One thing you gotta learn about this day and age is that developers and publishers do not care about opinions, fan criticisms, the community, etc. They give you the illusion that they do. There is really only one thing they listen to and that's money. If the aforementioned happens to coincide with money then that just a happy coincidence.Originally Posted by go_clo
Begging the minority to care? Hmm...pretty sure we don't really matter as much as you say or else Conviction wouldn't have spun out on the direction that it did.
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See more rantings on the game industry at my blog: http://spy81.blogspot.com/
The "wait and see" idea is a risky one. Sometimes it means "seriously this will blow your mind" and other times it means "let's delay the complaints until launch. They can see it when they buy it". Essentially it can either back-stab or surprise. Now, I know what I said earlier in the thread and it remains true, but nightFoxninja and go_clot hit it right on the head. We have been PR'd to the point that we bought the game and realized we'd wasted our money. Sure I enjoyed Conviction for it's Co-op, but I had serious complaints about the single player and core gameplay.
I honestly hope that you are who you say you are and your intentions are not malicious. I bought Conviction out of loyalty to the series and was met with a disappointing game. The only reason I never traded in my Conviction was because the trade in value was so low, it was in my best interest to keep the game.
I think I speak for everyone who was disappointed with Conviction when I say; don't tell us we'll like something when you know we won't.
Xbox 360 GT: CELLGHOST206
Hi Zack, I really appreciate you posting here.
I think we will have some nice discussions here with you.
Of course there was some resistance and there may be a bit of an overreaction.
It's difficult to do constructive criticism after a small demo. I realised that a lot of things are back now, which is great. Don't get the people wrong though when they are still having concerns after you brought back the things the fans were asking for. It wasn't necessarily the daylight which shocked but it's also this mass appeal market approach which you were talking of too. It reminded much of the Conviction Demo where things they didn't showed at first weren't in the game at all and so does people come to conclusions.
There are a lot of questions like how does the Light & System works now? Are some features related to the difficulty, like the infinite ammo or waypoints and so on?
Now I take your word for granted that we will be happy when more information are coming. My concerns aren't the features you brought back. I think all the people will be happy about them. I have only concerns about the special circumstances about the scripted scenes which are forced on the player. It's equal if it's a mission who forces you to be stealthy or a mission that gets you into some heavy action. I think the player should be able to choose his approach, that's the only real concern I have. I don't know if this Demo will be a part of the game. It's just... when you have all these stealthy features and use them consequently throughout the Singleplayer Campaign, won't the player not feel disturbed or frustated when at the end the enemies still seem to know Sam Fisher is there, regardless of how stealthy you go through the mission? I mean this feels like you got through a very difficult mission and exactly at the end the console or the PC is crashing or you are dying.
You made it actually pretty cool in Deniable Ops in Conviction. If you triggered the alarm more guys are coming in to support the other ones and you have more to kill. These scripted action sequences could be just as well used in Singleplayer Campaign when you triggered the alarm, when everyone knows you are there. I mean, imagine if in Deniable Ops in Hunter Mode at the end of every passage these 10 enemies are coming anyway, although you played completely stealthy. It wouldn't be fair. Personally I just want that both sides the people who liked to play the old games and the people who like more the Action approach are able to play the way they want without being forced too. I think that's definitely possible. Yes some diehard fans won't still like it but they are all gone already since DA or C happened.
You know the Coop was accepted so well in the community for a reason. Yeah there weren't any Coop moves (I am sure you brought them back too), but they had the ability to choose their own approach most of the time. There weren't as much scripted sequences that punished your way how you were playing the game. There is a reason people played much more often the Coop Campaign as of the Singleplayer Campaign which doesn't appeal to someone after the second playthrough. It's not because he knows everything already, it's because he cannot play it the way he wants to.
Think of the Bank mission in SCCT if you were carefully enough you can avoid the alarm at the end of the level at the safe, if not you have the NPCs coming after you and there it would make even sense if SCCT added a scene where we see the police coming to the bank and investigating everything. I think most people wouldn't have had any problem with that, because that would be a real consequence for not being that careful in a Bank!
In the Demo I don't know at all why these guys (with the truck) are coming. Is there a real reason behind that? Why would they be alarmed of an intruder, is there something before the mission which explains this? I mean otherwise it doesn't make sense that they are there. Well actually there would be no problem if they would come anyway, but they shouldn't be alarmed, should they? Even when there was this Killing in Motion thing. Actually everything at the beginning was pretty stealthy. The end of the demo also seems not to have any alternatives to get into the house. We know we can do it the Action way, can we do it the complete Stealth way though?
I am actually sure there will be Deniable Ops again and I am sure I will enjoy this part of Splinter Cell Blacklist. But I also want to be able to enjoy the Singleplayer Campaign as I did from SC1-4 and that's only possible if the gamer (equally if he prefers more action or more stealth) can play Sam the way he wants to. Exactly this will make sure that the character Sam and the player will have a very deep bond while playing. So the player can really be Sam Fisher.
That's something people constructively critized about Conviction from the beginning on. The way you told the story was great, but the story itself not. Because it had plotholes and it limited the freedom of the players by these special circumstances. But from the demo there wasn't much you can see that this was taken into consideration when making the story for Splinter Cell Blacklist. I think that's the only reason why people may be still upset and disappointed by Blacklist because if that's not adressed they don't see a reason to play stealthy and to use the features you brought back.
Last edited by Andre202; 06-05-2012 at 03:59 AM.
Wow...this is the first time I've seen a Ubi dev on the forums. Please keep on here. I have a few concerns. Unlike many hardcore fans who despised Double Agent, I actually liked it. it FELT like SC with Sam having to use the tactics we've all learned from SC1-Chaos theory but in new environments we weren't accustomed to. believed and still do so, that this was the right way to change up the gameplay. I like the Kinshasha mission and it's one of my favorites in SCDA (behind Shanghai, JBA HQ 4, Iceland and then tied with the snow mission...the one aboard the Rublev. In fact Every mission including the jail and the Cozumel cruise ship were good and still felt like SC -- all the gadgets everything. Then SCC rolls around. I despised the single player (no offense guys, I want to give you my honest feedback with the hopes you toy with it).
The Co-op on the other hand felt much more in line with what I had come to know (as many fans agree, old and new) and D-Ops is what kept me from trading in the game. So kudos to the multiplayer devs. I was truly hoping the single player campaign would go off the co-op of SCC and not the single player in terms of the way the story is told, gameplay, etc. I have a few concerns...and I'm not sure if you can answer any of these but if you can give answers, or hints, or whatever....I would appreciate it immensely.
1. Is there anyway to change the climbing speed? Slower, more realistic, Assassins Creed-esque even (which is already fast for a 50 year oldhaha). It was one of the my major complaints from Conviction was the speed at which Sam moves which felt unrealistic for even a 20 year old. He seems to climb the cliff face like Spiderman...I don't like it to be blunt. So can there or are there alternate (but longer but maybe even stealthier paths with more guards to sneak by or kill, whatever haha) to get to the same place? Also, the speed in the gameplay we saw today doesn't even need to be scrapped -- is there a way to put an adjustable setting in the options menu to tweak climbing speed? Or is it possible to move slowly just by slightly pushing on the thumbstick? I love the slower, more methodical approach.
2. Nonlethal attacks? In the gameplay and the trailer we saw nothing but executions and knifes to the throat -- will there be nonlethal attacks like in the first 4 games? The corner takedowns from DA were so amazing and if those could somehow be reanimated into this game...that'd be fantastic. In conviction, you could only be lethal -- even the attacks that looked nonlethal such as bonkin' them over the head counted as kills. Which is another question: will there be a ranking system akin to CT or DA after each mission? Like number of times detected, alerts, alarms, bodies found, number of KOs, number of kills, etc.
3. Will the SC-20k return with all of it's gadget-firing goodness or even the SC3000 with new attachments? Or are sticky shockers strictly limited to that crossbow pistol weapon? I love to fire my gadgets as oppose to throwing them, it seems more efficient to me, so is that in the game? Firing sticky cams or what have you as opposed to throwing? If not, could it be implemented since there's stilla ways to go?
4. Is the light and shadow gameplay going to be like Convictions? Black and white filter when in shadows, color when exposed? Because if so....I plead with you to give us another vision mode and just tint everything green when activated and call it nightvision. The new sonar (or whatever the new vision mode is) looks much better but I would still prefer to have the classic nightvision and opt out of using the vision mode that shows me every enemy in the area. It's fine if people wanna use it but if there was another vision mode I could rely on...that's be much appreciated by almost every classic fan. I guarantee that having classic nightvision will make most of the classic fans rethink their stance, at least a bit. Maybe you already have nightvision and will show it off later on a night mission. Who knows? I doubt you can confirm one way or another if it's there but I really, really, really hope and will come out and beg for it. To me, nightvision is as important as hiding bodies and more important than luring although that was coolto see again.
5. You say it's possible to go stealthy...so is that part in the gameplay where the terrorists have the turret on the truck...is that scripted? Can we avoid that? Or if it happens anyway...can we sneak around and forget calling the airstrike?
6. I'm still iffy on the game, especially after Conviction but the fact that you came on here and are asking us to wait and give it more time is something. I will, I was planning on holding out. Maybe you could release an online gameplay video sometime soon of a night or dark mission and put to rest some of our concerns? I still don't see why having Ironside would break the illusion -- to me it seems to break the illusion of trying to pretend that this is Sam and he doesn't even have the same voice. If anything, it should just be a new agent or a reboot of the series where it's Sam, younger, and on his first mission. Idk, something. Having no Ironside is just...no matter what you say...blah to me. Sorry haha (x but I will play the game if my fears are put to rest and I'll just pretend it's a new agent named Sam Anderson or something haha
7. Deniable Ops....please tell me if there are a bunch of outfits of D-Ops? I'm a huge fan of customizing and think that every outfit should be put in the game. The classic suit, the Chaos theory/double Agent scuba suit, the Eclipse, etc. They don't even necessarily have to be used in the story just for D-Ops. Also can you say whether or not single player missions can be done in D-Ops? I feel like that'd be a logical step forward for the experience.
8. I hope to see more material soon to judge the game more adequately but, to be completely honest...as of now...the game is on very thin ice imo. I know the game will sell well but I really hope extra time is put in for hardcore players even if it means having to add in new animations, setting up the KO ability, and nightvision....I think if you bring back all these staples as well as the ones you've already brought back such as sticky shockers and luring...it'll make the game so much more appealing to myself and other hardcore classic players. Keep in mind that launching gadgets like I mentioned wanting to have would be the lowest on that list. As long as gadgets are present that's fine but the feel of launching would be better to me. I also, and I;m no programmer, but I feel like all you'd have to do is make an alt. fire for the gun that shoots the gadget but in reality the game is still "throwing" the gadget, just not showing the animation and instead showing the gun fire animation or something. I feel like it'd be easy to implement. Maybe not.
Sorry for all my questions ...you have to understand, I fear for one of my most beloved franchises....
Anyway whatever you can answer outright, hint at, etc. would be so appreciated. You don't have to necessarily say "we have nightvision" or something but a slight hint like "I feel like fans of the old goggles will be pleased with some of the features of the new one" or something. Or...idk. That makes it sound like we'll like the new sonar but...you get what I mean. As long as you don't get fired, whatever you can reveal without giving away too much yet and getting in trouble will be fantastic.
hi sir, first of all splinter cell blacklist looks and play just awesome.. and just one request sir plz make singlar player story mode longer.. and sandbox style choice to do mission.. and rest is just awesome thank you very much for making it happen ur just awesome
I really think from a gameplay standpoint this looks like the best splinter cell ever. I loved conviction, and though Chaos Theory may be the pinnacle of the series thus far, I do believe this will surpass it. I didn't get the vibe that this is conviction 2.0 at all, maybe I am naive but based on what I saw towards the beginning of the trailer and what the OP said, I feel that this is a perfect balance between the two game play styles. So yeah gameplay = SPOT ON in my opinion.
On the other hand, I was so hyped at the announcement I didn't even notice a change in voice, then I went back to watch it again and yeah, I'm a bit ticked also. There was no reason to change the iconic voice of Sam Fisher to some younger guy. You can clearly hear the age in his voice and it does not fit the character model at all. I get that you wanted to do full motion capture of the body and face, but noone said they had to belong to the same people. If I remember correctly Halo Reach used full motion capture of both entities using 2 different people per character. I guess Ironside's face isn't Sam's but I really figure you could have made it work.
Overall the game looks awesome but the voice acting is a bit of a disservice, that other Lambert in Pandora Tomorrow is horrid, it makes me stop playing alot sooner than I would when I do pick that game up every now and again. This new Sam isn't nearly as bad, but it certainly retracts from the experience.
And lastly, Sam is so old at this point I did not expect yet another game with him to be honest, and no one would have been saddened if you just said, he's retired, here's the new guy and had the same game. Changing the voice at what I assume is the characters last game is just depressing.
But good job blowing my mind, the announcement will definitely be my favorite moment of e3 this year
sir im also huge fan of splinter cell i play each and everyone of it multipal times and blacklist is just awesome sir just awesome as u said its gonna be bigger im in sir and true spliner cell fans r also in.. everyone wants some innovation sir ur doing it right the crazy stpid fans always complain who do'nt knw wht innovation means .. me and my all buddies are in and if i could i will tell whole world to look forward to this game.. plz launch some preorder for uk becoz me and my buddies can'nt wait for some extra dlc and stell book editon kind a bundle plz plz plz plz sir ur just awesome to be polite to harsh stpid comments they r just mionority.. i trust ur vision sir and i will always be for sam fisher
Another proud day for humanity...
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See more rantings on the game industry at my blog: http://spy81.blogspot.com/
@RealSamFisher10 @spy81 totally. Abductions are lethal or non-lethal, depending if you equip the Karambit or not. Just like all H2H kills.
Maxime already confirmed that you are able to do non-lethal takedown, as long as you haven't equiped the knife (Karambit).
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