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Thread: What do you think about a multiple vote? | Forums

  1. #1

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    In one of the novels by author Nevil Shute..."In the Wet"..... the subject of multiple voting comes up....not an illegal act as we see it now....but a real system....
    It looks good to me......have any countries tried it??

    an excerpt from the book, describing it...


    For half an hour they chatted. Then his host said, 'There's one thing about Australia I wish you'd tell me. How does your multiple vote work? It's quite an issue here in England, as perhaps you know.'
    The pilot raised his eyebrows. 'I didn't know that. You don't have it, do you?'
    'No. How does it work out in practice?'
    'I don't really know,' said David. 'I've never thought about it much.'
    Captain Osborne asked, 'Have you got more than one vote, yourself?'
    The pilot nodded. 'I'm a three vote man.'
    'I hope you don't mind me asking these questions,' the captain said. 'It really is getting rather important now in England.'
    'I don't mind,' David said. 'The only thing is, I'm afraid I don't know much about it. I've never bothered.'
    'What do you get your three votes for?' the captain asked.
    'Basic, education, and foreign travel.'
    'The basic vote - that's what everybody gets, is it?'
    'That's right,' the pilot said. 'Everybody gets that at the age of twenty one.'
    'And education?'
    'That's for higher education,' David said. 'You get it if you take a university degree. There's a whole list of other things you get it for, like being a solicitor or a doctor. Officers get it when they're commissioned. That's how I got mine.'
    'And foreign travel?'
    'That's for earning your living outside Australia for two years. It's a bit of a racket, that one, because in the war a lot of people got it for their war service. I got mine that way. I didn't know anything about the Philippines, really, when I came away, although I'd been there for three years, off and on.'
    'You had a wider outlook than if you'd stayed at home,' the captain said. 'I suppose that's worth something.'
    'I suppose it is.'
    'So you've got three votes. How does that work out in practice, at an election?'
    'You get three voting papers given to you, and fill in all three, and put them in the box,' the pilot said.
    'You're on the register as having three votes?'
    'That's right. You have to register again when you get an extra vote - produce some sort of a certificate.'
    They sat in silence for a time, looking out over the crowded harbour in the sunset light. Rosemary came to the saloon ladder and spoke up to them. 'You can get more votes than three, can't you?' she said. 'Is it seven?'
    David glanced down at her. 'The seventh is hardly ever given,' he said. 'Only the Queen can give that.'
    She nodded. 'I know. We get them coming through the office. I should think there must be about ten a year.'
    'The others are straightforward,' David said. 'You get a vote if you raise two children to the age of fourteen without getting a divorce. That's the family vote.'
    'You can't get it if you're divorced?' asked Rosemary smiling.
    'No. That puts you out.'
    'Do you both get it?'
    'Husband and wife both get it,' David said.
    'What's the fifth one?' asked the captain.
    'The achievement vote,' said David. 'You get an extra vote if your personal exertion income - what you call earned income here - if that was over something or other in the year before the election - five thousand a year, I think. I don't aspire to that one. It's supposed to cater for the man who's got no education and has never been out of Australia and quarrelled with his wife, but built up a big business. They reckon that he ought to have more say in the affairs of the country than his junior typist.'
    'Maybe. And the sixth?'
    'That's if you're an official of a church. Any recognized Christian church - they've got a list of them. You don't have to be a minister. I think churchwardens get it as well as vicars, but I'm really not quite sure. What it boils down to is that you get an extra vote if you're doing a real job for a church.'
    'That's an interesting one.'
    'It's never interested me much,' said the pilot. 'I suppose I'm not ambitious. But I think it's quite a good idea, all the same.'
    'So that's six votes,' Captain Osborne said. 'The basic vote, and education, and foreign travel, and the family vote, and the achievement vote, and the church vote. What's the seventh?'
    'That's given at the Queen's pleasure,' said David. 'It's more like a decoration. You get it if you're such a hell of n chap that the Queen thinks you ought to have another vote."
    'Aren't there any rules about getting it?'
    'I don't think so,' said the pilot. 'I think you just get it for being a good boy.'
    From the cabin hatch Rosemary said, 'That's right, Uncle Ted. It's given by a Royal Charter in each case.' She added, 'I'm just dishing up.'
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  2. #2
    sounds like a jazzed up verison of the old time voting restrictions, where only men of means could vote.

    here its education and foreign travel or income increase, still sounds like the same old ,,,how to disenfranchise the poor,,, story to me.

    heck they even inculde the church, giving it extra votes. reminds me of the three estates system. that didnt end well if i recall correctly. a few people lost their heads, so to speak.
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  3. #3

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    It doesn't look to me to penalise the poor...just that those with a more varied and mature outlook and experience of life get to have more say...

    a poor person could still have got his basic, family and maybe foreign travel votes...not to suggest that very many people would qualify for more than 3 or 4 votes anyway..
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  4. #4
    you need money to get a education and for foreign travel, raising kids is expensive too. money problems are a major cause of divorce and money is the one thing the poor tend to lack.

    yes they would still have the basic vote, but the system is weighted against them. its not like they dont have enough disadvantages anyway, adding even more sounds like a singularly bad idea.

    this is the stuff revolutions are made of. read up on the french revolution and how the voting system was stacked against the poor and even the middle class.

    theres also the old jim crow laws of the american south that show this is a bad idea. i dont think dr.king would be to thrilled with this voting system.
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  5. #5
    Originally posted by Von_Rat:
    this is the stuff revolutions are made of.
    That would start one alright. Many people already feel the upper class is pulling away from a sliding down middle class even in the USA. I'm in the supposed sliding down part. I'd be revolting at some point.

    Imagine if the Democrats' Super Delegates had power in the general election? It could negate our representation.
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  6. #6
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    On the subject of voting, I am truly disgusted with our system here in the USA. Our two party system stinks and people are practically brainwashed into believing you have to be either a republican or a democrat. There should be a lot more parties. There actually really are a lot more parties but the voting process has been so controlled by the two big parties by ballot laws that they squash any chance the other ones have of getting anywhere.

    I also have become disenchanted by so-called representative democracy. The senators and congressmen do not represent our best interests and vote according to their own personal inclinations. And this is due to special interests and a ton of corruption. We should just forget all that and have the citizens get out and vote on everything themselves. It would be pain in the butt to go out and vote all the time but imagine what a different country it would be if we used such a system!!

    Just think, we'd likely not have gone into Iraq and we for sure would have a much tighter control on our southern border with Mexico. There'd likely be more jobs too as we'd formulate laws to severely punish corporations from outsourcing amd move factories to other countries. Our trade laws would be more balanced and we would not be getting most of our products from China. We'd overall be opposed to "globalizaton". True conservatives would have a voice again instead of the neo-conservative like Bush and McCain. The democratic party would not be so radical and extreme to the left.

    Most of our people do not like tha Iraq situation and the vast majority ( about 80% ) are sick of the flow of illegals through our borders. Are we being represented?? Apparently not!!!! The people being "represented" are the ones making a bundle from both the war and the illegals. Our system is totally corrupt. And this is the opinion of a far right conservative!!
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  7. #7
    All votes should be weighted by how much you actually pay in taxes. Pay more, you count more. If you make 10 billion a year and dodge all the taxes, you don't vote. You can elect to pay more in taxes so your vote counts more, too.

    I'd give "large taxpayer" bonus to anyone in, or honorably discharged from the military as well (for life, they "pay their due" with life and limb).

    Alternately, at least disenfranchise people who don't actually pay taxes since voting for them is a conflict of interest. Remember that originally you had to own real property to vote (some Jeffersonian agrarianism there).

    tater
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  8. #8
    So how do feel about taxes being based on ability to pay?


    "You need to get out and **** more, L_F m8."
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  9. #9
    Senior Member ploughman's Avatar
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    I'm interested in taxation based on willingness to pay.

    I do think, though, that an individual's personal exposure to taxation should be capped. A brake on 'big government' might also be a limit on tax revenue as a function of GDP, although I'm not sure about the level it might be pegged at.
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  10. #10
    Why bother?
    when my one vote in the US doesn't even count?

    IMO everything should be done by POPULAR vote.
    Do away with the party system, and the electorial collage. throw out dellegets, caucasuses and super delegets.

    let the popular vote decide. after all the popular vote best desides the will of the people. that's the whole point of an election. The person with most votes wins. why in the hell do they make it so damn complicaed.

    and what's bad, in my state i have to vote for 1 party. either democrat or republican. I can't vote a split ticket.

    Example: lets say Sen Clinton wins the Dem nomination. and say she picks some joe blow congressman from Bumfcked, Nebraska i never heard of for VP.
    And say McCain picks Huckabee.

    now what if i disagree with Sem. Clinton and dislike her choice for VP. Supose i think huckabee would be a better choice.
    thier from differnt parties...but hey i don't have a damn party so i should be free to vote a split ticket. BS.

    voting in this country is so screwed.
    Hell i may even vote for nader this year. he's anounced as an independant. Given a choice between A democrat, a Republican, or an Independat....i'll go with the independant every time so long as i agree with them on the issues.
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