PDA

View Full Version : Coop missions are so immersion breaking-Suggestions for ACV



dimbismp
02-23-2015, 03:55 PM
So,there were similar threads about this topic,but i can't find them.

Anyway,the coop in ACU was really inconsistent and immersion breaking.First of all,i thought that the coop missions were just missions Arno did with other assassins and that were given by the Council.In reality,it is much more complicated,as it turns out that every member of the team is an Initiate.

Also,Arno rarely speaks during those missions.So,it doesn't feel that it is him doing the missions,but just a random assassin of the period.

The most important reason though,for which i will never forgive the devs,is how ****** the timeline is.Arno is expelled drom the Brotherhood of Paris in 1793 iirc.But guess what?He actually takes part in missions given by the Brotherhood of Paris during the period 1793-1794.Six whole missions!!!!!!How do you explain that?


My advice for ACV is this:Keep it simple.
Samuel,or whatever his name is,should be given missions by the Brotherhood.The other players are not Initiates,but just other assassins.Samuel should speak more than Arno during these missions and finally,the missions should be unlocked chronologically.

***Edited out the partially masked profanity. Please don't bypass the auto-censor in future -- Thanks

ze_topazio
02-23-2015, 04:12 PM
They need to have this missions, or at least the ones that deal with historical events, being unlocked as you progress in the story.

Shahkulu101
02-23-2015, 04:32 PM
My suggestion - get rid of it unless it's separate from single player.

The_Pashker-Man
02-23-2015, 04:42 PM
Coop with out historical story. More cooperation. Like Desmond and lucy in acb. Diffrent type of missions like racing or survival.
And you dont play as samuel. You create an assassins for the mp and coop both. Choose gear and look (face and hair)

Assassin_M
02-23-2015, 04:49 PM
1) Unlock them as story progresses to coincide with historical canon and in game events
2) Have protagonist or giver of mission IN THE TIME PERIOD narrate the story, not someone from modern day

The second point is sort of in Dead Kings.

Matknapers18
02-23-2015, 04:58 PM
Yeah, I was kinda upset to see that co-op added nothing to Arno or the unity story. Sorta felt chucked in.

For Victory, character creation and customisation for co-op could be pretty neat actually. It means that Ubisoft wouldn't really need to worry about the timeline, dates and relevance within Samuel's story. But then again, this would completely eradicate any link between coop and single player.

Namikaze_17
02-23-2015, 05:06 PM
I agree with everyone else that the missions should only unlock as you progress in the game.

Granted, some dialogue by Sam or someone in the period would really add to it as well.


EDIT: Off-topic, but Mat I want a Viking AC too. ^__^

*High fives*

I-Like-Pie45
02-23-2015, 05:18 PM
The Eyecue Solution: Remove single-player missions
http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/257/968/786.jpg

Perk89
02-23-2015, 06:34 PM
I'm pretty sure the bread march mission also occurs while Arno is in the Bastille or at least shortly after and yet somehow you're there.


all that aside, the whole thing is a mess regardless. One of the game's biggest complaints is that it feels so disconnected from the setting and co-op is one of the biggest culprits for that. All the notable moments of the Revolution are crammed into co-op missions, where the quality and experience is an utter disaster. I have yet to attempt a game of co-op where every player didn't sprint ahead on his own in a chance to be "the hero" and ruin the entire mission by bringing in every guard in the area. Ubisoft thought they could took some moments of the Revolution, slip them into co-op and it wouldn't be a big deal, but it blew up in their face. There is no plot development, no character development, and the implementation of it robs the single player of what it could have been and destroys the immersion I have as a player as I watch other idiot players run off and act stupid. Not to mention the whole thing is a buggy mess.

As I said in my own thread on the issue, the best thing they could do is simply drop co-op from the campaign and have a separate studio do the co-op as it's own exclusive game-mode completely separate from the events of the main game, just as they used to do with the multiplayer. It benefits Ubisoft as it also allows them to explore time periods they may otherwise never get to do and flesh out the single player completely so that it doesn't have to "save" material for use in co-op and flesh out co-op completely without having to make it fit within the confines of the single player story.



it is a win/win and there is no reason it shouldn't be done,

Xstantin
02-23-2015, 06:38 PM
1) Unlock them as story progresses to coincide with historical canon and in game events


This. I ended up making a timeline for replays.

Perk89
02-23-2015, 06:39 PM
Yeah, I was kinda upset to see that co-op added nothing to Arno or the unity story. Sorta felt chucked in.

It makes the co-op bland, but at the same time, do you really want your single player experience to depend on xXxD34THS1AY3R555xXx or whatever...? Having other people ruin the immersion for me is bad enough as it, do you really want them to be a part of the main plot and character progression?


For Victory, character creation and customisation for co-op could be pretty neat actually. It means that Ubisoft wouldn't really need to worry about the timeline, dates and relevance within Samuel's story. But then again, this would completely eradicate any link between coop and single player.

Thats the goal.

Perk89
02-23-2015, 06:41 PM
This. I ended up making a timeline for replays.



You can do this, but as I found for some reason some genius thought it'd be a good idea to have some of the chronologically earlier missions be the "more" difficult missions, which means you're unlocking master and legendary gear within moments of Arno becoming an Assassin.

Xstantin
02-23-2015, 06:54 PM
You can do this, but as I found for some reason some genius thought it'd be a good idea to have some of the chronologically earlier missions be the "more" difficult missions, which means you're unlocking master and legendary gear within moments of Arno becoming an Assassin.

That'll be Women's March irrc. Agreed, it was kinda annoying.

Farlander1991
02-23-2015, 06:55 PM
When they first showed the co-op trailer, I thought that it would be side-characters from the main story that other people will be playing as. And, honestly, I would prefer that way.

While I do like ACU side missions by design, I really don't like the way it's narratively structured. The 'oh we'll just dump everything historical, which is mostly out of context, into side-missions' is an extreme. Honestly, for example, I couldn't care less about the stolen royal jewels. Or the heads of the person who made them post-mortem. Or meeting the creator of the Guillotine. Sometimes there should be less history in favor of consistency and normal narrative.

Matknapers18
02-23-2015, 06:59 PM
It makes the co-op bland, but at the same time, do you really want your single player experience to depend on xXxD34THS1AY3R555xXx or whatever...? Having other people ruin the immersion for me is bad enough as it, do you really want them to be a part of the main plot and character progression?

The co-op can still develop Arno's character while not being an integral part of the story. The co-op missions don't necessarily have to link in to the main storyline, but they could still revolve around more minor events in Arno's life that progress his personality and such. Although, I somewhat agree, no one plays co-op with friends in order to watch a meaningful cutscene. I would just like some link, thats all.

Perk89
02-23-2015, 07:02 PM
That'll be Women's March irrc. Agreed, it was kinda annoying.



Honestly its its stuff like that is so overly abundant in Unity that makes me feel as if Ubisoft is completely disconnected from their fanbase. I've long criticized Ubi for not understanding what the series' strengths are, but Unity took it way over the edge. They have taken a chainsaw to everything their fanbase likes about the franchise and have done crap like this.


Hey Ubisoft, this series isn't about unlockables and weapon classes and all the other crap you've ripped off from popular games. It's about story and narrative and world-immersion.

Perk89
02-23-2015, 07:04 PM
The co-op can still develop Arno's character while not being an integral part of the story. The co-op missions don't necessarily have to link in to the main storyline, but they could still revolve around more minor events in Arno's life that progress his personality and such. Although, I somewhat agree, no one plays co-op with friends in order to watch a meaningful cutscene. I would just like some link, thats all.



Youre not understanding what I'm saying.

Matknapers18
02-23-2015, 07:10 PM
Youre not understanding what I'm saying.

Oh my mistake. I'm intrigued though, please elaborate. Are you basically saying that co-op and single player just don't mix?

GoldenBoy9999
02-23-2015, 07:46 PM
I hope that the narrator is changed for Victory. Bishop's enthusiasm to accomplish these tasks for historical figures confused me as the Animus does not alter the past. Sure, getting the food to the Parisians may increase Arno's synchronization but it doesn't change anything. The French Revolution is over, it's just a simulation.

A historical narrator would make much more sense as he has valid reason to encourage you to accomplish your goals.

fenris19892
03-21-2015, 12:27 AM
I'm pretty sure the bread march mission also occurs while Arno is in the Bastille or at least shortly after and yet somehow you're there.


all that aside, the whole thing is a mess regardless. One of the game's biggest complaints is that it feels so disconnected from the setting and co-op is one of the biggest culprits for that. All the notable moments of the Revolution are crammed into co-op missions, where the quality and experience is an utter disaster. I have yet to attempt a game of co-op where every player didn't sprint ahead on his own in a chance to be "the hero" and ruin the entire mission by bringing in every guard in the area. Ubisoft thought they could took some moments of the Revolution, slip them into co-op and it wouldn't be a big deal, but it blew up in their face. There is no plot development, no character development, and the implementation of it robs the single player of what it could have been and destroys the immersion I have as a player as I watch other idiot players run off and act stupid. Not to mention the whole thing is a buggy mess.

As I said in my own thread on the issue, the best thing they could do is simply drop co-op from the campaign and have a separate studio do the co-op as it's own exclusive game-mode completely separate from the events of the main game, just as they used to do with the multiplayer. It benefits Ubisoft as it also allows them to explore time periods they may otherwise never get to do and flesh out the single player completely so that it doesn't have to "save" material for use in co-op and flesh out co-op completely without having to make it fit within the confines of the single player story.



it is a win/win and there is no reason it shouldn't be done,

The co-op would've been better like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZMGI0lpNbA but unfortunately they didn't make the co-op missions like this all it is now is the same tired missions over and offer no differing variables as shown even the idea of assassins being stealthy has been toned down so you'll see people just charging into the fray to kill enemies instead.