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View Full Version : 60 years ago.Operation Tidal Wave.Ploiesti Inferno.



Zayets
08-03-2003, 09:04 AM
August 1st,1943. The faith of the 2nd WW was still undecided.Allies,I mean here the Yanks and the Brits, planned and carried one of the most powerful raid of the WW2 over the oilfieds in Ploiesti area. That area was producing 1/3 of the oil used by the Germans being considered by Churchill the root of the German power. At that time , Ploiesti was a real fortress , being the most defended area in the whole Europe. Americans choosed 1st of August because was Sunday and people weren't working. Mind you that this action was considered "an accepted action of sacrifice" by the Amerocans. Although the production was reduced for 1/2 years , the goal of the mission was never achieved.What remained in history , was the effectiveness of the Axis deffenders, half of the planes never returned. The Axis fighters took down about 20 planes while the rest was done by the AA/AAA. For those who can speak Romanian here is a link:
http://www.expres.ro/investigatii/?news_id=127656&PHPSESSID=031e052a80068aab583796e4d1998ddf

Here are some links in English
http://www.airartnw.com/tidalwave.htm
http://orbat.com/site/history/historical/usa/operationtidalwave.html
http://www.operationtidalwave.com

That was the history lesson for today /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif




Zayets out

Zayets
08-03-2003, 09:04 AM
August 1st,1943. The faith of the 2nd WW was still undecided.Allies,I mean here the Yanks and the Brits, planned and carried one of the most powerful raid of the WW2 over the oilfieds in Ploiesti area. That area was producing 1/3 of the oil used by the Germans being considered by Churchill the root of the German power. At that time , Ploiesti was a real fortress , being the most defended area in the whole Europe. Americans choosed 1st of August because was Sunday and people weren't working. Mind you that this action was considered "an accepted action of sacrifice" by the Amerocans. Although the production was reduced for 1/2 years , the goal of the mission was never achieved.What remained in history , was the effectiveness of the Axis deffenders, half of the planes never returned. The Axis fighters took down about 20 planes while the rest was done by the AA/AAA. For those who can speak Romanian here is a link:
http://www.expres.ro/investigatii/?news_id=127656&PHPSESSID=031e052a80068aab583796e4d1998ddf

Here are some links in English
http://www.airartnw.com/tidalwave.htm
http://orbat.com/site/history/historical/usa/operationtidalwave.html
http://www.operationtidalwave.com

That was the history lesson for today /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif




Zayets out

XyZspineZyX
08-03-2003, 09:56 AM
cool all ways looking for good reading links

Zayets
08-03-2003, 10:07 AM
brookt wrote:
- cool all ways looking for good reading links
-
-

Then , you can always speculate:

http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=1622&highlight=




Zayets out

XyZspineZyX
08-03-2003, 10:09 AM
thanks again http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
08-03-2003, 02:40 PM
good links Zayets.

I thought the bombers returned and very substantially degraded capacity of Ploesti - one of reasons why Germans had chronic (rather than just severe) fuel shortages come '44.

Zayets
08-03-2003, 02:55 PM
Was a daring and heroic attempt to knock down Hitler's black gold.The area was too defended but bombers managed to pour enough steel to reduce its capacity.Not enough to stop German panzers /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif . Anyway , Roosevelt said at first that the price was too high , but in war's economy I think 70-80 bombers was a medium loss , neverthless , was one of the most bloodiest air fight. What is interesting though is that there are not always exact information of both sides loses. The truth is yet in dark regarding this mission. If you take American sources they will claim almost half of the refineries capacities , if you take German ones , is way less. For 30 years Americans thought were the FW's bringing down their planes , in reality were IARs (confused with the Wuerger) and Bf's. I think is not quite possible to simulate such a raid in FB , no computer will handle such a massive deployment of forces in FB , just my 0.02 euros.


Zayets out

XyZspineZyX
08-03-2003, 03:59 PM
Hi Guys
one thing to remember about damage to targets, as far as the Allies were concerned, they did a great job, doing a lot of damage to the plants, but what they did not know or think about was how much of the plants were in use at the time

so while they did a lot of damage, not all of the plants were running at 100% to start with, so a lot of the work, was able to be moved from plant to plant as needed

it was a very large area and many, many plants, the ones that were hit,were hit very HARD, but the ones that were not, were able to pick up the slack

total damage to the overall production was high, but damage to what was being used at the time was not, and then repairs and speading the work out, made it HARDer to knock out

later in the war, it became a major target, with at times almost dayly raids

hope that made sense

HARD_Sarge

lets see if this is better, if the area could make 1,000,000 barrels of oil a day at 100%, but the area was only running at 70%, it was making 700,000 barrels a day, the raid came in and did around 32% damage to the over all area, after repairs and moving work around, the GE were still able to use the area to around 65%, so what it could of been making, was knocked way down, but what it was making and ended up making were close to the same