Ubi-People (and all you other people, too) - A moment of your time, please...
This thread has become a Q&A thread where you can ask the devs questions about GRFS and, if they have an answer, they actually do answer - be warned, though, that the answers you get might not be the ones you were wishing for.
This is not a Feedback or Bug-Report Thread, however, so please keep those posts in their appropriate places.
And please keep your questions civil.
And for those not willing to read through all the answers, I have compiled them here:
I will try to keep that updated, but feel free to help out.
//End of Edit//
Guys, I know you're busy, but do you think maybe someone official could post every few days on the forums to show us our concerns and issues are being heard and that you're working on some fixes? And not in the well-meaning but ultimately meaningless twitter or facebook way. I do think we deserve a little more of a personal contact.
It may sound like a ridiculously small thing, but trust me, you do NOT want to keep quiet until you have everything for a patch fixed. People already think you don't care or don't read any of the stuff we post - and some people take huge care with their posts, make maps and pictures and videos to show what they mean. They wouldn't do that if they didn't care about the game.
During the Beta, every few days Ubi-Antoine posted some balance changes and it made a huge difference to the mood on the forums. Even the people that were not happy with the particular changes were happy that Feedback in general was being taken into consideration and reacted to quickly. But since release there have been no balance changes announced, no fixes, no to-do-list for a patch, and people feel ignored.
Maybe worst of all, apparently none of the Beta Balance Changes made it into the finished game, and it's extremely frustrating for people who spent hours composing the most coherent Beta Feedback possible and see with glee how the quick changes made the game better and better, only to find the very same problems are still in the Finished Game - basically all the stuff that was gone by the end of the Beta. No wonder people feel abandoned, wondering if their work and contribution was and is for nothing.
I think you made a great game, but there have been problems and still are problems, and your silence about addressing most of those problems makes them so much worse.
There are two threads in these forums, the Feedback and the Bugs/Issues threads, and those are the two threads that would benefit the most from some active attention from your side. Not that I think you don't pay attention - i.e. read - but a few posts or some updates in the First Post would go a very long way to assuaging the collective abandonment issues the community suffers from. I know you are reluctant to release preliminary patch notes or goals, and for good reason, but that's not even what most of us are asking for. All we want to hear is:
"We hear you. We're working on it. Stick with us. It'll be worth it."
One thing that plagues many games and their forums, is the often sporadic nature of official responses.
And it's a vicious cycle, between the Ubis an the Customers:
The devs will want to use these first two weeks or so to gather as much data, bugs and issues as possible. At the same time, they don't want to put out some preliminary patch list until they are sure they can actually do all they want to do. The problems with the servers, and the open hostility of the forum responses will make them think twice about even thinking about hinting at something they may not be sure they can deliver. These people actually have feelings and put a lot of work and effort into this game. There is a line between constructive criticism or even legitimate complaints and the awfully abusive and derogatory nature of many of the forum's posts, and you can only hear how terrible the project you dedicated your life to for the last five years is, before it actually starts to hurt. So they will sit back and wait, check and double check and even triple check their work before even confirming they're working on something, because they are actually trying to make the best game possible - not for themselves, but for you - and yet they have seen how terrible the response to their initial work was and how cruel and unforgiving its shortcomings were pointed out.
On the other side, there are the customers. They paid good money for something that, obviously, is not a perfect game. Whether they like the game or the game play itself, is a matter of taste. I personally love the game, and I have played TC games since the original Rainbow Six on PC, but I can understand how some of the changes might not have gone over well. Still, style is not a flaw, and GRFS has its share of those. Some of those flaws make it hard or even impossible to enjoy the game at all. And that's frustrating. I think we all had great expectations for this game, and maybe some of those are now coming back to haunt us. But they are right, it's not their fault. And they would like some answers. Well, actually, most demand answers and/or instantaneous rectifying of whatever problems they are experiencing, but nevertheless, they have a right to some answers. What is being worked on, how the existing problems will be addressed, and when those fixes will become available. And if their questions are not answered in what they consider a timely manner, well, they get even more frustrated. And the questions, the criticism and the complaints turn ugly.
And the uglier it gets, the less likely it will be for anyone official actually answering those questions in a preliminary manner - as in: "We will try to do this and that by that time." But if the customers are already this frustrated - and trust me, I share some, even most of your frustrations - just imagine how outright crazy it will make you, if the announced patch either did not fix your personal "most annoying issue" or does not come at the promised time. Thus: The Cycle.
I can only hope the official Ubisoft side sees the wisdom of providing constant contact. I believe that most of us (the customers) would be content, at least for a little while, if we could just hear every second day or so that they are working on a patch, that progress is being made, and that the patch will try -TRY- to address these or those issues. No specifics, just to let us know we have not been forgotten and our issues are not being ignored. Similarly, someone official regularly posting in the Feedback and Bugs threads would ease at lot of minds and tension.
Of course, some might say this should go without saying. Sadly, the forums tell a different tale. From both sides.
I encourage everyone to bring their feedback, their issues and make them known, but please do so in as civil a manner as your mood allows. It will make it that more likely that the officials will answer.
And after some answers, maybe, like in the Beta, we see some things actually happening. Most of the Ubis are probably busy with Server Issues and Lag Minimizing, so, again, we don't expect that small things will or should take precedence over the most basic aspects, but the whole community is in dire need of some kind of reassurance that they are not being ignored.
And maybe something more. Maybe - and I know this is a business decision and I can fully understand that a decision like that might cost jobs, in which case it should never, not ever happen - but maybe, maybe Youbisoft might consider lowering the price of the Arctic Strike DLC - or even putting it out for free. I know, I know, this is just a hopeful suggestion, but hear me out.
The many connection and lag problems have already led to a small exodus of Online Players. You know that. Add to that the growing discontent of the GR community and their feeling of being ignored in the forums, and more and more people stop playing. With the announcement of the DLC, you have created a new problem for the online community: Some will buy it outright. Others will not. And some will start an open boycott of the DLC until their main issues with the game are fixed.
All of which will split an already dwindling community even more, making it harder to get good connections in matchmaking, leading to more frustrated people stopping to play, and so on and so forth.
If you want to see an example of how something like that can lead to the quick and painful death of an online community, look over the Cryisis 2 console MP. Great Game, Great MP, terrible connections. Exodus. Merging of Playlists to maintain some semblance of Online Gaming. Then, two weeks after the second MP DLC was released, you could not find a single match online. It was incredibly sad.
So, take this is a concerned warning, in the hope of something similar not happening to GRFS:
Pretty much half the people playing the game will not buy the DLC if the connection, lag and server issues are not fixed permanently at least several weeks before the release of the DLC. Offering the DLC at a reduced price or free of charge would be a grand gesture to a very concerned community. Not ultimately necessary, but still greatly appreciated. It will be a balancing act, all determined by how quickly the main issues can be addressed, and the smaller issues are shown as being worked on.
But until then... We need a Proof of Life, a Sign of Hope, a Reason to Keep Faith.
It's that simple. Please do not abandon us.
However small a thing you might think this is, and however small the information you are willing to give, know that it will have tremendous effects.
A few words every couple of days. A few signs of progress. A few lines showing that you care.
Last edited by P4NCH0theD0G; 06-07-2012 at 11:48 PM.
I been saying this since I started posting. I find it odd that a dev team will keep their consumers in the dark, especially with DLC on the horizon. At this point, most of us would be happy hearing from Ubi once a month. You gotta have @ least a list of things your're working on. No harm in letting us know what those issues are.
Ghost Recon Online did it right: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php...-Theo-Sanders/
Ghost Recon Future Soldier has 0 Dev Posts.
I just really don't understand their reticence. It's not that someone is about to get sued over saying something they might not manage to fix... Maybe they're all busy with E3 booth girls....
Wouldnt doubt it lol
Originally Posted by P4NCH0theD0G
First I want to start off by saying thank you for your post P4NCH0theD0G - well thought out and constructive feedback is always appreciated, even when given with a critical eye. The team cares very much about the game and the community. I'm going to reply to this with as much candor and transparency as possible and while I can't answer everything you've asked, I'm going to touch on some of your major points and hopefully shed some light on the process and the issues involved.
- We care very much about the game and the community; we have a team of forum managers, the GRFS ComDevs (myself and Ubi-Antoine), and the GRFS teams who read the forums continuously. This being said, the sheer volume of posts is more than we can reply to individually - as an example the GRFS forums had roughly 30,000 posts and replies during the beta period. Everything is read and someone replies to all of the hot-topics and trending issues when we are able. We also disseminate information through as many communication channels as possible (ghostrecon.com, facebook, twitter, etc). We would love to post replies more frequently, but we have to balance time spent writing posts with time spent reporting issues, generating community content, supporting the dev team, etc. - It is a personal goal of mine to improve in this respect and if you feel I'm not communicating enough in the future, please feel free to call me out on it.
- Communicating details and dates is important - Ubi-Antoine and I strive for as much transparency in this process as we are able. As much as we want to get information to you as quickly as possible, it is also important that we provide a high a degree of accuracy. In the past, the community and the team have both been burned when information has been released too soon: dates or details get change and people feel slighted. We don't hold back information once we have an accurate picture to share, but we work very hard to avoid conjecture and speculation. Sometimes the best answer that can be given is a "we're working on it" and a promise to follow up when we are able.
- Frequency and consistency of game updates are important to us, we pushed this hard in the beta and we are working to do the same with release. The server issues of the past couple of weeks have put a slight delay on this, but this is a high priority of the team and it is something we are resuming shortly. I also want to make it very clear that while our desire is for frequent updates and tweaks, the process cannot move at the same pace as during the beta. Because the game is in release, the verification and testing process for updates is longer - while it is never our intention to unbalance the game with an update, in release we need to be doubly sure changes are working as intended.
So these points being made, I'm going share what I can about updates:
- Balance and tuning will receive and update soon - I can't give you a specific date because I don't have it yet, but we're talking days, not weeks.
- We are working very hard to prep a title update for both platforms which addresses as many of the major issues as possible. This is not the first update (we had one on launch day) and there will be further updates to follow as we continue to address issues. We'll announce details on what the patch contains and when you can expect it once that information is nailed down. Please be understanding that we will not release this information until we have a high degree of certainty.
- We have already and are continuing to make updates to the server infrastructure. Most, if not all, of these changes are transparent to the end user, but will result in fewer Ubisoft server connection issues. I want to be extremely clear that this is an ongoing process, one we are taking very seriously. We'll provide more information to the community as it becomes available.
So there you go. If anyone has comments or questions they wish to post in a constructive reply, I will answer everything I can in this thread.
P4NCH0theD0G, Thank you again for your post.
Brilliant reply! Thanks !!!
I can't think of much to say but the sandstorm bug at the hanger is annoying, you can take the objective through the wall on the outside, probs already pointed out.
Is there any chance of an in game squad leaderboard? I know the network has it but it would make the squad matches so much more competitive if it was in the menus! That's all I want right now, game in brilliant loving it!