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kriegerdesgottes
02-02-2015, 03:52 AM
I haven't really reviewed an AC game for a while but this one really looked promising and I wanted to post it because I've been seeing a lot of disappointing reviews and negativity surrounding the game so I wanted to address it because the game has soo much potential to be the best AC game ever but falls flat and I worry that Ubisoft will do what they typically do when a game isn't as well received is they will scrap everything and start new and I think that would be a mistake but ACU does so much right. The problem is for every right thing it does, it seems to do two or three things wrong.

I personally enjoyed Arno as a character. I would say he's now my second favorite behind Ezio. He's witty and likable but I really didn't care at all for the British accent. If they had kept the same voice actor and had him do a believable French accent I think it would be a lot better. I don't understand why they would do this considering how much flak Ubisoft got for Altair's voice actor having a strong American accent. They fixed this by giving Ezio, their most popular character, an Italian accent and all was well. So why would they make everyone in this game British? I get because the animus translates what they are saying but the accent pulls me out of the game. Speaking of the animus, what happened to it? I miss it. I miss the glitchy animus and being in a descendent's body watching his genetic ancestral memories a lot. I'm not wild about this abstergo memory machine crap.

The graphics and setting are incredible. I always said the French Revolution would be perfect for an AC game. It was always my top pic. I really wish this game had done it better justice. It's so frustrating to see such a huge beautiful game with so much to do fail at making the basic things fun like navigation which was just blocky and annoying. I really miss how the navigation felt and controlled in the old AC1 AC2 games. It felt more realistic and fun. Then people complained it wasn't fast enough (apparently these ancient assassins are supposed to be the Flash?) Now it's just unrealistic when it does work and otherwise I'm constantly running into walls. Navigation is so important to enjoy the game. RDR is a flawless game but it's navigation, like in most Rockstar games, is terrible and therefore it's only fun for so long. I used to play AC2 every single day until ACB came out and I never got tired of it. I got tired of ACIII real quick because I hate the way they've changed the movement.

Another annoying aspect is the combat which again was changed because of cry babies on the internet saying the combat wasn't hard enough. My argument to this has always been the same. This is a master assassin we are playing here. Not some guy on the street. He should be able to take down several guards with ease and it should make me feel like a badass. That's why I play video games so I can not suck at doing things in a virutal world that would have real consequences in real life like murdering several guards at once for example. If the combat isn't fun (which it isn't) then a huge portion of the game is frustrating and annoying. I hate taking on missions because I know I'm going to be keeping my neighbors up teaching their kids new vocabulary screaming at ACU because the Combat is straight up not fun and annoying. Personally I think ACB had the absolute best combat of any AC game. it mixed counter kills with the ability to combine kills and encouraged you to chain kill. It was fun. This is not.

I will say for this game it was some of the best freedom of any of the game. That is one thing it also did absolutely right. It took the freedom of AC1 and AC2 and made the missions slightly more fun. This is something the games have been seriously lacking since ACB starting punishing the player for not playing the way Ubisoft felt they should play. So annoying. But this game went back to basics so allowed the player to go in and take the kill however they felt like it. That's awesome.

The customization in ACU is hands down the best of any AC game. I think we can pretty much all agree on that. I found it strange they didn't put in a Black/Red suit option because those were always the coolest in the other games but if they keep expanding on this customization and add more options each time then I think they would be great. One thing I would like back is the ability to customize my weapon wheel. I like having my weapons in a certain place when I need them. I'm not wild about the ACU weapon setup. I'm constantly throwing down cherry bombs or money when I want to throw a smoke bomb. Also PLEASE bring back the ability to select weapons and play with them while walking around. It drives me nuts not being able to play with my hidden blade while walking around. I ALWAYS do that in every game and this game takes it away for some strange reason. Please bring that back. I realize it's a small feature but I miss it so much.

As far as the story goes I'm a little disappointed they didn't delve more into the actual French Revolution story considering how tailor made it was for a AC game. I was really hoping to see more of Jean Paul Marat and Robbespier and Louis the 16th and Marie Antoinette but that didn't really happen. I think Marat only shows up dead in the murder mystery part which is a shame because he had a lot to do with the reign of terror happening. I liked Elise as a character but I wish they would have just made the French Revolution more part of the story instead of Arno's sort of clichee love affair with Elise. Otherwise I thought Arno getting Spoilers: kicked out of the assassins was a crazy part of the story and was really interesting. But at the end he seems to just somehow be an assassin again without much explanation. Apparently they just welcomed him back in for killing Germain?

Here is my biggest complaint about this game that I can absolutely not understand. WHY would they leave out ambient music from this game?!? After the community freaked out after ACIII for making this mistake and making the game so boring they went and fixed it in AC4 Black Flag. I really thought they had learned their lesson considering they fixed it in the next game. Then this comes out, their biggest game yet..No ambient music in free roam...Are you serious!? One of the things that makes AC2 so great is its music. Not just in how much of a genius Jesper Kyd was (you need this guy back) but how it was used in free roam. It made for a magical experience. The game having NO music during free roam sucks all that magic out of the experience and leave you walking around in a beautiful boring world where running around and fighting guards is not very fun.

This game has a great amount of side missions which Ubisoft seems to be a lot better at doing now since ACIII. No complaints there. The more stuff there is to do the better in my opinion. They finally got random events right in this one too. Revelations botched random events soo bad it was pathetic but stopping crimes and catching thieves in actually random and fun in ACU.

I really didn't want to make this super long but I actually really enjoy ACU for the things it does right but it does so much stuff that is just inexcusable that I just had to make a review because I'm afraid Ubisoft is going to see themselves losing money and scrap everything in ACU and that would be a mistake. ACU does so much right. It just also does a lot of stupid stuff that could have been so much better. For example all the awesome stuff from other games that are just not there. Not being able to pick up bodies or weapons? not being able to whistle from hiding spots or dive under water? You can't just leave functions like these out of a game like this.

Please also bring back a descendent character for modern times. I wasn't a huge fan of Desmond but boy do I miss him now. It was a necessary evil to add interest to the game. You couldn't wait to find out more about his bloodline and find out more about the man's history and what kind of assassins he might become because of it. Now he's just dead and they replaced him with .....a no name first person verision of "you". NO THANKS. Either bring Desmond back or bring in a new character whose memories we can watch from a glitchy animus please.

So I guess my message here is please don't scrap everything in ACU. It has some serious potential and is still one of my top favorite AC games. Keep the freedom, the graphics, the cool character, the customization but there's a lot of learning they can do from the previous games especially AC2.

DemonLord4lf
02-02-2015, 04:24 AM
I haven't really reviewed an AC game for a while but this one really looked promising and I wanted to post it because I've been seeing a lot of disappointing reviews and negativity surrounding the game so I wanted to address it because the game has soo much potential to be the best AC game ever but falls flat and I worry that Ubisoft will do what they typically do when a game isn't as well received is they will scrap everything and start new and I think that would be a mistake but ACU does so much right. The problem is for every right thing it does, it seems to do two or three things wrong.

I personally enjoyed Arno as a character. I would say he's now my second favorite behind Ezio. He's witty and likable but I really didn't care at all for the British accent. If they had kept the same voice actor and had him do a believable French accent I think it would be a lot better. I don't understand why they would do this considering how much flak Ubisoft got for Altair's voice actor having a strong American accent. They fixed this by giving Ezio, their most popular character, an Italian accent and all was well. So why would they make everyone in this game British? I get because the animus translates what they are saying but the accent pulls me out of the game. Speaking of the animus, what happened to it? I miss it. I miss the glitchy animus and being in a descendent's body watching his genetic ancestral memories a lot. I'm not wild about this abstergo memory machine crap.

The graphics and setting are incredible. I always said the French Revolution would be perfect for an AC game. It was always my top pic. I really wish this game had done it better justice. It's so frustrating to see such a huge beautiful game with so much to do fail at making the basic things fun like navigation which was just blocky and annoying. I really miss how the navigation felt and controlled in the old AC1 AC2 games. It felt more realistic and fun. Then people complained it wasn't fast enough (apparently these ancient assassins are supposed to be the Flash?) Now it's just unrealistic when it does work and otherwise I'm constantly running into walls. Navigation is so important to enjoy the game. RDR is a flawless game but it's navigation, like in most Rockstar games, is terrible and therefore it's only fun for so long. I used to play AC2 every single day until ACB came out and I never got tired of it. I got tired of ACIII real quick because I hate the way they've changed the movement.

Another annoying aspect is the combat which again was changed because of cry babies on the internet saying the combat wasn't hard enough. My argument to this has always been the same. This is a master assassin we are playing here. Not some guy on the street. He should be able to take down several guards with ease and it should make me feel like a badass. That's why I play video games so I can not suck at doing things in a virutal world that would have real consequences in real life like murdering several guards at once for example. If the combat isn't fun (which it isn't) then a huge portion of the game is frustrating and annoying. I hate taking on missions because I know I'm going to be keeping my neighbors up teaching their kids new vocabulary screaming at ACU because the Combat is straight up not fun and annoying. Personally I think ACB had the absolute best combat of any AC game. it mixed counter kills with the ability to combine kills and encouraged you to chain kill. It was fun. This is not.

I will say for this game it was some of the best freedom of any of the game. That is one thing it also did absolutely right. It took the freedom of AC1 and AC2 and made the missions slightly more fun. This is something the games have been seriously lacking since ACB starting punishing the player for not playing the way Ubisoft felt they should play. So annoying. But this game went back to basics so allowed the player to go in and take the kill however they felt like it. That's awesome.

The customization in ACU is hands down the best of any AC game. I think we can pretty much all agree on that. I found it strange they didn't put in a Black/Red suit option because those were always the coolest in the other games but if they keep expanding on this customization and add more options each time then I think they would be great. One thing I would like back is the ability to customize my weapon wheel. I like having my weapons in a certain place when I need them. I'm not wild about the ACU weapon setup. I'm constantly throwing down cherry bombs or money when I want to throw a smoke bomb. Also PLEASE bring back the ability to select weapons and play with them while walking around. It drives me nuts not being able to play with my hidden blade while walking around. I ALWAYS do that in every game and this game takes it away for some strange reason. Please bring that back. I realize it's a small feature but I miss it so much.

As far as the story goes I'm a little disappointed they didn't delve more into the actual French Revolution story considering how tailor made it was for a AC game. I was really hoping to see more of Jean Paul Marat and Robbespier and Louis the 16th and Marie Antoinette but that didn't really happen. I think Marat only shows up dead in the murder mystery part which is a shame because he had a lot to do with the reign of terror happening. I liked Elise as a character but I wish they would have just made the French Revolution more part of the story instead of Arno's sort of clichee love affair with Elise. Otherwise I thought Arno getting Spoilers: kicked out of the assassins was a crazy part of the story and was really interesting. But at the end he seems to just somehow be an assassin again without much explanation. Apparently they just welcomed him back in for killing Germain?

Here is my biggest complaint about this game that I can absolutely not understand. WHY would they leave out ambient music from this game?!? After the community freaked out after ACIII for making this mistake and making the game so boring they went and fixed it in AC4 Black Flag. I really thought they had learned their lesson considering they fixed it in the next game. Then this comes out, their biggest game yet..No ambient music in free roam...Are you serious!? One of the things that makes AC2 so great is its music. Not just in how much of a genius Jesper Kyd was (you need this guy back) but how it was used in free roam. It made for a magical experience. The game having NO music during free roam sucks all that magic out of the experience and leave you walking around in a beautiful boring world where running around and fighting guards is not very fun.

This game has a great amount of side missions which Ubisoft seems to be a lot better at doing now since ACIII. No complaints there. The more stuff there is to do the better in my opinion. It's just a shame it's so annoying getting from one to the next.

I really didn't want to make this super long but I actually really enjoy ACU for the things it does right but it does so much stuff that is just inexcusable that I just had to make a review because I'm afraid Ubisoft is going to see themselves losing money and scrap everything in ACU and that would be a mistake. ACU does so much right. It just also does a lot of stupid stuff that could have been so much better.

Please also bring back a descendent character for modern times. I wasn't a huge fan of Desmond but boy do I miss him now. It was a necessary evil to add interest to the game. You couldn't wait to find out more about his bloodline and find out more about the man's history and what kind of assassins he might become because of it. Now he's just dead and they replaced him with .....a no name first person verision of "you". NO THANKS. Either bring Desmond back or bring in a new character whose memories we can watch from a glitchy animus please.

So I guess my message here is please don't scrap everything in ACU. It has some serious potential and is still one of my top favorite AC games. Keep the freedom, the graphics, the cool character, the customization but there's a lot of learning they can do from the previous games especially AC2.

You have seriously put everything I've been complaining about and other things I didn't even realize i enjoyed or hated in such an elegant manner that i hope Ubisoft does listen and take heed to what you've said. I believe they were going in the right direction with the combat system, where you used to be able to chain kill everyone, you get stopped by certain enemies who were always there. That increased the difficulty. Taking away a ton of options to increase the difficulty doesn't make the game better, it just makes you look lazy and makes combat frustrating. When i first played Assassins Creed II, I tried to stick to the stealth approach, but it didn't always work, so i would fight my way out and try again. However, with this combat system, you make a little mistake in stealth and then the entire city is after you. That bugged the hell outta me. Unless they were ringing the bell, I dont expect to be set upon by an entire battalion of soldiers.

I do hope they try to fix where they went wrong instead of just scrapping everything and listen to players such as yourself for ideas on where to go next.

kriegerdesgottes
02-02-2015, 04:29 AM
@ Demonlord Exactly completely agree. Thanks for commenting :)

DemonLord4lf
02-02-2015, 04:33 AM
@ Demonlord Exactly completely agree. Thanks for commenting :)

Not a problem. I truly hope Ubisoft learns from their mistakes and improves on them instead of just trying to start over. :-/

SixKeys
02-02-2015, 04:58 AM
I disagree on:

-Combat difficulty. I'm one of those who are happy to finally see some challenge in AC. I'm not really a combat person in these games, I avoid it whenever possible, but I love having an incentive to avoid combat. Now you don't instantly fail a mission if you get into a fight, but it's still unwise unless you're prepared.

-British accents. I seriously don't get why this is such an issue. 99% of historical movies have everyone speaking in British accents, why is it a problem in games?

-I'm ambivalent about ambient music. In all the other games it's an absolute must, but in ACU I don't even miss it because the soundscape is otherwise so fantastic.

Everything else I pretty much agree on.

Megas_Doux
02-02-2015, 05:04 AM
Good review, I share you opinion in a lot of things....

However Ill point out the fact I disagree about combat. For I still find it rather easy, Unity is neither Dark Souls nor God of War in titan mode, but at least and unlike ever before, there is somewhat of a challenge on engaging more than four guards at once. Personally being able to take waves and waves of guards without ANY effort whatsoever bores me after a while.

Im afraid though, that due to the bad reception of it, call them "cry babies" if you wish, Ubi will return to the roots of that FIVE years old difficulty again......

Fatal-Feit
02-02-2015, 05:05 AM
Not a problem. I truly hope Ubisoft learns from their mistakes and improves on them instead of just trying to start over. :-/

By starting over, do you mean restarting from scratch? That's not Ubisoft. No way in hell are they dropping Unity's assets to build anew. It's Ubisoft's philosophy to reuse as much as they can. Some of Arno's animations are ripped from Connor. At most, they'll take some step backs to please the fans who dislike the changes.

Btw, don't think I'm picking on you today. I like you and enjoy your contribution to the forum. More convos, more fun.

DemonLord4lf
02-02-2015, 05:12 AM
By starting over, do you mean restarting from scratch? That's not Ubisoft. No way in hell are they dropping Unity's assets to build anew. It's Ubisoft's philosophy to reuse as much as they can. Some of Arno's animations are ripped from Connor. At most, they'll take some step backs to please the fans who dislike the changes.

Btw, don't think I'm picking on you today. I like you and enjoy your contribution to the forum. More convos, more fun.

Hey mods, i think this guy is stalking me o.o just look at that sig. I swear i think the eyes are following me o.o

Yea i know, As long as you dont make it personal i dont mind.

kriegerdesgottes
02-02-2015, 05:12 AM
I disagree on:

-Combat difficulty. I'm one of those who are happy to finally see some challenge in AC. I'm not really a combat person in these games, I avoid it whenever possible, but I love having an incentive to avoid combat. Now you don't instantly fail a mission if you get into a fight, but it's still unwise unless you're prepared.

-British accents. I seriously don't get why this is such an issue. 99% of historical movies have everyone speaking in British accents, why is it a problem in games?

-I'm ambivalent about ambient music. In all the other games it's an absolute must, but in ACU I don't even miss it because the soundscape is otherwise so fantastic.

Everything else I pretty much agree on.

Hi Sixkeys long time no see. If they hadn't already given the other characters in the series accents like Ezio and Connor and Edward who all had accent to their respective countries than maybe it wouldn't be so noticeable but this game sticks out like a sore thumb with the accents because it makes a mistake that people complained about a lot back in 2007 with AC1. Also if you watch the clueless gamer episode where conan obrien reviews the game it's like one of the first thing he notices and points out and he knows nothing of these games. It just pulls you out of the experience when the previous several games had already fixed and addressed them. It makes no sense to mess this up.

As far as the combat I am big on combat as it's pretty much all I did in these games before they added the random events which btw are also well done with ACU and so many other fun side missions. I have no interest in constantly running away. Maybe sometimes but I enjoy fighting my way out when necessary. But I can see where you are coming from as someone who isn't a combat person.

The soundscape being so fantastic just makes it that much more frustrating for me that ambient music just isn't there because if it was, it would be great and enhance the game that much more. It hurts the game to have just nothing when if it had ambient music, it would add so much more enjoyment to the game.

SixKeys
02-02-2015, 09:09 PM
Hi Sixkeys long time no see. If they hadn't already given the other characters in the series accents like Ezio and Connor and Edward who all had accent to their respective countries than maybe it wouldn't be so noticeable but this game sticks out like a sore thumb with the accents because it makes a mistake that people complained about a lot back in 2007 with AC1. Also if you watch the clueless gamer episode where conan obrien reviews the game it's like one of the first thing he notices and points out and he knows nothing of these games. It just pulls you out of the experience when the previous several games had already fixed and addressed them. It makes no sense to mess this up.

AC1's "mistake" was that Altar was the ONLY person in the Levantine to have an American accent. If all the characters sounded the same, nobody would have cared.

Keep in mind Unity is supposed to be something of a reboot for the franchise (though how successful it has been in that regard is up for debate). The accents are part of that. Ubi like recycling assets, and like it or not, if they're going to stick with this model of - at least - two successive games with the same engine and basic gameplay, then it makes sense to use neutral accents across the board. It means they can set the games in any time period but keep recycling the same soundbites from enemies and NPCs. Previous games required them to hire language experts to coach the actors to get the accents approximately right. With a neutral, semi-British accent that's one less cost to worry about. It makes sense from a financial point of view. I do understand the inconsistency complaint, but personally I'm not bothered by it.


The soundscape being so fantastic just makes it that much more frustrating for me that ambient music just isn't there because if it was, it would be great and enhance the game that much more. It hurts the game to have just nothing when if it had ambient music, it would add so much more enjoyment to the game.

ACU reminds me of AC1 in so many ways, soundscape being one aspect. AC1 had ambient music, but not all the time. Occasionally it would stop and you could wander around the city just listening to all the various sounds. You could find missions and navigate your way to landmarks just by listening to the sounds. Starting with AC2, they inexplicably made the sounds more muted. When Ezio climbs to the roof, it's like all activity down below stops. Unity brought back the vibrant sound design. You can once again find missions just by listening to sound cues (like when you hear a woman yelling she's been robbed or extremists threatening people). There's so much going on around you, audio-wise, that I find myself not even noticing the lack of music. I do hope ambient music will return in the next game, but ACU did okay without it, especially since the overall soundtrack was the least memorable one in the entire series.

Farlander1991
02-02-2015, 09:15 PM
I do hope ambient music will return in the next game, but ACU did okay without it, especially since the overall soundtrack was the least memorable one in the entire series

Not to mention, ACU has ambient music outside of missions. When you're in Cafe Theatre area from time to time you can hear a variation on the theme from 'On Father's Watch' (when you roam around as a kid in Versailles, and when you break into the palace too). And in other districts there's music too sometimes. It's not loud or prominent like in AC2-AC4, but it's there.

SixKeys
02-02-2015, 09:52 PM
Not to mention, ACU has ambient music outside of missions. When you're in Cafe Theatre area from time to time you can hear a variation on the theme from 'On Father's Watch' (when you roam around as a kid in Versailles, and when you break into the palace too). And in other districts there's music too sometimes. It's not loud or prominent like in AC2-AC4, but it's there.

I was going to mention this, but honestly, it's so rare and so subtle it might as well not even be there. Even AC3 had more ambient music.

Farlander1991
02-02-2015, 11:42 PM
I was going to mention this, but honestly, it's so rare and so subtle it might as well not even be there. Even AC3 had more ambient music.

It's certainly rarer than in AC1, but I've heard it enough that I wouldn't call it so rare.
To be fair, that also depends on the audio set you have. For example, on one of my headphone sets I could never hear any ambient music, while on another it sounded perfectly fine (and actually not so subtle) and not so rare. On the speakers I had I could hear the music, but not as clearly as on those headphones, much quieter.

PS. As AC3 doesn't have any ambient music outside of missions, it can't have more ambient music than ACU :p

Journey93
02-02-2015, 11:45 PM
disagree on the combat it was actually one of the good things about Unity finally some challenge
the graphics were nice and paris as a city just beautiful

BUT thats about it the story was ****
Arno was a boring protagonist, no MD etc..
in the end the flaws are just too much and the game is a 3/10 for me

The4orTy67
02-02-2015, 11:51 PM
Hey wassa matta you Altair?

DemonLord4lf
02-02-2015, 11:53 PM
Hey wassa matta you Altair?

That's racist!

lol that brought back memories lol. I miss the MD storyline :'(

SixKeys
02-03-2015, 12:59 AM
It's certainly rarer than in AC1, but I've heard it enough that I wouldn't call it so rare.
To be fair, that also depends on the audio set you have. For example, on one of my headphone sets I could never hear any ambient music, while on another it sounded perfectly fine (and actually not so subtle) and not so rare. On the speakers I had I could hear the music, but not as clearly as on those headphones, much quieter.

PS. As AC3 doesn't have any ambient music outside of missions, it can't have more ambient music than ACU :p

I could swear there were a few times in AC3 when you're freeroaming and music kicks in, even though you're not in a mission. Maybe I'm thinking of the times when you're traveling between mission markers and you're still allowed to take a few detours.

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 01:01 AM
I could swear there were a few times in AC3 when you're freeroaming and music kicks in, even though you're not in a mission. Maybe I'm thinking of the times when you're traveling between mission markers and you're still allowed to take a few detours.

They added that after a ton of people complained about there being no ambient music.

SixKeys
02-03-2015, 01:04 AM
In the Frontier there's also those random flute noises. Not that it really counts as ambient music, but it's nice all the same. It's the cities that really would have benefitted from music.

aprice07
02-03-2015, 01:53 AM
I definitely agree with the OP. Sounded out my feelings on everything. Especially the combat. Difficult combat can be achieved without sucking all the fun out of it. I still feel there should be a counter button and an attack button. The counter doesn't have to be an automatic kill every time.

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 01:57 AM
I definitely agree with the OP. Sounded out my feelings on everything. Especially the combat. Difficult combat can be achieved without sucking all the fun out of it. I still feel there should be a counter button and an attack button. The counter doesn't have to be an automatic kill every time.

That i'll agree on. Get rid of counter kills but dont get rid of counters.

Fatal-Feit
02-03-2015, 02:20 AM
That i'll agree on. Get rid of counter kills but dont get rid of counters.

So parries? :p

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 02:21 AM
So parries? :p

Not the same thing. Looks like the same thing, but are different. You can multi counter enemies, you cant multi parry them.

Fatal-Feit
02-03-2015, 02:27 AM
Not the same thing. Looks like the same thing, but are different. You can multi counter enemies, you cant multi parry them.

Parry is essentially a non lethal counter.

It's possible to multi parry, just as there are multi counters. Differences are, one was an implemented feature.

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 02:29 AM
Parry is essentially a non lethal counter.

It's possible to multi parry, just as there are multi counters. Differences are, one was an implemented feature.

Well, we all know that Ubisoft has said that Victory's combat system is going to be different then all the other Assassins Creed games. So who knows...

UrDeviant1
02-03-2015, 02:30 AM
The game needs parry and guard break mechanics similar to Dark Souls. They could actually learn a lot from that game. Whoever is working on the next AC game should go play some PvP on the Iron Bridge in Dark Souls 2, get some ideas.

SixKeys
02-03-2015, 02:41 AM
Well, we all know that Ubisoft has said that Victory's combat system is going to be different then all the other Assassins Creed games. So who knows...

Where did they say this?

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 02:44 AM
Where did they say this?

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/assassins.creed.victory.release.date.new.game.unve iled.e3.2015.ubisoft.new.combat.system/46792.htm

SixKeys
02-03-2015, 02:50 AM
http://www.christiantoday.com/article/assassins.creed.victory.release.date.new.game.unve iled.e3.2015.ubisoft.new.combat.system/46792.htm

That article is confusing. They seem to think AC3 was the last game before Victory, somehow managing to ignore Black Flag, Rogue and Unity. :confused:

Either way, I'm not so happy about the combat system being overhauled in practically every new game. Can't they just stick to one system and keep tweaking it to perfect it?

DemonLord4lf
02-03-2015, 02:53 AM
That article is confusing. They seem to think AC3 was the last game before Victory, somehow managing to ignore Black Flag, Rogue and Unity. :confused:

Either way, I'm not so happy about the combat system being overhauled in practically every new game. Can't they just stick to one system and keep tweaking it to perfect it?

My thoughts exactly! I enjoyed the old combat system and i was enjoying the new ideas they kept coming out for it. Now they just did a complete overhaul and it confused and annoyed more fans then it pleased.

Fatal-Feit
02-03-2015, 03:15 AM
Unity isn't the first game to completely overhaul the combat.


Either way, I'm not so happy about the combat system being overhauled in practically every new game. Can't they just stick to one system and keep tweaking it to perfect it?

Same here. Unity is a good start for tweaking. It's the most balance and has plenty of room to improve.

kriegerdesgottes
02-03-2015, 03:42 AM
My thoughts exactly! I enjoyed the old combat system and i was enjoying the new ideas they kept coming out for it. Now they just did a complete overhaul and it confused and annoyed more fans then it pleased.

Agreed. I always enjoyed the combat from the first three games especially Brotherhood. I think if they had just kept tweaking that and adding to it the combat would be really awesome now. Instead they saw people complaining about the countering and how easy it was so they erased all the things that were cool about it and just started from scratch completely alienating all the fans who really enjoyed the combat in the first place.

SixKeys
02-03-2015, 03:56 AM
Agreed. I always enjoyed the combat from the first three games especially Brotherhood. I think if they had just kept tweaking that and adding to it the combat would be really awesome now. Instead they saw people complaining about the countering and how easy it was so they erased all the things that were cool about it and just started from scratch completely alienating all the fans who really enjoyed the combat in the first place.

They tried tweaking the old combat system for four games and it just wasn't working. Each iteration made the combat easier while the devs kept claiming "oh, this game is much harder because we've made the enemies tougher". They were full of crap. You can't fix a broken system by making enemies stronger. The old system was based around two overpowered mechanics: blocking and countering. They worked on every enemy eventually, without fail. All you had to do was keep mashing the same buttons. They tried to fix the problem by creating so-called tougher archetypes like Janissaries who would block more often, but just like all the others their defense could easily be broken.

I enjoyed the old combat system for what it was, but Unity's approach is infinitely more balanced. It finally feels like the game is actually trying to give you a challenge, whereas previous games felt almost amateurish in their approach. It's ridiculous that they kept the old press-to-win system for as long as they did.

kriegerdesgottes
02-03-2015, 04:35 AM
They tried tweaking the old combat system for four games and it just wasn't working. Each iteration made the combat easier while the devs kept claiming "oh, this game is much harder because we've made the enemies tougher". They were full of crap. You can't fix a broken system by making enemies stronger. The old system was based around two overpowered mechanics: blocking and countering. They worked on every enemy eventually, without fail. All you had to do was keep mashing the same buttons. They tried to fix the problem by creating so-called tougher archetypes like Janissaries who would block more often, but just like all the others their defense could easily be broken.

I enjoyed the old combat system for what it was, but Unity's approach is infinitely more balanced. It finally feels like the game is actually trying to give you a challenge, whereas previous games felt almost amateurish in their approach. It's ridiculous that they kept the old press-to-win system for as long as they did.

I disagree. Yes in the original two games you could pretty much take down an entire army by countering at the right time but as people complained they tried to promote offensive combat more by giving you new abilities like being able to throw knives or shoot your pistol in the middle of a chain kill. It allowed you to try and build up a chain without breaking it (which could be difficult in ACB) while also striking the enemy instead of standing there waiting for them to attack. I personally liked the counter system and what Brotherhood did to make it more engaging but I did not like how they completely changed it in ACIII. The combat in that game was ok at best but in Unity you might as well be a baker or a lawyer with a sword. You definitely can't fight like a master assassin. Instead of just making the enemies harder to kill, they also made sure that if you sneeze, the entire French army shows up to punish you for it and you have the swordmansship of a baker to defend yourself. Cool...Not really it's super annoying.

And as far as the Jannissary thing goes, you still have to learn how to outmaneuver them. You aren't likely to just walk up and take them down especially in a group. They were hard. But if you learned how to beat them, you could indeed do it easily just as an assassin SHOULD do. I personally do not enjoy difficulty. It's why I hate Math. It's hard, therefore I don't enjoy it. If something requires a little bit of thought and when mastered is easy, then I enjoy it a lot. So I really don't see what the problem is. A person who struggles to fight every single enemy, is clearly not cut out to be an assassin in the first place.

Fatal-Feit
02-03-2015, 09:43 AM
Okay, first of all, you have a weird definition for Assassins. Assassins are men and women who value the Creed and fight for its cause. The games are called Assassin’s Creed, not Assassin Warrior. If all Assassins were one man army, they wouldn’t have resorted to stealth and would have won the war ages ago.

Second, the Assassin rankings are based on your capabilities and knowledge as an assassin, not a brute. They’re all humans. Edward was murdered by 2 bandits during his prime. A Master Assassin is someone who’s very capable of doing his job, not based on how many men he can counter-kill during a brawl.

Anyway,


I disagree. Yes in the original two games you could pretty much take down an entire army by countering at the right time but as people complained they tried to promote offensive combat more by giving you new abilities like being able to throw knives or shoot your pistol in the middle of a chain kill. It allowed you to try and build up a chain without breaking it (which could be difficult in ACB) while also striking the enemy instead of standing there waiting for them to attack. I personally liked the counter system and what Brotherhood did to make it more engaging

Yeah, and it was also ridiculously unbalanced and broken as it could be. Never mind the ample amount of instant health potions you’re supplied with, being able to flawlessly instant kill your targets was a whole baby inducing step of its own. Throwing knives were broken. You could hold it for a split second and instantly kill 3-4 targets at once, no matter the archetype (so much worse than Edward’s quadruple pistols). And you could hold 20-30 of them (same with about every other tool). Hidden gun didn’t require reloading and it was quick and deadly, almost instant killing all archetypes. Chain kills were broken as it got, I don’t need to spell it out. And don’t get me started on double tool kills… UGH.

The problem with the counter system was that you could counter to win. No tactics required. Everything else was filler and just as broken to the core. Brotherhood didn’t make the game more engaging, it did the opposite. It was a snooze fest. During my first initial replay hour of Brotherood, I didn’t flinch when Ezio was ambushed by 20-30 wolf men. All I had to do was equip my sword and hidden gun, counter/kill one guy, hold square, tilt my analog towards targets for the next 20-30 seconds, and they all died without leaving a scratch because of how broken double tool kill was. And even if I got a scratch, I’ve ample of amount of health potions to take 500+ more. That wasn’t engaging it was boring. Even the game is aware of that and that’s why optional objectives like (don’t lose a health bar) became a thing. It’s laughable.


but I did not like how they completely changed it in ACIII. The combat in that game was ok at best but in Unity you might as well be a baker or a lawyer with a sword. Instead of just making the enemies harder to kill, they also made sure that if you sneeze, the entire French army shows up to punish you for it and you have the swordmansship of a baker to defend yourself.

I LOVED that they completely changed it in AC3. Archetypes became immune to cheap tactics, ammo was scarce, they could attack you during double tool kill, you had to be aware of snipers/marksmen from afar, etc, etc. THAT is what I call engaging and THAT was what makes combat fun. Of course, I’m not saying AC3’s combat was good, but it was heck of a lot better than AC2/B’s.

Unity’s combat is still pretty easy and over-the-top to a degree. You’re supplied with several health potions, bombs, stun grenades, and deadly tools (but pretty scarce compared to previous titles). Also, I don’t understand the comparison with a baker or lawyer I can easily take down an army without 5 star equipment. It all boils down to practice and skill. Unity’s combat isn’t trying to make you feel feeble it’s trying to balance the game. It wants you to think, survey your surroundings, know the archetypes, use the tools, and most importantly, think about escaping. You’re an Assassin, not the hulk. The Ezio Trilogy had things backward with its pseudo stealth, damaging the franchise’s 3 core pillars. Call me crazy, but THAT, of all the AC games, is what I find fun and engaging. The game acknowledges me as a gamer and respects me with actual difficulty.


And as far as the Jannissary thing goes, you still have to learn how to outmaneuver them. You aren't likely to just walk up and take them down especially in a group. They were hard. But if you learned how to beat them, you could indeed do it.

You know, I’ve been having a blast with Revelations combat, and I consider it one of the original best, sitting right besides 3’s, but one thing that continues to strike me was how cheap Assassin Recruits were. Hold down a button and there goes the group of Janissaries in a flash.

But let’s assume it’s on cool down and we’re engaging the Janissaries. The problem is they’re still static and easy. Immune to certain tactics yes but that’s not stopping you from mopping the floor with them. You’re supplied with the most deadly tools, ample amount of health potions, and counter/bashing is still viable. They were never hard to begin with. I was talking to a friend recently who played Revelations (not a huge expert on the combat, no offense, Nami) and I was talking about AC’s combat and how the additions of Janissaries were great and he replied something along the lines of ‘’I guess they’re a bit harder, but I still beat them all without trying’’. He didn't have fun with the combat. In fact, he's anticipating Unity because its combat is just the opposite.


I personally do not enjoy difficulty. It's why I hate Math. It's hard, therefore I don't enjoy it. If something requires a little bit of thought and when mastered is easy, then I enjoy it a lot. So I really don't see what the problem is.

Ehhhhhhhhhh… This isn’t a topic I want to debate, but I’ll make it light.
For me, fun in video games comes from a challenge. If it’s not challenging, it becomes a drab. It may not be a problem for you, but that doesn’t speak for the majority. The problem with AC is that it’s not easy, it’s VERY easy. It doesn’t challenge you. Unity’s combat is still easy, but it offers you a challenge.

kriegerdesgottes
02-04-2015, 01:17 AM
I don't think we will ever agree on this point because you clearly enjoy difficulty in combat and I really don't which is fine but I just feel like the combat is not something that should be difficult for a master assassin. If they wanted to make other things challenging like maybe the puzzle sections or how to get into a building to kill a guy then I think that is where challenge should be implemented into the game but not into something that you are going to be doing for fun all the time and that the character realistically probably wouldn't struggle with. To me it's fun to be the Hulk. I can't do it in real life so why wouldn't I want to do it in a video game? And it's fun for me personally to be the one badass assassin who can easily kill 20 guards if I need to. Because I can't do that in real life as far as I know. And even if I could, I'd end up in prison which is also not fun. So I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on the combat.

SixKeys
02-04-2015, 01:55 AM
Disagreeing about combat difficulty due to personal preferences is one thing, but the "he's a master assassin, he should be a one-man army" argument is stupid. First off, we never start the game as a master assassin. We have to work our way from an apprentice to a pro. (Ezio was the exception since he got three games.) That's the whole point of a game. You start as a newbie, then work your way up to master level.

It's fine to say you don't want combat to be hard because you personally don't enjoy it, but using the lore as an excuse is just silly.

kriegerdesgottes
02-04-2015, 02:05 AM
Disagreeing about combat difficulty due to personal preferences is one thing, but the "he's a master assassin, he should be a one-man army" argument is stupid. First off, we never start the game as a master assassin. We have to work our way from an apprentice to a pro. (Ezio was the exception since he got three games.) That's the whole point of a game. You start as a newbie, then work your way up to master level.

It's fine to say you don't want combat to be hard because you personally don't enjoy it, but using the lore as an excuse is just silly.

Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. I could understand if at the beginning of the game he needs to learn the way of the assassin and so he doesn't have all of his skills acquired yet making combat more difficult. That would be fine. But if at the end of this game, you have all the skills possible and you still struggle to take on 5 guards then something is wrong. This is a person whose profession is to be a master at killing people. Why should the character who is a master assassin at the end of the game struggle with this? And in some of the games the character starts off as a master like AC1, ACB, ACR. I agree sometimes I find it a bit silly when at the beginning of AC2 for example, Ezio just kills two guards with zero training but at the end of the game I like to be the master assassin able to destroy guards with relative ease. I doubt we will ever agree on this which is really not a big deal so I'll leave it at that. To each his own. :)

Fatal-Feit
02-04-2015, 02:23 AM
Ugh... A ''Master Assassin'' isn't someone who can flawlessly go up against an army in combat, let alone 5 guards. Please stop making up your own definition. Yes, they have the profession to kill people, but it doesn't equate to combat. Arno assassinated the entire Templar conspirators, including Germain. That's more than enough to be deserving of the rank of Master Assassin. These guys are called Assassins, not warriors.

Edward struggled against 2 burglars and died, Connor was defeated by 2 men, and Shay was able to single-handedly wipe out all of the Master Assassins during the 7 years war.

kriegerdesgottes
02-04-2015, 02:34 AM
So you're saying a person whose profession is being a highly skilled killer would not know combat?.....yeah I don't think so. I'm not "making up" any definitions. I'm simply saying a person trained for years in the art of killing people should be pretty decent at combat.

Fatal-Feit
02-04-2015, 02:51 AM
So you're saying a person whose profession is being a highly skilled killer would not know combat?.....yeah I don't think so. I'm not "making up" any definitions. I'm simply saying a person trained for years in the art of killing people should be pretty decent at combat.

Don't put words into my mouth. Edward, Connor, Liam, Adewale, Achilles, etc, etc AND Arno are all very capable in combat. However, they are also humans. They can't go up against an army and they can fall in combat against another highly trained adversary.

Yes, you ARE making up your own definition for Master Assassins. You're saying Master Assassins can do this and that in combat and apparently you can't fight like a Master Assassin in Unity. That's all bogus.

Megas_Doux
02-04-2015, 03:07 AM
They are indeed capable and uber trained in order to take many enemies, but It should NOT be THAT easy for "them" or the player as it was the the old games haha :p

kriegerdesgottes
02-04-2015, 03:12 AM
They are indeed capable are uber trained in order to take many enemies, but It should NOT be THAT easy for "them" or the player as it was the the old games haha :p

Ok I'll admit the first two games were a bit too easy even for me but I feel like they could have made that combat more challenging and tweaked it to satisfy everyone instead of just scrapping the whole thing and creating the crap combat that exists in Unity. I think they were even starting to do this when Brotherhood came out and you couldn't just block everything anymore and it encouraged you to attack and keep chains going instead of stand and wait. And they also made enemies more difficult throughout the games but people kept saying "NOT HARD ENOUGH" so now we have a character who has to flee from any more than three guards and so everyone who enjoyed the combat the way it was is stuck with this boring crap.

Megas_Doux
02-04-2015, 03:22 AM
Ok I'll admit the first two games were a bit too easy even for me but I feel like they could have made that combat more challenging and tweaked it to satisfy everyone instead of just scrapping the whole thing and creating the crap combat that exists in Unity. I think they were even starting to do this when Brotherhood came out and you couldn't just block everything anymore and it encouraged you to attack and keep chains going instead of stand and wait. And they also made enemies more difficult throughout the games but people kept saying "NOT HARD ENOUGH" so now we have a character who has to flee from any more than three guards and so everyone who enjoyed the combat the way it was is stuck with this boring crap.

Personal preferences I know, but I still find Unity rather easy. It takes only a little bit more -not much really- to master. At the of day Im still the same one army as in the old games......

SixKeys
02-04-2015, 05:11 AM
Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. I could understand if at the beginning of the game he needs to learn the way of the assassin and so he doesn't have all of his skills acquired yet making combat more difficult. That would be fine. But if at the end of this game, you have all the skills possible and you still struggle to take on 5 guards then something is wrong.

Well, on that point we agree, but by the end of the game when Arno is a master assassin and you have him fully upgraded with all his weapons, if you still struggle to take on five guards then I'm sorry, but the problem is the person behind the controller.

SixKeys
02-04-2015, 05:18 AM
So you're saying a person whose profession is being a highly skilled killer would not know combat?.....yeah I don't think so. I'm not "making up" any definitions. I'm simply saying a person trained for years in the art of killing people should be pretty decent at combat.

Arno looks pretty decent to me:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RREradbIR7o

Edit:

Even better:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQ59Y69OxO0

Fatal-Feit
02-04-2015, 05:51 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f38_Sp4GjgE


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEAuvgdJrN4

he got da moves

Hans684
02-04-2015, 06:14 AM
Not to burst any bobbles but we are but we are not playing as them, they've died long before that. What we use is an avatar in the Animus thought genetic memories. So if we can slaughter entire armies or not in a simulator doesn't mean much. The Animus not a toy either, did Desmond complain how easy it was to kill when reliving Connor's life? No because it's irrelevant.

Shahkulu101
02-04-2015, 06:22 AM
Not to burst any bobbles but we are but we are not playing as them, they've died long before that. What we use is an avatar in the Animus thought genetic memories. So if we can slaughter entire armies or not in a simulator doesn't mean much. The Animus not a toy either, did Desmond complain how easy it was to kill when reliving Connor's life? No because it's irrelevant.

Yes but we ARE playing a game, we aren't the ones in the animus (unless you're crazily invested in the meta narrative). Incredibly easy combat makes for a bad game, I don't care about the animus stuff.

If they wanted they could make the animus simulation comprised of nothing but QTE's, it would be quicker and make more sense but at the end of the day we're playing a video game and that would suck.

DemonLord4lf
02-04-2015, 06:24 AM
At the end of the day, none of our bickering matters since Ubisoft has already decided they're going to get rid of this combat system and do something completely different.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/assassins.creed.victory.release.date.new.game.unve iled.e3.2015.ubisoft.new.combat.system/46792.htm

Shahkulu101
02-04-2015, 06:30 AM
At the end of the day, none of our bickering matters since Ubisoft has already decided they're going to get rid of this combat system and do something completely different.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/assassins.creed.victory.release.date.new.game.unve iled.e3.2015.ubisoft.new.combat.system/46792.htm

The combat can still be completely different but remain 'challenging'. Quebec have probably decided what they are going to do with the combat but they can still adjust the difficulty due to player feedback.

DemonLord4lf
02-04-2015, 08:54 AM
Combat should be like the Yakuza series. Especially Yakuza 5, andriasang.com/con2mf/yakuza_5_shinada/ (http://andriasang.com/con2mf/yakuza_5_shinada/)

dxsxhxcx
02-04-2015, 11:27 AM
you AREN'T a master assassin, you are (playing the role of) a fat virgin gamer sat on your living room eating some snacks and drinking soda (just playing with stereotypes here, don't take it personally.. :)) having fun with a interactive entertainment device (I don't remember how the commercial version of the animus is called now), when you use this device, you're given a set of skills the protagonist used to have, but like any other thing that you need to learn, you don't simply begin the emulation and instantly become good at it, it requires practice to master it so it makes perfect sense for the game (you play inside the game) to be challenging because different from the ancestor you CONTROL, you didn't have years/decades of practice in combat like he did, and before you say something, no, the animus doesn't use the same logic as the Matrix movie where you become a master on anything from the get go and this is proven by the fact that AC2's excuse was to train Desmond using the animus for him to absorb Ezio's skills using the Bleeding Effect's side effects...


ps: I don't know how old you are, but from what I remember from my youth (atari, snes/genesis era) and from playing old games today, games used to be a lot more challenging and less forgiving than they are today, so, like said by someone, this "5 year old difficulty" is what is new, so I believe it's more accurate to say that the "crying babies" are these people that can't stand a little obstacle on their way and/or be punished by their lack of skill.

Hans684
02-04-2015, 04:14 PM
Yes but we ARE playing a game, we aren't the ones in the animus (unless you're crazily invested in the meta narrative). Incredibly easy combat makes for a bad game, I don't care about the animus stuff.

Didn't say we didn't play a game, I prefer an in-game view on the series myself. I'm just saying easy or not we are Assassins, it's all simulated, I care about the entire story. Not the one I like the most.


If they wanted they could make the animus simulation comprised of nothing but QTE's, it would be quicker and make more sense but at the end of the day we're playing a video game and that would suck.

One of the many potentials this series has.