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backseatgunner
01-03-2004, 10:16 AM
Does anyone know when the Finns changed from the Von Rosen cross to the roundels? Was it after the change to the Allies?

backseatgunner
01-03-2004, 10:16 AM
Does anyone know when the Finns changed from the Von Rosen cross to the roundels? Was it after the change to the Allies?

SUPERAEREO
01-03-2004, 10:37 AM
Yes, I believe it was just after the armistice with Russia in 1944, so that their planes could not be confused with German ones.

F19_Ob
01-03-2004, 10:41 AM
AS i remember it , they changed the svastika soon after the war ended since the use of the svastika had become "infected" in the whole world due to the nazi connection.
Yes the symbol is still called svastika, but it didnt ofcourse have the political meaning of the nazi svastika and the von rosen svastika was "invented" before the nazi one so they had nothing to do with eachother.


The svastika is still used with different meaning in many parts of the world, mostly in asia.

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SUPERAEREO
01-03-2004, 10:55 AM
I had to double-check: according to "Military Aircraft Insignia of the World" by John Cochrane and Stuart Elliott, the swastika was abandoned in favor of the roundel in 1944.

SUPERAEREO
01-03-2004, 10:59 AM
Oh, and Latvia used a swastika too from 1918 to 1940 (Russian annexation), red in a white circle.

I believe it was a good luck symbol very diffused in the Baltic area and that still today it can be found over the entrance of old farms - that's probably how ended up in the coat of arms of Count von Rosen!

backseatgunner
01-03-2004, 11:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
I believe it was a good luck symbol very diffused in the Baltic area and that still today it can be found over the entrance of old farms - that's probably how ended up in the coat of arms of Count von Rosen!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Von Rosen "discovered" it in his travels around Asia, especially India, and adopted it. It was hwever well known in Europe as the"cross of Thor" beforehand.

I'm just trying to work out if the FAF flew in the Lapland War with roundels or while still using the swastika. Any Finns online tonight? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Pilven_Veikko
01-03-2004, 12:46 PM
Finnish Air Force used the "Rosen's Cross" in the Lapland War. The Roundel was established in 1.4.1945. Source: "The History of Finnish Air Force, vol. 17, Flight Regiment 2 (LeR.2) by Kalevi Keskinen and Kari Stenman. Book has

Zeus-cat
01-03-2004, 01:11 PM
My wife and I visited Pompeii and Herculaneum a few years ago. In one of the tile floors was a swastika. WE took a picture of the floor. I can't remember when Mount Vesuvious errupted, but I think it was at least 2,000 years ago. The swastika has been around for a while.

Zeus-cat

SUPERAEREO
01-03-2004, 09:54 PM
I am happy to stand corrected http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

backseatgunner
01-06-2004, 07:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Pilven_Veikko:
Finnish Air Force used the "Rosen's Cross" in the Lapland War. The Roundel was established in 1.4.1945. Source: "The History of Finnish Air Force, vol. 17, Flight Regiment 2 (LeR.2) by Kalevi Keskinen and Kari Stenman. Book has<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

thank you very much for this...oh,is that US date system or non-US date system ie: is it 01 April 45, or 04 January 45? Either way it's post-Lapland War. (must have been confusing for some of the German pilots, being shot at by a/c with swastikas!)

Pilven_Veikko
01-07-2004, 05:03 AM
backseatgunner!

Sorry about the date system. It is non-US system. We Finns use "The right" system http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

The Roundel was introduced April 1st, 1945. The last Germans left Finland April 25th, 1945. Only a handful of recon flights were flown in early April.