PDA

View Full Version : Do you think that Templars will be pro working class in Victory ?



RA503
04-28-2015, 01:45 AM
Hello people,recently I remembering Brotherhood's glyph in AC wiki,whem I reading one that talk about Alan turing : http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Alan_Turing

The templars killed him because they fear that his machines will cause unemployment.

Like we see in AC unity,that the templars post germain are what caused french revolution,will templars be pro working class ? what you think ?

VestigialLlama4
04-28-2015, 04:55 AM
Hello people,recently I remembering Brotherhood's glyph in AC wiki,whem I reading one that talk about Alan turing : http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Alan_Turing

The templars killed him because they fear that his machines will cause unemployment.

Well that Turing entry is so absurd that it doesn't make any sense. Historically its a joke since Turing was a theorist and not an inventor per se. As for Robots causing unemployment, that will only be possible if they were cheap to manufacture.


Like we see in AC unity,that the templars post germain are what caused french revolution,will templars be pro working class ? what you think ?

Well UNITY is the point where the Lore stopped making any real sense. Until UNITY the point of the games was that the Assassins were on the side of the people but the Templars were on the side of the aristocrats, they believed in plutocracy (rule by the "wise") and believed in control and directing the people, which is a purely anti-populist poor-are-scum vision of society. Even the Turing story, absurd as it is, the point is that the Templars want to control knowledge and be the ones who decide what to do with information.

In UNITY, Germain's motivation for starting the revolution is Jacques de Molay told him to, the King burned Jacques de Molay. Jacques de Molay cursed the king to the 13th Generation. So I will kill the King who is...of the 15th Generation! There is no real Templar logic consistent with what we see earlier. The only reason the Templars are shown as pro-Revolutionary is that there was a real life conspiracy theory by a nutjob catholic priest who wrote a book after the Revolution saying all those things and Ubisoft saw that and decided to take that literally.

The other reason is that at this point Templars are simply "bad guys of history" and the French Revolutionaries are seen as "Bad guys" in the Anglophone as compared to the American Revolutionaries. The fact that the French Revolutionaries were anti-racist, abolished slavery, introduced the vote to every adult male regardless of property, gave rights to Jews and Protestants, blacks, and essentially invented democracy as we know and live it today doesn't enter UNITY at all, since it would destroy and complicate the highly simplistic plot they cooked up, hence the series of lies in the database and plot, all meant to hide the fairly right-wing story.

So in VICTORY, the Templars might be on the side of the working class since Karl Marx is seen by people as a "Bad guy" and he was there at the time. So maybe your last mission is to Assassinate him.

wvstolzing
04-28-2015, 12:35 PM
So in VICTORY, the Templars might be on the side of the working class since Karl Marx is seen by people as a "Bad guy" and he was there at the time. So maybe your last mission is to Assassinate him.

At which point I'll proudly take up the mantle of the auditorevita.

RA503
04-28-2015, 01:59 PM
The unity case we don't if this idea comes from the main writters(you know,darby and the other lore keepers) or a personal opinion from amancio (the brotherhood's glyph are a bit left wingist but unity's contradity this a little bit).


Edit : VestigialLlama4 I remember now,see this video at 11:59


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxt5QeV9rPo

The pazzi familly is a bit crowd appealing

in AC 2 novel and the second DLC, Girolamo Savonarola is a friar that fights for the poor, he's not a templar but french revolution is not the first time that the assassins is against a revolution.

Shahkulu101
04-28-2015, 04:47 PM
If they are on the "side" of the working classes, they will be manipulating them not fighting for them. Like Abstergo does in the present day.

Unity and Germain's Templar's were supposed to introduce the transition of the Templar's from purely totalitarian into an organization that controls the people by contriving false democracies and fake notions of freedom - which is exactly how Abstergo operates. It DID address these things, but not very well at all so a potentially interesting plot line was wasted.

VestigialLlama4
04-28-2015, 05:24 PM
The pazzi familly is a bit crowd appealing

Appealing to the crowd by itself is not revolutionary and that looks more like astro-turfing (that is a specific set of supporters brought out to create a false populist identity, this is true across history). After all the Pazzi are the old Florentine aristocracy that are threatened by the Medici and their Nouveau Riche middle class support base. Its a reactionary movement.


in AC 2 novel and the second DLC, Girolamo Savonarola is a friar that fights for the poor, he's not a templar but french revolution is not the first time that the assassins is against a revolution.

Well what Ezio says at the end of the Bonfire DLC is essentially revolutionary: "You don't need Savonarola or the Medici, or the Pope. Think for yourself." Historically, Savonarola's downfall led to the rise of the short-lived Florentine Republic (which Savonarola created but could not uphold) which later fell into the hands of Soderini and his right-hand man...Niccolo Machiavelli, that was the real progressive era of Florence. The Assassins until Unity are definitely on the side of "the people, the oppressed and the poor". And "The Fall" made them consistent by supporting Lenin, which showed that the lore (back then) didn't mind allowing the Assassins to be on the "wrong" side of history (at least from an American perspective).


If they are on the "side" of the working classes, they will be manipulating them not fighting for them. Like Abstergo does in the present day.

Unity and Germain's Templar's were supposed to introduce the transition of the Templar's from purely totalitarian into an organization that controls the people by contriving false democracies and fake notions of freedom - which is exactly how Abstergo operates. It DID address these things, but not very well at all so a potentially interesting plot line was wasted.

The idea of "false democracies" doesn't really come out in UNITY at all since the game never discusses Democracy or any of the changes at heart of the event. I mean they don't even give Templars brownie points for abolishing slavery (which is acknowledged in Eseosa's Codex in INITIATES but nowhere in the main game). And the database outright lies and distorts stuff to avoid mentioning it.

The game's story is based on a very famous right-wing myth by Abbe Barruel (actually the original conspiracy theory) that the people of France didn't want a revolution and were content to live as the Catholic King's subjects and that the Revoluton was manipulated by a bunch of evil people (Barruel said "The Illuminati and the Freemasons" and this is the start of all the new-world-order Dan Brown crap). The point of the conspiracy is to say that people don't want to be free and have to be manipulated by shadowy, Satanic organizations into revolting against a good King and that the true people were good, little Catholics content to live as subjects with no rights. The English statesman Edmund Burke also said that the Revolution of "the swinish multitude" (His words) was the work of "Jew brokers" (edmund burke's words) and that fed a lot of nasty anti-semitic literature. In UNITY, the entire revolution is shown to be the work of Germain's crew. The famine = Germain forced Levesque to hoard grains and create an artificial famine. The King's trial = passed by one vote(rather than the decent majority in reality), key witnesses were murdered (actually no, only the people who voted for death were murdered) and the impression is that the King is innocent (no he wasn't, he lied to the people and plotted a civil war and started a constitutional crisis). All of this comes from early 19th Century royalist conspiracies since after Napoleon fell, they came in and started rewriting history (and exiled all the people who voted for the King's death away from France). The whole Jacques de Molay fixation comes from this time as well.

Until UNITY, the conspiracy element was meant to be soft-pedalled, it was never entirely supplanting the history and background. In UNITY they take a single biased viewpoint and let it filter everything simply because it aligns to Jacques de Molay and a set of real-world conspiracies. What it does is elevate a rank moron, incompetent and mediocrity like de Molay at the expense of actual, world-changing events and some of the most complex historical figures in any era.

ACZanius
04-29-2015, 12:12 AM
Screw Templars and their whole New World Order Utopia ideology, controlling the planet and enslaving humankind that being said, i hope they get back to what they really are instead of these gray area stuff, i want modern day plot to have huge progress in Victory (probably not but it's Darby and possibly Yohalem sooo ;) ).