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XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:06 AM
Changes In Community.

Something I had to write as viewing from sidelines for so long has become
somewhat unbearable.

I Would say A little while before FB came out a different crowd has settled
in here. Judging bye some comments most are likely of a young age or those
that take this game for advantage. Allthough I may be wrong in this issumption.

Ok a little history Lesson.
Before Il-2 was released the best WW2 Flightsims that I had played
was European Air War and Janes World War two fighters.
Back then the game you had except for third party work was what
you got ...thank god for the third party modders who still keep
these games alive today and probablly contributed to most of there
sales.

Then along came Oleg I can still remember when all you got of
updates was a few Pics at Sim.HQ. We where all amazed at what
was being created ..Oleg had a much more cheerful way back then
also and was having a ball explaining to us the new stuff that
was being created. I suspect many of us from back in those days
are still around but have a hard time viewing these forums ...
considering what games we came from. I have also noticed even guys
who help this game so much like Luthier and oters no longer post here.

On a last note I would like to Say please before Post have something genuine
to say ...Dont Ask for Patch now one day it will be released the only
reason it comes a little later is Oleg and Crew busting there but to
deliver something that should improve things ..that most of you wanted.

Please help keep this game alive by being positive if one day Oleg
and Crew was to say we have had enough time to close up shop think
of what we would miss out on (the old dont miss it to its to late
syndrome) Also remember what other game is out
there that even bother to tell you when patch or anything else is
comming out.

Support the game if you like it dont can it.
The_Few

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:06 AM
Changes In Community.

Something I had to write as viewing from sidelines for so long has become
somewhat unbearable.

I Would say A little while before FB came out a different crowd has settled
in here. Judging bye some comments most are likely of a young age or those
that take this game for advantage. Allthough I may be wrong in this issumption.

Ok a little history Lesson.
Before Il-2 was released the best WW2 Flightsims that I had played
was European Air War and Janes World War two fighters.
Back then the game you had except for third party work was what
you got ...thank god for the third party modders who still keep
these games alive today and probablly contributed to most of there
sales.

Then along came Oleg I can still remember when all you got of
updates was a few Pics at Sim.HQ. We where all amazed at what
was being created ..Oleg had a much more cheerful way back then
also and was having a ball explaining to us the new stuff that
was being created. I suspect many of us from back in those days
are still around but have a hard time viewing these forums ...
considering what games we came from. I have also noticed even guys
who help this game so much like Luthier and oters no longer post here.

On a last note I would like to Say please before Post have something genuine
to say ...Dont Ask for Patch now one day it will be released the only
reason it comes a little later is Oleg and Crew busting there but to
deliver something that should improve things ..that most of you wanted.

Please help keep this game alive by being positive if one day Oleg
and Crew was to say we have had enough time to close up shop think
of what we would miss out on (the old dont miss it to its to late
syndrome) Also remember what other game is out
there that even bother to tell you when patch or anything else is
comming out.

Support the game if you like it dont can it.
The_Few

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:44 AM
Any request for a patch shows that the person making it is playing the game, and is sufficiently enthusiastic about it to care whether certain bugs are fixed or not.

People reporting issues and asking for them to be patched _are_ supporting the game!

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:53 AM
good points.

Anyway, when's the patch coming out?

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XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 10:38 PM
just go to other forums like simhq netwings a complete waste of space for the piltos lounge etc like most of us do


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Good dogfighters bring ammo home, Great ones don't. (c) Leadspitter

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:06 PM
Why does your name have newbie under it if you have all this perspective?


Any comment is a good comment as far as Oleg is concerned. I bet he would rather 2.5 million people post stupid comments than 500+ come up with good posts.

XyZspineZyX
08-04-2003, 11:49 PM
I can never understand how someone can read a forum for a long time, and never say anything. That would be torture for me.

Da Buzz
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XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 02:52 AM
You haven't seen everything.

Sierra/Dynamix did the complete community interaction thing throughout over half of 1998, and they were really big on the interaction. But in the end there was a shakeup and decisions were made partly due to screwed-up elements in the same community as well as the corporation (who managed to lose/drive out the development team or key people over and over right to the end of a years long process) and we got what we got with red Baron 3D. Only by long hard efforts has the better part of the community been able to keep RB3D alive and improving still.

But they did interact well in 1998. And the DM is very good and detailed although it was users who had to trim the hit boxes down to match the parts. Still, not hit bubbles and for the average PC's of the times, the DM was amazingly well done. the gunnery however, was IMO arcaded right before the end to include a scatter cone. In the pursuit of making a physics-based FM match some tables the FM itself got cracked in nasty ways. And the netcode has yet to be matched by any free to play online sim, I've been on with 80 players at once on the same map.

All this ran decently on a 200+mz pentium-class PC (I had a K6-2 233) with 3D card (even a Voodoo-1 or less, a 4MB card worked okay until there were too many custom skins on players).

Physics-based FM, 1998. Detailed DM, 1998. Developer interaction, 1998. It is possible and even probable that the interaction and detailed DM happened before then but I didn't see it. Ask the Warbirds, Falcon and other FS communities about those. Red Baron 2 was the first I knew of sim with a physics-based FM. If anyone wants to say about the levels of detail then remember that PC's have and will be changing so there will be more detail later.

First is first though and only the detail level of IL2/FB is unprecedented, which I appreciate right along with the rest. Now if only the huge amount details there can be corrected to within human abilities then I'll be happy without any more added to further push the need to upgrade my system completely. Thanks is due and has been given in posts as well as timely purchases at full price. I know that those are appreciated in return.


Neal

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:31 AM
your right ..
I have noticed some peps.complaining about all the little details ..and never say anything good ..just complaine.

then nag the patch .. the patch..we want it now..

sounds like my kids at christmas....

some details are important to the developers ..YES and thats a good part of this forum.

but chill on the patch thing ..

and when I does come out ..the peps will be so thankfull.
like all there bitc#in worked ..hmm like kids.

did you know there is a dev.update section on the main site?

FYI..



Chin up ..HUTCH

http://www.il2skins.com/skins/thumbs/1848.jpg


Chin up ..HUTCH

http://www.il2skins.com/skins/thumbs/1848.jpg


Chin up ..HUTCH

http://www.il2skins.com/skins/thumbs/1848.jpg

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 04:27 AM
It got CS'd

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 05:54 AM
old mans ***!

it is nice to be nice though.

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 08:15 AM
unbelievable!!!!!!!

someone makes a good point and look what happens!!!

Yep!! he may have a tag as newbie from the board but hey if you post a lot of crap that doesn,t mean you rule the world.

SALUTATIONS!!!!

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 02:03 PM
A pretty good message TheFew. Let me make a few observations of what I've experienced in other communities and compair it to your experience.

Many people come and go from a community. You don't often see one person continually active in a community over the course of years at a time. In the case of Luthier, I think we all hope that his and IL2Center's updated self returns sooner rather than later. Such a co-ordinated system took talent and dedication and that was definately a person who was really capable of both.

The unfortunate side-effect of making a successful game is that there are going to be more and more of the general gaming public on these forums and while I hate to generalize, the more successful IL-2 and FB become, the more complaining, constant bickering, and general carrying on you are going to see. It happens to most games...its a positive sign that the game is doing well and a negative sign to the people who are used to a tighter and friendlier community.

Overall this is largely a good thing. People are paying attention to a highly realistic, demanding, and even educational flight sim product that is better than anything even on the horizon. Its a testiment to the quality of design that Oleg and his team have put forth. Even when you don't see Oleg being as positive and joyful about sharing things with the public as he used to...deep down I'm sure he and his team know what they want to do next and know very well what potential their products have.

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 02:11 PM
The truth is that without the patch-whiners, anti-whiners and tech factoid beaters, that in all likelyhood without them beating on each other, there would have been NO patch or a patch with much less substance.

This is the truth.

Most patches are not made, because of money and resources unless there is a large outcry from the community, period.

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 02:34 PM
Uh, <raises hand> I was here 'in the beginning'.

I know there are still a lot of people who are around here since IL2 came out (I can remember seeing the first screenshots and waiting about a year for the release - tense times /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif ).

I also have to say that the general content of the forums seems to have, well, declined a little. More time is spent demanding/complaining (legitimate posts aside) than at first (when many posts were "Check this out" or "How do you....?" or just appreciation of the sim). I suppose its only natural as there are less new players and excitement now than when IL2 was released....

ahh, I'm getting all misty. I tried to remember specific things, but my memory is as much use as a P40 /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
I do remember that the forum used to *feel* more welcoming - I'd come online and it'd be like walking into someones lounge where Tully, Skychimp, BuzzU, RBJ, SmokeJaguar, Helos, HeavyDelta and some Blitzpigs (to name a very few) were having a chat (sometimes vociferously) and you could say hello, sit down in the corner and enjoy the proceedings.../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

I'm sure a lot more could be achieved if we quit the wants and rants and came with the praise and the polite asks. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Ham_Tyler - the amazing human lawndart!

XyZspineZyX
08-05-2003, 03:57 PM
Yup Hamm, I too have been around since EAW was being developed by the Flight Sim Community.....most people would just post about what was just developed by the community, or try to help newbies (like me) to set up their PC's to run the sim with the mod's....their was no time for 'b$tchin'...things were changing fast, too many other things to post about. Just trying to get the sim to run on the latest mod was an adventure. We never dreamed of the DM or detail in Forgotten Battles. Their were NO clouds. Just getting the correct RPM gauge in the cockpit was a victory!

And I remember Oleg posting that he would like to make a flight sim with all the goodies already in it, right from the shelf, and couldn't understand why all the bells and whistles weren't in the sim (EAW) to begin with.
There weren't many WWII flight sims out, PAW and EAW....then he said he was actually going to put out a flight sim of his own, he was serious.

People said...'sure Oleg...you do that'.....

Then he did /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif .

Yup...those were much friendlier days. We had alot more to talk about back then....before Oleg made this flight sim...with all the bells and whistles...lol....

So.....did you get things to where you wanted them to be Oleg?.../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif .

Hello Hamm.../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif .


"Murphy's Law"

"Murphy's Law"