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Steaky_361st
02-26-2004, 08:35 PM
After reading Gibbages post on B&Z, I have begun to feel that his attitude towards B&Z is contagious. Ive actually found myself being kicked off of online servers for using the tactic...as the admins have said stuff like "I am untouchable" (Direct Quote..speaker will not be mentioned). I should also note that the admin did in fact shoot me down once while i was B&Zing.

I would like to also add that I am NOT vulching or base hugging...i wait for them to engage my fellow teammates or start climbing up after me well after takeoff.

Im an American Plane Flyer...and with the way the P51 and P47 are modeled, low and slow turnfights end in death. With all the La7/Yak/Ki84 Pilots even pure non B&Z energy fighting is a huge risk.

I dont mean to start another flame war on the topic.

Im just sayin...

-----------------------------------------------
Steaks
Cpt 375thFS
"And you thought the meat last night was tough..."

Steaky_361st
02-26-2004, 08:35 PM
After reading Gibbages post on B&Z, I have begun to feel that his attitude towards B&Z is contagious. Ive actually found myself being kicked off of online servers for using the tactic...as the admins have said stuff like "I am untouchable" (Direct Quote..speaker will not be mentioned). I should also note that the admin did in fact shoot me down once while i was B&Zing.

I would like to also add that I am NOT vulching or base hugging...i wait for them to engage my fellow teammates or start climbing up after me well after takeoff.

Im an American Plane Flyer...and with the way the P51 and P47 are modeled, low and slow turnfights end in death. With all the La7/Yak/Ki84 Pilots even pure non B&Z energy fighting is a huge risk.

I dont mean to start another flame war on the topic.

Im just sayin...

-----------------------------------------------
Steaks
Cpt 375thFS
"And you thought the meat last night was tough..."

noshens
02-26-2004, 08:44 PM
If you didn't intend to start a new falme war you should've said that in the gibbages post http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif.

SlickStick
02-26-2004, 08:45 PM
Steaky, do you really want to fly on a server that limits your tactics? I'm thinking no.

There are sooo many great servers out there. Don't get bogged down by ignorant hosts. Just move on and B and Z until your hearts content somewhere else.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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Vladimir_No2
02-26-2004, 08:46 PM
If everyone just flew B-239s and I-153s there would be no problems.

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SlickStick
02-26-2004, 08:46 PM
BTW, got a linky to that thread? I could use a good laugh about now,http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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VW-IceFire
02-26-2004, 08:53 PM
You were kicked for using a entirely legitimate tactic! Oh for godsakes...people are insane.

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Bearcat99
02-26-2004, 08:59 PM
You never heard of the flying your plane to its strengths cheat? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

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SlickStick
02-26-2004, 09:06 PM
Hehe, ZING!http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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Menthol_moose
02-26-2004, 09:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bearcat99:
You never heard of the flying your plane to its strengths cheat? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Even B&Z planes like the P47 should be flown in turning dogfights just to make it all nice and fair and so there is no more tears http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif



Eh, mates! What's the good word?

Eagle_361st
02-26-2004, 11:16 PM
When they cry about me using BnZ I just load up a P-39 and beat them low and slow. Then they cry they want me to go back and fly my P-47. LOL You just can't win, I guess we should just fly straight and level with our flaps down and 50% throttle to make it nice and easy for them. Oh well, I guess I am a lame BnZ cheater too. LOL

~S!
Eagle
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Griffon_25th
02-26-2004, 11:24 PM
BnZ is pretty easy, and its pretty hard at the same time. I hate it when im getting BnZed by several fighters and the rest of my team isnt even fighting for me. But i still persist! sorta a tangent but meh... This is the internet.

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SlickStick
02-27-2004, 01:30 AM
"but meh... This is the internet."

Truer words were never spoken.http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

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CARBONFREEZE
02-27-2004, 01:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Eagle_361st:
When they cry about me using BnZ I just load up a P-39 and beat them low and slow. Then they cry they want me to go back and fly my P-47. LOL You just can't win, I guess we should just fly straight and level with our flaps down and 50% throttle to make it nice and easy for them. Oh well, I guess I am a lame BnZ cheater too. LOL

~S!
Eagle
Commanding Officer 361st vFG
http://www.361stvfg.com
http://home.comcast.net/~smconlon/wsb/media/245357/site1003.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is 150% true.

Russian aircraft require skill to fly.
German aircraft require ten times that skill, and one hundred times the patience!

If guns are responsible for crime, my keyboard must be responsible for my spelling!

WUAF_CO_CRBNFRZ on HyperLobby

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BM357_Raven
02-27-2004, 02:30 AM
The Best Pilots Got it All:

I hate getting bounced.. I hate getting bounced once. I hate getting bounced twice, buy you know what I hate most of all is getting bounced thrice..

So here is my story:

One bright simulated sunny day when I was but a tot, I was buzzing circles and making lot's of pretty T's and B's with others who liked it a lot.

Our game was to weave and whirl about like cute little buzzing bees, buzzing through the meadow and beneath invisi-trees.

When all of the sudden, out came this guy from the sky with a rumbling thunder like a hawk drinking whiskey and rye.

He ripped us to pieces and disappeared back to his perch. Then, he repeated this atrocity over and over. First, one guy was dead and then so was all the rest of us.

I began to think thoughts that most certainly were battic when all of the sudden a lightbulb went on in the attic.

It occurred to me, like it must have occurred to real pilots of the day, that I had to go up just above the perch of that guy in the sky who has bounced me not once, nor twice, but thrice and blow him away.

So up, up, up I followed him with intensions of brutality. Up, up up, I scooted just behind him to catch him, or at least this was my mentality.

But wouldn't you know it, this B&Z-er had a plan for this too. For as I ran out of airspeed, I stalled just a little, then a little bit more, and as I nosed down this sucker from the sky swooped towards the floor to destroy me once more...man I was a fool...

Now I was angry in a way hard to express within the parameters of this forum, but let us just say that I wanted to get that sucka!

No matter how hard I tried, as long as I remained a simple little T&B, buzzing to and froe (fro?), I was never gonna catch the B&Z sucka and I was never gonna grow.

So I began to study and listen and read and watch some more, until I began to realize that this B&Z sucka was smarter than I had ever thought before.

It was HE--the one who used energy management, precision tactics and patience with perfection, who was the master strategist, the ruler, the top dawg, and the only one in the game with out a red-faced complex-tion.

Then I began to study the Way. As I practiced I became worse and worse, then a little better, then a little worse. But slowly I learned that this was an art and that there were many facets in his domain that shattered the simplicity of the basic chase-'em-around-and-try-to-slip-in-behind-them-over-and-over-video-game.

Then, I understood the contest of great fighter pilots was not as simple as turning and burning or booming and zooming, but playing every advantage in your favor and acting with brilliance like a master tactician. But to the more simple folk this great pilot might appear more like an imposter, cheater, or magician.

And nothing could be further from the truth. For T&B, you see is only the second half of a battle for two giants of the sky who have tied in their attempts to get or use an altitude advantage over the other guy.

And nothing could be greater, more poetic or more perfect then the one who,-- after stalemating his rival in the sky--bring's him down to his level where he can stomp and pounce and slice him to bits and then walk away like the bad mofo he be...

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JG5_UnKle
02-27-2004, 06:25 AM
BM357_Raven That was superb mate S!

Reminds me of Poe http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

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TugZooey
02-27-2004, 06:30 AM
/bravo Raven

Perfect description with a touch of class & style.

SUPERAEREO
02-27-2004, 06:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BM357_Raven:
Then, I understood the contest of great fighter pilots was not as simple as turning and burning or booming and zooming, but playing every advantage in your favor and acting with brilliance like a master tactician. But to the more simple folk this great pilot might appear more like an imposter, cheater, or magician.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Truer words were never spoken.

And I, a TnB'r, say so.

S!

Bull-Dog.
02-27-2004, 06:34 AM
Raven that was an interesting post. Youve got me thinking. Maybe thats my problem with my flying. I only have skill in one type of flying. I have noticed that it is always the B&Z pilots that always get me. Maybe i need to gain skills at B&Z to become a better pilot.
I think that I will try flying a P47 for a while and see what happens.

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BSS_Goat
02-27-2004, 06:40 AM
I want everyone to know I reported this post to the mods..... ya'll should be ashamed, making fun of our fellow pilots. tssskkk tsssskkk

F19_Ob
02-27-2004, 07:57 AM
As all sane people know, both TnB and BnZ were tactics developed to overcome weaknesses in the planes.

A fw190 in slow speed turning with any allied plane is normally shot down. Just being caught at low altitude is extreemly lethal for any axis plane.
The same way an allied plane is in trouble trying to climb towards any axis on altitude.

Only 3 fw's can keep an enemy airfield occupied and shoot down many or all spawning and taking off ,or all planes at the the deck low on E.
This is ofcourse no fun situation for the allied team. But if the team concentrate their efforts it is absolutely possible to turn the tables.


I have been in situations where I was in a p39 with a wingmate trying to keep 4 BnZ fw's (probably on voice too) off our planes taking off, and we could only get 1 or 2 sec snapshots at them when they attacked or flew past. It was a very hard situation and many got shot down, but the fw used the only sound tactic availiable. As soon as any allied succeded in coming close to a fw he got the rest of the fw behind him and it is also very easy to escape from p39's in a fw.

Ofcourse The allied should counter a threat like this with the best allied fighters for the job.

I have shot down many axis vulchers in this situation with yak3 (wich is the best) and also many with La7 (next best), although Im not fully familiar with any of them. But its still difficult if they are 3 or more axis and u still have to wait for them to make mistakes before u are able to close in.



Ohh.... and btw I have just been shot down the third time in a yak3 since I started to evaluate it. 2 of the times I had been damaged by flak flipping all over the place and the third was a bounce wich cripled my engine http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif It is almost as good as fw190.

karost
02-27-2004, 08:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Originally posted by BM357_Raven:


So I began to study and listen and read and watch some more, until I began to realize that this B&Z sucka was smarter than I had ever thought before.

It was HE--the one who used energy management, precision tactics and patience with perfection, who was the master strategist, the ruler, the top dawg, and the only one in the game with out a red-faced complex-tion.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

seem you learn very fast BM357_Raven yes .... you are the one of a smart guy... LOL


again... for the one who cry out the BnZ hit you .. please read BM357_Raven post 10 times and down your anger emotion , then select one of two way bellow

a) make home work like BM357_Raven did or

b) host you server with message "for gentlemen only ( BnZ go away )" http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif this would be save a time from many friend before join your host.



wwii air combat is like a chess game in speed of 350 km/h. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

now let's talk about how to Anti-BnZ tactic.

for me
1. do not let any enemy over your head
2.1 if I see a guy will bnz me and I have a time I will drive and break when he close and full shot with mg when he extend climb. like I-16 did with 109. or
2.2 I will drive at very low lever (50 meter) and see how he smart to BnZ me at low level and heading to the friend group. or AAA gun http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif or

2.3 if he not smart and let me climb at same level to him .... ha ha then let see who is the master of energy tactic. plus deflection shoting LOL...

anti-bnz tactic is very hard to success ... but
possible like play a chess.

###
ok any one would like to share tactic for anti-bnz tactic please join...
so the boy will stop cry



S!



S!

flyingskid2
02-27-2004, 08:37 AM
anti-B&Z? just get an I-16. Then it will be a stalemate. Or if you're lucky you might even kill the B&Zoomer. Of course, all bets are off if you are outnumbered. But 1 vs 1, pure T&B vs B&Z is a stalemate.

BM357_TinMan
02-27-2004, 09:05 AM
That was pretty slick Raven.

BM357_TinMan
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BM357_Raven
02-27-2004, 09:35 AM
Bull-Dog:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
I think that I will try flying a P47 for a while and see what happens.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not talking you away from the P-47, but I use P-51, unless I need a really heavy gun platform for ground attack. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the P-47--it's a real man's plane, but if you do like to fly the P-51, it's the fastest plane in the set with one of the highest compression speeds.

I have some good tips I'll pass on to you. When you B&Z with the P-51, keep your dive shallow; 30 degrees down pitch max and when you pull out, go easy cause you'll black out otherwise.

When you dive, close your radiator. In slow climbs, where you want to achieve your best climb rate, 165 mph (min), radiator full open, throttle 106% WEP. Not at all what the P-51 manual reads..but....

Be super easy on the controls, go for speed and extension over the tight turns which bleeeed speeeed and make you black out. Use the LIGHT TOUCH on the stick and extend away and *then* go for Alt if the bandit's got momentum with you, otherwise just go for more alt and re-position for the return attack.

To run away from a 109 or 190, be steady, trim, 5-15 degrees nose down pitch, radiator closed, power 88-92%. You will pull away with your lower drag aerodynamics--this was a tip from someone else. If you just dive, your drag will be less, but it wont always be enough to really get away and will instead just bleed valuable altitude which will be hard to regain thus making it hard to regain the strenghts of your plane..But sometimes you gotta do what ya gotta do...

I have read the P-51 manual and the manifold pressures dont seem to jive completely with what I find in FB, but, well.. maybe I dont know how to read manuals :S.

Always use at least 2 P-51's. Two P-51's vs two top notch 109 pilots is more in your favor than one P-51 vs one top notch 109 pilot.. Don't get suckered, but do all the suckering.

Also the top dawgs can often be found around 20,000 ft or more. If you make the mistake of thinking 10,000 - 15,000 ft is tall, then you are gonna be sucker-punched.

Having said this, if you are wanting to bounce bottom feeders, you can't do it from 22k ft. If they are at 1000-3000ft (I always talk feet cause we dont use speedbar--we also dont use icons so things are a little different between Full Switch and Mid-Switch games)-- then I recommend being somewhere around 10,000 before you start your attack.

The achiles heel of this statement is that you are open prey for the guy from 15-20,000 ft at angles 10. Again, good to have some buddies for backup.

I am sure that much of this you already have an idea of, but I'm sure there is something fresh to be learned.

S~

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Eagle_361st
02-27-2004, 10:11 AM
While Ravens advice on the P-51 is very good and pretty much spot on in regards to the Mustang, I have a few things to add. The P-51 is an excellent aircraft for learning BnZ, it's extremely fast, excellent high speed manueverablility, excellent high speed control response(sometimes too good i.e. blackouts) and most importantly offers excellent visability.

But I feel I must come to the defense of my trusty mount of all these years, my P-47. She is not a fat lady unless you fly her like one. Meaning that the P-47 can offer many if the same qualities of the P-51, and some even better. Sorry to say, but the P-47 is not purely a ground pounding aircraft, she is deadly leathal in the right hands. If you can master the P-47, you can easily master the P-51 or any other BnZ aircraft for that matter.

To do this, you will need patience and have the knowledge that there is always a learning curve and if you make one mistake it is game over. Grab a D-27(if you are going FR or with pit locked, I dont suggest starting with the D-10 or 22 as they don't afford the visibility of the D-27 and take alot more getting used too), extra ammo and no more than 50% fuel. Line up, warm your engine with rad flaps at setting 4 or 6 and take off at 99% throttle. Once your up climb at a rate of 20-25% initial climb and vary your throttle between 99-110%. And climb away from the action, changing direction and banking as well. Believe it or not the P-47 will climb very well in a spiraling climb. Keep climbing until you reach no less than 6K Meters or roughly 18-20K feet for the non-speed bar folks. Then level out keep your rad at 4 or 6, and throttle back to 70-80% throttle and head to where you suspect action. Now put your head on a swivel, SA is very important look everywhere including above you. While most action in DF servers will be at 1-3K, there are marauders like myself up high looking so that juicy target of opportunity, so be prepared. Once you have found your target and I suggest you find loners, dont try to engage in a furball, unless absolutely neccassary or if a team mate needs help. Pick your best angle, which is generally directly above(This depends on your distance in altitude), or above and behind. Place yourself for the run all the while maintaining your speed. Close those rad flaps, throttle back to 50% and roll over and down onto the target(Throttling back helps in your fight against torque), once on your way down throttle up to 90%, you will pick up a tremendous amount of speed. Close too firing range and be sure to use lead, and hold your fire until no more than 300 meters, go for the wingroot or cockpit. After the bounce your target should be dead or severly damaged and not looking to continue the fight. But roll under and to the right of the target and back up, keep your rad close and throttle all the way to 110% and go right back up to your perch high up into the sky. Now repeat if the target is not dead, but be careful know he knows your there, best to trick him and make him think you moved on. If he is dead go find the next target. One last thing remember the Jug does not turn well, unless you are fast and at high altitudes, but she rolls very well. Roll into turns, use rudder, and throttle to help you in turns as well. There is a lot of power coming from that big radial and alot of torque, so throttling back and kicking rudder while in a roll or a turn will help very much. Try it see what you think, and if nothing else try flying with some of us Jug drivers out there. There are many to learn some of our cagey tricks from. Hope this helps, and if you feel the Mustang is your ide follow Ravens advice and tactics they are very good. But don't be afraid to learn the Jug either. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

~S!
Eagle
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karost
02-27-2004, 10:56 AM
flyingskid2:- But 1 vs 1, pure T&B vs B&Z is a stalemate.


ok I have one good case study from MarkShot's STK/EAW for anti-bnz tactic



You Opponent Applies BnZ with big energy advantage
==================================================
if you stay at 2000 meter and speed just 350 km/h then see one guy over you at 4000 meter or over and start drive to you with speed over 500 km/h , you are going to dodge out his way when the range get close to 900 meter. Do not dodge too soon or you will give him a chance to line you up again and settle in on your six.

the recommend dodge is a "Split-S" why ?
# it is the beast option to maintaining your good turning speed.
# the guy could try to depress his nose to shoot while you Split-S is not easy at high speed drive.
# then he need to invert and pull after you while he is still accelerating. that make him move away from you.
# but if he try to follow after you Split-S .... at his speed over 500 km/h .. black out is his result.



you have to see him after you "Split-S" what type of his reponse ?
-----------------------------------------------------------------

1) he just level and extends up and away -&gt; then you roll out of the bottom of your split-S heading in other direction and climb to regain altitude until you speed back to 350 km/h., well this reponse reflect that he is very keep decipline of cool and you can have a chance to reduce the altitude separation with him.


2) he just invert and pull towards you to follow "with out decelerate" , then roll into another Split-S at the bottom of your current one. if you see that.. make second split-s you will find him below you and inside his turning circle. as I said if he black out .. so you have a change over him very good position for next move.


3) he just invert and pull towards you to follow and "cut throttle and open combat flap" it mean he will not kill you with BnZ but he will kill you with angle tactic wow that is very very danger coz you can not see him and he still hold a lot of energy at that time ..... he stay at good position good angle of your six and have alot energy to play engle with you ..
this guy very danger ... then you have two or three option.
3.1 if you are high enough from the ground then should chop throttle and begin a defensive spiral down ( or if you in 109 dump manual pitch less then 30% and open radiator full and open just combat flap coz he will see and understand your next move )[and I don't like this option ]
3.2 or play dance with horizontal scissors wolf http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
3.3 if you are high enough from the ground ,A barrel roll spin break (my most favor..just pull barrel roll hard unit it become spin your speed will drop fast keep look back at him while you spin he will come close and fast and open fire at you but not easy if he miss or his ammo not hit a major part keep look back to him before he fly pass to you ... push max power of throttle and re-cover from spin **** head down lettle bit for gain more speed then pull up you will see him with very good angle of shot now .... depend on you skill of gunnery recommend full brush wih mg to damage his control before he pull up away ....



I have experience with 3.3 option by shot 2x P51 down with apply same tactic ... I shot him not a mg 13mm but I give him my 108 30MM deflection while he try to pull up away .... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif



S!
check...
now is your turn http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

XyZspineZyX
02-27-2004, 11:16 AM
You got KICKED off a server for using a legitimate tactic???

You really need to reconsider the company you keep.

Go to a better DF server.

faustnik
02-27-2004, 11:35 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

But I feel I must come to the defense of my trusty mount of all these years, my P-47. She is not a fat lady unless you fly her like one. Meaning that the P-47 can offer many if the same qualities of the P-51, and some even better. Sorry to say, but the P-47 is not purely a ground pounding aircraft, she is deadly leathal in the right hands. If you can master the P-47, you can easily master the P-51 or any other BnZ aircraft for that matter.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

S! Eagle

I respect anyone who is willing to master a difficult a/c like the P-47.

Even though you are a n00b for not mastering the endless circle jerk dogfighting technique! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/crazy.gif

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crazyivan1970
02-27-2004, 11:54 AM
Ok folks, it`s Eagle vs Raven ... who can type more and faster contest... GET BACK TO WORK DAMN IT!!! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Kicking people from servers is lame in general... unless they are complete asshats.

V!
Regards,

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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

BM357_Raven
02-27-2004, 12:13 PM
I think I just need a good firing crazyivan... that would cure me from visiting these forums at work...

Eagle wrote:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
If you can master the P-47, you can easily master the P-51 or any other BnZ aircraft for that matter.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Can't argue with that... Last night I was fighting against the Jug with a 109 and landed a shot along the nose of the 47 that I am sure would've knocked the pony out of commission..

Before the P-51 came to FB, I think the Jug was my favorite plane in FB... I kinda like the 40 for various reasons--things so funky...

But still, if I have a serious mission with a lot of ground targets, that bad boy (the "47") really comes in handy.. Wish the 51 had rockets too.. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Cant wait for the P-38....I have P-38 model (approx 2.5 feet wingspan) with 5 rockets per wing, two lbs (think 500lbs), six fuselage bazooka rockets. Anyone know if all this was acheivable including the guns? Seems like a lot, but man does it look mean...

I should check my P-38 manual...doh!

BACK TO WORK RAVEN!!!!!

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BM357_TinMan
02-27-2004, 12:46 PM
LMAO

Raven v. Eagle

Who would win indeed?

They both made good points though...good advice for Full Switch DF server for sure

BM357_TinMan
xo BM357 VFG
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Bearcat99
02-27-2004, 01:01 PM
One key factor I notice everybody overlooked ... I guess because it goes without saying...but is so easilly forgotten when a novice attempts the tactic.... if you're a poor shot then the B&Z can get you killed..... The key to te B&Z is not onmly E retention...but hitting your target on that first pass..... I would always come in too steep in a boom (50-80 degrees) resulting in my blacking out on the climb and becoming a sitting duck....... Also Raven you hit the nail on the head....patience is key with the B&Z.... sometimes you get so hungry for the kill that you go for the boom before the target is ripe...or before your attitude and escape are thoroughly thought through...

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Cajun76
02-27-2004, 01:07 PM
Here ya go, Raven. One has the droptanks and .50cal gunpods, the other has rockets and bombs, a serious mudmover. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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Good hunting,
Cajun76

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What if there were no hypothetical questions?

Steaky_361st
02-27-2004, 04:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stiglr:
You got KICKED off a server for using a legitimate tactic???
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Yes twice actually

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