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glottis77
03-31-2004, 03:38 AM
so since day 1 i played il2 only offline, and now i considered myself a decent pilot who in a 109 can bring down the ai down quite easy.
then i started to go online, and my self esteem grew because i picked random servers and although scoring kills not as easy as against the ai i still had a kill to being killed ratio higher than 1. however then i started to fly on the war_clouds_aces server and my world crumbled.
i guess for each kill i score i get killed 5-10 times and often it is not a player who brings me down but rather me crashing while chasing another player. what makes me the most jealous is that often when we fly low and i start to fire he makes a move which would cause me to stall (at least i think so). it appears that people pull the stick extra hard and make a "3-dimensional jump". i tried this but in most planes except for the zero and spitfire i stall all day long, especially in fw190s and p51.
another thing that amazes me is markmanship. i get killed head on, out of a roll, out of a loop, incredible. there are guys who fly like marseille...
can you give me any advice? i don't want to practise anymore against the ai because it does not help. equally flying on newbie servers does not attract me as much as fighting against expert pilots. any special "tricks" etc? your help will be rewarded...

glottis77
03-31-2004, 03:38 AM
so since day 1 i played il2 only offline, and now i considered myself a decent pilot who in a 109 can bring down the ai down quite easy.
then i started to go online, and my self esteem grew because i picked random servers and although scoring kills not as easy as against the ai i still had a kill to being killed ratio higher than 1. however then i started to fly on the war_clouds_aces server and my world crumbled.
i guess for each kill i score i get killed 5-10 times and often it is not a player who brings me down but rather me crashing while chasing another player. what makes me the most jealous is that often when we fly low and i start to fire he makes a move which would cause me to stall (at least i think so). it appears that people pull the stick extra hard and make a "3-dimensional jump". i tried this but in most planes except for the zero and spitfire i stall all day long, especially in fw190s and p51.
another thing that amazes me is markmanship. i get killed head on, out of a roll, out of a loop, incredible. there are guys who fly like marseille...
can you give me any advice? i don't want to practise anymore against the ai because it does not help. equally flying on newbie servers does not attract me as much as fighting against expert pilots. any special "tricks" etc? your help will be rewarded...

T_O_A_D
03-31-2004, 03:43 AM
Yep!
Donate more of your virtual lives to the cause. Practice practice practice. There is no easy wonder answer for your quest.

I've been doing this since the Il2 Demo and I still get my arse handed too me. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Have you checked your Private Topics recently? (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=ugtpc&s=400102)
131st_Toad's Squad link (http://www.geocities.com/vfw_131st/)
My TrackIR fix, Read the whole thread (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?q=Y&a=tpc&s=400102&f=49310655&m=15310285&p=1)
2.11 drivers (http://home.mchsi.com/~131st-vfw/NaturalPoint_trackIR_2_11.exe)
http://home.mchsi.com/~131st_vfw/T_O_A_D.jpg

Bull-Dog.
03-31-2004, 05:20 AM
Been there and got the T shirt.
Like you I have found that practicing Off-Line is of no help at all. There appears to be slight differences to how planes handle and the deflection required from server to server.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/bull_dog/images/3-picture.jpg?0.7185765628443178

pacettid
03-31-2004, 05:36 AM
I started out in CFS2 and graduated to IL2 FB when it was released.

It was two years before I started to gain proficiency, and I still feel like I have a long way to go...my recommendation: enjoy the journey and practice, practice, practice - both online and off.

All the best, Don

Arnie_OT
03-31-2004, 05:55 AM
Did you fly with realistic settings offline? Cause that helps alot too.

Stalker58
03-31-2004, 08:12 AM
Even with realistic setting offline, it helps little. You need go online as frequent as possible and be prepare to spend 1000 virtual lives before you become an ace...

Altitude, speed, manoeuvre and.... CRASH!

georgeo76
03-31-2004, 08:30 AM
This Article (http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend/FYL/FYLindex.htm) may help you out.

______________________
Fiend (http://webpages.charter.net/Stick_Fiend)

michapma
03-31-2004, 08:44 AM
I don't know about that server, but you might consider flying tactics suited to your aircraft. The 109's strengths come at altitude.

C!

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The ongoing IL-2 User's Guide (http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/) | Forgotten Skies (http://www.forgottenskies.com/)
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Spinne_3.-JG51
03-31-2004, 08:45 AM
Consider joining a squad. You'll get a lot more input about what you do wrong.

http://www.student.richmond.edu/~vk5qa/images/forumsig.jpg

"Come on in, I'll treat you nice! I used to know your father."

SeaFireLIV
03-31-2004, 09:01 AM
I want to know what the Reward is? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

SeaFireLIV...

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/Old1.jpg

It`s not about the Machine...
(aka: You CAN teach an old dog new tricks!)

Capt.LoneRanger
03-31-2004, 10:35 AM
Flying against humans and BOTs is something quite different. I stopped flying offline, besides for some testing and gun practice. Training dogfight skills in Offline, isn't.

Some tricks that work on the AI are suicide against human players (like head-on).
Some tricks that work on humans are impossible against AI (like sneakin' up on lower six of a bandit)
And then, it also depends largely on the servers' settings. If you play on full real, diving from above, out of the sun or sneaking up from behind are best tactics to join a dogfight.
On servers with icons and externals enabled, these tactics are more or less useless, cause the major factor of surprise is gone.

So, yes, practice, practice, practice, is the answer. Don't be frustrated. You can often learn much more from being shot down, than from winning a dogfight.

The idea of joining a squad seems very good, too. I'm considering joining one, too, but most squads in Europe fly German planes and I prefer the ol' P40 and other US-planes, so I'm still on the look out http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

greets
Capt.LoneRanger

http://www.imageshack.us/img1/7182/1703abcdefg.gif

Xnomad
03-31-2004, 10:47 AM
I learnt to shoot using QMB and still use it to practice my gunnery yes you won't improve your tactics and such offline but QMB is a great place to learn deflection shooting. You won't be able to get that much shooting time done so quickly online. The only deflection shots not simulated in QMB are a long persistant chase in a fast turn and very high speed manouvres as I usually miscalculate these deflection shots online and only get it right after 1 or 2 bursts. Other than that it's the place to practice shooting http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.xnomad.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/sig.jpg

tttiger
03-31-2004, 11:38 AM
Amen, X...

QMB is my Practice Arena.

Sure, the AI and the Human pilots are different (although the AI has improved again in AEP) but what the enemy is doing isn't the point.

I get two things out of practicing in QMB:

1. I can work on my gunnery, which ALWAYS can be improved.

2. I can make my airplane an extension of myself, learn what it does well and what it doesn't do well. If you're chasing an enemy plane on the deck in a 109, you aren't doing it right. The 109 should be fighting in the vertical, not the horizontal. Practice will teach you that and make the right moves intuitive.

Finally, read everything on tactics you can get your hands on. Roert Shaw's book Fighter Combat, Andy Bush's articles at SimHQ. And evrything about how your airplane, whether it's a 109 or a Jug, and how it really was flown in RL.

I've been flying sims for eight years now and I'm still learning.

GL

ttt

"I want the one that kills the best with the least amount of risk to me"

-- Chuck Yeager describing "The Best Airplane."

JV44Rall
03-31-2004, 11:47 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Spinne_3.-JG51:
Consider joining a squad. You'll get a lot more input about what you do wrong.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I could not agree more.

Also, pick one plane you really like and stick to it, learning all its strengths and weaknesses.

Finally, work offline on one weakness at a time. If you keep crashing in a stall fight, spend some time offline stall fighting AI or in a mock stall fight. Learn what works and what you're doing wrong. After you feel more comfortable with that topic, go to another weakness.

My impressions of the last two months revolve around dawns. Pink dawns, grey dawns, misty, rainy and windy dawns, but always dawns; first light. Shadowy Spitfires and quietness . . . . Geoffrey Wellum, First Light.

TgD Thunderbolt56
03-31-2004, 12:04 PM
The basics have already been covered.(i.e. practice until it hurts, join a squad, practice some more), but in addition to these I would say get on voice with a good wingy.

At the start of your pilot career, the learning curve is steep, but it flattens out after a month or so depending on the time you put in.



http://home.earthlink.net/~aclzkim1/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/il2sig2.jpg

Xnomad
03-31-2004, 01:32 PM
Oh I forgot a really important one!!!! Get "IL2 Compare", this utility will compare two planes and tell you which one climbs faster, turns faster, or flies faster at certain altitudes. It does this using graphs that overlap each other. Study different scenarios with this.

I learnt a lot from this and since then I know when to fight and when to flee depending on which plane I am up against. It has been a great help, my kill ratio has improved loads infact the last 3 days I've only been shot down like 4 times and those were mainly crashes or being severley out numbered or half asleep. Picture being chased by a P-38 and a Spitfire! You turn the Spitfire will have you, you run and the Lightning will get you http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

I don't have a link for the utility but Google will guide your way.

http://www.xnomad.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/sig.jpg

brimigus
03-31-2004, 02:16 PM
If you play on the War Cloud my tatic is to just be somebodys wingman,two againt one is allways in your favor,plus learn how to shoot useing external padlock it makes the steap delection shots easier and the head ons way easier.

glottis77
03-31-2004, 03:00 PM
PADLOCK??? i thought this was off on the war clouds server???

Maxhome
03-31-2004, 03:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by tttiger:

I've been flying sims for eight years now and I'm still learning.

GL
"<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And that, I fear, is the bottom line.

Makes me feel a whole lot better, too - praccy, praccy, praccy... sooner or later, we will improve. Maybe 1% have that magic basic ability. My experiences so far prove beyond doubt that I am essentially rubbish, and I have to keep practising, to learn.

But 8 years? Arg. Oh well. Only 7 and three quarters to go http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

brimigus
03-31-2004, 07:22 PM
If the sever allows for external views you can padlock any aircraft or ground object externaly,regardless if the cockpit padlock is disabled.It's hard at first to make the shots but the more they turn and the closer you get you'll allmost never miss.If you would like to see what Im talking about I've got hundreds of online NTRK's from the War cloud servers I can send you.

LC34
03-31-2004, 10:33 PM
Aww guys you should know better than to call it practice. Practice is something you would rather not do but have to in order to play, i.e. practice after school in order to play in the big game on Friday.

I would call it, "learning while screwing up." Kind of like when your on a first date. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

RdTimeTheCharm
04-01-2004, 04:03 AM
The server mentioned is free aircraft selection which tends to make pilots choose the mean a$$ 44 and 45 planes.

Still i dont find it problematic to fly G2 against them and get decent score the times ive visited.

Maybe we use it different times or something, because i havent noticed any condensation of aces on that server. (considering the fact that it has icons and still there are alot of friendly fire incidents)