I am SICK of getting ripped off! Resurrect traditional HoMM monsters! | Forums

[paul_lambert]

In the original HoMM series there were various monsters, castles and locations, this is not so in the latest instalment. They have reduced the amount of creatures present in the game and expect us to pay more money for expansions containing creatures which should have been in the original release. What I am trying to say is, I am sick of getting ripped off and in the new expansion there shouldn't be only a few new neutral monsters, there should be lots, that's what we deserve! And I don't mean "new"� as in copying old creatures changing their colours and calling them "new"�, i.e. Lich/Grand Lich to "Lich Master!?"�. Bring back the Halflings that's what I say!

An example of some of the creatures from previous HoMM games which are not found in HoMM5...

"¢ Basilisk
"¢ Behemoths
"¢ Berserker
"¢ Centaur (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Cyclops (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Dragonfly
"¢ Dread Knight
"¢ Efreet
"¢ Evil Eye
"¢ Genie (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Gog
"¢ Gorgons (medusas but M&M changed concept to a bull monster)
"¢ Gnoll
"¢ Gremlin
"¢ Halfling
"¢ Harpy
"¢ Leprechauns
"¢ Lizardmen
"¢ Manticore
"¢ Medusa (Are really Gorgons in Greek mythology)
"¢ Mega Dragon
"¢ Naga
"¢ Nomad
"¢ Pegasus
"¢ Pikeman (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Roc
"¢ Satyr
"¢ Thunderbird
"¢ Troglodyte
"¢ Troll
"¢ Wyvern

My new ideas for heroes...

"¢ Bestial (Found in MM8)
"¢ Chimera
"¢ Hippogryph
"¢ Terror (a creature used in M&M8 as the Fear, Terror, Nightmare and HoMM4 as the Venom Demon)
"¢ Wild <Animal Name> (in various M&M games there have been wild animals like Dogs, Boars, Rats or Bats. A good idea would be to introduce the Berserk skill from HoMM4 back once again. So you could have wild packs of animals, i.e. wild savage dogs)
"¢ Wisp (are found in other M&Ms such as MM7 and MM8)


So to cut a long story short, what creatures do you want back? Are you with me and think all of the above should be re-introduced? Have you got any monster ideas which you would like to see in the game!?!

Please post and fight for the cause!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Metel_Star]

You should make this a poll if you want people t choose which creature they want back to the HOMAM games

[PhoenixReborn06]

Originally posted by paul_lambert:

"¢ Centaur (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Cyclops (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Dread Knight
"¢ Genie (In every game bar HoMM5!)
"¢ Gremlin
"¢ Harpy
"¢ Manticore
"¢ Naga

So to cut a long story short, what creatures do you want back? Are you with me and think all of the above should be re-introduced? Have you got any monster ideas which you would like to see in the game!?!

The creaures that I kept from the list are already in the game or the expansions.

The death knight, genie, gremlins, and harpies (blood furies) are already in the original game. So I get the feeling you haven't played the game much.

I also don't see the purpose of having random creatures without a faction idea. I like some the creatures sure, but the next expansion is already running the limit of creature numbers by having 'alternates' that aren't very different. I don't want to remember an entire bestiary and don't forget about game balancing.

[paul_lambert]

Thanks for replying, a fair comment I would say. Ok, in some sence I would agree with you on having " too" many creatures for the beastary.

But I dont agree with the 4 creatures you said were already in the game (and YES I have played the game a bit...you cheeky devil )... yesthe gremlin is in the game, my mistake...<STRIKE>but</STRIKE> the deathknight is not a monster its a leader so its kind of not in the game and still in the game if you know what I mean...blood furies are not harpies in my opinion, they may have the same skill but I dont feel like they should be related.

well enough of this, i dont wont to make this a bickering match or a moaning session....You say something about a faction idea...well this is my idea, I hope you'll let me know what you think...

Faction Name:The banished
Theme:Creatures which are mutants/freaks which have been banished to the swamp lands (kind of influenced by the HoMM3 fortress).
Monsters:1st lvl = Wisp (small, very weak but fast creature. Melee. The native species of the swamp lands)
1st lvl upgrade = Dancing light (Melee. Same stats as wisp but weaker damage as it can now do all-round "burst-attack")

Monsters: 2nd lvl = Centaur (Mutant banished into the swamp, could be seen as "freak by rest of the realm). Classic creature. Archer)
2nd lvl upgrade = Centaur up-riser (slightly stronger but can now "up-rise" his team by increasing moral via magic spell horn for 1 round).

Monsters: 3rd lvl = Gnoll (mutant, arch-rival of minator. Melee)
3rd lvl upgrade = Gnoll thrasher (stonger attack, can push back enemies with attack for 1 square).

Monsters:4th lvl = Lizard-man (mutant, has spear for long distance attack. Melee).
4th lvl upgrade = Lizard-man elder (melee but can now fire an "acid spit attack" at short range which lays on the floor and damages creatures who tread on it, once acid disappears after 2 rounds for instance, he/she may spit again).

Monsters:5th lvl = Basalisk (mutant baby dragon. Large creature. Melee).
2nd lvl = Enraged basalisk (increased hp + damage, can now "leap" jumping over objects and opponents).

Monsters: 6th lvl = Gorgon (not bull creature but "medusa type". Melee. Stone-gaze.)
6th lvl upgrade = Medusas' chosen (melee & now spell caster. No retalation. Can cast slow, "stone legs") makes target stick to that location for 1 turn).

Monsters: 7th lvl = Chimera = (large creature. Is seen as a freak. Spell caster. Flyer).
7th lvl = Greater Chimera = (wise and powerful creature. Can cast more spells, i.e. summon 100 wisps, stronger and faster.)

Well thats my idea, I would appreciate it if you could let me know what you think

ONE MORE THING! if I had to choose five neutral creatures which deserve to be in the game they would be...
Creature 1: Halfling (neutral creature of the plains. deserves to be in the game, because if it wasn't for him (and for Tolkien creating him of course) there would be no fantasy rpgs! shooter, small creature)
Creature 2: Begger / Hermit (outcast of empire campagin. weak melee, lurks around grassy areas, has begging ability, if army is next to enemy castle, each begger/hermit takes 1 gold per turn)
Creature 3:Evil eye (classic Might and Magic Creature...do i need to say anymore?)
Creature 4: Wyvern (once again, a good creature)
Creature 5: Manticore (large melee/shooter creature, perhaps lvl 5, lives in underground or in inferno areas).

[PhoenixReborn06]

Some interesting stuff. I'm probably not the best person to judge since I'm not a big fan of h3 fortress.

From your suggestions I like very much the wisp, the gorgon (stone-gaze rocks) and the Lizard man with a spear (reminds me of TES: Arena).

I'd also like to see an evil eye, those things are surprisingly tough both in homm3 and mm6. Darn Agar.

Finally I apologize for being so combative, I wasn't, but then being on the forums where everyone fights I got into the habit.

[paul_lambert]

Thanks again for replying
No need to apologize, my topic title doesn't help, sorry about that. I only chose it to get ppls attention ...

its nice to hear you like the wisp, gorgon and lizardman ideas, thanks very much!

Well I think now I feel a bit better as some one has acknowledge the idea. I'm not really sick of getting ripped off...its just that I dont have the money to buy the expansion(*bursts into tears)....still at school sadly BUT i'll find a way of hording some pennies!

.....on the whole, it would be nice to see some new creatures, no matter what they are, even if they are a "tertiary/alternative upgrades" i.e. the master lich (I TAKE EVERYTHING BACK WHAT I SAID! I REPENT MY SINS! *beats self with large twig).

ANYWAYS...im off to walk the poochies on their daily wal***s...HUZZAH!

once again cheers mate

[tadaeusas]

Originally posted by PhoenixReborn06:
but then being on the forums where everyone fights I got into the habit.

Great true. Meaningful sentence here.

[Imaginaut]

Hey Paul,

I feel your pain and I love the fatc that you appreciate all things swampy. Here's a few quotes from a thread I started dealing along similar lines...

Posted Wed July 25 2007 08:21 Hide Post
A lineup for a new fortress:

Skinks/Lizards- Level 1 Unit (Appears as 2 relatively small lizards on the battlefield, generally poor unit; enraged)

Dragonfly - Level 2 Unit (Flyer, Generally high initiative, 3 or 4 speed; upgrades have more initiative; similar to dragonfly from h3)

Lizardman -Level 3 Unit (Shooter, "Switch to Sword" ability (wastes some % on the movement bar, gains plus 2-3 attack and loses ranged ability); One upgrade would have duel swords or a spear (no range); backbone of the army

Medusa/Beholder- Level 4 Unit (Shooter, no melee penalty, Beholder would fit team more if changed to green cause he'd fit the colour scheme)

Gorgon(bull) - Level 5 Unit [seems like some people want it back, i just can't think of anything to replace it other than a stronger lizardman] (regular or low initiative, decent speed/damage/hp; make it less bulky and change colour scheme to more appropriately fit the theme or even better, get a lizardman to ride it , also the death stare would stay)

Witch - Level 6 Unit (Name pending; looks like a lizardman female (i.e., not human) with a cloak; Teleport, Caster - Some dark magics like slow, curse, and perhaps decay (would be its main damaging procedure); ranged (no melee penalty), below average damage)
Basilisk - Level 7 Unit ("Constrict ability"- prevents constricted enemy from attacking the basilisk until the basilisk is physically attacked [spells don't count]; the basilisk should be more snakelike instead of how it was featured in HOMM3, would have high initiative for a level 7 unit, but relatively low speed; one of the upgrades would have sick 'flaps' sticking out of it much as the greater basilisk had in HOMM3, other upgrade can grow some legs/change a little in appearance and lose constrict ability, but make up for it with additional abilities or increases to damage, etc.)

Racial Ability: Capture (name pending): All lizardman heroes have the ability to capture a certain percentage of enemy troops at the end of battle. These enemies (if there is room in your army) join you as slaves/sacrifices, meaning they cannot fight for you, but can be sacrificed at town for instant resources or increased resource production (idea of ancient tribes sacrificing to increase crop production). Certain things would affect amount of enemies captured/resources gained (skills/buildings). Basic level- 5% enemies, Adv. 10%, Exp. 15%, Ult. 20%

Ultimate Ability: (thing where you get all those prerequisite skills) Conquer: Captures are instantly sent to town before the battle begins (that is, creatures are lost from opponent's side before battle even begins) and are exchanged for random resources or increased production in random resources

Theme behind team: Swamp/Ancient Civilization Theme, much more "Mayan" as opposed to the Orc's native american feel (for example, face/body paint, feathers/skulls sticking off of weapons, and some aspects of voo-doo and HOMM3 themes)

Town Look: Picture a temple (similar to looks with Fortress of HOMM3) with swampland surrounding the general area, and lush green forestry everywhere else (rainforest type trees). Buildings would be made out of similar material used to make the Castle itself

Predominant race: Lizardman

Notes:

Unless someone can make a gorgon fit into this team, i'd rather have a 'bigger' lizardman replace it or a gorg rider

Witch's possible names: Charmer, Sorceress, crone, beldam, medusa/gorgon (if someone can replace gorgon with another unit)

Racial ability makes sense to me, as they could set traps such as nets before the battle and capture some troops in that way, and later sacrifice those victims to the Gods (very ritualistic team)

Skills that assist racial ability: logistics-> pathfinding-> "Swift Capture": ability to create caravan after battle to send the captures to closest castle

Name of Faction: Only thing I'm stumped on. I'm thinking preserve since its not taken anymore, and it kinda makes sense (swamps are preserved in their natural state), yet the name doesn't reflect the "expansion" motif going along with the town, so I'm tryin to think of a name more suitable with expansion and growth rather than preservation. Some possibilities (I guess): Moor, Slough



Well anyway, I know that H5 series is comin to an end, but it'd be nice to see this faction or something similar to this faction in H6, cause lizardmen are pretty cool/original

P.S. i started makin this list before i saw triumvere's post

Any comments/ suggestions would be cool

[Imaginaut]

and here was my reply/reinvionsing of the concept. as you can see, those crazy bull Gorgons always make the cut. they were the coolest creatures in HOMM3.

Posted Wed July 25 2007 09:51 Hide Post
Hey P,

That's a pretty interesting reinvisioning of the Fortress. I have to admit I like some of your ideas and the capture idea is intriguing.

Bu here's an alternative. What about Regeneration as a racial ability? Almost like the Deep Hydra ability so they heal damage and even rise from the dead at the end of combat, just like the Sun rises from the dead of night.

Envisioning your Mayan/Aztec theme I can think of some adjustments to creature naems and abilities...let's see:

Level One: Lizards and Skinks. Lizards may not have any special abilities at all and be kinda weak like Imps but Skinks should have Split as an ability where they duplicate themselves during battle. At the end of combat the survivors can Recombine. The Split Version would od maybe 1-2 Damage and the non-Split 1-3 so it's a bit of a choice.

Level Two: Lizard Man/Lizard Warrior. Maybe make them more "savage" than their HOMM3 analog. Maybe give them Claws for close combat (no loss of effectiveness in hand to hand)and Acid Spit for their ranged attack.

Level Three: Serpent or Sun Fly or Sun Serpent and Winged Serpent. Like the Serpent and Dragon Flies of old, they should have blindingly high initiatives and good mobility. The upgrade gains Wings and Flight Special Ability and more mobility but no more Initiative, I guess. Maybe the upgrade would be a four square creature. They would both have Blind as a special ability as their gaze is like staring into the Sun (or maybe they could be like Spitting Cobras and spit in opponent's eyes to Blind them) and maybe the Winged Serpent should have Trap or Bind where it constricts it's body around it's opponent to crush them to death or maybe it should have Mezmerize where it controls it's opponent, kinda like a heightened version of Blind where it takes control of its target.

Level Four: Swamp Hag/Swamp Witch. The Magic User and elite Ranged attacker. Tons of possibilities here depending on which way you want to go with the metaphor. All sorts of abilties are possible from Blowguns with Poison Darts to Snares made of Vines that rise from the ground to Entangle opponents. They could carry Flint or Obsidian Daggers to Sacrifice victims as well. Could also be called Hag/Crone or Initiate/Priestess or some such combo. Meteor Shower or Darkness spells and maybe Invisibilty would make sense too (as would Regeneration but to load them with Special Abilities may entail making them more frail physically...which could work, too).

Level Five: The Mayans and Aztecs were nutty for Jaguars so you gotta have them somewhere. Huge Speed and Initiatives and Big Nasty Bitey Teeth and Claws. The same size as Hellhounds and Cerberi but Level Five with Higher Attack and Damage etc. Should ahve the No Retaliation Ability to reflect their ferocity. Upgrade could be the Tezcatlipoca.

Level Six: Gorgons and Mighty Gorgons. Gotta keep the reptilian bull motif and the Acid Breath and Death Stare are a must. Not much I'd change about these guys except to jack up their hitpoints since they've been promoted to Level Six. Maybe adding Acid Blood, mentioned elsewhere, would be good too. They'd be Large Creatures. Aztecs and Mayans were nutty for Bulls, too, like most ancient cultures. Maybe they could look more like oxen with the sideways horns?

Level Seven: I've always loved the Basilisks but maybe sone sort of Serpent/Wyrm combo would make more sense. Probably call them the Feathered Serpent/Quetzacoatl to maintain the metaphor. The Serpent could be like a giant Anacondo with Regeneration and Constriction powers...and feathers! The Quetzacoatl could be even larger and have Swallow Whole or Devour powers where it literally envelops and swallows it's prey whole! That would be cool. Obviously they'd be Very Large Creatures.

Those are my ideas. Cool Mayan inpsiration, P!

[Red_orbiT_]

You do know ressurection(true) is a fifth level spell right? Can you even afford that level of a mage guild? And then, even if you do have the necessary wisdom, you can't be sure that you'll get the spell anyway...

And Satyrs are NOT traditional.