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View Full Version : What's that round thing Arbaaz Mir is holding in the Chronicles art?



LoyalACFan
04-16-2015, 09:23 AM
http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20150331170522/assassinscreed/images/6/6a/Assassin%27s_Creed_Chronicles_Promo_Art.jpg

Didn't read Brahman, maybe it was talked about there, but it looks pretty cool.

Side note, but holy crap the images make me want an EIC India game freaking STAT. And that's saying something, because I wasn't that interested in it until now.

VestigialLlama4
04-16-2015, 09:27 AM
It's called a Chakram. Like a Shuriken.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chakram


Side note, but holy crap the images make me want an EIC India game freaking STAT. And that's saying something, because I wasn't that interested in it until now.

Well they never will do a full game in India, that's for sure. And seeing Chronicles killed any reason why there should be one.

shobhit7777777
04-16-2015, 09:27 AM
Chakram

Sushiglutton
04-16-2015, 11:01 AM
It's an embroidery hoop used for decorating the costume.

BananaBlighter
04-16-2015, 06:04 PM
Well they never will do a full game in India, that's for sure. And seeing Chronicles killed any reason why there should be one.

Nooooo!!! I've always wanted an AC game in India... :(

VestigialLlama4
04-16-2015, 06:06 PM
Nooooo!!! I've always wanted an AC game in India... :(

If they do that it will be a pile of cliches. You can tell that from Far Cry 4 and from screenshots of Chronicles with its crappy colour scheme.

HDinHB
04-16-2015, 06:28 PM
It's an embroidery hoop used for decorating the costume.

Oh :( I thought it was an Aerobie.

https://youtu.be/2n-CTAs_9yo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdPjwLt04Zk

(You're welcome UbiWorkshop)

pirate1802
04-16-2015, 08:27 PM
If they do that it will be a pile of cliches. You can tell that from Far Cry 4 and from screenshots of Chronicles with its crappy colour scheme.

Farcry 4 wasn't India though. It was more Nepal. To their credit they used the correct lingo of Hindi, which we commonly use, and as a bonus they also got the cusswords spot on (which is important because you aren't a legitimate Hindi-speaker unless you pronounce bhenchod properly :p ) Normally when foreigners make movies/games with Hindi in it they make the fatal error of using textbook pure Hindi, which almost nobody uses. If you want to look at an extremely poorly made Indiacentric movie, you have The Temple of Doom as an example. I cringed through the dialogs. Ubisoft normally gets their Hindi right. If I remember correctly, Blacklist had some co-op missions in the subcontinent. Hindi was good there as well. Like what I use when I talk to my friends, not what we were taught at schools and only worn out professors use.

VestigialLlama4
04-16-2015, 09:03 PM
Farcry 4 wasn't India though. It was more Nepal.

It wasn't either. Its just a hodgepodge land cobbled with bits of India and other areas backpacking tourists visit.


To their credit they used the correct lingo of Hindi, which we commonly use, and as a bonus they also got the cusswords spot on

Who cares for that? The game is still a cliche, with crap about Shangri-la (a purely Western fantasy that comes from a piece of s--t novel called Lost Horizon) and other shameless exoticism.

And you know the only reason Ubisoft will make an AC game in India or any exotic location is to fulfill that fantasy.

Shahkulu101
04-16-2015, 09:16 PM
It wasn't either. Its just a hodgepodge land cobbled with bits of India and other areas backpacking tourists visit.



Who cares for that? The game is still a cliche, with crap about Shangri-la (a purely Western fantasy that comes from a piece of s--t novel called Lost Horizon) and other shameless exoticism.

And you know the only reason Ubisoft will make an AC game in India or any exotic location is to fulfill that fantasy.

I think it was set in a fictional location precisely so they could make it kitschy and clichéd without offending and misrepresenting a certain place. Far Cry is a game that plays to stereotypes for laughs and entertainment purposes so they were never going to try and be accurate in those regards.

I don't think it indicates they would take that approach if they were to make a game set in actual location like India in a title like AC that prides itself on such things.

pirate1802
04-16-2015, 09:26 PM
It wasn't either. Its just a hodgepodge land cobbled with bits of India

Which bits of India if I may ask, apart from the language obviously (and just the spoken language mind you, if you see the written words, they are in Nepali, not Hindi. Even on the loading screen.)



Who cares for that?

Erm.. People who can tell the difference? For others it might not be much but getting Hindi right is the first thing you need to address when you make a game on India. Because really, you can put all the nuanced research and brain-erecting stuff in your game, but if you don't get the language right it will just look like a fancy drama enacted by people who have no idea what they are doing. On the flip side, I'd expect more competence from people who are bothered to find out the which dialect of hindi is spoken in which part of India, than from a bunch of people who would just open the holy texts to know how hindi is spoken. So yes, it matters a hell of a lot, but not to everyone I guess. Just like the Italian-speakers here on the forums would tell you how cringe-worthy Ezio's 'Italian' was. And some of them actually prefer Unity's style of glossing over regional accent than using such cheap ones. The more you know..

Also, nothing wrong in wanting to fulfill your fantasy. If I can fulfill my fantasy of sailing the high seas acting like a pirate, why can't they?

I-Like-Pie45
04-16-2015, 09:30 PM
thank yoo pirate come again

VestigialLlama4
04-17-2015, 03:44 AM
I don't think it indicates they would take that approach if they were to make a game set in actual location like India in a title like AC that prides itself on such things.

Not so sure about that. I mean CHRONICLES is a handbag of cliches, and UNITY is A-- in terms of France and French culture. This kind of stuff, this cultural sensitivity and willingness to go past cliches, used to matter to the people who created and made AC but its no longer true it seems.


Because really, you can put all the nuanced research and brain-erecting stuff in your game, but if you don't get the language right it will just look like a fancy drama enacted by people who have no idea what they are doing.

Surface details don't matter when the overall conception is to give a cliched "Wow, look at the Third World, their marriages are all bad, there's so many cheap drugs, there are so many local exotic animals to hunt, and Elephants and Tigers are what its all about, their funeral customs are weird and so on." It's a basic bargain basement exoticized portrait.

Dev_Anj
04-17-2015, 06:37 AM
Not so sure about that. I mean CHRONICLES is a handbag of cliches, and UNITY is A-- in terms of France and French culture. This kind of stuff, this cultural sensitivity and willingness to go past cliches, used to matter to the people who created and made AC but its no longer true it seems.


I'm sorry, but AC 2 had a lot of Italian stereotypes and exaggerated bits of Renaissance Italy. AC 1 had a bunch of French, English and Arabian stereotypes too. These statements don't hold up. I'll leave it to other members to point out examples, as my memory of these games is a bit rusty.

pirate1802
04-17-2015, 06:41 AM
Surface details don't matter when the overall conception is to give a cliched "Wow, look at the Third World, their marriages are all bad, there's so many cheap drugs, there are so many local exotic animals to hunt, and Elephants and Tigers are what its all about, their funeral customs are weird and so on." It's a basic bargain basement exoticized portrait.

Surface details... oh well. I guess you are just not able to understand. Someone who is not even able to get these 'surface details' correct would most likely not get the other things right as well, the ones you mentioned. While those who get them right, that indicates atleast a surface-level interest in the culture, and they are the ones to do cliched characterizations. Consider Connor. Would you expect someone, who can't differentiate between mohawk and iroqois to get the finer details of native american life right?

You seem to have already made up your mind about Chronicles, so I've just gotta ask, what is so cliched about its art style? Yes it's colourful and all, but that's how India was at that time, still is. Colourful. So... ? Yes the comicbook was cartoonish but that's what comicbooks generally are. The things you generally tend to ignore when you pronounce it a clichefest is the Assassin himself. (Which is perplexing since you raise AC3 on such high a pedestal largely because of its unconventional protagonist) Arbaaz Mir. He is a muslim hailing from Kashmir. How many Kashmiris do you see in videogames? The people who go for the cliched wild Asia look are the ones who generally go for a tilak-wearing Hindu for their hero living somewhere near a holy river and thumbing prayer beads, not a minority member of troubled frontier lands, definitely not. Heck, how many videogames you see dealing with the very origins of the kashmiri problem at all, however tangentially? But no that doesn't matter as well, because the settings is too colourful :rolleyes:

VestigialLlama4
04-17-2015, 12:49 PM
I'm sorry, but AC 2 had a lot of Italian stereotypes and exaggerated bits of Renaissance Italy. AC 1 had a bunch of French, English and Arabian stereotypes too. These statements don't hold up. I'll leave it to other members to point out examples, as my memory of these games is a bit rusty.

Let's assume that you are right, that all the AC games attempts at some kind of historical fidelity was bogus and the games don't really matter (which I don't think is fair to the developers) and that articles like this are talking out of their rear-end (http://kotaku.com/a-game-that-showed-me-my-own-black-history-1486643518).

The fact is if every game is cliche, does that make it right for the new games to be cliche too?


Surface details... oh well. I guess you are just not able to understand. Someone who is not even able to get these 'surface details' correct would most likely not get the other things right as well, the ones you mentioned. While those who get them right, that indicates atleast a surface-level interest in the culture, and they are the ones to do cliched characterizations. Consider Connor. Would you expect someone, who can't differentiate between mohawk and iroqois to get the finer details of native american life right?

I was talking about Far Cry 4, which got surface details like using colloquial Hindi right (which is not a widely spoken language in the North-East, the area in which Kyrat is placed, and Hindi itself is a kind of hegemonic language). They got surface details right, included an entire sidequest in Shangrila in subtitled Hindi but the story and all background details are a cliched mess. The only interesting bits are the stuff with Pagan Min. That's why I say surface details don't matter. A movie like KUNDUN by Martin Scorsese is entirely in English but its highly respective, authentic and accurate about Tibetan culture, likewise The Last Emperor is fairly accurate about China and also in English (and natural English, not pseudo-posh BBC reject English).


You seem to have already made up your mind about Chronicles, so I've just gotta ask, what is so cliched about its art style?

The art directors themselves said that they were inspired by 19th Century lithographs in British newspapers. Those lithographs weren't bad but they all worked on a set of cliches certainly. They also said they wanted the feel of the classic Prince of Persia (which is based on the 1940 Thief of Bagdad). So the inspirations, however much I like POP1 and British Raj paraphernalia, are cliched messes to start with, and they have no interest in going past that.

Dev_Anj
04-17-2015, 04:28 PM
Let's assume that you are right, that all the AC games attempts at some kind of historical fidelity was bogus and the games don't really matter (which I don't think is fair to the developers) and that articles like this are talking out of their rear-end (http://kotaku.com/a-game-that-showed-me-my-own-black-history-1486643518).

The fact is if every game is cliche, does that make it right for the new games to be cliche too?


AC games have never attempted to be serious historical studies, sure in AC 1 they did try to base their story off some famous stories from that age, but there were several inconsistencies between what was depicted and what actually happened in real life, like the actual William being really old and dying of old age, Acre being a mixture of Syrian and English architectural buildings, rather than being exclusively English architectural buildings with some torn down Syrian buildings in the mix, English soldiers speaking in cockney or faux posh accents, and more. In short, yes there are some attempts at utilizing historical details, but all they do is often form a backdrop for the stories and the world. Seriously, any well learned historian will point out how inaccurate the early AC games were and how they use stereotypes for their world building and stories.

VestigialLlama4
04-17-2015, 04:39 PM
Seriously, any well learned historian will point out how inaccurate the early AC games were and how they use stereotypes for their world building and stories.

Here are some serious historians discussing Black Flag, Liberation and Freedom Cry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwJzj9g5HNI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C9h3p5Efa4

Here is another disccussing UNITY's hatchet job
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r47yZIYBUzc

Look, in any case you dodged the question. Even if what you say is true and that none of the series had standards for historical fiction, why is it okay for later games to be as cliche-ridden and fake, mediocre as earlier games. Shouldn't fans expect that games get better, stories get more interesting and things become less cliche-ridden as the series progresses.

Dev_Anj
04-18-2015, 03:36 AM
I never said it's okay for games to be full of overused tropes, I just said that they aren't and never were fully accurate. I would prefer if they weren't fully accurate, because to be honest if they stayed completely true to history, it would most likely be a boring game. There wouldn't be fancy gadgets, people influencing events from behind the scenes, people jumping around rooftops regularly etc. Something having overused tropes doesn't make it bad immediately, it's still possible to use them in a way that feels fresh. After all, every story these days has ideas that can be seen in many stories, as human beings like stories they can relate to, and there's a narrow number of concepts that human beings relate to universally and that provide for elements which make stories interesting.