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JG26Red
03-11-2004, 02:59 PM
what are the top speeds of the KIs we get in FB? sea level and its fastest point????

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 02:59 PM
what are the top speeds of the KIs we get in FB? sea level and its fastest point????

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 04:08 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by JG26Red:
what are the top speeds of the KIs we get in FB? sea level and its fastest point

i have found myself being chased down by these planes in both the A9 and D9...

Everywhere i look the ratings i see are 309-325mph on deck and 388-392mph at 21k... at both alts both the A9 and D9 are faster at each level???

i have seen speeds for 360 on deck and 427 at alt... but that was with the BEEFED up one the us tested after the war... what tests are you looking at for speed in this plane?

crazyivan1970
03-11-2004, 04:11 PM
Run away from that server Red... you know why http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 04:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Run away from that server Red... you know why http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

V!
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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

huh? i have seen this in numerous servers.. iam going to test the KIs tonight on level and go up to 7k and see what they get, should not be more than 530s on deck and 640s up top... i have tested the A9 and i got 560s on the deck open raid and 110 per power with 30mm wing cannons..., didnt go up top yet...

crazyivan1970
03-11-2004, 04:20 PM
you misunderstood me buddy... Frank should not be chasing you at all http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif cause it should be on your side hehe

V!
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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 04:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
you misunderstood me buddy... Frank should not be chasing you at all http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif cause it should be on your side hehe

V!
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Kozhedub: In combat potential, the Yak-3, La-7 and La-9 fighters were indisputably superior to the Bf-109s and Fw-190s. But, as they say, no matter how good the violin may be, much depends on the violinist. I always felt respect for an enemy pilot whose plane I failed to down.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ahhhhhhhhhh i see what you mean, i do really hate them servers, turns out most servers out there are like that too... sigh... nothing like having to worry about a fello butcher bird or BF coming for me... lol

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 04:24 PM
Also Oleg... is there anyway we can get rid of the damn ETC Rack?

JG26Red
03-11-2004, 07:12 PM
my simple speed tests...

KI 84A

Deck(300-400m)
560kph with raid closed 110 per
550kph with raid open 110 per

in what i have read its about 20-30kph too fast on deck


UP(6000-6100)
670kph with raid closed 110per
630kph with raid open 110per

the 630kph with open raid and 110per is right on with the realy KI, but the 670 isnt...

also, i can make this thing turn on a dime at 700-800kph, it in reality had bad high speed handling, about 350mph(570-600kph) it was said to have mushy stick... also in speeds over 400mph sharp turns where know to snap wings... i made sharp turns at 800 area without issue, went to around 850-880 area before they broke... off again


for ref -

A9

Deck
560 - wep raid closed prop pitch normal
550 - wep raid open prop normal

590 - wep raid close prop pitch 100
560 - wep raid open prop 100

off here, it stats without wep 575kph(585-595 with) i had wep on all the time, never came close to those speeds, only with closed raid and prop pitch but that lasts for about 1min...575 without wep is the thing here

UP (6000)

600 with riad open 110per prop normal
630 with raid closed 110per prop normal


630 with raid open 110per prop 100
655 with raid closed 110per prop 100

again, missing some speed here...

thanks oleg for the better climb... just need somemore speed out of the A9 now, if that means taking off that rack give us the option..

[This message was edited by JG26Red on Thu March 11 2004 at 06:22 PM.]

[This message was edited by JG26Red on Thu March 11 2004 at 06:24 PM.]

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 08:25 AM
nobody seems to care about the obvious miss on FM????

robban75
03-12-2004, 08:36 AM
I know that with 110% and boost the Fw 190A-9 and D-9 are faster. The Ki-84 accelerates better though. I'll check it when I get home. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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Eagle_361st
03-12-2004, 08:41 AM
The Ki-84 is most defiantely over rated by everything I have read on it. It seems that it got the US tests numbers, which would be great if every aircraft in the game got it's absolute highest possible performance. I.E. boost mods and higher octane fuel, but many don't. I can honestly say though that it seems it has indeed been toned down a little from v1.22. Good tests, they are almost spot on from what I have gotten as well. Although I was able to achieve a few more Kph through the whole test my variations are with +/- of 5 kph of yours.

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Oleg_Maddox
03-12-2004, 09:00 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
nobody seems to care about the obvious miss on FM????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Could you read view object for the speeds of Ki-84?

There is data from Real tests of Ki-84 in NASA.
This confirms by Japnese consultants that helped us to get this and Japanese data.

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 09:07 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg_Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
nobody seems to care about the obvious miss on FM????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Could you read view object for the speeds of Ki-84?

There is data from Real tests of Ki-84 in NASA.
This confirms by Japnese consultants that helped us to get this and Japanese data.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

what view object are you talking about? i dont see it.. iam just refercing about half dozen books i have and about 20 diff websites... they all say that the top speed on deck was 325mph(524kph), the current model outperforms that by 20-30kph in game...

the US test did get about 30-40kph more speed, but that was done with beefed up plugs and 140octane gas, which the japs never had in wartime, iam hoping you would mod via wartime... not really fair u think? the mod a plane with after war test and not others?

also, any info on why the FW is about 20-30kph too slow???? is it the RACK???

[This message was edited by JG26Red on Fri March 12 2004 at 08:15 AM.]

Oleg_Maddox
03-12-2004, 09:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg_Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
nobody seems to care about the obvious miss on FM????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Could you read view object for the speeds of Ki-84?

There is data from Real tests of Ki-84 in NASA.
This confirms by Japnese consultants that helped us to get this and Japanese data.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

what view object are you talking about? i dont see it.. iam just refercing about half dozen books i have and about 20 diff websites... they all say that the top speed on deck was 325mph(524kph), the current model outperforms that by 20-30kph in game...

the US test did get about 30-40kph more speed, but that was done with beefed up plugs and 140octane gas, which the japs never had in wartime, iam hoping you would mod via wartime... not really fair u think? the mod a plane with after war test and not others?

also, any info on why the FW is about 20-30kph too slow???? is it the RACK???

[This message was edited by JG26Red on Fri March 12 2004 at 08:15 AM.]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please look for the engines used in different models even markered as one.

Also could you show me document that US test was done on Octan 140 and the engine wasn't damaged with this... I'm very interested.

ZG77_Nagual
03-12-2004, 09:22 AM
Red, I think your off on this one. According to both the US and the Japanese the Ki84 was quite the superior dogfighter to anything the US had - at least low to mid. It was plagued by manufacturing defects due to bombing but the first batch was practically hand-built and they were outstanding. Since manufacturing defects aren't modeled ( and really it would be very frustrating if they were! Possibly on option for BOB but not for dogfighting online!) We have the truly outstanding plane the KI really was. I personally don't fly it much but it is and should be the best dogfighter in the simm.

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 09:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg_Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Oleg_Maddox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JG26Red:
nobody seems to care about the obvious miss on FM????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Could you read view object for the speeds of Ki-84?

There is data from Real tests of Ki-84 in NASA.
This confirms by Japnese consultants that helped us to get this and Japanese data.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

what view object are you talking about? i dont see it.. iam just refercing about half dozen books i have and about 20 diff websites... they all say that the top speed on deck was 325mph(524kph), the current model outperforms that by 20-30kph in game...

the US test did get about 30-40kph more speed, but that was done with beefed up plugs and 140octane gas, which the japs never had in wartime, iam hoping you would mod via wartime... not really fair u think? the mod a plane with after war test and not others?

also, any info on why the FW is about 20-30kph too slow???? is it the RACK???

[This message was edited by JG26Red on Fri March 12 2004 at 08:15 AM.]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please look for the engines used in different models even markered as one.

Also could you show me document that US test was done on Octan 140 and the engine wasn't damaged with this... I'm very interested.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

In 1946, a captured late-production Hayate was restored and tested at the Middletown Air Depot in Pennsylvania. At a weight of 7490 pounds, the aircraft achieved a maximum speed of 427 mph at 20,000 feet, using war emergency power. This speed exceeded that of the P-51D Mustand and the P-47D at that altitude by 2 mph and 22 mph respectively. These figures were achieved with a superbly maintained and restored aircraft and with "highly-refined aviation gasoline, and were not typical of Japanese-operated aircraft during the later stages of the war"

"When the Hayate using fuel of 140 octane rating and high-quality ignition plugs was tested in the United States after the war, it made a record of a maximum speed of 689 km/h, and was praised as "the best one of all Japanese fighters appeared in the Pacific War".


now, these are done in tip top shape, but still not fair to model a plane for being in tip top shape, maybe you should model P51s, P47s FWs BFs and soon with best octane gas and nice super duper plugs.. eh?


u still havent answer question about the RACK on the FWs... can we remove this someday maybe? iam sure it would help in some speed and so on

lbhskier37
03-12-2004, 09:40 AM
Unless they jacked up the boost pressure running 150 octane would be exactly the same as running the fuel that the plane was designed for. If you can find proof that they had jacked up the boost pressure to go alone with this 150octane fuel you would be on to something, but just running a higher octane alone does nothing for an engine.

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gates123
03-12-2004, 09:52 AM
It amazes me that you guys are such kik A$$ mechanics to think octane doesnt help a motor. Hell I can tell the difference between 87 octane and 95 in my 2-stroke cr500 dirt bike. It doesnt ping as much and runs much better all around with a small increase in torque. Give me another 20-30 octane and I'll end up hurting myself. That why planes use avaition gas (120 octane)and not some crap 83 octane gas made in Mexico. I hope you guys dont change your own oil in your car.

http://gr.fipu.krasnoyarsk.edu/camms/archive/ww2_fighters/0112/pics/0112_2_1.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 09:56 AM
Engine: One Army Type 4 eighteen-cylinder air-cooled radial (Nakajima Ha-45). The following engine models were used: [Ha-45]11 rated at 1800 hp for takeoff and 1650 hp at 6560 feet. [Ha-45]12 rated at 1825 hp for takeoff and 1670 hp at 7875 feet. [Ha-45]21 rated at 1990 hp for takeoff and 1850 hp at 5740 feet. [Ha-45]23 rated at 1900 hp for takeoff and 1670 hp at 4725 feet.


these are the engies the hayte uses, if that means anything...

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 10:08 AM
what about the high speed handling of the KI84? it turns rather well at high speed, when in is said at speeds over 350mph it didnt handle well at all, got kinda sluggish, i.e. 109... also hard moves at over 400 mph would tend to damage the wings... i had put this in a dive and it didnt brake up until 1042kph...

lbhskier37
03-12-2004, 12:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
It amazes me that you guys are such kik A$$ mechanics to think octane doesnt help a motor. Hell I can tell the difference between 87 octane and 95 in my 2-stroke cr500 dirt bike. It doesnt ping as much and runs much better all around with a small increase in torque. Give me another 20-30 octane and I'll end up hurting myself. That why planes use avaition gas (120 octane)and not some crap 83 octane gas made in Mexico. I hope you guys dont change your own oil in your car.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually I hope you never have to work on anything I drive.

The octane rating of a fuel is a scale of how the fuel performs compared to the ignition temperature of octane. A 100 octane fuel ignites at the same temperature as octane, a higher rated fuel like 150 octane ignites at a higher temperature. There is always the same amount of "energy" in a fuel regardless of octane rating.

Now on to your bike Mr. Ace mechanic. You said you get less pinging (knocking I think you mean) and more torque by moving up to 95 octane from 87 octane. This is because your engine was designed to run the higher octane. Your engine either has too high of a sparkplug advance or too high of a compression ratio to run 87 octane so the fuel is igniting before the piston hits TDC (top dead center, but Ace mechanic here should know that) that is a knock. Since there is ignition while the piston is still traveling up, you have a force acting against the motor with is causing your loss of torque. Now if you still have any knocking while running 95 octane, you would get more performance with 104 octane, but if your knocking is gone now, it will be the same. Now planes use avaition gas 120 octane because they have a compression ratio designed for it.

BTW if ya need any help tuning that motor let me knowhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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JG26Red
03-12-2004, 12:55 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lbhskier37:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gates123:
It amazes me that you guys are such kik A$$ mechanics to think octane doesnt help a motor. Hell I can tell the difference between 87 octane and 95 in my 2-stroke cr500 dirt bike. It doesnt ping as much and runs much better all around with a small increase in torque. Give me another 20-30 octane and I'll end up hurting myself. That why planes use avaition gas (120 octane)and not some crap 83 octane gas made in Mexico. I hope you guys dont change your own oil in your car.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually I hope you never have to work on anything I drive.

The octane rating of a fuel is a scale of how the fuel performs compared to the ignition temperature of octane. A 100 octane fuel ignites at the same temperature as octane, a higher rated fuel like 150 octane ignites at a higher temperature. There is always the same amount of "energy" in a fuel regardless of octane rating.

Now on to your bike Mr. Ace mechanic. You said you get less pinging (knocking I think you mean) and more torque by moving up to 95 octane from 87 octane. This is because your engine was designed to run the higher octane. Your engine either has too high of a sparkplug advance or too high of a compression ratio to run 87 octane so the fuel is igniting before the piston hits TDC (top dead center, but Ace mechanic here should know that) that is a knock. Since there is ignition while the piston is still traveling up, you have a force acting against the motor with is causing your loss of torque. Now if you still have any knocking while running 95 octane, you would get more performance with 104 octane, but if your knocking is gone now, it will be the same. Now planes use avaition gas 120 octane because they have a compression ratio designed for it.

BTW if ya need any help tuning that motor let me knowhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

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<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

just trying to point out some fm cocerns... ki needs some work, its overmoddeled a bit

PikeBishop
03-12-2004, 01:01 PM
Okay I wish to make a point VERY STRONGLY here!
While the critics of the KI84 spend all their time trying to find reasons to say why it was crap and is overrated in the game. None of you seem to grasp the point that you are essentially NITPICKING about a few kph or kpm.
How many of us can actually fly these machines as they should be flown. I am sure that if we could these ineffectual arguments and spurious situations in combat would not arise. As far as heresay evidence goes I think Oleg has the right approach by trying to produce the fragility or formidability of any particular type in a general way but then when it comes to hard data he is taking the best that any machine could produce and is sticking to that right across the board EXACTLY AS ANY SCIENTIFIC EXPERIMENT SHOULD BE RUN! with the same criteria applied to all aircraft. Otherwise IL2fb would be all over the place... leave the man alone. In real combat situations it was the aircraft that got you where you wanted to be by climbing better diving better turning better jinking better....cooperating better....or whatever, the rest was spotting positioning and shooting and I dont think a few meters either way made much difference if you were a good pilot. If you played the game right through the war period as new types came in and out moral would rise and fall accordingly and there would be good and bad times........for all nationalities!!!

gates123
03-12-2004, 01:14 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by lbhskier37
Actually I hope you never have to work on anything I drive.

The octane rating of a fuel is a scale of how the fuel performs compared to the ignition temperature of octane. A 100 octane fuel ignites at the same temperature as octane, a higher rated fuel like 150 octane ignites at a higher temperature. There is always the same amount of "energy" in a fuel regardless of octane rating.

Now on to your bike Mr. Ace mechanic. You said you get less pinging (knocking I think you mean) and more torque by moving up to 95 octane from 87 octane. This is because your engine was designed to run the higher octane. Your engine either has too high of a sparkplug advance or too high of a compression ratio to run 87 octane so the fuel is igniting before the piston hits TDC (top dead center, but Ace mechanic here should know that) that is a knock. Since there is ignition while the piston is still traveling up, you have a force acting against the motor with is causing your loss of torque. Now if you still have any knocking while running 95 octane, you would get more performance with 104 octane, but if your knocking is gone now, it will be the same. Now planes use avaition gas 120 octane because they have a compression ratio designed for it.

BTW if ya need any help tuning that motor let me know


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well my only experience in being a mechanic comes from my dad who has been working on turbines for multi-engined a/c his whole life. Basically he can fix a twin turbo Cheyenne 4 with one arm and a blindfold. As far as octane goes I try to run aviation gas in my 2-stoke when I can (dad hooks me up). Bike runs flawlessy (no knocks or pings) and a substantial increase in torque even though it wasnt "designed" for 120 octane. Point being the better octane the better preformance weather the engine was made in 1941 or 2001. OCTANE DOES MATTER! It might light at the same temp but its a cleaner burn which results in better preformance. I'm done and will close my part of this thread.

http://gr.fipu.krasnoyarsk.edu/camms/archive/ww2_fighters/0112/pics/0112_2_1.jpg
Did anyone see that or was it just me?

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 01:26 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PikeBishop:
Okay I wish to make a point VERY STRONGLY here!
While the critics of the KI84 spend all their time trying to find reasons to say why it was crap and is overrated in the game. None of you seem to grasp the point that you are essentially NITPICKING about a few kph or kpm.
How many of us can actually fly these machines as they should be flown. I am sure that if we could these ineffectual arguments and spurious situations in combat would not arise. As far as heresay evidence goes I think Oleg has the right approach by trying to produce the fragility or formidability of any particular type in a general way but then when it comes to hard data he is taking the best that any machine could produce and is sticking to that right across the board EXACTLY AS ANY SCIENTIFIC EXPERIMENT SHOULD BE RUN! with the same criteria applied to all aircraft. Otherwise IL2fb would be all over the place... leave the man alone. In real combat situations it was the aircraft that got you where you wanted to be by climbing better diving better turning better jinking better....cooperating better....or whatever, the rest was spotting positioning and shooting and I dont think a few meters either way made much difference if you were a good pilot. If you played the game right through the war period as new types came in and out moral would rise and fall accordingly and there would be good and bad times........for all nationalities!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

more than a few kph... more like 20-30kph all around, and high speed handling of a FW that it didnt have and it was durable a bit, take hits but its airframe was rather weak that it couldnt take high speed maneovers... all this from a half dozen books and dozens of online reports i have read... only reason iam asking is because i have been run down at the deck in one and at 6k meters by one and i dove at over 800kph and it stuck right with me and it stuck with me, this was in both a A9 and D9, no he didnt have alt advantage, we both crossed paths at same alt, he simply turned and chased me down easy... wrong... also, dove from 7k got to about 800kph and pulled up, FW can do this, KI cant but did in game, and it stayed together... wrong..

at least this is what i have read the last few days... hey, if its wrong, DAMN there are tons of phoneys getting money.. lol

lbhskier37
03-12-2004, 01:28 PM
again gates, higher octane will give you more performance, only if you change the engine somehow. It does not make the fuel burn cleaner, there is sometimes additives in "premium" fuels that do this, but they have nothing to do with the octane rating. I could go home and dig out my books on combustion but I think that would be pointless.

Now back to the thread, Red the 150 octane used in the american tests would only give a performance increase over the Japanese fuel if the manifold pressure was increased to go alone with it. Do you have the information on the manifold pressure used in the american tests, and those used by the japanese in service?

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WWMaxGunz
03-12-2004, 01:29 PM
Back when I had my Virago I used an engine cleaner that boosted octane. My mechanic warned me not to overdo it as I could burn out my valves. maybe that's because I was able to run that much more power, that much hotter? I'd run 92 oct Sunoco instead of the 87 or 89 just because it would start better and seemed to run better. I did end up crisping one valve but there was a lot of high speed running before that.


Neal

JG26Red
03-12-2004, 01:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lbhskier37:
again gates, higher octane will give you more performance, only if you change the engine somehow. It does not make the fuel burn cleaner, there is sometimes additives in "premium" fuels that do this, but they have nothing to do with the octane rating. I could go home and dig out my books on combustion but I think that would be pointless.

Now back to the thread, Red the 150 octane used in the american tests would only give a performance increase over the Japanese fuel if the manifold pressure was increased to go alone with it. Do you have the information on the manifold pressure used in the american tests, and those used by the japanese in service?

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Official "uber190n00b"
"Only the spirit of attack, born in a brave heart, will bring success to any fighter aircraft, no matter how highly developed it may be." Adolf Galland

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nothing on that killa, just the octane and the special plugs... also said to be in superb running condition... if they put 150 octane in it iam sure they would have done what it takes to be done make it run on it,,,, iam sure they wouldnt be that dumb

point is, sure it could do that, but not in real world war conditions, sure the game takes away breakdowns and unreliable parts, BUT to make a plane run on better parts because it can but didnt in real war conditions is WRONG... lets do that to say the FW 190D.. eh? lets pep that sucka up and lets see what it does... if iam not mistaken the P51s and P47s in this game are set to run on normal octance and so on when in reality they where run on higher???????

lbhskier37
03-12-2004, 02:12 PM
The thing is that I dont think they would have modded the engine to get higher boost pressure to take advantage of the higher octane. For that they would have had to modify the supercharger I think. I dont know why they wouldve done this. Now maybe the japanese were overboosting the engines anyways and just deciding to through out reliability concerns, and in that case I think the higher octane wouldve made the engine run better, but I doubt the japanese wouldve been overboosting their engines like that.

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Official "uber190n00b"
"Only the spirit of attack, born in a brave heart, will bring success to any fighter aircraft, no matter how highly developed it may be." Adolf Galland

lbhskier37
03-12-2004, 02:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WWMaxGunz:
Back when I had my Virago I used an engine cleaner that boosted octane. My mechanic warned me not to overdo it as I could burn out my valves. maybe that's because I was able to run that much more power, that much hotter? I'd run 92 oct Sunoco instead of the 87 or 89 just because it would start better and seemed to run better. I did end up crisping one valve but there was a lot of high speed running before that.


Neal<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

In your car the higher octane probably helped cause you musta been getting some knock with the lower octane stuff. Im not saying that higher octane does nothing, just that it only does something if the engine is set up for it.

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Official "uber190n00b"
"Only the spirit of attack, born in a brave heart, will bring success to any fighter aircraft, no matter how highly developed it may be." Adolf Galland

pinche_bolillo
03-12-2004, 04:10 PM
I have often wondered about the ki 84s speed and climb myself. japanese data puts the a/c at 340ish at sea level and 390 ish at 6-7000 meters. with an initial rate of climb around 3,600 fpm. our ki 84 is 15-40 mph faster than this depending on the altitude.

the higher speed and climb figures come from the previously stated usa test data after the war running a much higher grade fuel than the japanese had themselves.

here is what I am suggesting as a possibility.
due to the poor quality of fuel the japanese had available it is possible that they could not extract the stated hp figures from the engine. power had to be reduced to avoid pre-detonation. the usa av gas + the higher standard of maintanance given to the ki 84 in the usa permitted the engine to be run at its full design potential thus yielding much better speed and climb.

for the gentleman that stated earlier that we are knit picking about a small speed discrepency. even a 10 mph advantage is good enough to run away from a disadvantaged situation. at altitude I would consider 40 mph significant. especially when you consider the only advantage most of the a/c in question had over the ki 84 was their speed. and even this has been taken away from them.

JG26Red
03-13-2004, 10:51 AM
UFO ALERT --- Yak3, LA7 AND NOW THE KI 84!!

chris455
03-14-2004, 12:45 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by gates123:
It amazes me that you guys are such kik A$$ mechanics to think octane doesnt help a motor. Hell I can tell the difference between 87 octane and 95 in my 2-stroke cr500 dirt bike. It doesnt ping as much and runs much better all around with a small increase in torque. Give me another 20-30 octane and I'll end up hurting myself. That why planes use avaition gas (120 octane)and not some crap 83 octane gas made in Mexico. I hope you guys dont change your own oil in your car.

[This message was edited by chris455 on Sun March 14 2004 at 12:10 AM.]