[ old town screens thread ] | Forums

[Dark-Whisperer]

<span class="ev_code_PURPLE">Moderator information :

The new, principal Towns Screens thread is located here</span> :

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...9&a=tpc&f=5861060878


Let me start by a quote from official FAQ thread on this forum. First question in thread and one that most people wanted to be clarified is:

Will there be any town screen?

And the answer is: YES, totally. In the demo shown in Colonia, they used a temporary screen. The final one is said to be in 2D, more like H3 and H4 and not as complex as the H5 ones. Erwan Le Breton, the game producer, said it himself:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Erwan Le Breton: There will be 2D animated town screen in the release version of the game

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Later on Facebook Julien Pirou aka Marzhin ( http://www.facebook.com/note.p...e_id=153143868044919 ) said:

Town screen: there is still a town screen, or more accurately, a town window. Each town still have its own theme music and all. It is a 2D, animated town screen. The Haven town screen was part of the missing elements, that's why it was replaced by a mere screenshot for the demo.

You can see more info about a city on its 3D model on the adventure map (not just its town hall and if it has fortifications). You can learn a lot about your adversary's strategy just by observing how he developed his towns.

First part from FAQ thread is not correct as I have learned from Heroes Community forum. Even Marzhin's post isn't clear enough so majority of people were mislead to believe that there will be fullscreen town screens. There was even a thread here about 2D/3D town screens and fans preferences. To most of us never occurred that this first screenshot labeled as temporary isn't a placeholder and that town screens are going to be in window just like in demo in Colonia. Furthermore Marzhin suggested that we will be able to see town development directly on adventure map in attempt to minimize significance of town screens.

What this means?

It means that we will get fixed size window for town screen instead fullscreen. If someone thinks that this will improve performance he/she is making mistake. Opening another window on adventure map will decrease performance further. In attempt to needlessly speed up game developers destroyed one of games main features.
Instead of beautiful 3D or 2D screen we will get flashlike, probably non interactive, desolate excuse for town screen.

Please post here your thoughts so we can draw some attention of developers while is still not to late.

[KingImp]

They say that the town is going to be along the lines of what we had in H3 and H4, but right now things are not looking promising.

I'm not about to jump on the riot bandwagon like some have as I've seen from personal experience (H5) the change that can come from the Alpha and Beta versions to the final release version, but if what we have been shown is in fact what they plan on giving us, then it is clearly a bad step in the wrong direction for this series.

Enough with the "we have to speed up the game and turn it into an MMO" nonsense. Heroes is not about going fast and having lightning reflexes. It's about taking your time and strategizing. Stop trying to make this game something it's not by attempting to make it faster. If they are so worried about this slowing down performance, then try eliminating the tree animations as that is what truly bogged down people's systems, not the town screens.

[Fever_K]

In my opinion, town windows would be an horrible mistake. I really like the game for what I've seen until now (just to point out that I'm not a regular hater), but this change would be a disaster!

Town screens (both 2D and 3D) have always been part of the game, and for a good reason!
It's great to see your city growing, full screen and with music on.
The screens grant a feeling and a particular atmosphere to each faction.
I can't really imagine Romero's music playing while looking at a town window on the adventure map!

Cities are an important part of Heroes and cannot be reduced to a 300 pixels window as if they were minor feature!

Please, change your mind about this matter: it's not too late to at least separate the towns from the adventure map..!

[Thunion]

What this means?

It means FUUUU...Ubi stop,you made mystakes,you made good things,BUT removing the townscreen is the same as if you would have removed Shaman from WoW "to simplify the things".Making new heroes is good,they dont have to look like copy of homm 1/2/3/5 BUT removing town screen is crossing the line,dont make another h4 they crossed line and there you go,now its unrarely called worst heroes ever..Thanks for noticing that out Dark-Whisperer its better to know that now then turn on the game,enter town and then "WTF is that?"...

[WaterPoloLaw]

Yeah, I got on the Heroes Community forum last night and saw this discussion. With all due respect, I think the community website over at Heroes Community needs to calm down just a tad. There are WAY too many speculations being made that have ZERO evidential basis. I am not saying we should not voice opinions, I just think we are putting the cart WAY before the horse and are largely jumping to some pretty rediculous conclusions as a whole.

To my knowledge, the developers have not released ANY screenshots with the so-called "town screens." You and everyone else at the Heroes Community forum have no clue what these town screens (or "town windows") do or do not contain. Personally, I think you are inferring way too much from the above statements.

Let's stick with what we know for certain.

Animated 2d Screens: First, we know that the screens will be graphically intense, interactive, and animated 2D models. Personally, I think this is a good idea. Just because something is 2D does not mean it is any less visually simulating that a 3D model.

I can see why this change was made. Quite frankly, it was a pain to navigate the 3D towns in Heroes V. Half the time after purchasing a new building or upgrade, you could hardly tell that any changes were made at all to the town. It also really detracted from gameplay to take the time to enter, upload the town, and then exit, and reupload the map.

My point being is this: I think we should all reserve judgment on the 2D v. 3D issue until AFTER we have ACTUALLY SEEN the 2D results, not before. At present and giving the developers the benefit of the doubt that the screens will be no less artful and visually stimulating than the town screens in Heroes V (which they deserve), I think it may make total sense to move from 3D back to a highly animated 2D town screen.

Town Windows: Just because something is a "town window" as opposed to a "town screen" does not mean that it does not take up the majority of the screen (or all of it in its entirety) at the time you are viewing it. Once again, if the town window takes up say 75%-95% of the screen, then I don't see how this is a problem either.

That said, I HIGHLY doubt we are going to get a miniture flash-like picture window, which it seems people are assuming. Rather, from what we know, it sounds to me like you click on a town and a very large, detailed, aminated and interactive window appears that takes up the majority of the screen showing you the details of that town and allowing the player to purchase new buildings and upgrades. While the window is active, the rest of the map darkens and the music changes so it has the same "feel" of entering the town and viewing an entirely new screen.

Like I said, I am going to wait to pass judgment on this one, as should we all at this point. Provided that the window is sufficiently large enough so it takes up most of the screen, which it sounds that it does, I don't see this as a problem at all. Once again, I see the benefit that players can quickly and easily move in and out of town screens without any upload or transition time.

Honestly, who cares if the town screen is 100% fullscreen or is in a window that is 85% fullscreen? Seems a silly reason to get our panties in a wad at this point, especially when we have no clue what these screens actually look like.

3d Models of Towns and Town Upgrades on Adventure Maps: You can actually see this on a number of the screeshots, and it is pretty freaking cool. There happens to be a very noticable differnce between towns and castles. You can also see many of the upgrades and buildings in the castles. For example on one of the screenshots, the 3d model of an inferno castle has a large eye at the top of the tower, while many others do not. Clearly, the eye at the top of the tower is some sort of unique building or upgrade that could effect a player's strategy decision regarding whether to attack that castle.

I disagree also that these 3d Towns were to be used to "replace" or "diminish" the use of town screens. I think the new enhanced 3d models on the map are there as an added feature to the game, nothing more.

What this means?

It means that we will get fixed size window for town screen instead fullscreen. If someone thinks that this will improve performance he/she is making mistake. Opening another window on adventure map will decrease performance further. In attempt to needlessly speed up game developers destroyed one of games main features.
Instead of beautiful 3D or 2D screen we will get flashlike, probably non interactive, desolate excuse for town screen.

How in the world did you come to this conclusion?? Yes, I understand this is what they are discussing over at the Heroes Community forum, but to be quite frank, there is ZERO basis for such conclusions at this point.

Based on what we know for certain, and only know for certain, you can't make such outrageous conclusions.

Once again, who cares whether we get a "fullscreen" town screen or an 90% fullscreen town window? Who says the townscreen is not going to be beautiful, artistically designed 2d and animated? Who says it is going to be non-interactive and flashlike? As of right now, I see zero basis for such statments.

We should wait and see. Once we actually have a screenshot of the town screen (or town window) then we can better decide whether it is or is not a good decision. In fact, I am going to go out on limb here and go one step further that I hightly doubt we are going to dislike these changes. I could be wrong, but I would be willing to bet that I am right.

[Fever_K]

@WaterPoloLaw: Zero basis, you say?
Did you take a look at THIS?

They said that the picture is a placeholder, but the rest will stay this way, as confirmed by both insiders and Pirou.
30% town windows are good enough for your taste?

[WaterPoloLaw]

Originally posted by Fever_K:
@WaterPoloLaw: Zero basis, you say?
Did you take a look at THIS?

They said that the picture is a placeholder, but the rest will stay this way, as confirmed by both insiders and Pirou.
30% town windows are good enough for your taste?

The scroll over on the shot clearly says "Switch to Town Window." Clearly this is not the "Town Window," otherwise how would you be able to "Switch to Town Window?"

It seems pretty obvious from the picture that this is not the "Town Window," but that there is another "Town Window" (obviously larger and more detailed) to which you can navigate. I may be wrong, but this clearly looks like merely a quick window of sorts so you can see the basics of the town and adding creatures to your army without actually entering the town screen.

In fact, I would go out on a limb and say it is obvious this is the case and is facially apparent from the screenshot. I see nowhere that the player is able to purchae upgrades to the town via the use of this "Town Window." Clearly this is not a screenshot of the main "Town Window" and, as is apparent on its face, there is another more detailed "Town Window" to which you can switch to and navigate. Wouldn't you agree?

[andthenitends]

If I can quickly buy creatures from that town window, I will say it's neat.

If I can't, then the town window is pretty useless as I will have to click to go to town window all the time anyways and it's an unnecessary constant extra click.

Edit: Actually, I'm sure there will be a way to directly enter town screen without going through the window.

[WaterPoloLaw]

Originally posted by andthenitends:
If I can quickly buy creatures from that town window, I will say it's neat.

If I can't, then the town window is pretty useless as I will have to click to go to town window all the time anyways and it's an unnecessary constant extra click.

andthenitends,

Notice how there are seven locked buttons at the bottom of this quick screen. I will bet you anything that, in the final version, those seven locked buttons will allow a player to purchase the seven various creatures available in that town and move them to the player's army without the hero actually having to enter and interface with the more detailed town screen. Wouldn't you agree?

Look, I am not saying I am right, but this screenshot clearly does not appear to be the actual "town window." This appears to merely be a quick window so you can more quickly add units from the town to your army.

[Dark-Whisperer]

@WaterPoloLaw

I will not comment on the part of 2D vs 3D part of your post because its not topic of this thread and its been discussed before in another thread.

So lets get to work.
First release date for this game was march 2011. This clearly wont happen. New date is spring 2011 that gives around two months of development time including beta test and tying loose ends. What does that tells me about town screens?
1. Town screens are done but they don't want to show them until last moment because it will trigger avalanche of ranting
2. Town windows are still not finished and this half done "feature" will be rushed and implemented in whatever sorry state it is to meet the deadline.

If something is loaded into separate window and occupies 95% of screen whats the benefit of that? As you should know 2D graphic doesn't scale like 3D with bigger resolution. If they make large 2D screen there is no need for it to be in window. So its safe to assume that screen will be fairly small and will not take 95% of screen. Screenshot of towns screen in my first post shows it clearly.
People here were mostly against 3D because of performance reason. This window mode WILL NOT increase performance of your computer. Second concern was functionality and smaller window indicates lower functionality. I see no reason not to go full screen, absolutely none.

As Marzhin said:

You can see more info about a city on its 3D model on the adventure map (not just its town hall and if it has fortifications).

This is remnant of no town screens idea. Valuable time was spent of this feature because at first there should be no town screens at all so the state of your town had to be noticeable directly from adventure map.

On the screenshot there is button that says "switch to town window" because that particular screen shows recruitment screen... nothing more, nothing less. Its safe to assume that they will not make several different size windows for every town feature.

And one more thing... 90% of those "uninformed" people ranting "without reason" on Heroes Community are hardcore fans that soak up every bit of information about this game for more then a year. I would rather raise my voice with them while something can be done about something as essential as town screens then to be surprised when there is absolutely nothing to be done. We might be already too late but I will say my opinion anyway.