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[skywarp00]

After comparing the sales of Vegas 1 to Rainbow Six 1, I can certainly attest to this 110%. I can say without a shadow of a doubt that if Vegas 1 didn't have the name Rainbow Six tacked onto it it would have failed even harder than it did. I would have been surprised if it even hit the 1 million mark in unit sales. If not, then it would have for sure taken a lot longer to hit the 1 million mark. Without the Rainbow Six name, its just another generic shooter.

hmmm lets hope your wrong

[Dcopymope]

hmmm lets hope your wrong

In relation to how well Patriots may sell, well, we haven't seen any gameplay footage so I'm not so sure, but if the target footage and what they've promised is any indication, then I might as well just say that I'm not expecting Patriots to sell much better than Vegas 2 based on the overall negative reaction of the hardcore fanbase which I have shown based on unit sales of both the original Rainbow Six games and the Vegas series is the fanbase that actually matters. As far as Rainbow Six is concerned, the hardcore fanbase always made up the majority of the people that bought any Rainbow Six game that's ever come out, just like any Arma or Operation Flashpoint game. So Ubi Soft come put this nonsense of trying to appeal to the so called casual fanbase to rest, there really is no casual fanbase, most of them aren't buying the games anyway. Like I said before, there is the hardcore fanbase that are actually buying the games, and then there is everyone else, the outsiders, who in the end shouldn't even be put into the equation based on the stats.

[Menacewithin]

When is the last time RB6 brought out a game... even Patriots was announced a year or two ago and still a year or two away. Don't hold your breath, and I know it's sad to hear... but this series is just hopeless...

Before we go and bash Ubisoft, actually... they are the ones behind our beloved RB6 3 & Black Arrow. I'd love the reintroduction of that style of game. The multiplayer was above anything then, and now in my opinion. I am so tired of the Call of Duty style games. No wall hug, no sprinting, no stupid "perks". I do like the "RPG" factor of Vegas 1 (Vegas 2, no thanks.) In that you gain XP to unlock levels. I love the customization of gear and the ability to add your face to your character. These types of things add personality to the game and extend replay value. I can do without the story line, but would rather return to the Mission oriented style of the past; but that is never going to happen.

Also, a thing of the past is the regular Deathmatch. 1 life... everyone wants to just do the run and gun, and don't care if they die cause in 5 seconds they'll just respawn back. What made RB6 3 & Black arrow so special was moments of suspense. You couldn't hear your dead teammates, there are no stupid gadgets showing you where the enemy is. You just have to go search and destroy... and the maps were just awesome. Ah well, I guess that's why we have memories...

[skywarp00]

Every interview i read and listen to has ubi/redstorm saying that they are moving forward with the series and aren't really looking back at what was done....

Patriots should be great but don't expect the same as the original series....hope for the best though