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Deezl-V
06-21-2015, 05:35 PM
I, for one, am just saying this as I have played all AC games and feel this is the reason why assassin creed has lost its way. The implementation of guns. Introduced in AC3, it was new to the series and I think most found it fine. Even myself had no issues with it. But the time it continued to be used more and more and more just make the CORE FEEL of BEING AN ASSASSIN, just bland, boring and non existent.

Before guns (AC1, AC2, ACB and ACRe), I felt like an assassin, like actually being on a mission. I guess the whole aura of being an assassin was felt more in ancient times, than in these gun filled times. It seems like guns and now new gadgets are creating assassins creed games into a fantasy arcade kinda game like batman (which is fine because it's batman), and shadow of mordor (but that's fine cuz I'm dead brought back to life), but for assassins creed it seems very gimmicky and kinda desperate.

To me, playing AC chronicles, reminded me of what assassins creed should be like. Hiding, distraction, patience, timing, story, reason, purpose, target, elude, etc... I just feel AC has fallen away from this and it's because the introduction of guns that has caused all this. It's like ubisoft thought "we have guns now so let's make newer gadgets to combat them." I actually felt more like a true assassin in chronicles china than I do in any AC game after ACRe.

I just don't feel like a true assassin anymore.
I would love if the series went back to its core like AC1 & 2 and made games more towards to ancient times with than these more modern times.

AC would have had some great games if they used ancient China, India, Egypt, Mongolia, Japan, Isreal, Persia, Greece. That's 8 games right there.

It just comes down to one thing, the hidden blade. Why even have one if there are guns? It's totally out of place and that's what I'm talking about. I don't feel like a character is in his place. Completely out of it, weird and awkward. Why bring a knife to a gun fight?

Anyone else feel the same or completely disagree?

Farlander1991
06-21-2015, 05:45 PM
Before guns (AC1, AC2, ACB and ACRe)

You do realize that we had guns since AC2? And enemies had guns since ACB? Not to mention, the hidden gun is RIDICULOUSLY overpowered. I mean, people were complaining at AC4's shooting several guns in a row thing, but you could do it maximum 4 times and then it takes time to reload, Ezio's trilogy though? Your guns reload is almost instant and the time it takes to get a 100% shot is barely significant and you can do it like up to 6 or more times.

Xstantin
06-21-2015, 05:53 PM
I just don't feel like a true assassin anymore.
I would love if the series went back to its core like AC1 & 2 and made games more towards to ancient times with than these more modern times.


I think Unity was fine tbh. I barely used Arno's pistols anyway. Timing and hiding as you say.

frodrigues55
06-21-2015, 06:04 PM
It doesn't really bother me, to be honest. Ever since the first game, when stuff went wrong you could engage on huge battles in the middle of the street, so it's not like assassins have always been discrete. Plus, I feel that a long range weapon is really useful to taking down enemies and creating strategies ever since it was introduced by the crossbow in ACB.

In the end, I don't love guns, but I don't really hate them. They fit with the times and it's adding variety to the games, which is something cool to see as each one of them has their own little thing going on even though the core never changes.

However, I do agree that they need to go back a lot in time though, but not only because of the guns. I just think it's time for an old, old AC; they have been more on the modern side for too long and sometimes assassins do look out of place.

Shahkulu101
06-21-2015, 06:20 PM
There's no phrase I hate more than True Assassin.

D.I.D.
06-21-2015, 07:31 PM
There's no phrase I hate more than True Assassin.

You're alright, you are.

Hans684
06-21-2015, 07:45 PM
I, for one, am just saying this as I have played all AC games and feel this is the reason why assassin creed has lost its way.

In what way did it loose it's way? Feels of being an Assassin? Well the awnser to that will always be subjective.


The implementation of guns. Introduced in AC3, it was new to the series and I think most found it fine. Even myself had no issues with it. But the time it continued to be used more and more and more just make the CORE FEEL of BEING AN ASSASSIN, just bland, boring and non existent.

Times changed, they have to adapth to the time and it's improvent.


Before guns (AC1, AC2, ACB and ACRe), I felt like an assassin, like actually being on a mission.

So it is feels, nothing new. And we have had guns since AC2, the hidden gun. It's way more overpowered and can fire far more and faster than Black Flag.


I guess the whole aura of being an assassin was felt more in ancient times, than in these gun filled times.

AC is based on history, guns has and always will be part of AC. History made sure of that. Then there is MD that's been in AC since day one, one moment in MD has Assassins in a gun fight at Abstergo on a rescue missions to get Desmond.


AC would have had some great games if they used ancient China, India, Egypt, Mongolia, Japan, Isreal, Persia, Greece. That's 8 games right there.

So more or less 8 games that's the same but a few changes to fit the time.


It just comes down to one thing, the hidden blade. Why even have one if there are guns? It's totally out of place and that's what I'm talking about. I don't feel like a character is in his place. Completely out of it, weird and awkward. Why bring a knife to a gun fight?

Hitman is a good example.


Anyone else feel the same or completely disagree?

Let's see, limited time periods, limited gameplay, more or less the same and wasted potential because of something as little as guns. Does't sound as ambitious or as innovative as what we currently have.

Shahkulu101
06-21-2015, 08:27 PM
You're alright, you are.

http://myreactiongifs.com/gifs/beardedguyheadnod.gif

Deezl-V
06-21-2015, 08:39 PM
You guys are misunderstanding me, or maybe I didn't explain it properly. I meant guns by gun filled enemies. Since AC3, all enemies have guns. They are in groups and bosses have them and their guards too. That's what I meant. Not a few guys here and there and even our character having it (ezio) but everyone else having it and the game riddled with it that it causes ubisoft to make new gadgets to work around the game with everyone having guns. Black flag was great. I really did enjoy it, but again, i didn't feel like a assassin. An assassin that has a reason to have a hidden blade. Just gimme a knife and get rid of the blade already. It's becoming a game like that. Like hitman agent 47. These games should be miles apart, not getting closer in similarities.

That's just how I feel since the game brought in guns to almost all enemies since AC3.

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 09:00 PM
That's what I meant. Not a few guys here and there and even our character having it (ezio)
What difference does it make, though? By actually saying this, you're putting into perspective how minuscule of an issue it is and how it really only affected the combat, nothing else. I mean, play AC I and ACU...tell me the difference. Just combat. AC I had archers with bows, which is a quite gun. Same with every game. Guns actually add more depth to the combat, I'd say.

Xstantin
06-21-2015, 09:03 PM
An assassin that has a reason to have a hidden blade. Just gimme a knife and get rid of the blade already.

Well, Unity's assassins were a bunch of stuck up traditionalists so they probably loved having their hidden blades. Connor had the pivot knife thingy so it's already there I guess.
EDIT: and isn't it actually a good thing with guards having guns then? You'll avoid them and all that. it's like a perfect true assassin simulator :)

m4r-k7
06-21-2015, 09:04 PM
Guns have hardly had any impact on gameplay though (apart from AC 4 where you could take down like 6 people with Edwards pistols)

Most characters have now had a side arm but it really hasn't done much - I mean its good for combat but terrible for stealth so I hardly even use guns.

The only annoying thing about guns is the problems with AI - enemies will 99% hit you without missing (which is why AC 3 human shield feature needs to come back) For example in Unity, you would more than likely get shot when running away from enemies, even when parkouring.

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 09:37 PM
For example in Unity, you would more than likely get shot when running away from enemies, even when parkouring.
There's a dodge button when running away now in Syndicate......I said that already, didn't I? Sorry for sounding repetitive, if I did.

Farlander1991
06-21-2015, 09:44 PM
(apart from AC 4 where you could take down like 6 people with Edwards pistols)

I'm sorry, but I take issue with AC4 being like standed out from the rest. Yes, it's true that you can kill 4 people practically at the same time with guns, but then you need to take time to reload and if there are other enemies around you that's really not that good. Ezio's hidden gun reload is instant, so you can kill 6 people in a row without a sweat (or 10 in ACB if you have the Uplay unlock for a bigger gun pouch). And if we take double tool kills into account, with Edward + gun you can kill 8 people max before you have to spend time to reload, in ACB/ACR that's 12/20 people (depending if you have pouch upgrade). In AC2 at least you get the gun pretty late, but replaying ACB after AC4/ACRo/ACU and holy **** is that the deadliest and fastest gun in the series ever (not to mention it's ALWAYS 100% kill when used vanilla, without combos or anything, that's not the case with AC4 where stronger enemy types require more bullets if you don't aim for headshots).


enemies will 99% hit you without missing

I found the chances to be 50%. Then again, when running away from firing enemies I never run or climb in a straight line, so that probably helps.

EmptyCrustacean
06-21-2015, 09:53 PM
You do realize that we had guns since AC2? And enemies had guns since ACB? Not to mention, the hidden gun is RIDICULOUSLY overpowered. I mean, people were complaining at AC4's shooting several guns in a row thing, but you could do it maximum 4 times and then it takes time to reload, Ezio's trilogy though? Your guns reload is almost instant and the time it takes to get a 100% shot is barely significant and you can do it like up to 6 or more times.

tbf the guns pre ACIII were super slow and therefore you could not use them in combat, only from a distance and even then when stealth wasn't required otherwise you'd get caught.

Farlander1991
06-21-2015, 09:58 PM
tbf the guns pre ACIII were super slow and therefore you could not use them in combat, only from a distance and even then when stealth wasn't required otherwise you'd get caught.

I'm replaying ACB right now. They're far from super slow. In the mission where we were holding off the bridge I actually had to wait like 15-20 seconds for the next waves of enemies to appear because the one it sent before I cleared out with my 10 hidden gun bullets (plus one or two sword kills cause there were a bit more than 10 enemies) in a very fast period of time and the game apparently didn't expect that to happen in such a short time (when you do counters, kill streaks or double tool kills, animations take quite a bit of time, so it's faster to clear out an area by simply turning lock on and just shooting everybody).

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 10:07 PM
tbf the guns pre ACIII were super slow and therefore you could not use them in combat, only from a distance and even then when stealth wasn't required otherwise you'd get caught.
Wat wat wat, slow, wat?

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-21-2015/XbX4L2.gif
This is 6 (3 with the gun) kills in 5 seconds.

Not to mention that you can aim freely by holding square when there's only one guy in front of you.

m4r-k7
06-21-2015, 10:10 PM
There's a dodge button when running away now in Syndicate......I said that already, didn't I? Sorry for sounding repetitive, if I did.

Thats good! Sorry, I thought the dodge was only in combat but if you can dodge while running away thats a nice new feature :)

king-hailz
06-21-2015, 10:11 PM
I can see how you made the correlation and I agree with you to an extent, but this is too tiny of an issue to effect the game for a large number of people.

I hate guns in games, one of the main reasons I liked AC was because it was different and didn't have guns.

Most of my favorite games don't have guns, such as fighting games like Tekken or Mortal Kombat and games like batman when I don't use a gun. I was extremely bored of guns in games and I like games where we don't have them.

But I don't think it made that much of a difference to the games, and I really don't see how it effects the quality of the story at all...

Shahkulu101
06-21-2015, 10:21 PM
The fundamental problem is that the core mechanics are shockingly sub-par and that the (artistically beautiful) open worlds are ruined by repetitive, checklist design side content and hundreds of vacuous collectibles.

Guns are a tiny problem - if you'd even consider them that...

king-hailz
06-21-2015, 10:24 PM
The fundamental problem is that the core mechanics are shockingly sub-par and that the (artistically beautiful) open worlds are ruined by repetitive, checklist design side content and hundreds of vacuous collectibles.

Guns are a tiny problem - if you'd even consider them that...

This is exactly it!

EmptyCrustacean
06-21-2015, 10:30 PM
I'm replaying ACB right now. They're far from super slow. In the mission where we were holding off the bridge I actually had to wait like 15-20 seconds for the next waves of enemies to appear because the one it sent before I cleared out with my 10 hidden gun bullets (plus one or two sword kills cause there were a bit more than 10 enemies) in a very fast period of time and the game apparently didn't expect that to happen in such a short time (when you do counters, kill streaks or double tool kills, animations take quite a bit of time, so it's faster to clear out an area by simply turning lock on and just shooting everybody).

I'm talking specifically about AC2.
As for Brotherhood in comparison to Unity and Black Flag yes it is slow.

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 10:37 PM
I'm talking specifically about AC2.

No, you said pre AC III


As for Brotherhood in comparison to Unity and Black Flag yes it is slow.
No, I just showed you and Farlander explained how it's not.

EmptyCrustacean
06-21-2015, 10:39 PM
No, you said pre AC III


No, I just showed you and Farlander explained how it's not.

I had AC2 IN MIND when I made that comment so if you want to argue over symantecs be my guest but it's a waste of time.
And you haven't showed me JACK. It IS slower in comparison to Black Flag and Unity that is undeniable and you can take out less guards than in those latter games.

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 10:42 PM
I had AC2 IN MIND when I made that comment so if you want to argue over symantecs be my guest but it's a waste of time.
So we're supposed to read your mind, then?


And you haven't showed me JACK. It IS slower in comparison to Black Flag and Unity that is undeniable and you can take out less guards than in those latter games.
Yes, I have, calm those tits, mate. It's not slower, it's as fast. Here's you "You're wrong, it's a fact" Here's me "No, you're wrong and here's why". Come on, explain why i'm wrong. It's not hard. And calm down.

Namikaze_17
06-21-2015, 10:54 PM
"I don't feel like an Assassin"

http://reactiongif.org/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/08/GIF-annoyed-disbelief-exasperation-frustrated-incredulous-irritated-Jack-Nicholson-shades-GIF.gif

Well I guess AC1 is your only Assassin game then. :rolleyes:

EmptyCrustacean
06-21-2015, 11:01 PM
So we're supposed to read your mind, then?


Isn't that what you were claiming you were doing before, brah? Are you telling me now you don't have the super power of mind reading? How disappointing. And convenient.



Yes, I have, calm those tits, mate. It's not slower, it's as fast. Here's you "You're wrong, it's a fact" Here's me "No, you're wrong and here's why". Come on, explain why i'm wrong. It's not hard. And calm down.

No, dude, you lack reading comprehension so showing me a gif (which can be sped or slowed down btw) and then not showing a comparison video with Unity or Black Flag is typical of you but makes no sense.

frodrigues55
06-21-2015, 11:11 PM
Thing is - times evolve and so does Assassins. Everyone and their mommas wanted french revolution, victorian london. Nobody wanted pirates but hey, look at that, it worked. Those games couldn't happen without guns, and ultimately AC is more of an historical game than a stealth game. It's about using the instruments and enviroments available within the time piece it is set in. It's one of the things I love AC for. It's about taking its core to different times and eras and using their changes in your favor.

In the end - would you want a bunch of games limited to old eras or have a large variety of games set in a bunch of different eras, past and modern? I would choose the second. I'm hoping they go back in time and I will embrace that if it's a good game. But I wouldn't want them stuck there forever just because of "NO GUNS".

Assassin_M
06-21-2015, 11:40 PM
Isn't that what you were claiming you were doing before, brah? Are you telling me now you don't have the super power of mind reading? How disappointing. And convenient.
What are you even saying? Please talk sense.



No, dude, you lack reading comprehension so showing me a gif (which can be sped or slowed down btw) and then not showing a comparison video with Unity or Black Flag is typical of you but makes no sense.
Nah, I think i'm fine. I just think you lack any proof and are just having a bad day. Tell you what, take a sun bath. It'll probably help you feel a little better. The Gif was 5 seconds long. You can find the original video on YT too. 3 gun kills in 5 seconds and you can aim at single guards with no reload time. Not our fault that Farlander and I remember the games better. Lets say I'm an idiot. That i'm skewing stuff. You didn't even give Farlander a solid counter argument. Farlander made a post, explaining to you quite well that you're wrong but you just dodged it.

Pandassin
06-21-2015, 11:47 PM
I don't mind guns. The only game I really used them in was Black Flag since they were really handy when boarding ships/in large fights.

It makes sense for them to be in an AC game if they were around at the time. If you don't like them, don't use them; the games are still very playable without them.

EmptyCrustacean
06-22-2015, 12:13 AM
Nah, I think i'm fine. I just think you lack any proof and are just having a bad day. Tell you what, take a sun bath.

:rolleyes:


The Gif was 5 seconds long. You can find the original video on YT too. 3 gun kills in 5 seconds and you can aim at single guards with no reload time. Not our fault that Farlander and I remember the games better. Lets say I'm an idiot. That i'm skewing stuff. You didn't even give Farlander a solid counter argument. Farlander made a post, explaining to you quite well that you're wrong but you just dodged it.

I didn't dodge anything. He made his point and you added to it with a gif so I responded to your post rather than saying the same thing twice.
You keep avoiding my point about comparison because you know i'm right.

Assassin_M
06-22-2015, 12:26 AM
I didn't dodge anything. He made his point and you added to it with a gif so I responded to your post rather than saying the same thing twice.
You keep avoiding my point about comparison because you know i'm right.
Oh, so you didn't reply to his well constructed post but looked at my poor one? You didnt counter ANYTHING either of us posted. I showed you the double kills and how fast they are. Go watch the video, man. Just face it, you're just blabbering on now. Drop it before you remove the last shred of doubt of your desperateness.

And no, I'm not avoiding it. You made the claim (Poorly, I should say). I can say "ACB is as fast as AC IV" but it's just blabbering. I can say "No, you're wrong" but it's just blabbering. You're saying in comparison, it's slow. Prove it. Show me. Less blabbering and more proof, please

EmptyCrustacean
06-22-2015, 12:36 AM
Oh, so you didn't reply to his well constructed post but looked at my poor one?

Well at least you admit your post was garbage.


You didnt counter ANYTHING either of us posted. I showed you the double kills and how fast they are. Go watch the video, man. Just face it, you're just blabbering on now. Drop it before you remove the last shred of doubt of your desperateness. And no, I'm not avoiding it. You made the claim (Poorly, I should say). I can say "ACB is as fast as AC IV" but it's just blabbering. I can say "No, you're wrong" but it's just blabbering. You're saying in comparison, it's slow. Prove it. Show me. Less blabbering and more proof, please

No, YOU prove it. You're the one saying that I'm wrong for saying so ad nauseam. It's midnight here in London and I'm not going to waste time pulling up AC2 and Black Flag videos for someone who has played the game and KNOWS guns are slower in AC2 than Unity and Black Flag. That is a widely accepted fact. I have work in the morning.

Locopells
06-22-2015, 12:38 AM
And I repeat, knock it off and agree to disagree already...

Assassin_M
06-22-2015, 12:54 AM
And with that we say....Goodnight, Steven. Goodnight, Steven, always a pleasure.

ze_topazio
06-22-2015, 12:58 AM
Guns are clearly the least of this series problems.

Altair1789
06-22-2015, 02:54 AM
There's no phrase I hate more than True Assassin.

Exactly. Assassins were meant to exist for a very long time, why would a modern assassin be limited to swords and knives for the sake of being a "true assassin"?

That being said I don't think guns should be too strong. I support game content as late as the 1920s (DLC, but not a main game), but I don't want to see fully automatic guns used to their fullest. Maybe the mobsters with the tommy guns can only shoot semi auto

But guns are certainly not what's causing problems for the series

CreepyKitten
07-04-2015, 04:11 AM
I have to play more than I have already to fully understand. I've only fully completed Black Flag, which was my very first AC game and I loved it despite my ridiculous fear of the ocean (especially in games, because I REFUSED to go down into the ocean with the diving bell). I'm currently working on Liberation in 'The Americas' pack which I just got in the mail Thursday and so far I'm not too crazy about the weapons. I just unlocked my current arsenal in the Bayou and I'm tasked with taking out 2 thugs with the blowpipe, I should NOT be fighting with how to work my own weapons. However, in regards to your post, I was under the impression that the weapons changed with the time and setting of each game, according with what was available at the time each game took place. Since I've only just made a scratch in the series, is that not what it's like? :confused:

Beas7ie
07-04-2015, 08:50 AM
There's no phrase I hate more than True Assassin.


How do you feel about False Assassin?

or Possible Assassin?

or Unsure Assassin"

Shahkulu101
07-04-2015, 09:14 AM
How do you feel about False Assassin?

or Possible Assassin?

or Unsure Assassin"

Depends on the context that it's used in.

Not sure what that would even mean.

That sounds interesting.

phoenix-force411
07-04-2015, 11:11 PM
Hoods ruin the games.

D.I.D.
07-04-2015, 11:19 PM
Hoods ruin the games.

YYYYYEEEEEEEEEEE

https://38.media.tumblr.com/03bfba38377a9b864d75e0c6e7e3d4fb/tumblr_mo7e6ubszg1sok7a0o1_250.gif

EEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSS

THIS

http://d.ibtimes.co.uk/en/full/1438196/assassins-creed-syndicate.png

You can pretty much fill these games to the eyeballs with guns and I'll be happy, because that will necessitate planning on the part of the player. It'll encourage stealth. Bring the guns, please.

AssassinHMS
07-05-2015, 01:49 AM
You can pretty much fill these games to the eyeballs with guns and I'll be happy, because that will necessitate planning on the part of the player. It'll encourage stealth. Bring the guns, please.

While it’s true that guns may encourage stealth (in theory at least) we need to remember that there are other core pillars to think about besides stealth and that this is a game made by Ubisoft.
And since it’s Ubisoft we’re talking about I can tell you there will never be an AC game that will make you feel remotely weak or that will force you to use your brain. The power fantasy is “essential” to AC as it is. So what does this mean?

It means that you will always have a big advantage over most enemies in the game. That was alright in AC1 where you would perform moves that basic enemies could not (counter kills; combo kills; grab breaks; defense breaks, etc.). It was alright because you would easily assume that, as an Assassin, you were far better trained than any regular guard and it was only normal that you knew more combat techniques than them.
But, back then, there were no guns involved. In a time period where guns are popular, there is NO reason why a single enemy can’t kill you just as easily as you can kill them, by pulling the trigger.
And that kills the illusion of power which simply cannot happen.
So what you’ll see is a game full of enemies that will take their sweet time pulling out and aiming their guns and that will only do so occasionally from time to time when they decide to remember they have a gun. Not only that, but the game will surely give you some magical way to either dodge bullets or shield yourself from them at the press of a button (such as the human shield seen since AC3) all in the name of the power fantasy.


Guns also affect navigation, particularly when trying to escape from a fight, since they’ll make the chase a lot harder (in reality) only they won’t (because it’s a video game and power illusion, etc.) so the pursuers will likely miss every chance they get or worse, hit you every time which works against the power fantasy and therefore makes it a lot more inexcusable.
And all of this KILLS Immersion.

Even though AC is supposed to be a stealth game, it “has” to fulfill the power fantasy or else Ubisoft might lose a big part of the fanbase and the best excuse for bad gameplay.



So, in the end, it’s probably better for AC to stay away from guns.

The_Kiwi_
07-06-2015, 09:35 AM
I agree
Guns shouldn't be like they are in AC3/4/Ro/U
I enjoyed doing the 4 pistol kills in AC4 but it did make it incredibly easy, but it didn't detract from stealth at all
Pistols are fine if they're not overpowered, but submachine guns shouldn't be in AC, it ruins the uniqueness of the franchise

ProdiGurl
07-06-2015, 12:26 PM
I haven't read this thread yet but I don't think guns is any qualified reason - especially when you have a whole arsenal of weapons at your disposal to complete missions with.
Plus there were guns in other great AC games. I think each assassin should be evenly matched with the weapons available to enemies in the era they're in.
Feel free not to use them (unless the mission challenge asks for it). If there were no guns at all, you'd have gamers complaining about it too.

If AC 'lost their way', I'd say it went more into lacking mystery that we all enjoyed in ACII & Brotherhood.. I'm no fan of puzzles, but I LOVE mysteries.
Another thing was that Far Cry 3-4 had been coming out w/ open world fun while AC went more towards controlled missions - basically steering you in their direction. Gamers like open world freedom so restriction is felt there. [Even tho I get that you're following footsteps of ancestors & the whole synch thing]...
I think AC fans like doing missions their own way with as much freedom as possible?

Then there's the fighting system... that gets changed quite a bit and I don't know which system in previous games is the favorite. I personally liked Brotherhood.
I'd say the severe game breaking glitches are a bigger issue these days too - not just w/ AC either. I think once the new consoles are out longer, it will make games smoother?
I got ACU in the X1 Unity bundle last Cmas & haven't downloaded it to play but I knew the next AC was going to be coming out & want to play ACU so I rented it for 4th of July wkend and fell in love with the story - the last mission I played was Assassinate Sivert. Really fun and I missed playing AC alot.
I think AC will always be a series I love.

LoyalACFan
07-07-2015, 04:46 AM
I don't think it's the guns that are the problem, per se, it's just the fact that the more modern it goes, the less unique it feels. There's always a certain charm about exploring ye olden tymes in media, for me anyway, and I think the success of the early games were partially due to that. It adds a little extra element of the fantastical and the mysterious the more the setting is detached from our modern times. That's not to say that AC needs to stick to ancient history, it just means it needs a little extra spark to compete with the franchise's earlier outings. Unfortunately, the games seem to be getting more and more by-the-numbers, so that spark is hard to come by.

Fatal-Feit
07-07-2015, 05:40 AM
People who believe guns are worse in the later games must have not spent much time on the older titles.



No, YOU prove it. You're the one saying that I'm wrong for saying so ad nauseam. It's midnight here in London and I'm not going to waste time pulling up AC2 and Black Flag videos for someone who has played the game and KNOWS guns are slower in AC2 than Unity and Black Flag. That is a widely accepted fact. I have work in the morning.

I'm glad AC2 is brought up because yes, aiming the hidden pistol is slower, but it's still a FAR more effective weapon than the guns in Unity and Black Flag. To start off, it's instant kill with no damage upgrade required. Yeah. Second, AC2's pistol doesn't attract any guard with its sound, making it one of the most OP range weapon in the series. Basically, take Connor's bow and arrow, increase its range and give it instant kill damage. :p Who cares if its aiming is slower, you can patiently take down a dozen guards from afar without repercussion unlike Black Flag and Unity.

CreepyKitten
07-07-2015, 06:10 AM
Wat wat wat, slow, wat?

http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/6-21-2015/XbX4L2.gif
This is 6 (3 with the gun) kills in 5 seconds.

Not to mention that you can aim freely by holding square when there's only one guy in front of you.

I'm loving this gif immensely! So bad ***. I may've not played every single one of the AC games to date, but I'm sold by that gif alone. Well done Sir M, well done. And you too, kudos to you as well Farlander or noting the difference! :cool:

Fatal-Feit
07-07-2015, 06:17 AM
Before guns (AC1, AC2, ACB and ACRe), I felt like an assassin, like actually being on a mission. I guess the whole aura of being an assassin was felt more in ancient times, than in these gun filled times. It seems like guns and now new gadgets are creating assassins creed games into a fantasy arcade kinda game like batman (which is fine because it's batman), and shadow of mordor (but that's fine cuz I'm dead brought back to life), but for assassins creed it seems very gimmicky and kinda desperate.

Ehhh, besides AC1, I think the older titles were far worse offenders when it came to new, arcadey, and gimmicky gadgets. As cool as it was, AC2 did NOT need the hidden pistol. And I practically have to force myself to remember to play around poison darts during replays. ACB was filled with OP, gimmicky, and unnecessary tools. You've got the crossbow, parachutes, hidden pistol, throwing knives, poison, etc, yeah. --And I'm mentioning all of them because ACB had no sense of balance with its arsenal. ACR has the bombs, and if that's not the most fantasy/gimmicky/arcadey thing ever, well, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

AC3 had a problem, and that I do agree with.

All of Black Flag's tools had a usage and were pretty well balanced. --FOR AC, THAT IS. And the blowpipe fit the timeline pretty well. Nowhere near as bad as the crossbow. The rope dart is questionable, but it wasn't OP and its existence was better justified than the hidden pistol in AC2. Rogue has its problems, but the Air Rifle was still better balanced and better used than, well, R's bombs. Besides the Phantom Blade, I dunno what's there to complain about with Unity's tools. I mean, again, the Phantom Blade's existence is still far superior and more justified than most of the tools of the previous titles.

Thinking back at it, the previous games were really ridiculous with their new tools. The hidden pistol, the crossbow, the bombs, the PARACHUTES! I'm pretty sure you're going off on the wrong games, my friend.


To me, playing AC chronicles, reminded me of what assassins creed should be like. Hiding, distraction, patience, timing, story, reason, purpose, target, elude, etc... I just feel AC has fallen away from this and it's because the introduction of guns that has caused all this. It's like ubisoft thought "we have guns now so let's make newer gadgets to combat them." I actually felt more like a true assassin in chronicles china than I do in any AC game after ACRe.

That's something I love about Chronicles. It really embodies the stealth genre far better than the main games. That said, the latest games (Black Flag, Rogue, and Unity) have actually done a better job of depicting exactly that, so I don't know what you're complaining about. I mean, you can actually go through many assassination missions w/o being interrupted by a cutscene or chase sequence. For AC, that's a HUGE feat. :p AC1 is a lot more linear than people remember, and it's often broken into multiple stages of combat, stealth, and navigation. --Similar to the Ezio Trilogy. And AC2-ACR are anything but what you remember of them, dude.


I'm loving this gif immensely! So bad ***. I may've not played every single one of the AC games to date, but I'm sold by that gif alone. Well done Sir M, well done. And you too, kudos to you as well Farlander or noting the difference! :cool:

Ezio's double tool kills are so badass, and honestly a little better than the ones in the Kenway Saga (although a bit more OP).The screen got up far too close in the later games, which kind of looked ugly for certain animations like the pistol-to-mouth one, and made it hard to see if an enemy is attacking you during the animation.

CreepyKitten
07-07-2015, 07:20 AM
Ezio's double tool kills are so badass, and honestly a little better than the ones in the Kenway Saga (although a bit more OP).The screen got up far too close in the later games, which kind of looked ugly for certain animations like the pistol-to-mouth one, and made it hard to see if an enemy is attacking you during the animation.

Rad, I don't know if you'd seen my first post in this thread but Black Flag was my first AC game I'd ever played. And I LOVED it! So because I love it as much as I do and after learning so much more when it came time to hack into my co-workers Animus Computers, I decided I wanted to play all the AC games. I'm currently working on Liberation since I got "The Americas" 3 game pack for my PS3 (Now I essentially have 2 Black Flag games) last week. I think when I'm done with Liberation, I'm going to try my hand at either Adéwalé's DLC called Freedom Cry or AC Chronicles: China. I don't know which one I want to start first, but I know I WANT to play them both ;)

Fatal-Feit
07-07-2015, 08:57 AM
Rad, I don't know if you'd seen my first post in this thread but Black Flag was my first AC game I'd ever played. And I LOVED it! So because I love it as much as I do and after learning so much more when it came time to hack into my co-workers Animus Computers, I decided I wanted to play all the AC games. I'm currently working on Liberation since I got "The Americas" 3 game pack for my PS3 (Now I essentially have 2 Black Flag games) last week. I think when I'm done with Liberation, I'm going to try my hand at either Adéwalé's DLC called Freedom Cry or AC Chronicles: China. I don't know which one I want to start first, but I know I WANT to play them both ;)

Oh, Freedom Cry fo sho! One of the best substantial DLCs in the series. :o

Jexx21
07-07-2015, 10:28 AM
We NEED MOAR GUNS

ProdiGurl
07-07-2015, 12:58 PM
I'm loving this gif immensely! So bad ***. I may've not played every single one of the AC games to date, but I'm sold by that gif alone. Well done Sir M, well done. And you too, kudos to you as well Farlander or noting the difference! :cool:
Ya that was the training thing for doing chain kills in Brotherhood. It's been so long I forget the name. I watched so many Youtubes of these and was in love with them. They were a challenge all their own. Spent alot of time in that arena, it almost felt like Batman style fighting only with weapons..
This is the combat system I wished they'd go back to. They could tweak it or whatever - make it harder, but it was AWESOME.

I forgot to mention one other thing I noticed was missing/changed. The MUSIC is replaced by crowd noise. I noticed it in ACIII.
I still think AC needs music.