes out."

I do love MD! :cool:
But I disagree with everything else.
Apart from the character abilities and "skills" Unity ruined AC with that.:mad:

Open world is what AC is based on.
I agree it doesn't need to be as big, its where Unity went wrong IMO.
Unity was just quantity over quality.;)

D.I.D.
08-19-2015, 02:49 PM
I do love MD! :cool:
But I disagree with everything else.
Apart from the character abilities and "skills" Unity ruined AC with that.:mad:

Open world is what AC is based on.
I agree it doesn't need to be as big, its where Unity went wrong IMO.
Unity was just quantity over quality.;)

Really? I disagree with this, since I find it hard to see how Unity did not increase both quantity and quality in its world, and I'd love to see more cities that large and even larger. Paris was gorgeous, much prettier than any environment we've had until now, and I loved how much of it there was. If we were talking missions, I'd agree wholeheartedly - too many of those!

strigoi1958
08-20-2015, 08:24 PM
I think that Unity in an effort to give value for money may and I do emphasis may :D have had a few too many things to collect. In all honesty it gave me the opportunity to see every part of the city.... every decayed building, cobbled street, water damaged walls in stark contrast to the opulence in other areas.

It allowed me to explore in order to get to difficult collectibles.... the initial map was awash with icons but as nice as it was... and I truly am grateful for the size and work that went into Unity I wouldn't have minded a few less collectibles. Unity does have quality and quantity but I like the harder to find and obtain collectibles more than the amount. Especially as I'm compelled to get every one;)

I too wouldn't mind eagle vision returning to its earlier state as Sorrosyss has said...

and in my previous point 5 accessing anyone any protagonist touches (by virtue of DNA contact) would allow us to use the animus to its fullest ... we could play as Sofia, Yusuf, Elise, Mario Auditore or Charles Lee, old friends,enemies and new ones... I would like to see the animus being used more... this would mean more MD and guidance from the first civilisation and allow for a plot to travel across time and the world... sometimes chasing a character for a strand of hair, a drop of blood or any way to access their DNA and enter their memories in the search for artifacts...
It might even involve a glitch in the animus where past and present protagonists meet with the first civilisation and become more aware (somewhat like desmond and Ezio)....

I think it offers up far more storylines and even if playing as Cesare Borgia we catch a cameo glimpse of Ezio, it would be nice... kind of like going back home after a long time away:D

king-hailz
08-21-2015, 08:21 AM
I agree with everything. With the reboot, I think they could easily push the modern day setting way in the future and give us hints on what happened in the past when Juno took over the world. It would be so easy to lose this modern day and start all over again... forgetting g about stupid sages and crappy phoenix projects!

BananaBlighter
08-21-2015, 11:11 AM
I really want to know what was going through the writer's mind when they wrote 'to SAVE the franchise'. AC just needs some time to realise what made it special and focus on enhancing those features. I personally wouldn't find this new IP that they seem to be talking about fun.

SteelCity999
08-21-2015, 06:45 PM
Stop obsessing about the pillars of AC. You keep hearing that over and over again and yet all it does make for repetitive gameplay. Take a chance Ubi! Let the assassin do something different to peak interest.

Hans684
08-21-2015, 08:21 PM
This article is as bad as Bellec's suggestion of "saving" the brotherhood.

Sushiglutton
08-22-2015, 04:44 PM
Here are my thoughts:


8) I def think Ubi should try out a linear AC game, similar in structur to say TLOU. It should be a globetrotting adventure spanning a few eras (this is one of the benefits of the linear structure, you are not as tied to a (handful of) specific place(s). The cutscenes in Unity are beautiful and I think Ubi are good at cinematic feel. A linear game would allow them to explore it more fully. It may also make it easier to focus on improving the mechanics. At the same time a linear structure automatically loses a lot of the OW-fluff that's very harmful to the feel of the game imo.


7) I enjoy melee combat in games more than stealth, so this is not something I want per se. That said Ubi has butchered the execution so many times now. At this time you have to question if the talent to design melee combat exists at the company. If not, it could potentially be better to cut it (then again, the stealth AI has been horrendous too). I still think that if Ubi can find the right people with a mandate to build a slightly more complex combat with some skill elements and a lot of style, they could succeeed. So this point is a no for now.



6)The eagle vision in Syndicate is one of the silliest things I have ever seen. What the heck are the designers smoking? Some moments in the Evie demo the screen is so cluttered that I can't possibly think it will help casual gamers. I thought EV had the best look in AC3, super cool. Then AC4 introduced the see-through thing and I wish Ubi went back from that. EV is very strongly conected to the Assassin identity. It's a potentially useful mechanic if done with moderation (pretty much all stealth games have some version of it). Removing it doesn't make a ton of sense and won't save the franchise.


5) Would not play a present day game.


4) I'm no expert on animation systems (either lol), so not sure what to think. I do believe there should be a bit more interaction in the parkour. Think TR2013 had some neat ideas with the axe. It wasn't difficult, but it made you feel involved, something AC3/4 failed pretty hard at with their "hold the stick, we do the rest"-mentality. I would prefer if these extra interactions were not based around gadgets. For me pure parkour is one of the most appealing aspects of the franchise.


3) This is a minor thing in my book. What I don't want is for AC to go too much RPG in terms of stat based upgrades and equipment/loot flooding. Keep it simple. Like in point 6 I also prefer to give the assassin more physical skills (like combat/parkour moves) rather than a bigger arsenal of gadgets.


2) I liked the era typical boardgames, thought they were a cool way of connecting history with modern cutting age (aka the videogame itself). I would probably always add a couple of era specific games if it was up to me. Don't see the point of tying it to player progression stats. In fact I kind of hate the focus on that of modern game. Why can't you just do activities because they are fun? Must there be an unlockable hat at the end of the road?


1) I would prefer doing another historical IP over a reboot. Don't really see the point rebooting. The difference between AC:R and AC3 is pretty massive. It's not like a more cartoony franchise were you can drastically change the look. AC will always be realistic-ish.

LoyalACFan
08-22-2015, 09:05 PM
8) Historical tourism is basically all this series has going for it at this point (when people look forward to the "next AC" it's always about the new city/location to explore) and free exploration is a pretty critical part of that, so I think this would ultimately backfire pretty spectacularly. I think Ubi is generally good with cinematic storytelling and could pull off a pretty great linear game given the chance, but it shouldn't be an AC game. Ideally the open-world should serve the purpose of planning an approach and pulling off a perfect assassination aided by your great knowledge of the game space versus a big open city with a billion collectibles, but it does need to be open-world IMO.


7) No, this is dumb. FIX the combat, don't scrap it. Makes no sense that a highly-trained, extremely athletic parkouring assassin would be completely useless in a fight.



6) Again, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with Eagle Vision, it just needs to be cleaned up (like Sushi said, Syndicate's EV looks totally ridiculous). Most stealth-based games have some sort of "second eyes" mechanic, like Batman's detective mode, Dishonored's dark vision, Splinter Cell's NVG's, etc. Even MGS, which the author uses as an example against EV, has thermal goggles which do basically the same thing minus the tagging mechanic.


5) Nope nope nope nope nope nope. Again, historical tourism is this series' one and only unique selling point. Set it in modern day and you've got either a clone of Splinter Cell or a clone of Watch_Dogs. Now, it could be argued that there should be a modern-day component that takes cues from those games while tying into an in-Animus core experience, but I honestly think the MD is too far gone to salvage and should just be dropped.


4) The writer did kind of a poor job explaining this I think, but I get the gist. Basically, he doesn't think parkour should be so automatic. Fair enough, but... It kinda needs to be. It's pretty bread-and-butter to the experience. If it becomes a pain in the a$$ just to scale a two-story building, you're going to find yourself doing a lot of fast-traveling. Being able to quickly climb around the city is pretty core to the AC fantasy. It's like saying GTA should have a mechanic where you have to fill up on gas and perform regular scheduled maintenance on your car. Yeah it's more realistic and would involve a greater degree of player planning and care, but being able to just seamlessly hop in a car and blast around the city spraying bullets everywhere is kind of critical to the experience and should be as easily accessible and smooth as possible. The challenge of AC should come from the stealth and combat, not the basic traversal from point A to point B.


3) I think they were already trying to get back on this route with Unity. I would prefer having skills and unlocks come more fluidly in the story like in the first two games versus having to buy them in a skill screen, but I actually don't think progression needs to be a huge part of AC. I feel like you should start the game with most of your skills already, and the assassinations should get harder as the game progresses so that the difficulty increases with the player's skill level, versus the character's stats. This is why I hate replaying RPG's, it's always so stat-based that you have to grind forever just to get to a point where you can beat an enemy archetype you've already become accustomed to wrecking on a regular basis.


2) I actually kind of snorted at this one. Why the eff should playing checkers factor into the character's progression? A bit of escape from the the standard gameplay loops is kind of THE POINT of minigames. Leveling up your "checkers skill" sounds stupid as hell to me.


1) Yes to a reboot, just not one that uses any of this author's ideas :p @Sushi I think the point of the reboot is more for the lore rather than the gameplay/style. Yes there's a massive difference between ACR and AC3, but the same cluttered BS mess of lore still carries over.

Jessigirl2013
08-22-2015, 10:38 PM
Really?

IMO they just bombarded the map with bad quality side missions and pointless collectibles.

I mean just looking at my Unity map..
I collected tons and yet the map is still bloated!

I didn't mean it in terms of graphics quality (that's Unitys only strength) as I was talking about the quality of the open world aspect.

LOL- Just read the last sentence.
I guess we do have the same opinion ;)