The Trouble with Sam Fisher. An Objective Look at the Controversy. | Forums

[Daedalus_89]

@Shobhit...

Why is Batman in Mumbai? Is he the hero they deserve?

[Andre202]

Explain

You gave an example yourself with Grim, that was one tiny part where the old Sam shined. I am hard at thinking about a second example but I do not remember any other situation which would remind me of the old Sam.

Other then that, a lot of disicions which are made in the new game are justified through the Conviction storyline, which was poorly written as you said it yourself too. Very often we have discussions of how would Sam handle the situation and if only one option is available they justify that with Conviction. In the Legacy series we didn't have that problem because people could decide the outcome in such situations, they could shape the character and do whatever they think Sam would do. If we now have a limitation in those dicisions and point them out, it's just: Ahh Sam changed through Conviction, it's ok. Completely forgetting that at least SCCT of the legacy series allowed you do the decision you want.

[shobhit7777777]

You gave an example yourself with Grim, that was one tiny part where the old Sam shined. I am hard at thinking about a second example but I do not remember any other situation which would remind me of the old Sam.

Other then that, a lot of disicions which are made in the new game are justified through the Conviction storyline, which was poorly written as you said it yourself too. Very often we have discussions of how would Sam handle the situation and if only one option is available they justify that with Conviction. In the Legacy series we didn't have that problem because people could decide the outcome in such situations, they could shape the character and do whatever they think Sam would do. If we now have a limitation in those dicisions and point them out, it's just: Ahh Sam changed through Conviction, it's ok. Completely forgetting that at least SCCT of the legacy series allowed you do the decision you want.

Oh Ok.

For me, Conviction Sam was a natural outcome of the game's canon and the way I played through the legacy games. Invisible yet lethal.

@Daedalus

No

Because the chicken tandoori is awesome here.

[Daedalus_89]

There were a couple moments where we saw brief glimpses of the old Sam at work.
I pointed out in another thread that we saw a little bit of his old curiosity, for example. Despite the fact that he's extremely pissed off, he can't help himself when Grim mentions that Reed's been stonewalling the president.
And in one of the original trailers, Sam has a monologue...

"You always come back to who you are, you always come back to what's important. I started asking questions, I started finding answers. When those answers took me back home, that's where I went. The only thing worth hunting is the truth, no matter where it's hiding."

^This is that curiosity at work again. A desire to pull at enough threads to unravel the truth.

Then when the president and Sam were on the phone with each other at the Lincoln Memorial, he was completely professional. He showed that same demeanor when he and Grim were in the White House.

We see his sense of humor when he kneecaps the Vice President...
"You really ought to work on the whole bulletproof thing."

And various other lines throughout the game...
"Fisher...I used to work here."
"I smell like a spare tire."
"Grim isn't paying me by the hour."
"Nice to see you again. Tell me what I need to know, and I might not snap your neck."

So yeah, we aren't COMPLETELY without the Sam Fisher we know and love. But overall, they've taken a lot away from Sam as far as his character goes. It'll be a challenge to see a revival of that character without Michael Ironside's instantly recognizable growl, but if they've got some good writers on board, it won't be impossible.

[shobhit7777777]

So yeah, we aren't COMPLETELY without the Sam Fisher we know and love. But overall, they've taken a lot away from Sam as far as his character goes. It'll be a challenge to see a revival of that character without Michael Ironside's instantly recognizable growl, but if they've got some good writers on board, it won't be impossible.

Why would we be? After all that the guy has been through

[Daedalus_89]

Agreed.

Like ANYone of you, he's acting differently than he normally would be after going through something traumatic.
People keep using the mission where he rescues his daughter from kidnappers as some kind of indicator that Sam would be professional all the time, no matter what.
The difference between that mission and Conviction is that Sam was in control. He knew he was going to be able to take down the guys who took his daughter, and he had the advantage of surprise.
Sarah dies because she gets hit by a car, and then he finds out in Malta that it wasn't an accident, that Sarah had been murdered.
THEN he finds out Sarah's still alive; and that Grim and Lambert, probably the closest thing he has to friends, knew all along.
He had absolutely no control over any of that. He couldn't resolve the problem by doing what he usually does, and going all Taken on their asses.
So yeah, I'm not at all surprised that Sam Fisher has changed. Neither should anyone else.

That said, now that he's had some time to get over the shock that his daughter is still alive, he should be able to return to his usual professionally detached self. I think by what we're seeing from Blacklist, that'll be the case.

[Andre202]

That said, now that he's had some time to get over the shock that his daughter is still alive, he should be able to return to his usual professionally detached self. I think by what we're seeing from Blacklist, that'll be the case.

Exactly. Hopefully that's the case.

[CELLGHOST206]

Liam Neeson should have been the next Sam Fisher

[Yabab_2]

Liam Neeson should have been the next Sam Fisher

Wow... that is actually a VERY good choice!

[Daedalus_89]

Liam Neeson should have been the next Sam Fisher

Excellent choice. He's got the physical presence, he can even do a pretty gruff voice.

But with Unknown; Taken, Taken 2, The A-Team, Battleship, K-19, The Grey, even his brief cameo in The Next Three Days, I feel like Liam Neeson is starting to get typecast into a specific role type.
Sam Fisher would be right in that category. Liam Neeson's a diverse and talented actor. I'd hate to see his abilities go to waste on one spy/military/conspiracy movie after another.