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Yeah, yeah, I know, you're going to say that you've seen this type of thread before, it is spam, etc, but just read on and I'll try to make a good argument.
Unit killing is generally a detestable subject. It has left a sour taste since it started being exploited by various players, and there are those who defend it and those who fiercly attack it. Personally, I think there is a way that unit killing can stop being so incredibly annoying. These are the arguments of those who DO unit kill: 1. Demoralizes the enemy. It is not uncommon that the enemy will quit when he sees his prized units slaughtered. This is true, but a very stupid reason. Why? Well, firstly, this game doesn't have the largest community. The community is quite mature overall, but small, and annoying your fellow community members just leads to bad relationships and a bad community. Also, many will quit the game altogether. Many people's response is that we don't need these people. Let me open your eyes. WE DO. No, we don't need the 12 year olds, but we need the other gamers to strengthen our community, to grow larger and create a better environment for gaming. Less wait times, friendlier people, more encouragement for a second EndWar as well can all be accomplished if you don't unit kill. Yes, you may gain wins if people quit the game too, but this is a short term, and thus, flawed view on things. 2. Unit killing can make lives easier for your faction. True, but remember, this is just a game. There is no need to be so incredibly competitive. You just encourage more hostilities between factions, and all the negative effects above. Plus, having stronger enemies can mean that games become more of a challenge. When noobs finally rank up enough, buy enough upgrades and gain the experience they require, the touger opponents will not be such a shock for them if their games have been more challenging. Moreover, more challenging games are more fun. I like battling another commander with similarly high-ranked units, it makes for fantastically tense games. Furthermore, I can't play 100 matches every day. I have other games to play, places to go, people to see. Ranking up units is already hard as it is. How the game SHOULD be played: Moral Code: You will not kill your opponents units unless the opponent kills yours first. Units will always be lost accidentally, especially gunships, and you will shrug off the losses, perhaps offer a friendly apology to your opponent and continue with the game. Usually, if units are just killed by accident, then the game becomes much more friendly and as a result, you have a more closely bonded community. Unit killing just creates bad blood between people. No one wants to see the experienced units they worked hard to rank up disappear and be replaced by amateurs. I'm not saying that unit killing isn't needed. Units will always be lost and so this keeps the game fresh. You will always be trying to rank up your units, it's a goal that keeps your gaming experience fun. What I'm saying is that EndWar players should have standards. You should respect your opponent, give him a fair fight, and walk off happy. Even if you lose, you will have enjoyed the challenge. As things stand, the community is constantly scared of unit-killers, the unit killers themselves are bullies, people ask for truces between matches and generally, the environment is hostile. There is no good reason to emp+wmd units. There is no reason to kill downed units. If a unit gets killed in the crossfire, so be it, but this situation is just attrocious, and although I love playing every day, people are continuously trying to ruin my day. I believe I've written a compelling argument, if you want to disagree or agree, go ahead, but please don't spam this thread. I fight fast, hard and well. Do the same and you'll have my respect. |
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The game is played how people want to play.
In a normal RTS game you kill without mercy until there is nothing left but a rotten corpse. Why should Endwar be any different. You shouldn't get so attached to your units and if your a good player it shouldn't matter what rank your units are. http://www.hasthelargehadronco...oyedtheworldyet.com/
"it had run its course, gone off course, rolled down a cliff, hit a cow, and then exploded." |
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Truth is, it does matter what rank your units are when you're playing a similarly skilled commander. I agree, people should play how they want to play, but what I'm saying is that they shouldn't do it at the expense of others. And in other RTS games you don't lose units, you can just spawn more. Finally, it is a fact that many people are "attached" to their units, including me. No, I don't mind 2-4 of my units die in a match, but if my opponent purposely kills them, it just leaves a very sour taste, because you want to have this great battalion and people keep standing in the way of that. And you get sick and tired of playing unit killers because the matches just aren't enjoyable. You get mad and you're just not having fun. I fight fast, hard and well. Do the same and you'll have my respect. |
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This is ****ing stupid.
Do you want everyone to have a legendary battalion? What would be the point of having units level up and upgrade then, remember the glitch in the severs that caused units that were killed or rank up to not count? Remember how boring it was... Now I know that you said unit killing shouldn't be taken out entirely but there is not enough "accidents" to stop people from getting a legendary battalion. How then would the community grow? At least as it is now people can stand a chance since a lot of people have recruits, but if everyone had a good battalion and a new comer comes in with recruits is he really going to enjoy it? Its all ready a major complaint! You want to be able to get a good battalion easily, which is basically what your saying, but with the double ex weekends its all ready incredibly easy to get a good battalion. How much easier do you want it to be? I play about 20 games per week and I don't find it hard to keep my units up. I think you just need to get better at keeping your units alive. |
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And yet again, someone misses my point. I don't want a legendary battalion. I want a community with members that don't backstab each other all the time. And you can lose units really easily. And there are many with recruit battalions in all 3 factions that battle between themselves. Things aren't really that bad for the noobs. Yeah, the learning curve is steep, but it's not that steep. And if people come back if unit killing is reduced, then there will be even more noobs to battle against other noobs. And no, I don't remember how boring it was. I fight fast, hard and well. Do the same and you'll have my respect. |
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Awww diddums.
Unit killing IS and ALWAYS will be part of the game. Get used to it. http://www.hasthelargehadronco...oyedtheworldyet.com/
"it had run its course, gone off course, rolled down a cliff, hit a cow, and then exploded." |
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astalano is right,
we need a larger and friendlier community, the only way to acheive this is through ones own moral code. there are plenty of people on that know what makes people mad, they just don't care and it is creating hostility. i can win with or without my 3 star units, i just don't want some a hole killing them cuz he thinks he is tough on the other end of the controller, and usally if they start it, i end it. now, and now i know that guys name, and next time i will be out for him, hostility created. i've now gotten to the point where i try to be the bigger player and not kill even if killed. there are very few of us veteran players left, and if we want to have bad blood between veterans that is one thing, but don't beat up on noobs that you've never played before. last thing, this game may die a very slow death, but can we try to encourage a healthy community and see if we can't get some new players on board, the game is now available cheap used, so be nice to the noobs and maybe one day the can try to kick our butts. p.s. my record for units killed in one game is 18, so i know how to make the opponent mad, and yes, it was a long time ago and have stopped mi-behaving since, sorry to whoever you were  |
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i played a game in Tow with my secondary account (same faction) and i realized that without secondary attacks, upgrades and support upgrades, it's near impossible for a rookie to rank up units in TOW. especially if they only play a few games a week.it was brutal. 4-5 units lost a match, and during the weekdays, no rank ups. I needed to go to my main account just to get the feel of being competant again.so i understand this guys argument. if i were a new guy, i would have tossed this game. i think of it this way. it's better to have happy larger community of everyone with legendary battalions than a unhappy, small, paraniod community with everyone fearing for their units. Because with me, a relatively good commander, playing the game from week one with over 500 matches played, over 430 won, can't hack it as a rookie with no cash, i real rookie would be far worst. never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake-Victory belongs to the most persevering-Take time to deliberate, but when time for action has arrived,stop thinking and go in- One of the forefathers of the EF,Napoleon Bonaparte. |
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If I were in charge of the game I would of left unit killing just as it is now(well maybe throw the emp/wmd out the window for killing units), and make it so you get more XP per unit if you have more low ranking then high ranking units in your battalion, and/or upgrades purchased.
If you have say less then 5 units at hardened rank or above then all your units receive double xp, or if you have less then 25% upgrades purchased then you get the double xp. Just something along those lines would make it much easier for newer players to get up to the average. |
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yo b, that is a great idea, too bad no more support is available for the game. i love the weekends now, i can get my lost units back where they need to be, however, noobs don't have the ability to win every game like you and i, so they could use a little extra help.
now, if we could get everyone to agree to be nice to each other when they meet, then if they don't get along, let the stronger commander win, but at least give someone the benefit of the doubt out of the gates if ya don't know him. overall, if the xp points were a on a sliding scale for the rank of your battalion that would make it alot easier for the rank 6's to 10's, 11 and up should be good enough to do it own our own |
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lol
have fun with your little "agreement"....all 4 people of the endwar community that actually come to these boards won't kill each other.... why don't you all just skirmish over and over if you are that worried about it? or learn to play better..... i switch batallions constantly, and have no problems winning with recruits, makes the challenge more fun actually...who wants to sit around on the best faction all the time(jsf) with the best units all the time(legendary) and turtle and then secondary attack the hell outta whatever comes close every game??? doesn't sound like much of a challenge to me at all....and the challenge is what makes it fun! Everyone on here calling themselves veterans and very experienced....but yet Angry Toaster and B are the only two I have seen in my LIFE! and B plays on PS3!!!(i have 360).... so back on topic...stop your crying and practice practice practice.... try out all factions, different battalions and different strategies....then unit killing will not matter, you will have the experience and knowledge to know what to expect from your opponent and how to counter attack anything you see on the battlefield.....that is my advice...suck it up dude.... this game has been out like 9 months, the real decent people love it....the others wanna cry about unit killing...will it ever stop!?!?!?!  |
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casual guys will simply just leave the game. Is that what you want? A small community driving people away? I figure most vets know how to deal with unit killers, but what about the rookies, guys who just picked up the game? They play ten or so matches and they will never play again. So a potential long term player gone. Great right? just because you feel like a douche and want to kill his tanks. The vets aren't complaining on behalf of themselves, they are complaining on behalf of the new guys who play a few rounds in TOW, get frustrated at the jerks unit killing everything in sight and having no way to respond in kind. They probably don't even want to, they just want to rank up their units and play for fun. Or they struggle, work hard, get a few units ranked up and BAM, EMP+WMD. All lost. Or the nice WMD+airstrike combo, always a nice one. Sure you may be able to win with rookie units, good for you, nice stuff. But you're a experienced vet. What about the new guys? The guys we need to grow this small community? What defense do they have for that? Grow a tough hide maybe? A few may. Most will play other games. Sometimes, I think the reason Endwar failed is not because of Ubisoft...it's because of the people who play Endwar. never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake-Victory belongs to the most persevering-Take time to deliberate, but when time for action has arrived,stop thinking and go in- One of the forefathers of the EF,Napoleon Bonaparte. |
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Ahh it's nice to see we can still get a semblance of a heated debate going still.
That is a big part of the problem with endwars chances, and it wasn't helped by the fact there was close to nil pushing of the game on behalf of ubisoft. Along with the basic facts that this is a un popular genre on consoles and it was made by a inexperienced studio. Ubisoft launched the game with failing chances. Set it up to be new comer unfriendly, then the poor community sealed it's fate by not trying to overcoming that flaw. And probably hurt the chances of all RTSs on the console for a long while. |
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yup, i barely knew this game was around until i was looking for games to rent last november. glad i found it then, but for those who find it now they have too many good players to contend with right away. add unit killing some poor noobs battalion to death and he'll trade this thing in faster than whore sweats in church.
too bad it was what seems to be a failed attempt at a constructive community to build a big enough following to support this game and new releases of the same genre. you may be right b, there probably wont be a ton of rts for the consoles if this bs goes on. and that my friends is the biggest bs part of it all |
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Yeah the people who just picked up the game will defiantly continue playing if they have to compete against legendary battalions with their recruit ones... That will be fun not know how to play the game and having the combat chain reversed on you. That will keep them in the game.
I never hear complaints from new comers who are tired of having units killed as its usually because they come across the people with straight legendary's and they don't have a chance in hell. Really, how are new comers going to enjoy the game if they can't even down a unit |
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If you have a good strategy, you can do pretty well and very few people have full legendary battallions, even if their units don't get killed on purpose. But having a bully kill your units and you can't do **** about it because your units aren't good enough to retaliate will just **** you off enough to quit. You'll think of that person as a representative of his community and just quit and go back to playing CoD4. I fight fast, hard and well. Do the same and you'll have my respect. |
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As a new player (had the game about 2 weeks), I have to agree. Unit killing would will always happen but the problem lies when people who vastly outclass you anyway still see the need to deliberatley unit kill. This has got me so frustrated I've got to the point where I find myself throwing abuse at the guy I'm playing - something I've never done before in my 5+ years of online gaming.
To those who are saying that people can still win with vastly outclassed units - well I would love to know how. I've had it pleanty of times where my rookie gunboat cannot beat a veteran tank etc - and then if it does It gets unit killed in retalation anyway. Now I will put my hand up and admit that I'm not the worlds most strategic thinker, I think that at lest 70% of the time I am outclassed, not outfought. It is a shame that ubi have pulled support for the game already. I should have worked out before I bought it that the support would be naf as ubi always done a poor job (rainbow six 3 anyone?). Heres what I think should be done though;
As I said, shame none of this will happen, but we can live in hope! I'm going to stick with the game a little while longer but I'm getting to the point where I'm finding it too frustrating and not really enjoying it any more. If anyone would lkie to game with me, I'm on the 360 as Europe - my tag is prod81 |
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face it, new comers are going to lose regardless. like i said, vets know how to kep their units alive whether by destroying uplinks or evacacing in yellow or by shield regeneration,forceful retaliation, but the vets will have very experienced units regardless. so new guys will lose, that's a given. if a new guy can't win and he quits, ok, what more can you do? toss games?No. But if a new guy can't win AND is having his battalion brutally destroyed,and quits, well, that we as a community can do something about.We can stop unit killing on purpose. I think new guys might be a little frustrated that they cannot win as often as they would like starting off in TOW, but they must be that much more if they cannot win in TOW and people are deliberately killing off all of their units that they are working so hard to rank up. I know i know, people shouldn't grow attached to their units. but people do,and if that's what keeps them playing the game, i say so be it, and show them respect. Dont go saying you're unit killing to help the new gys win, because all you're doing is driving them away. you're unit killing to try to feel superior to your opponent, either to sour their victory or rub salt into the wound of their defeat. never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake-Victory belongs to the most persevering-Take time to deliberate, but when time for action has arrived,stop thinking and go in- One of the forefathers of the EF,Napoleon Bonaparte. |
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but see this thread wasn't started by someone 'brand new to the game'....
it was started by someone claiming that they are a veteran but just got their battalion reset and had to come on here and whine a little..... I ALWAYS check gamerscore on my opponent...and if it is under 300 i NEVER unit kill....i figure after the 300 mark they will have decent units and a decent amount of experience...from then on out its basically kill or be killed...cause thats normally what happens... |
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I didn't make this thread because my units get killed. I made it because our community is pathetic and hostile, and newcomers are constantly drawn away from EndWar. I'm sick of people asking before games to not kill units. I'm sick of some high-ranking bully killing off mine because he feels superior. And I am sick of playing games where unit killing makes the game a chore to keep playing. I just want an agreement between the members of the community to respect their comrades, which will make for more fun games and slowly save what little of a community we have left. I fight fast, hard and well. Do the same and you'll have my respect. |
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