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BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 10:11 AM
1) Try 800 x 600. It will help your framerates and will make it easier to see. I also think it more accurately represents how planes look in real life at high distances.. but that's open to discussion...

2) Turn the brightness up a little on your monitor (if your monitor is old, you will have a dull picture also making it harder to see).

3) Keep your bearings straight.. If you don't focus on your heading and use visual flight references you can wander off and get lost...which means you wont see anyone.

4) the real experienced pilots will often climb above you. In full real, they can sometimes see YOU better than you see them, depending on time of day and whether there is snow on the ground. Try getting some angels and see if you start seeing more planes.

5) Look out of the side of your plane where you get the best FOV.. If you head straight for an IP, for example, you just wont see as much.. Try approaching where you 'think' the enemy is by cutting back and forth in a zig-zag, or 'come around the bend' in a wide curve.

6) Remember that the top pilots use the Sun and mist in FR... The best way to check for bandits in the sun is to cover the sun with the framing of your cockpit or you can move perpendicular to the sun and raise your wing up like it was your hand to cover the sun and look around it.. Another smart thing is never to turn your back to the sun.. if you can help it.

If there is mist or haze, try climbing until things clear. If you wanna bounce someone remeber you can come down into the mist and bounce them from below... Also, it's the one time that hitting the deck will REALLY hide you http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif...

7) Check your six -- cliche? You betchya! But with icons you can be much more lazy about checking your 6 than you can be in a FR game. In FR, if you are lazy about it, and dont 'wag' your tail outta the way to get a good look behind and below you, then your sorry 6 is gonna get pulled outta the sky over and over.. the easiest pilots to bounce are the ones who fly relatively straight and level for 15-20 seconds at a time (or longer).. If this is you, then you are in trouble. I once saw a plane way of in the distance. It took me about 2 minutes to get to him, but he never saw me approach. I spent the whole time positioning for an advantage and the whole time tried not to get caught.. I engaged my guns at about 250 meters and he never knew what hit him.. The whole time I am sure he thought he was doing a good job of checking his six, but he never really repositioned himself.. In the last 15 seconds of my attack, he still could have made me and juked if he had been awake...poor sod...

8) Hat Swicth? Hmmm. I know some pilots who are pretty proficient at Full Switch and still use the ole hat.. I say you really need to be able to scan and look. Some guys complain that the TrackIR boyz have the advantage. Don't listen to that.. That's bogus. If you can get proficient with mouse-look you (set your mouse sensativity 'in game' to 2.0 and make sure you have enough space to move your mouse around on your desk tray without hitting anything) then you will have better control than a trackIR pilot, who can sometimes get snagged up with his gear... I use both, and prefer TrackIR because it really 'MAKES the game' but in a pinch, I can always fall back on the mouse. Takes 1 month to learn. If you are right handed then right hand on stick and left hand on mouse...

9) Pick a wingman..any wingman... When you enter a Full Swictch game and see a guy out there ask him if you can fly his wing, even if he already has a wingman, join up with them and try to stick together... call out contacts and headings via chat so the others can respond.. ALSO, there is something about having a wingman which totally benefits you. 1st, you know that when you look at him, he is a friendly (generally). When you look back at your wingman, and see nothing, you know his six is clear.. when he looks at you he can see you are clear.. If you kinda thatch weave while you are en route, you can weave in and out of each other checking each other's six in the meantime.. A wide weave is better and you can decide how often to perform it.. Anyhow, the point is that having a wingman is more than just an extra set of eyes, in terms of 'seeing' -- it's a point of reference that each pilot can look *too* and then *beyond* thereby clearing each other "clr"..

10) Get away form your base when you climb.. Well one could argue this point, but if you climb right at your base, then it is likely that you are gonna get hit with your pants down.. I learned this the hard way, but you dont have to... Try heading away from base and away from the conflict to grab a little E (or was that a big 'e')... then come back into action.

There's pleanty more and I am sure some of the others have some good tips for the guys who wanna get into it.. I'd be interested in reading other peoples tips or refinements to what I have posted here.

Might be a good place for some Q & A...eh?

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BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 10:11 AM
1) Try 800 x 600. It will help your framerates and will make it easier to see. I also think it more accurately represents how planes look in real life at high distances.. but that's open to discussion...

2) Turn the brightness up a little on your monitor (if your monitor is old, you will have a dull picture also making it harder to see).

3) Keep your bearings straight.. If you don't focus on your heading and use visual flight references you can wander off and get lost...which means you wont see anyone.

4) the real experienced pilots will often climb above you. In full real, they can sometimes see YOU better than you see them, depending on time of day and whether there is snow on the ground. Try getting some angels and see if you start seeing more planes.

5) Look out of the side of your plane where you get the best FOV.. If you head straight for an IP, for example, you just wont see as much.. Try approaching where you 'think' the enemy is by cutting back and forth in a zig-zag, or 'come around the bend' in a wide curve.

6) Remember that the top pilots use the Sun and mist in FR... The best way to check for bandits in the sun is to cover the sun with the framing of your cockpit or you can move perpendicular to the sun and raise your wing up like it was your hand to cover the sun and look around it.. Another smart thing is never to turn your back to the sun.. if you can help it.

If there is mist or haze, try climbing until things clear. If you wanna bounce someone remeber you can come down into the mist and bounce them from below... Also, it's the one time that hitting the deck will REALLY hide you http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif...

7) Check your six -- cliche? You betchya! But with icons you can be much more lazy about checking your 6 than you can be in a FR game. In FR, if you are lazy about it, and dont 'wag' your tail outta the way to get a good look behind and below you, then your sorry 6 is gonna get pulled outta the sky over and over.. the easiest pilots to bounce are the ones who fly relatively straight and level for 15-20 seconds at a time (or longer).. If this is you, then you are in trouble. I once saw a plane way of in the distance. It took me about 2 minutes to get to him, but he never saw me approach. I spent the whole time positioning for an advantage and the whole time tried not to get caught.. I engaged my guns at about 250 meters and he never knew what hit him.. The whole time I am sure he thought he was doing a good job of checking his six, but he never really repositioned himself.. In the last 15 seconds of my attack, he still could have made me and juked if he had been awake...poor sod...

8) Hat Swicth? Hmmm. I know some pilots who are pretty proficient at Full Switch and still use the ole hat.. I say you really need to be able to scan and look. Some guys complain that the TrackIR boyz have the advantage. Don't listen to that.. That's bogus. If you can get proficient with mouse-look you (set your mouse sensativity 'in game' to 2.0 and make sure you have enough space to move your mouse around on your desk tray without hitting anything) then you will have better control than a trackIR pilot, who can sometimes get snagged up with his gear... I use both, and prefer TrackIR because it really 'MAKES the game' but in a pinch, I can always fall back on the mouse. Takes 1 month to learn. If you are right handed then right hand on stick and left hand on mouse...

9) Pick a wingman..any wingman... When you enter a Full Swictch game and see a guy out there ask him if you can fly his wing, even if he already has a wingman, join up with them and try to stick together... call out contacts and headings via chat so the others can respond.. ALSO, there is something about having a wingman which totally benefits you. 1st, you know that when you look at him, he is a friendly (generally). When you look back at your wingman, and see nothing, you know his six is clear.. when he looks at you he can see you are clear.. If you kinda thatch weave while you are en route, you can weave in and out of each other checking each other's six in the meantime.. A wide weave is better and you can decide how often to perform it.. Anyhow, the point is that having a wingman is more than just an extra set of eyes, in terms of 'seeing' -- it's a point of reference that each pilot can look *too* and then *beyond* thereby clearing each other "clr"..

10) Get away form your base when you climb.. Well one could argue this point, but if you climb right at your base, then it is likely that you are gonna get hit with your pants down.. I learned this the hard way, but you dont have to... Try heading away from base and away from the conflict to grab a little E (or was that a big 'e')... then come back into action.

There's pleanty more and I am sure some of the others have some good tips for the guys who wanna get into it.. I'd be interested in reading other peoples tips or refinements to what I have posted here.

Might be a good place for some Q & A...eh?

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XyZspineZyX
02-17-2004, 10:23 AM
All good advice. But I'd preface all of it with:

Change your attitude. Don't start with the idea that the mission is a failure if you're not hip deep in enemy within 5 minutes after wheels up.

Set yourself up for success: plan on getting altitude before contact. If you have a choice, don't take off from the base closest to the enemy or the front lines all the time. Take off from a rearward base and take a circuitous route. It really is OK to take 10 - 15 minutes to set up for entry to the battle zone. It won't kill ya, and it is NOT necessarily boring.

Don't fly in a straight line defined by the path between you and the enemy base. Rather, fly along areas parallel to it, possibly UPSUN, where you're likely to spot the doofus who DO fly these obvious routes. Fatten up on these doofus; that's what they're there for, to pad your personal score.

Take 75% or full fuel and plan on using all of it. Loiter in areas where enemy are likely to congregate. Pick your battles. Do risk assesment and fight when you have the advantage. Know when to cut your losses and leave.

And, above all, fly EVERY MISSION to survive and RTB, as though your life depended on it. This is hard to do, but it improves the experience.

crazyivan1970
02-17-2004, 10:27 AM
All great points Rav... but 800x600... dang man.. FB looks like .. well. I`m gonna move along http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 10:30 AM
Lol:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Don't fly in a straight line defined by the path between you and the enemy base. Rather, fly along areas parallel to it, possibly UPSUN, where you're likely to spot the doofus who DO fly these obvious routes. Fatten up on these doofus; that's what they're there for, to pad your personal score.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Pilot: "Contact, doofus, 10 o'clock low"

And CI: looks like Qrap? Ya get used to it.. Actually, I dont even notice anymore.. It's no sooo bad.. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

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adlabs6
02-17-2004, 10:44 AM
Some nice advice, but I often avoid "realistic" dogfight servers. The whole method of fly/search/kill/respawn has no tooth to it for me. Coops are far better suited to "realistic" settings, as there is a purpose to your squad's flight, whether recon, intercepetion, etc., beyond being the king of the hill.

Having a realistic mission objective laid out greatly assists enjoyment of "realistic" settings for me.

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BaldieJr
02-17-2004, 10:48 AM
don't forget to setup an easy-to-reach button:

` + Sorry, I use 800x600, didnt mean to TK you. + ENTER + ENTER

<pre class="ip-ubbcode-code-pre">
______ _____
(, / ) /) /) , (, /
/---( _ // _(/ _ / __ ,""""]
+----/ ____)(_(_(/_(_(__(__(/____/__/ (__--------,' /---+
| / ( / ,' NR / |
|(_/ ..-""``"'-._ (_/ __,' 42 _/ |
+-.-"" "-..,____________/7,.--"" __]-----+

</pre>

Zen--
02-17-2004, 10:52 AM
I have to absolutely agree on flying each sortie with the intent to survive and make it back to base, that mentality changes everything and makes the feeling more intensive.

Patience is a must, don't be in a hurry to get in a scrap. Consider that many people who fly full switch do exactly what Raven and Stiglr have said and are playing every card in their favor. Haste plays right into their hands, so think before you take off, use patience and get used to taking a lot of gas.

When I take off in a regular DF server, I always fly with 50% fuel, I plan on staying in the air for 20-30 minutes at a sortie or until ammunition runs out.

In a full difficult I take 75% and often plan to stay airborne for the entire mission cycle time...up to an hour if I'm capping a friendly area in particular. If going on the offensive bomb run, I'll take 50% and enough bombs to make a dent in the target, then be quick on getting in, dropping ordinance and getting out to maximize total sorties.


For these kinds of servers, a bit of extra planning is a must...and success is not really measured by how many kills you get but rather (in my case anyway) how well do I feel I executed my plan and did I achieve what I set out to do on that run. There are times when I score no kills at all...but perhaps I bombed the heck out of the target or chased away bandits which allowed my friendly Jabo's to complete the objective...I might come home with zero points but if I know others on my side came home with points because of what I helped do, thats more than enough for me.



Good post Raven, well thought out. S!

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

crazyivan1970
02-17-2004, 10:54 AM
I don`t relly have problems seeing planes at 1280x960 http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
Regards,

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VFC*Crazyivan aka VFC*HOST

http://www.rmutt.netfirms.com/coop-ivan.jpg

Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

XyZspineZyX
02-17-2004, 11:09 AM
adlabs wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Having a realistic mission objective laid out greatly assists enjoyment of "realistic" settings for me.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But, that IS a realistic misison objective to do a proper sweep or patrol at an alt that increases your chance for success, isn't it?

My point is, if more people flew that way instead of with their hair on fire and full of gamer mentality, the whole SERVER would see better action overall.

yarbles67
02-17-2004, 11:18 AM
What do you think prepares you for your full-real coops http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Full real dog servers like the ones Raven & Co host are money. You can surf out there and work on stuff that you'll use in your full real online wars.

By the way, some great advice has been dished out in this thread - good stuff!

The bottom line about full-real,full-hard, whatever you want to call it is anxiety. There's a certain level of anxiety, stress you experience in this format that you'll never experience with the difficulty watered down. The best example is pulling up to formation not knowing their oreintation. You get within 200 meters and realized you just pulled up to baddies and you're by youself. Then it's on.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by adlabs6:
Some nice advice, but I often avoid "realistic" dogfight servers. The whole method of fly/search/kill/respawn has no tooth to it for me. Coops are far better suited to "realistic" settings, as there is a purpose to your squad's flight, whether recon, intercepetion, etc., beyond being the king of the hill.

Having a realistic mission objective laid out greatly assists enjoyment of "realistic" settings for me.

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http://www.geocities.com/adlabs6/B/ | http://www.il2skins.com | http://777avg.com/omegasquad/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ColoradoBBQ
02-17-2004, 11:18 AM
Problem with checking your six on full real is whne you can identify the plane as an enemy, its too late.

SKULLS_LZ
02-17-2004, 11:23 AM
I'd like to respond to adlabs6: Blazing Magnums is a "scripted" DF server with team objectives. Not only are there team objectives for the DF map, the outcome of one battle affects the conditions in the next, i.e. available number of AC, bases and pos. of front lines. COOPS are great too, but they lack a key aspect that the scripted DF has, which is the constant action (danger), and completely unpredictable enemy.

Great Server (Blazing Magnums), and great post Raven! I can't thank you and your squad enough for bringing "Full Switch" to the masses!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Yeah I vulched ya. Now put a cork in it and pick another base before I bust a c@p in your sorry @ss.

JG14_Josf
02-17-2004, 11:31 AM
Josf: "Hertt, fast mover approaching 6 oclock"

Hertt: "Split, I'm right"

Josf: "Rgr, going left let's I.D. that bogey"

XyZspineZyX
02-17-2004, 11:34 AM
Colorado BBQ wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Problem with checking your six on full real is whne you can identify the plane as an enemy, its too late.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not necessarily. That's where your knowledge of the situation comes into play. Heading, alt, numbers, seeming "task" all give you important clues as to whether a dot is enemy or friendly. It's not foolproof by any means, but it is something.

Also, nothing's stopping you from getting on the My Army chat buffer: "dot 3km alt, B-3 near (name of town); friend?" Er, provided he's not closing too fast... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

TacticalSkirmsh
02-17-2004, 11:41 AM
Interesting discussion by thread starter.

While an experienced virtual pilot can and often does elude being shot down by one and maybe even two inexperienced pilots, the reality is that when a good pilot is on your six, the game is generally over.

Now there's a lot we could talk about with regards to not allowing, well easily allowing anyway, that bandit on your six, and yes lots of defensive strategies can be employed, but I'm talking about a GOOD player being on your six who is going to counter those attempts. Bottom line your going down.

Generally, you have two options in most DF servers. Make him work really (really) hard for his kill. Second, if you are near enough, drag him to your AAA guns (base).

Now, there is a possible third option that can and does happen, but not often enough, a team mate (well a player on the same side anyway) comes to your rescue.

Now this is where a combat flight game becomes a whole new experience. Wingmates make it possible to be in the worst situation and yet not become someone's next kill. It adds a new dimension that might see you returning to base more often and with some kills to show for it. Or at the very least, just coming home when by all accounts you shouldn't be.

:FI:TacticalS!

Cold_Gambler
02-17-2004, 11:58 AM
great advice.
I'm going to try 800 X 600- I can never see the other guy, even after we've engaged- it's the one thing that's stopped me from going FR. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 12:06 PM
right Stiglr...

there are times when I catch a bogie fast approaching.. I see him several clicks out, and continue to position for the egagement.

I make a call on comms that I have a bogie and ask my wingman to look at heading 0-3-0 high. He sees it and responds "contact" or "Tally" whatever...

Then I use comm's and determine that it is not a 357th man coming at us..

The plane is still approaching and closing quickly. I become more guarded, trying to position so I can begin a turn to get around on him and avoid a head-on by creating an impossible angle for him..

Maybe, in this case, he is so hot coming in and the haze and sun are making it more difficult that I still have not planformID-ed him, and he continues to move on me like I am the enemy...

He may or may not know if I am friendly, but he sure is displaying hostility..My wingman has positioned high now and is ready to bounce when the plane comes around me to engage....

Now I am really alert, I treat him like a bandit that is trying to force me into a head-on, while I continue to off-set what he is trying to do..

The angle I have created is sufficient and as he comes into range I discover it's a friendly and whoosh he shoots past me, now trying to jump on my six.. "It's a friendly!" I call out on comms to my wingman, "Not sure *he* know's it though.." I waggle my wings and try to convince him to break off the attack...while my wingman hastily types "FRIENDLIES!" enter "DONT SHOOT" enter

Anyhow, kinda fictional, but that's how we do it... or something like that...

And Baldie, although there are times when I fail to recognize planforms, it is more often that this doesnt happen at 8x6. But I find that at either setting, therer are times when you can have planform recognition problems.. Especially when a new plane is introduced into the soup on a subsequent map.. If you are used to seeing P-51's vs 109's and 190's and then a P47 or P-40 is introduced, it can kinda throw you...

Maybe I-- or perhaps one of the others here could take a bunch of screenshots of different planes at different distances for silouette (sp) recognition... Then we could post them on our site to help everyone improve their ID abilities.. Hmmm... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif now that's a thought..

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BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 12:15 PM
I keep saying planform when i really should be saying silouhette.. "silouette"? well as you can see I can't spell sillywet, so...

Planform is the shape of the plane, but I believe it relates to a top-down view only of the plane.. anyone correct me if I'm wrong, please.. I mix my terminology http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif up all the time....

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Zen--
02-17-2004, 01:48 PM
All unknown contacts should be treated as hostile until proven otherwise and as a rule, unless in friendly airspace under conditions I know that it is unlikely that enemy planes can be there, EVERY contact I see I immediately begin manuevering to attack. By manuever, I mean climbing for altitude and position, I rarely ever fly straight at a bandit to attack without thinking about the situation first.

You must always assume that a contact is hostile if it is moving toward you, unless you are 100% sure it is a friendly (like you just saw him take off, are on comms with him or something similar) and it's generally a good idea to assume that he has seen you also. By assuming that the contact sees you and is moving to engage you as hostile, you are as prepared as you can be and in the event that it turns out he is friendly, well you just found a wingman didn't you? If he's not friendly, you have already begun the engagement process and should be much better off than if you assumed he didn't see you or that he wasn't hostile.

If flying a Jabo, when I see contacts I immediately begin looking for ways to minimize my chances of being seen because on FR servers especially, I like to drop my ordinance in peace...I prefer to never see another AC friendly or hostile if possible. Thats my 'quiet time' so to speak, where I can drop bombs and not be harrassed by all those gunslinging fighter jocks http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

When flying offensive in a fighter, I realize that I pretty much try to follow the advice that Raven, Stiglr and others have mentioned here...always try to stack the cards in my favor.


What you will find on servers like the Blazing Magnums is something simulating reality pretty well. It's a game/simulation we fly, but the settings they use bring pretty much the best sense of immersion you can get on a computer with the technology in FB....there is the anxiety, the constant 6 checking, the uncertainty of what distant contacts are, the need for wingmen, the need to know how to navigate and understand the terrain, the need to plan ahead and play the odds to reduce or eliminate as many risks to oneself that one can....you know what that sounds like to me? What real life pilots went through. I don't claim FB to be real life, but when you actually turn all the difficulty settings on and are fortunate enough to find a host who understands the change to game play and makes missions accordingly, you really get the full effect of what FB can offer. It's a hell of a feeling too http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Keep up the good work BM, I also thank you for taking the time and effort to host a server that many might find to be too hard at first, but have the patience to provide the explanations and encouragement for them to give it a go.

&lt;S!&gt;

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

adlabs6
02-17-2004, 04:01 PM
Well, my comments have attracted a bit of unwanted fire.

Firstly, I made no negative comments about Blazing Magnums servers, how could I? I don't believe I've ever played on them.

Secondly, I made no negative comments about "realsitic" server settings. I simply said I didn't like them as much as "realistic" coops.

The topic title of this Raven's thread is: "I'd FLY Full Switch, but I can't find the enemy..." and then there are some thing to try to get up to speed. That's a great idea, and if it gets together well, might be sticky worthy. But my response is based on my experience that many "mid settings" pilots will become frustrated with air warfare if they repeatedly suffer from the feeling that they just can't get ahead. Sometimes, just taking it easy (settings your comfy with) is a great way to settle down, and maybe actually make some progress that you'll be proud of.

I mentioned coops because they rely more on a written objective often, more than a kill count objective. It makes for a better established patience IMO. Exactly as Stiglr wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>My point is, if more people flew that way instead of with their hair on fire and full of gamer mentality, the whole SERVER would see better action overall.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, I'm not trying to knock your server Raven, sorry if my original post was not clear enough to express this. http://www.geocities.com/adlabs6/B/bin/1/happy.gif

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JG27_Dacripler
02-17-2004, 04:11 PM
Thanks for the advise for the screen settings, I may try that for the Full Switch to give it a try.. I use the same 1280X960 @ 85 as Ivan has. Yet, I see dots on my 9700 pro with a 19" monitor. It is frustrating watching the shape of the aircraft change into what appears to be a 109- then a p-40 then a yes .. A LA or Yak.. Strange since the later patches in the game which IMHO have reduced the image and identification of the aircraft in terms of its true appearance. In a vertical, looking above and during the time of engagement aircraft model gives me frustration by its shape of being larger for a brief moment.. the aircraft slowly takes form to show the Id (Yak, P-40, 109 etc.) and finally snaps further out from where it actually "appears" to be at that particular instant. I am saying; the aircraft is indistinguised then gets larger for a brief moment. then fades smaller until it is finally recognised. I need to work the system to my advantage to find the settings in which I am fully capable of distinguishing the aircrafts silloutes. As the patches and video card drivers have changed, it has reduced the visual accurity as the game once had.. I have 12 different zoom settings and can only truely distinguish aircraft from afar by looking at them from a high and flat surface. I am not resistant to the change but in speaking of my own behalf, I think the visual representation of the aircraft is certainly beautiful. But the irony is not being capable of seeing the modeling from an accurate distance is the problem I face.

BM357_Raven
02-17-2004, 04:29 PM
Np. adlabs, I'd didnt get offended at all. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. We try to make our missions have tactical objectives beyond simple dogfighting. Sometimes, a certain map's victory requirement might be based on destroying a certain bridge, harrassing a convoy, or supporting a tank movement (of course the tanks are stagnant http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif). Sometimes strategic targets like factories or fuel cells are introduced. Soemtimes the map can be won according to combination of objectives or simply one of the following objectives:

Destruction of:

Planes, pilots, train cars, artillery, tanks, AAA, vehicles (trucks and cars) and ships.

I think that's all of them. When victory has been acheived, according to which team won, the next map is loaded to facilitate a 'result' or consequences of that victory.

So if the first map was a spearhead attack by an elite panzer unit, and the attack was successful with the support of 109's fending off some Il-2's, then when the next map is loaded to reflect this success with the front lines adjusted to reflect this.

Further, the Russians may, or may not have less planes and pilots at their disposal.. I think you get the idea..

[Thanks Sammie and BadBernie http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif]

Here's some more stuff that might help one or two people get better..:


FLAK: use FLAK as a spotter. Flak points out the enemy. So in a FR game, flak is your friend..

Ground Fire: (on finding the battle) Look for glistening lighting on the ground in the distance.. that can indicate where the battle is.. Follow the lights of the battle.

Tracers: (recognizing friendly from foe) Ever notice the blue tracers spewing from a 109? That's something you'll never see come from a P-51... So if you're the LW and you see blue tracers, you know he's one of your own http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif...

Landing: (on surviving) I need to practice this one more.. but when possible try to head to a base which is least likely to get attacked while you come in for a landing.. Maybe even pick the far one.. Bandits love to hover and prey on incoming and outgoing.. Vulching is ALWAYS allowed in our games and 'chuting' is too (because it leads to victory) and this is War... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Navigation: This is one of the more difficult things to master at Full Switch. So, for the beginner, you need to locate your magnetic or repeater compass.. In the german planes, if you don't know the "O" is East..I guess deduction would have made that evident. In the P-51 and P-39 the two long parallel pointers indicate your heading. You need to establish a basic sense of North/South or E/W before you get too far from base.

Look at the map and find the most recognizable feature near your airfield. When you spawn, look for this feature.. This will be a beacon to find your way back to base..

If the Sun is low, use it as a reference to help you with your headings. This will prove valuable as well. Other features like coast lines and lakes are invaluable.

I notice now that I can figure out where I am pretty quickly. It used to take a lot longer. In fact I used to get so lost that I would sometimes just find a base to land at hoping it was friendly and then respawn to start over.. Now I tend to almost instinctively know where I am...just takes practice.

When Lost: Altitude simplifies the appearance of the landscape. What I mean by this is that when you are really low, you are seeing too much detail which is hard to describe on the map. I find, that altitude makes it easier to recognize the larger visual references and relate them to what I see on the map. Key things to look for are:

<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>Coast Lines<LI>Cities<LI>Concrete Airdromes and other airfields (concrete airdromes can be seen from a very far distance)<LI>Lakes<LI>River Junctions<LI>Road Junctions<LI>Uniquely shaped forests or parts of forests<LI>Places where Roads and Rail Roads come together (RR's are grey on the map)<LI>And if worse comes to worse, there is always the end of the map..if you hit that you will see nothing but nothing..A no-man's land..Turn around then[/list]

Notice I try not to get too caught up on other minutia.. Bridges can be a blessing if it's a map with only a couple bridges, but if the map has 50 bridges,then it can get very confusing. Also, a map full of roads means that trying to recognize yoru location (when you are totally lost) by seeing a road in game and then trying to find it on the map, can be tough and take waaaaaay too much time, imo..

Look for something that is unique about a certain place. Like is a big wooded area split by a road? If there were hundreds of wooded areas split by roads then this wouldnt be very useful.. Check the map.. Ah there is only two different places where that occurs according to the map... So that means I am either here or there.. Now you've isolated things a bit..

Or how about, hey this river just dead ended ..hmm how many other rivers just stop in the middle of nowhere? Lemme check the map.. Oh, about 20...hmmm, but hey this one stops just east of a wooded with a small city to the south ... Now lemme check the map...

I know it's all pretty basic stuff, but anyhow, that's how I find my way around on a new map if I do get lost. The nice thing is that as you get better, you get lost less, and when you do get lost it is for a much shorter period of time..

Morning Mist: If there's a lot of mist, you can use it defensively, and hit the deck and usually vanish, but so can the enemy. This doesnt always work, but if you can create enough separation, you can kinda disappear while he's on yoru six and begin to alter your heading..

If you can't see and you are several thousand feet off the ground, you are probably still too low. Climb above it until things are clear...

Water and valleys offer more fog than higher places...

If you are low in fog, watch your altimeter.. Sometimes you are a lot lower than you think.

Clouds: Can help you and hurt you. Sometimes you will follow an enemy into a cloud. I general advise my guys against it.. Rather, I like to cover a cloud bank with two or three of my guys and keep an open eye for the whole body of the cloud to see where the bandit might pop out from.

If you have one on your six, the clouds will almost always offer you a safe getaway.. if they are dense and multiple. When you enter a cloud, situate your plane so you can stay in there as long as possible. Try to fool your opponent when you enter the cloud by changing your direction a little inside the cloud. When you exit look for the next cloud, and sorta bounce through them checking your six and speeding along. When you enter the cloud ignore the temptation to convice yourseld you are rightside. That feeling is a lie and will get you killed. Instead, go straight to your gauges and keep and eye on your artificial horizon and your VSI..

--Real Life Pilot Hazards of WWII--

Remember, in real life during WWII most pilots had no radar. Pilots got lost all the time. Even navigators in bombers could get mixed up. Real pilots would fly to what they were sure was a friendly base only to find the FLAK guns waiting for them when they were on a final approach. YES, THIS REALLY HAPPENED.

Pilots would get lost and run out of fuel and have to ditch it.

Pilots would shoot at and in some cases kill their own friendlies just because they 'thought' it was the enemy. P-51's look somewhat like a 109 in the distance..

Planes would disappear into clouds never to be seen again--pilots would get disoriented in there (notice today how VFR rated pilots cant go into clouds whereas IFR rated can)...Learn to trust your instruments.

Pilots would get stuck in dives, pilots would spray and pray and shoot up the whole sky without an enemy kill.. Pilots would get lost from the flights and end up alone only to get shot down...

All the things you experiece in FR is well within the parameters of the many things that REAL fighter pilots had to contend with..


---WHERE'S THE ACTION?---

It's over here.. I dont know about you guys, but man, I rarely have trouble finding the action. As long as there are at least 4 players (better to have more, of course) I never have trouble finding the action. Newer pilots just need to look for the signs and get a FEEL for the game. As you develop a new sense of Situational Awareness the nuances will begin to show through and you will start to find that you are always looking for the Full Switch game....

Where's the action? It's over here! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

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[This message was edited by BM357_Raven on Tue February 17 2004 at 04:05 PM.]

[This message was edited by BM357_Raven on Tue February 17 2004 at 04:07 PM.]

BM357_Fuser
02-17-2004, 07:28 PM
S~ adlabs6...

Flying FR or FS (Full Switch) can be somewhat confusing at first for sure. Newbee's entering the sim probably should ask themselves a question before joining any Full Real "FR" game, and that is: Why did i get IL2FB for in the first place. IMHO it is the closest thing we have to an experience that many during WW2 felt as they flew some of the toughest fights fought during the war. I agree with u on the difference between "mid-settings" pilots and some of us who want to take the sim to the utmost realistic settings we can get. "Ask our CO, Mr Raven" he'll tell you how stubborn I am about FR. I just cant hardly stand going down from 1200 x 1600 resolution on my screen. I have a 20" digital flat pannel to help my eyes, but damn that dot is small! I cant tell you the frusturation I have when someone with 800 x 600 see's me miles before i see him, but I enjoy the beauty of the graphics also, even tho it gets me killed most of the time http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif. I just plan to continue to use my highest settings possible, and get all the good advice I can from u guy's. In the mean time, for all "Mid-switch" guys contemplating going FR, dont despair. Most of us doing FR are allways willing to help someone to get better.

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adlabs6
02-17-2004, 08:14 PM
Hi again,

I forgot to add that I'm happy to see your squadron showing acceptance for running 800x600 for those who feel they need it. Hopefully this issue will be saved from a point of ridicule for those who admit to using it.

In my case, my poor eyesight is the main reason that I have to use lower resolutions. Each time I've had my eyesight checked, my vision has progressively worsened since the last time. As it stands now, I'm sitting 2 feet or less from my 17" LCD panel, and still I must squint to see a dot at resolutions above 1024x768 with my glasses on, and I'm only 26 years old!

Using the lower res settings is the only way I can play without great fatigue these days. Another helpful trick is slightly bumping the contrast settings, so that distant dots stand out a bit easier.

In anycase, I'll have to try to stop by your server to test the missions out.

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kyrule2
02-17-2004, 08:39 PM
Without reading the whole thread.

Good points Raven (I did read your posts), especially about looking for the ground fire and tracers, makes finding the enemy much easier. When I first started I couldn't id s*&t, but after some time it has become much easier. Thanks for taking the time to create this thread, hopefully it will attract more to BM and other full switch servers (the way the game was meant to be played IMO).

Actually I just wanted to say God Bless Blazing Magnums server because there is NOTHING like full switch. I love those night missions where it is difficult to even navigate and you canstantly have that feeling of being hunted. Thats what its all about.

In short, if you haven't tried full switch you are cheating yourself IMHO. It takes time to get used to, no doubt, but once you learn the finer points you will find the game more challenging, more immersive, more enjoyable, and more rewarding. Just my thoughts.

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Zen--
02-17-2004, 09:55 PM
Funny, when I'm in my D9 on those night missions, I feel like the hunter, not the hunted.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

kyrule2
02-17-2004, 10:14 PM
Zen, I mean in an unseen enemy kind of way http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif. Makes the "pucker factor" rise a-little.

Actually I feel like the prey until I see tracer rounds go off, then its "nose to the wind" time.

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Koan___
02-17-2004, 11:40 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by adlabs6:
I forgot to add that I'm happy to see your squadron showing acceptance for running 800x600 for those who feel they need it. Hopefully this issue will be saved from a point of ridicule for those who admit to using it.

In my case, my poor eyesight is the main reason that I have to use lower resolutions. Each time I've had my eyesight checked, my vision has progressively worsened since the last time. As it stands now, I'm sitting 2 feet or less from my 17" LCD panel, and still I must squint to see a dot at resolutions above 1024x768 with my glasses on, and I'm only 26 years old!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I also have a below average eyesight, adlabs6.
I wish your eyesight improve.
I wish you and i and all enjoy our lifes.
After all life is The ultimate FR/FS game.
Koan

Zen--
02-18-2004, 12:07 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kyrule2:
Zen, I mean in an unseen enemy kind of way http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif. Makes the "pucker factor" rise a-little.

Actually I feel like the prey until I see tracer rounds go off, then its "nose to the wind" time.

http://www.brooksart.com/Icewarriors.jpg

3./JG51_Hunde
http://www.jg51.com/<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I know what you mean when flying other planes definately, but there is something about the 190 that increases my confidence level dramatically, despite some of it's short comings. For me I just feel like I am untouchable, everything moves very slowly, I have all the time in the world to evade bandits close aboard, to pick the time and place of my attack and to work my way out of tight spots. I still get shot down, no uber pilot here, but the 190 is the one plane where I have no worries at all. Just been with it for a long time I guess.

When it comes to any conditions that don't completely favor TnB fighters, shucks, I just get a smile on my face and go to work.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

MatuDa_
02-18-2004, 12:48 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
All good advice. But I'd preface all of it with:

Change your attitude. Don't start with the idea that the mission is a failure if you're not hip deep in enemy within 5 minutes after wheels up.

Set yourself up for success: plan on getting altitude before contact. If you have a choice, don't take off from the base closest to the enemy or the front lines all the time. Take off from a rearward base and take a circuitous route. It really is OK to take 10 - 15 minutes to set up for entry to the battle zone. It won't kill ya, and it is NOT necessarily boring.

Don't fly in a straight line defined by the path between you and the enemy base. Rather, fly along areas parallel to it, possibly UPSUN, where you're likely to spot the doofus who DO fly these obvious routes. Fatten up on these doofus; that's what they're there for, to pad your personal score.

Take 75% or full fuel and plan on using all of it. Loiter in areas where enemy are likely to congregate. Pick your battles. Do risk assesment and fight when you have the advantage. Know when to cut your losses and leave.

And, above all, fly EVERY MISSION to survive and RTB, as though your life depended on it. This is hard to do, but it improves the experience.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

One great server to fly this style is virtualpilots1 in the hyperlobby. Most ppl there tend to fly in teams and use tactics described above. If this ticles your fancy, drop by and experience a different dogfight http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Bull-Dog.
02-18-2004, 06:35 AM
Have you noticed that more pilots are flying (Full Real or close to) servers. Perhaps more pilots are changing there preferance from fun to challange.
I enjoy both. Its nice to have the choice.

Still trying http://mysite.freeserve.com/bull_dog/images/1-picture1.jpg?0.9261296277898643 Still dying

kyrule2
02-18-2004, 06:40 AM
The funny thing Zen, is that I am wickedly successful during night missions. Maybe it is the fear that drives me or maybe it is like you said, an advantageous condition for the 190. The firepower and the increased ability to escape/hide makes the 190 devastating during the nocturnal stuff http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. And I agree with what you said.

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BM357_Raven
02-18-2004, 10:25 AM
Zen and I were flying against the city loaded with AAA.. There were like 4 or 5 P-51's buzzing around.. Sometimes you'd catch a glimpse on them, sometimes you'd even get a fix on them, but it cerainly was a challenge.

I found the defenders (the P-51's) got a little frustrated because they were essentially unable to stop Zen and I from strafing out their entire AAA. But I set it up to be timed, and if we didnt knock out our objectives the map would flip in favor of Blue...

I dunno, Zen, I think the did a pretty good job of harrassing us, what do you think?

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BM357_TinMan
02-18-2004, 11:49 AM
raven,

Get back to work http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Oh, me too http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif

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Zen--
02-18-2004, 12:06 PM
They did a darn good job (there were 5 of them? holy smoke, I was in more danger than I thought) but the advantage on that mission was definately with the attacker. We came in unseen, our targets lit themselves up when firing for easy identification (as AA guns are simple to see day or night when firing) and we could usually pull off into the distance to break contact, unless closely engaged.

I must say that whoever those mustang jocks were, they did a good job, at least twice I took direct fire from my 6 and you don't get there in the dark by accident. Naturally I never saw them coming lol, but fortunately having been bounced a zillion times by Yaks and La's during broad daylight has taught me a couple tricks here and there, the darkness was the icing on the cake for evasion.

I really had a lot of fun, stayed up way longer than I intended to and was late for work the next day. All worth it http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Say Raven, add some search lights next time...never gotten to fly around them online and I think with the stability of your server they shouldn't be a problem...I mean we had 4-6 planes over the target and at least 6 AA guns firing like crazy, I never had a bit of stutter which is great.


The thing I liked a lot was the engine noise as some unseen plane whipped past...whoaaaaaaaaaaaaa! Talk about intense. I found my hat snapping back and forth like a real pilot jerking his head to try and see what the heck just passed, who it was and which way they were going. Thrilling!

Night fighting is an order of magnitude more difficult than day fighting obviously. On full switch navigation becomes a critical skill and something even more important than that...collision avoidance with the ground. At night, like sometimes on winter maps also, you have no perspective on the ground, it all looks black and you can't tell how high you are. When engaging the AA guns, you are firing at it's muzzle flash which helps to see it, but gives you no real idea of your dive angle or relationship to the ground... I found myself constantly watching the artificial horizon, the target flash and my vertical sink rate all at the same time to try and stay oriented. Only bounced the tail wheel once on the pull up http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


I didn't think doing things like that all together was possible because I never need all that in a game with speedbar enabled...everything you really need is all right there on the speedbar, but in full switch all of your instruments help at one time or another. What surprises me the most though is how quickly you can adapt to doing all that simultaneously. It's not easy like the speedbar, but it's also nothing close to impossible and the learning curve is not nearly as bad as it might seem.


Had fun, see you again soon http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

BM357_TinMan
02-18-2004, 12:37 PM
Thanks Zen for the praise and the enthusiastic account of your time on our server.

As the administrator of our server and someone that has built some of the maps that are flown there (Raven built the map set to which you are refering) I can tell you that A great deal of time and energy is put into it.

It is really nice to hear from those (I have seen a couple of other posts from others too, thanks to them as well) that come to our server that they enjoyed the scenerios provided by our map builders and did experience excessive amounts of lag/stutter.

S~

BM357_TinMan
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BM357_Raven
02-18-2004, 03:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Say Raven, add some search lights next time...never gotten to fly around them online and I think with the stability of your server they shouldn't be a problem...I mean we had 4-6 planes over the target and at least 6 AA guns firing like crazy, I never had a bit of stutter which is great.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I did have spotlights but for some reason they never activated..http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif but that's the first thing I mentioned when we got over there.. Gotta go back and see how I goofed http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

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BM357_Raven
02-18-2004, 08:41 PM
zat it for this post?...guess so...how's that song for the Good, the Bad and the Ugly go?

Man that is one of the stupidist movies.. And for some reason I love it..why is that i wonder http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/crazy.gif

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Zen--
02-18-2004, 10:00 PM
The good, the bad and the ugly is one of the GREATEST movies ever made and is probably the best western film period :|

Bite your tongue! (and bring on them darn spotlights)

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

NedsDead
02-18-2004, 10:56 PM
That sure sounds like fun. I've had this sim since the first day I spotted it on a store shelf but never had a pc strong enough to fly with more than 3 or 4 planes.

I was thinking about online air racing since I have no idea how to dogfight but after reading this post I hope to become an easy TARGET soon!

I'm still trying to learn what the mixture and prop setting do for my plane and what point my engine comes apart.

Zen--
02-18-2004, 11:06 PM
S~ Ned, welcome to the forums. Check out BM357 in hyperlobby when you get the chance.

What plane are you flying btw?

-Zen-
Formerly TX-Zen

NedsDead
02-18-2004, 11:14 PM
S! I just posted under a new topic and fogot to introduce myself http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif I don't really fly any yet due to poor pc performance but I hope to hookup a new one this weekend.

BM357_Raven
02-19-2004, 09:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
The good, the bad and the ugly is one of the GREATEST movies ever made and is probably the best western film period :|

Bite your tongue! (and bring on them darn spotlights)
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

you're too much...

"....and then there were searchlights..."

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BM357_Raven
02-19-2004, 02:27 PM
searchlights are in there and the right color.. I wonder...? Do they not work in a DF maybe?

The only other thing I noticed is that it was a little hazy in there. I turned that off, but...? I dunno...

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_____________________________


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Blazing_Magnums Server (http://bm357.com/NEW_BM357/server.htm)