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Dreadnought77
09-11-2004, 01:42 PM
Just got a few random newbie questions I couldn't find the answer to. If you wouldn't mind helping me out, I'd appreciate it.

1: What is 'Vulching'? Is it like respawn camping?

2: Do you know of any offline single missions/campaigns/qmbs, whatever, that you can use an IL2t (torpedo bomber) against ships? Torpedos look like fun, but I never got a chance to play around with them. Also, does anybody know how much they weigh, roughly? It seems torpedo bombers sacrifice almost all other armerment just to carry 1 or 2 torpedos. Against boats, are torpedos that much better than, say, a 1,000 pound bomb and a couple rockets? (Which would also leave plenty of bullets for me to spray harmlessly into the sky in 1 gigantic burst...speaking of which, they need to add a Crowbar/Knife/Brass Knuckles/Chainsaw for melee air to air combat. Am I the only who watches the history channel documenteries about Soviet aces challenging German aces to knife fights?)

3: Is it possible to harm the people fleeing their rides, and if so, is there any advantage to it? I've honestly never killed a ground crew and left the vehicle intact (that I know of).

4: Kinda related to 3...is it possible to kill *AI* pilots/tailgunners with a lucky shot? I know the AI can kill your gunners and pilot this way, and I know it works online, but I can't seem to recreate this against the AI. I seriously spent like half an hour in the QMB setting up 1 on 1s against B-17s and He-111 trying to take out the pilot going straight at the cockpick. I tried to do the same against the tailgunners. I shot down several with sustained fire to the cockpit/turrets, but I never saw the gunners stop firing, and I defenitly never saw the plane just go 'limp' like the pilot was hit. I've seen many people complain about this with FB/AEP/Something, and had it happen to me in multiplay several times, but Ill be damned if I can master it.

Thanks again.
Dreadnought

Dreadnought77
09-11-2004, 01:42 PM
Just got a few random newbie questions I couldn't find the answer to. If you wouldn't mind helping me out, I'd appreciate it.

1: What is 'Vulching'? Is it like respawn camping?

2: Do you know of any offline single missions/campaigns/qmbs, whatever, that you can use an IL2t (torpedo bomber) against ships? Torpedos look like fun, but I never got a chance to play around with them. Also, does anybody know how much they weigh, roughly? It seems torpedo bombers sacrifice almost all other armerment just to carry 1 or 2 torpedos. Against boats, are torpedos that much better than, say, a 1,000 pound bomb and a couple rockets? (Which would also leave plenty of bullets for me to spray harmlessly into the sky in 1 gigantic burst...speaking of which, they need to add a Crowbar/Knife/Brass Knuckles/Chainsaw for melee air to air combat. Am I the only who watches the history channel documenteries about Soviet aces challenging German aces to knife fights?)

3: Is it possible to harm the people fleeing their rides, and if so, is there any advantage to it? I've honestly never killed a ground crew and left the vehicle intact (that I know of).

4: Kinda related to 3...is it possible to kill *AI* pilots/tailgunners with a lucky shot? I know the AI can kill your gunners and pilot this way, and I know it works online, but I can't seem to recreate this against the AI. I seriously spent like half an hour in the QMB setting up 1 on 1s against B-17s and He-111 trying to take out the pilot going straight at the cockpick. I tried to do the same against the tailgunners. I shot down several with sustained fire to the cockpit/turrets, but I never saw the gunners stop firing, and I defenitly never saw the plane just go 'limp' like the pilot was hit. I've seen many people complain about this with FB/AEP/Something, and had it happen to me in multiplay several times, but Ill be damned if I can master it.

Thanks again.
Dreadnought

Bearcat99
09-11-2004, 04:13 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dreadnought77:
Just got a few random newbie questions I couldn't find the answer to. If you wouldn't mind helping me out, I'd appreciate it.

1: What is 'Vulching'? Is it like respawn camping?

No.. vulching is shooting down planes in a DF server that are parked, landing,taking off, or taxiing.

2: Do you know of any offline single missions/campaigns/qmbs, whatever, that you can use an IL2t (torpedo bomber) against ships? Torpedos look like fun, but I never got a chance to play around with them. Also, does anybody know how much they weigh, roughly? It seems torpedo bombers sacrifice almost all other armerment just to carry 1 or 2 torpedos. Against boats, are torpedos that much better than, say, a 1,000 pound bomb and a couple rockets? (Which would also leave plenty of bullets for me to spray harmlessly into the sky in 1 gigantic burst...speaking of which, they need to add a Crowbar/Knife/Brass Knuckles/Chainsaw for melee air to air combat. Am I the only who watches the history channel documenteries about Soviet aces challenging German aces to knife fights?)

No answer for that one.....

3: Is it possible to harm the people fleeing their rides, and if so, is there any advantage to it? I've honestly never killed a ground crew and left the vehicle intact (that I know of).

That is another form of vulching... yes.

4: Kinda related to 3...is it possible to kill *AI* pilots/tailgunners with a lucky shot? I know the AI can kill your gunners and pilot this way, and I know it works online, but I can't seem to recreate this against the AI. I seriously spent like half an hour in the QMB setting up 1 on 1s against B-17s and He-111 trying to take out the pilot going straight at the cockpick. I tried to do the same against the tailgunners. I shot down several with sustained fire to the cockpit/turrets, but I never saw the gunners stop firing, and I defenitly never saw the plane just go 'limp' like the pilot was hit. I've seen many people complain about this with FB/AEP/Something, and had it happen to me in multiplay several times, but Ill be damned if I can master it.

Yes...

Thanks again.
Dreadnought<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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LStarosta
09-11-2004, 04:27 PM
Finally, some good questions! I believe they've been answered.

As for the torpedoing question:

Learn to use the Full Mission Builder, it will be your best friend. www.airwarfare.com (http://www.airwarfare.com) has good tutorials and tips. Open up a dogfight map. Dogfight 10 will do the trick, though any map with water will do fine. DF10 just happens to be my favorite.

Then choose the objects menu. Select stationary ships*. Spawn a couple ships in the water. Next, go into the objects properties (you'll need to do this for each ship you spawn, so you better do this for each ship as you go) and select what team it will belong to. If you select blue and you're red it will shoot at you with devastatingly accurate sniper flak. However, if you wish to just practice torpedoing, skip bombing, etc without being harassed, then change the ship's color to "NONE". It will not fire at you no matter which team you spawn on. Save As your dogfight map, remembering where the ships are, and voila! Start a Multiplayer server in IL2 and select the map you just Saved As, and you've got your own custom made torpedo/skip bombing range to practice on.



*I've tried using moving ships with waypoints, but they don't tend to load when you play the map as a dogfight map.

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Woofdang
09-11-2004, 04:49 PM
I'm having problems staying in the sky =( I cant get the feeling of speed of movement or projection I guess and I cant get any good idea of how much power the plane has or weighs. What can help me work this out better? It's very discuriaging after spend over 12 hours of play I still manage to go into spins of a sort and drop. I've flown in a small crop duster before in real life and played a bunch of jet sims before but am just having a tuff time with these planes I guess? =(

-- Woof

icrash
09-11-2004, 04:57 PM
For the qmb, use online islands8 as map. Fly for the red and choose a plane that packs torp(s). You can ignore the target option because ships aren't listed. You leave from the "lower island and fly to the upper one. There are 2 moving ships on the way there. There are 3 stationary ones grouped together and one by itself near the enemy airfield. Also where the island curves around and to the left of the 3 stationary ships, there are 3 stationary subs grouped together. They do shoot at you but one more so than the others. Like LStarosta said, full mission builder is great cause you can custom design your missions. Happy hunting, hopes this helps.
Hey Woof, what plane(s) are you using? Some tend to be skittish more so than others. The P-39 gives me fits & I got into the bad habit of flying with spins/stalls off. Listen to the plane, most make a sound when they start to stall (kinda like wind past an open car window). Plane also tends to shake/jump around too. Watch the angle on the wings & how sharp ya turn. If one gets alot higher than the other in a turn or you really horse the plane into a turn, they'll stall.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v117/icrash/147th.bmp 147th Fighter Wing

[This message was edited by icrash on Sat September 11 2004 at 04:05 PM.]

horseback
09-11-2004, 06:06 PM
woofdang-

The best way to get the feeling of movement is to select the widest field of view and have a fan blowing in your face. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I would also stay with a single type of aircraft, because each is different (some more different than others) and responds to control inputs (by the way, if you're using a joystick, did you check to make sure your input sensitivities are not all maxed out?) differently. In all but the biplanes, sudden movements lead to a stall, followed by a flaming death if you lack sufficient altitude to recover.

Sound provides useful clues too. If you start hearing a whooshing sound like a strong wind, that's a clue that the air over your wings is getting a little too sparse, and you're on the edge of a stall. Of course, that also means that you're turning as tightly as you can at that speed (and trim, another mystery that can be put off 'til later), so you can either try to hold it there (if you're gaining on someone), ease off or throttle back a bit and try for a tighter turn.

I find being able to see my instruments absolutely critical, until I get a 'feel' for the aircraft. German fighters have a very useful needle and ball set up to tell you if you're in a bank or skid, and from the 109G-2 onwards, a very nice artificial horizon to let you know if you're in a climb or dive. In wide view with the gunsight toggled, you can see most of your key instruments (speed, altitude, artificial horizon, compass, and turn and bank indicator). Most other cockpit displays are less useful for a beginner, although someone who is reading this will shortly contradict me and quote his personal favorite.

I prefer the German 'pits for learning because the turn and bank needle is very sensitive (not unlike my ex-wife), and will tell you the moment you're not flying straight and level. Once you can master that, then you can worry about the turning, diving, and climbing stuff, starting slowly, and gradually raising the tempo until you're confident enough to try flying under bridges. This is my self-test for mastery of a new type: in QMB, I select the Smolensk map, and fly to Smolensk along the river at about 200m, flying under every bridge I see. The final test is under the pedestrian bridges over the tracks at the train station in beautiful downtown Smolensk. If I can do that, I'm ready for a campaign in that fighter (except for the P-38: it won't fit under the pedestrian bridges, and it's a really tight fit on the suspension bridges-I've only made it once on one of those so far).

It is unfortunate the Training missions format in the original Il-2 Sturmovik were not kept in Forgotten Battles. They showed you all the necessary maneuvers and what had to be done to accomplish them, and then immediately gave you the chance to try them yourself. You'll have to muddle through with the QMB. Just don't try to start off too fast. A realistic flight sim means that you need to learn to fly the plane before you can learn to fight with the plane.

Patience, young padawan!

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

ruf9ii
09-12-2004, 07:13 AM
1. yes, vulchin is spawn camping

2. in my opinion 1 or 2 1000lbers is more effective than a torpedo. the fighter bombers also have more guns and manouvreability than medium bombers etc. only trouble is getting the bombs to the ship and getting away alive http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif almost no luck if ur goin up against a battleship or even a destroyer. with torps tho u can launch them from as far as u like, and if ships r static u will always hit.

if you want to practice, u can do as others say and make a full mission. but this takes time and if u dunno wat ur doin it can be daunting. just go into quick mission builder instead and choose the crimea map. dead ahead of your startin position are a selection of ships, destroyers and PT boats. no cargo tho. friendly ships are to your 7-8, near the town. (edit: i see someone has listed onlineislands in QMB as another map, this works too but distances r further i think)

3. yea, u can kill the vehicle crews, but there is no advantage. next time u bomb some vehicles make a track and play it. centre the view on the trucks and slow down the time to 1/4. the men will all die when the bomb goes off( assumning ur aim is true http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif)

4. it is possible to shoot the individual crewmembers of bombers and such. go into 'config.ini' and change arcade=0 to arcade=1. this shows u were every rounds hits the plane with an arrow. (warning, lots of arrows is inversely proportional to frame rate...more arrows, less FPS). rear gunners are invincible tho as far as i know http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

kn00bski
09-13-2004, 06:59 AM
4: Kinda related to 3...is it possible to kill *AI* pilots/tailgunners with a lucky shot?

...that´s how I get practically all my kills...

lil_labbit
09-13-2004, 07:57 AM
LOL

Vulcing is flying above an airfield and shooting at planes.
If you pass once shooting at planes it's called strafing.
If you stay doing it it's called Vulching.

Yes - you can kill the pilots (in the plane as well as hanging in the air/running/lying on the ground. Never had your screen go black? (that's when they killed you - if it goes red - you're wounded http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif )...

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F19_Ob
09-13-2004, 08:36 AM
Regarding vulching.

I have seen very few "camping" vulchers, but it happens.
A few has as their trademark to hover high above or close to an enemy airfield to finish of planes taking off, landing or spawning and to get the damaged enroute homewards.
This hardly is any problem since there may be multiple airfields to choose from and the flak at the airfields often give early warning.
It can even be fun and exciting to evade a vulcher when one or many attack the airfield and u get up and shot one down http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif. They often get shot down after a while, but on few occasions a team on voice do it in fast BnZ'ers (like FW190)and are untuchable. (rare thing though).

some groups use navlights so they can see and keep track of eachother easily, and also knowing that the ones without lights are enemies. That way they see when its time for the other to zoom down and pick off defending climbers but also when a plane spawns.
The lights are very bright and seen miles in daylight, they even look like UFO's at close range.

So even in sims they find some tricks atleast, but not quite like campers in other games.
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Ashoka74
09-13-2004, 08:37 AM
My noob question is more "practical" - I am playing offline only, and when I am setting up easy single mission, I have only three maps as a option.
Is here some way how to put rest of maps to map selection? To edit some file?

Thanks for advice,

A74

lil_labbit
09-13-2004, 08:42 AM
Go to Full Mission Builder (FMB)
Build your own http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Check

http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/

To learn how-to http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
There's also a manual on CD 2 of FB http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://members.home.nl/lil.labbit/lilseesya.jpg
Question: Did you back-up your files?
Answer: I didn't know they had a reverse...

FI WILLIE
09-13-2004, 09:20 AM
Woofdang..

I too have flown a lot of open cockpit tail dragger junk and this game is a LOT different. About 90% of the "cues" that you used when flying are not present.

Having said that, have you checked the calibration of your joystick? My rudder defaulted to 100% all the way across when I started playing and it drove me nuts until I figured out what the problem was. Any input gave me a full rudder deflection and I spent a LOT of time boring holes in the ground.

Another thing I recommend is fly one type of bird until you get the feel for the game. Use the quick mission builder and set your plane up with 25% fuel and then click the UNLIMITED FUEL so you don't run out of gas and then go fly your plane for while.

I learned the game in the little I16. They're pretty agile and "honest". Now the only plane that regularly eats my lunch is the 190 series. (I'm going to conquer that plane or break my discs.)

Be patient and it will all fall into place eventually.

Sidenote for you, there are 2 us in my squadron that have quite a few real flight hours and we routinely get thrashed, roundly and soundly, by gents that have never sat in a real plane. This is the closest thing I've found to real flight but it lacks a LOT being the real deal. I still enjoy it as this is as close as I'll ever get to flying a high performance piston engined plane unless I win a BIG LOTTO.

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pakfront
09-13-2004, 02:19 PM
I just discovered that there are parked planes sitting at the enemy airstrip on dogfight servers. They are fun to shoot at. In fact, due to my extremely crapulent shooting skills, they are about the only planes I can hit consistently.

Is this vulching? Does it affect the game by reducing the number of planes the enemy has to respawn? Or are these just decoration?

ruf9ii
09-13-2004, 08:54 PM
'parked' planes only count sometimes if the server is running a script. destroying it will detract from the 'pool' of available planes.

attacking planes on the ground with bombs or rockets isnt considered vulching because it takes more skill and ammo is really limited to only 1 or 2 passes (unless your packing a whole bunch of rockets like in a p47 or p38 etc...

steel_blue_eagle
09-13-2004, 11:08 PM
Torpedos are more effective because they explode below the waterline and cause the ship to take on water, whereas bombs and rockets generally have to cause damage to the ship/crew or start fires and secondary explosions to cause it to sink, which can take quite a while and who wants to hang around in a hostile area for hours to make sure the thing is actually going down?

WTE_Galway
09-13-2004, 11:12 PM
with regard to ships and torpedoes in IL2

- torps have a very simple model and hence can be dropped from any altitude and any speed and still work .. you can even "dive bomb" with them

- the damage model for larger ships has several "compartments" and you need to damage several of them .. hence if you pump 3 or 4 torps into exactly the same spot it will not sink .. you need to target different areas of the ship with each new atack

Bearcat99
09-14-2004, 06:39 AM
All you newbies... if you havent go to the Sturmovik Essentials link in my sig...... get the UQMG.....

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