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  1. #141
    Senior Member shobhit7777777's Avatar
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    I could never ghost...not because of lack of skill or patience..just because it was so **** unrealistic. It just doesn't happen...requires me to exploit the games to ridiculous levels and breaks immersion thus destroying my fantasy. I try to keep it as real life as possible (Irony..I see it) especially in realistic stealth games.

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  2. #142
    Senior Member sameer_monier's Avatar
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    As NG4 said, even in CT Action was kinda there, Non Lethal Take-downs still count as such.

    @Shobhit: First time I played CT I did the same, If I got detected I carried on, cause I always thought I was Sam Fisher, if I screw up, I can handle it, I even remember first time on the bank after leaving the vault and activating the alarm and I was like WTH, what happened

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  3. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by shobhit7777777 View Post
    I could never ghost...not because of lack of skill or patience..just because it was so **** unrealistic. It just doesn't happen...requires me to exploit the games to ridiculous levels and breaks immersion thus destroying my fantasy. I try to keep it as real life as possible (Irony..I see it) especially in realistic stealth games.
    If you consider ghosting to mean playing without every interacting with anyone, I don't think the game was even designed to be played that way. We were meant to grab guards, for example. Otherwise, they wouldn't have written so many lines of witty dialogue for those guards. You'd be missing out if you never interrogated anyone.

    I like to kill people or knock them out and then hide them somewhere neat and tidy. I tend to kill bad guys, but I don't like killing bank security guards, for example, since they aren't involved in any evil schemes. I like that you can play with morals.

    Also, I don't like leaving guards behind me because that's an unnecessary risk. It seems more reasonable to knock them out and stash them somewhere, and I love the fact that when they woke up they wouldn't even know who you were or what happened, since you crept up from behind. I do ghost once and a while, but just for a different challenge since I've played through the games soooooooo many times.

    Once I played SC1 without ever using a gadget or a bullet, except for the bullet I used to kill Nicoladz. It gave me a whole new appreciation for the game since I was forced to explore new ways to get through levels. Even though the 'pathways' are quite narrow in that game, you'd be amazed how many alternative routs there are. I found ledges and pipes that I'd never noticed before. The level design is truly incredible.

    So, fingers crossed that SC6 will offer the same wide range of enjoyment.
    Ubisoft, please prove me wrong.
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  4. #144
    Senior Member SolidSage's Avatar
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    SC has always required a certain amount of action on my part but in the early titles it was about luring or getting the drop on whatever obstacles posed a greater risk to exposure. Knocking out is a nice option when unaffiliated entities become involved but generally, I prefer to be sure the enemy's watchdogs won't wake up and alert the location while I am still about the business. If Sam is there in a sneaking suit with silenced weapons, I figure 5th freedom is a go, and success being my number one objective requires me to perform in the most efficient manner, that provides the highest chance of that success. Zero tolerance for 'problems'. On the serious story play throughs anyway.

    I find Ghosting, by my definition, to be available for a good portion of SCC, and easier to do in it because of how much better character controls are. I felt previous SC's were really more about waiting for windows of opportunity to act. SCC allows me to move around patterns and blend and shift in the shadows more freely, in the light too. The response and tools are better IMO, more Predator like, as was advertised. I enjoy SC more because of this, but acknowledge that there are some minor inconsistencies ('A' but-ton with ADD).

    Levels, routes, options, story, characters, gadgets, weapons, actions.....I'm all for improvement and additions to these.
    Last edited by SolidSage; 04-06-2012 at 09:43 AM.

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  5. #145
    Senior Member shobhit7777777's Avatar
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    @Codenameeric

    I agree. It's just that you see a LOT of emphasis on the LTL-No Contact gameplay I automatically assume thats what Ghosting means. IMO Ghosting means leaving no evidence of your IDENTITY rather than presence...OR leaving ANY one thing which might blow the operation in the slightest.

    I normally do not kill standard guards (Bank guards, Displace employees etc.) but if I have communicated with them I WILL kill them...as they can give away a lot of details..race, age, sex, voice level of training etc.
    Same with equipment...I remember shooting EVERY sticky cam I used to destroy it and render it useless for ANY investigating party...and I was SO detail oriented that I shot the cam with the SC-20K to leave standard NATO 5.56 rounds instead of the more exotic 5.72 rounds the Pistol used.

    They will discover your intrusion one way or the other..whats important is to cover any links between the op and your organisation. I don't care if they find 3 dead bodies and their servers wiped clean...I will be bothered if they have clues to my nationality, affiliation, training etc.

    Just like you I KO'd/Killed every guard I could to leave NO ONE dude behind lest they wander around and blow my op...it was impossible in the game but it certainly helped create the fantasy of a deep infiltration.

    @SolidSage

    I totally agree. I do not like leaving behind ANY loose ends. The only good guard is a dead guard. Maybe thats why SCCs transition to lethal stealth did not bother me much as I did pretty much what I was doing since the first game..taking down guards. It just felt a more realistic/plausible Modus Operandi. I'd imagine a 4 man Navy SEAL unit to operate like SCC agents...silent shots to the head..moving fast..taking down multiple targets..swift and silent.
    Last edited by shobhit7777777; 04-06-2012 at 07:43 PM.

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  6. #146
    I don't think that anyone would try to play a Splinter Cell in Ghosting Style from the beginning. The first playthroughs are for the enjoyment and the exploration of the story and I am very happy Splinter Cell has these dialogues with the NPCs and the hidden details in E-Mails and so on. I also play very often Splinter Cell the way I play Hunter in SCC. Just like you I am making sure that every dude is KO and it makes fun to do so because of the several animations and so on. You can enjoy the game. But after that I try to find the ulitmate challenge and that's the ghosting. Sure you lose a lot of dialogue with the NPCs but you already had all this enjoyment and you know all of them already.

    Now that's the point where you can bluster into being the ultimate ghost. Leave everything the way it was and noone will ever notice that you were ever there. It feels very rewarding to do this and this blustering into ghosting adds a lot to the replayability. First you KO all, next time you KO the guys where you didn't find another way around and another time you try to find a way to go around all these NPCs. That's the depth Stealth games always offered and Splinter Cell did this just as well. I think I can do a very good example with GTA. The first time al lot of people play it with a massive use of Cheats. I did it too. But then I decided to do a 100% playthrough of GTA SA without any cheats and the game felt completely different but it felt very good and very rewarding.
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  7. #147
    Senior Member SolidSage's Avatar
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    @Shobhit
    To me, Ghosting means the only thing I touch is the objective. No kills or KO's, no shooting or turning lights out, no alerts at all....basically I do nothing except sneak past everything without using any tools or tricks.
    While it is fun and somewhat believable to a point, I don't NEED to be able to ghost the entire game to enjoy it. How restricting it would be to have to make a game that basically never required the player to be put into a compromising situation. The game would basically play itself and our role would be to just observe and gather the intel. Might as well just watch TV imo. I can accept full ghosting to mean playing the game where you only interact with mandatory elements, but that has to include some AI, otherwise there is no need for any story whatsoever, that involves the player character anyway.
    So, like you, SCC wasn't a shock because it actually embraced my method more....I hated the struggle with the shooting in SAR, it was like Sam had no idea how to use a gun.

    Ghosting is a fun challenge after playing lots of other ways, but to require SC to be built around that method as priority, is requiring a bunch of other staple elements to be diluted...no thanks. My Sam has always got his hands dirty at some point and he has no problem with it.
    I too believe that realism is reflected in fast elimination of problems. You sneak UP TO them then drop them fast, rather than betting the entire mission on your ability to constantly avoid detection by guards you were too kind to eliminate.
    The operatives are equipped and trained to kill at a very high degree, because it's required.

    @Andre
    I always play GTA with the cheats off. I just started playing 4 with cheats for the first time this year and it is SO much more fun. Screw driving those old beaters and futzing around with crappy pistols unless it's the initial story journey.
    Last edited by SolidSage; 04-06-2012 at 10:37 PM.

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  8. #148
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    Well heres some,its on german as google translate didn´t want to work for me but anyway i underestand german
    http://de.ign.com/news/13571/Splinte...Mitarbeiter-an
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  9. #149
    That's the original news: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...toronto-studio

    Nothing new about Splinter Cell 6. They slowly should turn on their hype/PR mashine.
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  10. #150
    Senior Member sameer_monier's Avatar
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    I am tired of this BS, Tease a trailer or something already, we are at May, the 2 most amazing games I am waiting for from Ubi are really kept hidden (R6P & SC6), they won't possibly wait till they ship GRFS !!!, or worse nothing at all till at E3 floor :S

    One Month to go.

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