Easy to learn, Hard to Master - M&E | KIM | Forums

[Andre202]

So let the discussions begin. I will add a video where we might discuss details about that feature.




A thing I noticed about gaining the M&E token is that it seems not to be necessary to do a Stealth Takedown to get it. Maybe I am nit-picking here though. At 2:25 Sam kills the fourth guy who detects him, he still gets the M&E token. That's just a note, which some may have not noticed and I wanted to make aware of that.

I think we don't have to change anything when it comes to the easy usage of that feature. What needs to get right in my opinion is the difficulty, balance, relation of advantages/disadvantages, consequences ... However you wanna call it. Discussion is open for suggestions, I will add mine later on, it's really late here already.

[MerriIl]

They could add some kind of mini QTE to make it take some sort of reaction skill to execute.

[Andre202]

No QTEs, please. That's the only restriction here (LOL). It would feel to arcadey I think.

[MerriIl]

We've never really seen enemies give Sam any real resistance, as far as a fight goes have we? It's always been pretty much instant death by CQC or bullet. It'd be fun to see sam go in for the CQC and have to rumble for a little bit (think Bourne Identity fights). Although that shouldn't even be an option for Sam, as he shouldn't ever put himself into such a situation. But maybe if he had to struggle with that 4th guy during the KIM sequence (the guy before the car jump) and also concentrate and marking the other two while struggling with the 4th guy.

That's pretty far fetched but would surely make it more difficult to complete an entire M&E/KIM sequence.

[sameer_monier]

As I pointed in the other thread, we can make M&E more that what it is:

- You can't mark when you are under fire, and if you are under fire you lose the ability to execute, those two rules would make M&E a stealth feature and surprise element.

- Limit the marking to 2 marks ((maybe 3 at best)), also once the target is out of your FOV you lose the mark ((I know marks are used by stealth player as a tracking device)), and of course no marking through walls.

- Maybe one mark per takedown, so it is actually worth saving for sticky situations.

Simple options, to make it more tactical, instead of being used as an Action feature, I don't want to drastically change the whole feature into something else.

Indeed Sam got a token of M&E, like in SCC it doesn't matter if you are stealthy or not, take down = M&E token, maybe another suggestion to add to my list, to make M&E token only gained when doing a Stealthy Takedown, that will also enforce M&E is an Aggro-Stealth feature, rather than Action feature.

I hope to see your suggestions and ideas soon enough.

BTW seeing that M&E sequence, I really love how the animation is so fluid.

[x3c_Limerick]

I still say add the ability to aim while Executing, leaving room for error. No Game Over screen, just consequences Sam will have to deal with.

[MerriIl]

Honestly just have a load-out selection screen like in CT, but instead of ammo/items, make it selection of play styles (ex: Assault or Stealth). This would determine the mechanics - Assault would have KIM, M&E, etc. Stealth would have light/sound meter, variable speeds, etc. Just playing with my thoughts

[x3c_Limerick]

Sounds like Lambert/Redding style to me, nice idea.

I still think failure options in M&E should be present, but it is difficult to nail down exactly what circumstances would be reasonable enough for balance of realism and what is able to be programmed into the game with not a whole lot of time left on the development cycle clock.

[harbi-117]

Unfortunately, the Mark & Execute mechanic is set in stone in Blacklist. There is no way they could change or tune it because the whole map design is being created around ( 1 Takedown = Full M&E tokens )

There will always be that one lone guard that the developers put outside of a building or make him facing a wall in the shadows because the next area is guarded with 4 or more guards. In a way it's similar to the Hitman games when they design a map, they always put that (stupid, drunk or sleepy) guard next the building you need to enter with his disguise.

I only hope they could tune it a little bit on Hard difficulty for us... FOR US ubisoft
there are many examples, here's a few:

- 1 Take down = 1 M&E token
- No more than 2 marking abilities on all guns
- a cool down meter for it... wait... don't do it... he's not a super hero... oh wait!... * troll face * just teasing lol

[shobhit7777777]

It's simple..actually pretty tricky to pull off..but simple in theory.

M&E hinges on AI placement and routine. The simpler the patterns and placement...the easier it is to pull off executes. Complex placements, requiring timing and proper target prioritization will bring an element of strategy to the mechanic.

Instead of the old 3 man cluster here and a lone free-kill there.....the patterns can be made more complex. Have the routines be modular so that an algorithm can mix and match those patterns to produce a complex aggro stealth scenario.

Players would have to observe, mark the lone guy and then figure out how to execute the rest with minimal drama.

I believe Sameer said that you can priority mark targets now....that is certainly a step in the right direction. But I have my reservations about that.