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  1. #1
    Senior Member Jazz117Volkov's Avatar
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    Rolling/Dodging/Running on the 'Take Cover' button

    I do not get it.
    And Splinter Cell Conviction isn't the only game that suffers from this. Most 3rd person games do... pretty sure it started with Gears of War--ironically I'd say Gears is the one that has the least issues, due to extreme amounts of polish.
    Still, what's the fascination with cramming completely different but simultaneously important skills/abilities onto one but!on?
    The torrent of fails attached to doing this are a spectacle of magnitude.
    And some games have their cover but!ons so cramped that interacting--or the action but!on as they used to say--is also crammed under the same blob of plastic.

    I get that the number of but!ons on a controller are limited etc. but that's just the thing, every game I play that has this problem I see an alternative command setup that would avoid said problem and allow for a fail free zone. I don't think we need more but!ons, I think developers just need to put more effort into making better use of them.

    What's your take on this cramped cover but!on plague?
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  2. #2
    Senior Member SolidSage's Avatar
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    It's becoming more prevalent as action counts increase in number.
    I think some of the cramping is logical design, like running, cover to cover and obstacle vaulting all being mapped to the same button in GRFS. They are all related to quick movement, using different buttons for them doesn't make sense.
    Other odd button sharing gets in th way though. I consistently have problems with action buttons, switches, pick up weapons, melee etc, especially when a map these dats does have the tendency to become littered with action objects.

    I like the option to customize controller layouts (fully customizable, not choice of legacy, classic, etc), partially to allow the player to eliminate personal problem areas, or wasted buttons attributed to play style (I don't use ALT Fire mode much, so that button might be a wasted spot for me), but also to allow for consistency between games. I would use the same layout for Gears as I do GRFS, SC, Uncharted, etc, to the point that it was available. It would allow me to benefit from muscle memory more, keep those fingers organized.

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  3. #3
    Senior Member Jazz117Volkov's Avatar
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    Yeah, I hear ya about the running/cover--that's justifiable. In fact, taking cover and running can be great on the same button if there's a micro pause before the running takes effect
    hold for run + tap for cover = success--just like Gears... though again, Gears suffers from the roll/cover + DODGE problem... nothing worse then sticking to a wall instead of diving to safety.

    In light of that, you could do the same with SCC gameplay: tap LT to roll + hold for cover = zero fails

    Mass Effect 3 (COOP) has bugged me a little with this lately, but Uncharted 3 (just as it was in 1 and 2) is really a fun sucker.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Andre202's Avatar
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    I agree there but I also want to touch on the click and point system.
    I am actually not really satisfied with this system. It often happens that when you point on a wall for example that you often do things or climb up the wall at a position you never pointed at with your mouse or stick. You look up the wall which definitely should get your character on the ledge but instead he picks up the weapon on the bottom. Now of course you can fix such kind of things through having more buttons for different interactions. But after all, if I do not aim at the weapon or pistol to pick it up, the game shouldn't give this command the priority over the command you were aiming for. Sometimes some very weird climbing stuff happens when I am playing the Deniable Ops Maps.

    While using more buttons for different interactions should be the way to go I still think that they need to work on the point and click system or use something completely different because I am not sure how the hell you want to open the door quietly, bash through it or open it normally for example. In all cases where multiple commands are possible the point and click system in it's form shown in Conviction does have it's limits.
    Last edited by Andre202; 05-23-2012 at 05:56 PM.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member shobhit7777777's Avatar
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    OT:

    Check GBS page now for a lil goodie (GRFS related)

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  6. #6
    Senior Member newhenpal's Avatar
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    All I know is that Chaos Theory never suffered from any cramming. The long list of actions one could take on a door was a hassle to get through from time to time, sure, but it was never really a problem. The folks at Ubisoft Toronto would save us some headaches if they adopted a control scheme that closely resembled CT. There should be enough room for M&E on the D-pad if they did.
    The more things change, the more they stay the same.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Jazz117Volkov's Avatar
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    Doors? Okay... lemme think for a sec.
    Ah, I have it, HOLD 'A' to open-door-stealth (use the directional commands to control the door)
    TAP 'A' to open-door-normal, and 'move' towards the door and tap 'B' to bash/kick the door.

    Biggest trouble with Conviction's interaction is it takes no advantage of 'holding' bu!tons, and athletics and actions are under the same command.
    Split them up for gawds sake!
    Having a duration effect, I.E. holding and tapping a but!on, AND splitting said action over two commands is like having three new but!ons!
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  8. #8
    Senior Member newhenpal's Avatar
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    I think a double tap would be better suited for bashing doors, but yes, developers could stand to have certain commands be initiated with a held button. To pick on M&E, it only really needs one button to work. Now you have room for a button dedicated to jumping - isn't that better? Chaos Theory did it well when it came to item selection. Did I mention that I wuv Chaos Theory?
    The more things change, the more they stay the same.
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  9. #9
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    Yea next console controllers won't need any more buttons when games revolve around triggers and X/A. Then again the trend is going towards motion control.

    I was hoping that next console controllers would add 2-4 buttons so games like classic SCs or RTSs could have more complexity, there's still room behind the controller, but with this trend of "A is for Awesome Button!!!" I don't see it happening.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member sameer_monier's Avatar
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    Totally Agree with Jazz, though I would like the run to be with the analogue not on the cover button, I am getting used to it, but yeah it is an issue.

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