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View Full Version : POLL: How about a PRINTED manual ?



Drebbel
04-21-2004, 01:16 AM

Drebbel
04-21-2004, 01:16 AM

Drebbel
04-21-2004, 01:47 AM
I personally can do without a printed manual, a digital manual will be ok for me. But it would be nice if the manual explains about manual TDC. Of course I expect te sim itself to fully support manual TDC !


Drebbel

The Submarines of the Royal Netherlands Navy 1906 - 2004
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Egan2.0
04-21-2004, 11:43 AM
I would love a proper printed manual but we probably won't see one.

Maybe we'll get an option to mail order a special edition like 'Lock On' had.

A thin, printed one covering tutorials, controls and how the mission editor works with a proper one in PDF format on the disk would be fine though.

CDragon
04-21-2004, 12:45 PM
I'd go for a digital manual, if it was, when printed, a fat, detailed manual with plenty of background material, manual TDC tutorials/explanations, a ship database, complete with silhouettes, mast heights, etc.

I can hear the chainsaws in the forests starting their work now... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ulfr1066
04-22-2004, 12:48 AM
What ever happened to the good old days of wide and bountyful manuals? The other day I stumbled upon my manual from Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe and noted its great abundance of not only pertinent information on flight systems so often left out of sims nowadays, but also the wonderful amount of background lovingly written into the manual. Il2 and Forgotten Battles have raised the bar for flight sims and make a mockery out of the once-glorious pixeled beauty of SWOTL, but they have much to learn from ol' Lawerence and his crew about documentation. Il2 barely had enough instrutions for some inexperinced players to play the game(though they have likely atoned for this deficingy with their long devotion to supporting their sim once it was on the market). Even the supposed Evil Empire of Computing and mind control, Microsoft included a very well written manual in CFS2, with some nice oral history to fill out the pages. UBIsoft might not be on the plane of Microsoft in terms of deep pockets, but I doubt that the cost that went into the manual realy bit into Microsofts profit to the point were it was cost perhibitive. The designers of the program are knowledgable enough about their project to produce it, so how hard is it to produce a decently thorough manual. If you are going to bother to put in the effort to simulate complex systems why not spend the extra day and explain what you have just created.

walter_gouws
04-22-2004, 12:53 AM
I enjoy being able to open the game box, and then seeing all the goodies in it, like thick-as manuals, maps, etc.

so yeah, I would very much like a big fat and juicy printed manual http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

CB..
04-22-2004, 01:17 AM
i think the fact that folks are still searching for original boxed copys of AOD simply to get hold of the maps included is testimony enough...

Drebbel
04-22-2004, 02:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CB..:
i think the fact that folks are still searching for original boxed copys of AOD simply to get hold of the maps included is testimony enough...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep, very true. I have one AOD map archived and anotherone framed on my PCroom wall http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


Drebbel

The Submarines of the Royal Netherlands Navy 1906 - 2004
http://www.DutchSubmarines.com/
We have a NEW FORUM:
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SailorSteve
04-22-2004, 10:05 AM
I voted for PDF manual, if it helps keep my cost down. I can live with reading it off the computer or printing it out myself.

What I would like to see is copies of all the Kriegsmarine maps (which is what the AOD map was) either in the box or onscreen, so I can print them out myself.

Always keep you clothes and your weapons where you can find them in the dark.

walter_gouws
04-22-2004, 07:10 PM
What is AOD?

CDragon
04-22-2004, 07:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by walter_gouws:
What is AOD?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

AOD is Aces of the Deep.

Redwine
04-26-2004, 08:18 AM
Agree with Drebbel.........

A good, fat and big manual with full support of all kind of themes, specially manual shooting will be so great, but I can live with this in .pdf version........

I am from a old wave, the enchntement of a book will be not replaced never....... but I can be happy with a .pdf version........

The important is the manual must to be so good, complete and teach the user to manage all kind of situations, included historical data, and specially manual shooting for hardcore use.......

I think so the most important is the manual content............ manual will be so complete, this is the most important.........

And....... I preffer the company use the resourses of a printed manual into include a set of plastic calculator rulers for manual shooting........this will be so great !

Of course, to have both ....... a printed manual and a plstic set of calculator rulers wil be better even........

______________________________
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.

CDragon
04-26-2004, 08:49 AM
Does anyone know UBI's track record on manuals for their games? Anecdotes graciously accepted! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

SOF_Timber
04-26-2004, 08:53 AM
All this is very good...hope Ubi delivers everything everybody is asking for. One simple question though...how much are you guys willing to spend for all this?

CDragon
04-26-2004, 09:23 AM
(Possible) Suggested Retail Price: $49.99 US (my figure. Actual figure may and probably will vary).
Shipping: $5.99
Productivity lost playing it: Into the $10s of thousands.
Hours spent modding the thing: Priceless
http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

LtBen
04-26-2004, 05:35 PM
The bigger the better. Preferably bigger than The German Army 1933-1945 by Matthew Cooper http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

klh
04-28-2004, 01:50 PM
I can do without a printed manual as I rarely use them after learning the game. However, PLEASE include printed materials that would be useful for gameplay, such as...
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>- silhouettes with mast heights, draft
- maps in Kriegsmarine style
- a "whiz-wheel" to help with manual TDC
- a key command quick reference[/list]
Another wish list item would be an engima code key book (in the hopes they will include a working enigma http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif)

ulfr1066
04-28-2004, 09:21 PM
I think ubi's track record with their manuals for sims is not so good. Functional information like setting up a multiplayer game is all well and fine, but a simulation needs more than mere guidance as what to do after the disc is in the drive. The thin documentation has always been a point of complaint in the print media's assessment of their games. To quote the "bottom line" of PC Gamer's review of Il2 Sturmovik "LOWS: Horrendous manual and lame tutorials". Indeed much information has been left out of the game such as techinical data on systems that can hardly be considered to be self evident. Everything from armoured cowl settings to the new weapons added in Forgoten Battles (PC 1400?) has largely been left out of the two games' manuals. It amazes me that people are so prone to over-argue the costs of printing manuals. However if the information is unavailible for printed manuals I think the next best place for the technical information is in the graphical menu of the game itself. The "view objects" option in il2 has an overview of technical info for most of the planes, ships and ground vehicles that would have once been the part of a comprehensive manual. This method of delivering data is to me the next best thing to having it in my lap in the form of a manual. I needn't exit the sim to look for data on a cd, or spend the time printing off a .pdf. However this information should be expanded to include weapons information, in this case information on the changes in Kriegsmarine armament and munitions, and the enemy that they might come across. As toward the map from AOD. Gone are those days that sims printed maps I'm affraid &lt;though I note that many rpgs of recent years have had maps, along with several strategy games&gt;.

ParaB
04-28-2004, 09:47 PM
I'd mostly agree with Ulfr. UBI's record with sim manuals isn't terrible but there's a lot of room for improvement.

SHII manual: not bad, but definately a bit short. Explains the game's functions well but a bit more historical background/data would've been nice.

Lock On: printed manual definately too short, only barely explains the game's functions. Good PDF manual on disc though.

IL2:FB : printed manual not bad but again a bit short. Much useful information as PDF files on disc, though.

For SHIII I expect a small SHII-style manual with around 50-60 pages that describes the game's basic functions and hope for a detailed PDF document describing ships, weapons systems, tactics and some articles about WW2 submarine warfare and the battle of the atlantic.

storm1172
04-28-2004, 11:25 PM
"MicroProce" thats says all. They could do some realy good manuals, including all you needed from tuturials to background info.
Gunship, F17 and Silent Service are some good Amiga/C64 games they did.
So yes a good printed manual with background info is a must.
pdf file are only good for warez kids that dont want to buy the game.¨ http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

xwhitemousex
04-29-2004, 09:54 AM
- A fat manual with all info needed to learn everything from the basic dive/emerge to hardcore TDC and manual shooting, and with historical background and so forth
- A Silhoutte Manual in addition to the game one. (Loved going through my dads silhouette data books from his days in the navy. He'd copy pages from the book where the name, heights, lengths and all that data for each ship was printed)
- Plastic rulers (this would be such a priceless addition)
- Kriegsmarine maps... maybe one major one of the european theater, mediterrean, Iceland/NE england/Ireland etc... Or at least make them available to order online et.c.

One of the things that got me hardcore into simulations such as SH, Falcon 4.0, European Air War, Combat Flight Simulator and so forth, was the old C64 and Amiga500 simulators that contained a big, far manual with lots of data to get yourself immersed in.

If you check out the Falcon 4.0 manual, it describes the full use of 3 different Air-Ground radars, 4 different Air-Air radar modes as well as an ocean of other information. I spent hours learning it all, and the rewarding feeling when you start to master them is unique.

Of course, there was the options to simplify everything, but I'm a sim-player, not an arcade player.

Please, fat and informative manual, preferably with additions such as "whiz-wheel"/rulers, silhoutte manuals and maps... its a Simulator, not an arcade game...

Simulator is the key word here folks http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Redwine
04-30-2004, 09:02 AM
Agree, Silhouette Type Contact Book will allow us to know all heights for all masts of the ships.......

This must to be present........

May be in a paper book or in .pdf to print ...but we need to have it..........

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

CB..
04-30-2004, 09:28 AM
agree playing SH3 without any printed reading matter, maps ship silouhettes etc etc would be like playing the board game Monopoly using a random number generator instead of dice...shaking the dice in your hand and rolling them across the board was an important element of the gameplay..stuuf like this makes a difference subtle perhaps, taken for granted definitely ; but fundemental non the less..!

Drebbel
04-30-2004, 10:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ParaB:
&lt;snip&gt;SHII manual: not bad, but definately a bit short. Explains the game's functions well but a bit more historical background/data would've been nice.
&lt;snip&gt;<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually the SHII paper manual sucked big time. In many countries there was only a printed leaflet with a douzen pages boxed with the sim. The leaflet did not even address all sim functions ! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

But those countries did have the complete English manual on the SHII CD


Drebbel

The Submarines of the Royal Netherlands Navy 1906 - 2004
http://www.DutchSubmarines.com/
We have a NEW FORUM:
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http://www.dutchsubmarines.com/hosting/images/sig/drebbel/kmoorlwp.gif

ParaB
04-30-2004, 11:08 AM
Mine was about 120 pages, in german, so I stick with my assertion that it was not bad, but a bit short in some aspects. Of course a printet leaflet of a few pages with the rest as PDF file is a slap in the face for someone buying a full-price product, no question.

HeibgesU999
05-06-2004, 10:40 PM
what if they had an interatctive manual in the captains nook on his bookshelf that you could look at ingame.

or more precisely, when your 3d kalue climbs down from the bridge, slides down the ladder through the conning tower, then, dropping into the control room, leaves the IWO in charge, walks back the kalue's nook, lies down, and picks out the game manual to read.

perhaps they could also have a copy of the uboat commanders handbook for reference in a similiar manner

CDragon
05-07-2004, 06:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HeibgesU999:
what if they had an interatctive manual in the captains nook on his bookshelf that you could look at ingame.

or more precisely, when your 3d kalue climbs down from the bridge, slides down the ladder through the conning tower, then, dropping into the control room, leaves the IWO in charge, walks back the kalue's nook, lies down, and picks out the game manual to read.

perhaps they could also have a copy of the uboat commanders handbook for reference in a similiar manner<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Cooler would be that the game manual was actually an item you could carry around with you. So after laying in bunk for a while, our captain decides he'd like some air. He could take the manual to the bridge...

Perhaps even enjoy a smoke. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

HeibgesU999
05-07-2004, 12:06 PM
YES!!!!!

WilhelmSchulz.-
08-16-2005, 04:47 PM
A printed Reconition manual. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif