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Forums Prince of Persia Prince of Persia - General Discussion DRM in prince of persia (2008)
Forums Prince of Persia Prince of Persia - General Discussion DRM in prince of persia (2008)|
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3 Ubi games spring to mind that I couldn't run for for the DRM, and I'm sure I won't be risking a PC purchase again.
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Just to clarify, I have not pirated a game in over 20 years, and I will never pirate a game regardless of its DRM status. I simply would have gone without, or purchased a console version secondhand. I believe in the rule of law, and that people should pay if they play. I admire the work of game devs and their hard work and creativity deserves financial reward IMO. Ordinarily, I would not purchase secondhand but it is the only legal option open to me if I want to play without financially rewarding DRM-using game publishers. It actually upsets me to feel forced to boycott games over this issue: I've had to cancel pre-orders over it for games I'd been salivating over for a couple of years. I really want to financially support game devs that make such amazing titles, but I know that if I do not vote with my wallet, game publishers seem unwilling to take my concerns seriously. I do know of many formerly legitimate customers who have been so incensed by DRM that they feel no compunction about pirating in response. And I can tell you from a community POV, that the number of gamers paying attention to the issue is increasing incrementally with every new afflicted release. I only mention this because I wanted to make the point that many of the DRM protesters really are, or were, legitimate paying customers. And absent the DRM, I believe they would be so again. It is my opinion that some game publishers are kidding themseleves if they think excessive DRM is a solution to piracy. From what I have seen, there are many former customers of EA that are so angry about the new SecuROM/restrictions that they are either boycotting (like me), or have decided that joining the pirates is somehow justified in retaliation (I do not agree with their thinking but it is undeniably happening). And the pirates themselves just remove the DRM and distribute it DRM-free anyway...so how does it reduce piracy by those people? At best you might get a few days delay, nothing more. I posted my Amazon order number as 'proof' I already had purchased POP, and as evidence that your decision really will attract back customers who would absolutely never have purchased it had it been bundled with SecuROM. I've also made sure to place a positive headline about your enlightened decision on our website, and have posted the information on Amazon to assure DRM-aware customers there that this title is safe to purchase. I feel it is just as important to speak up when game publishers do right, as when they do wrong (IMO). I intend to do whatever I can to ensure that Ubisoft gets credit for this with POP. I cannot promise you that it will reduce piracy, or that I can drive dozens of sales by myself. But collectively, we can spread positive word of mouth for a change, and vote with our wallets. I'm speculating that this is an experiment by Ubisoft: comparing DRM-encumbered piracy rates for Far Cry 2 versus piracy rates for DRM-free POP. If the piracy rates are similar enough that the cost of DRM licensing fees, server maintenance, customer support, and legal libailities exceed the supposed benefits of the DRM then maybe you'll re-evaluate the whole DRM strategy as a publisher. If that's so then I think it's a smart experiment and shows commendable fiduciary responsibility to your shareholders. I really look forward to the day when this whole contentious issue is done with and we can just be excited by the work you guys do again  (sorry for the lengthy post, and I'd gladly buy you a beer too if ever we meet ) |
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If you have never pirated a game in over twenty years then I'm even more impressed and I respect you further. I'll still happily by you that drink if you're ever in Montreal
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Talking about Far Cry 2... I would never have bought it, because of its DRM. I got it as a birthday present and I was too curious to return it. You know, I really felt ashamed that I kept it. It didn't feel right, because FC2's DRM system treats people as criminals on parole.
Systems like that punish the wrong people. Customers should be respected and if the games industry loses money because of piracy then I think that industry should invest that money to fight piracy. That's a better way to protect your intellectual property. The sites that offer illegal copies aren't owned by people with an ideological goal. You'll see ads on those sites. Some offer subscriptions to offer faster downloads or "premium content". You'll never know what the software you download is infected with. They often switch the intrusive DRM for worms phishing for data. We are talking about organized crime here. Let's say that the cost to add DRM to a title is about $ 200K. Multiply that with the number of games you release in a year. Do the same with the EA titles and those of other big companies. Use it to collectively fund the fight against piracy. Fight back. Work with law enforcement to try to close those sites down. What I see now is that you fight the wrong people. You fight the customers. And I don't like it to be treated like a criminal with intrusive rootkit-like DRM. If the games industry is continuing their aggressive DRM policies then sooner or later the PC games industry will kill itself. Gamers will stop buying PC games. I am not sure that companies like nVidia, ATi, Intel, Microsoft, Creative, etc., like this trend. It's their industry too and it feeds a lot of mouths. I wonder what happens next if the games industry is not acting soon. |
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@Razz - Aloha!
I want to inform you that I have not purchased an Ubi title since SH3 and its DRM fiasco. I was also banned from UBI forums for asking about the DRM and was in heated arguments on the SubSim forums over it as well as a couple others and subsequently quietly left the SH community and stopped making mods for it and trying to developing the community. With that said I have also been boycotting EA and to a lessor degree AB for the past few years as well as promoting the boycotting everywhere and anywhere I had a voice. To say I hate DRM with a passion would be an understatement of epic proportions. I had a $700 DVDR drive bricked as a result of it and two other cheaper $300 drives to boot! This of course does not even consider the system side issues but I digress... Anyway, the point of this post is to inform you that even though I have zero interest in PoP I will be ordering a copy to support this move by your company. I always put my money where my mouth is and I'm willing to support any publisher that will do away with this DRM madness. Note: I reregistered on these forums to make this post for you. |
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You can accept my challenge too. Or comparing DDRM game sales with a NO DRM sales will hurt so much if POP beats bad Farcry 2? |
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I never had ANY problems with DRM games. I bought Bioshock, Assassin's Creed, Spore, Far Cry 2, GTA 4 and countless others. I always intended to buy PoP DRM and I never asked myself if it was going to include DRM or not. Seeing that Ubi decided not to put any in the game, I salute this move. IMO this is the way to go for developers: aggressive pricing (29.99$ here in Montreal) and no DRM to be sure not to repulse any potential buyers. Bravo Ubisoft as I am sure that the sales are going to go up. What is stupid is the limited number of installation, now that is a bonehead move.
Also razz, I have yet to buy the game, but are we able to remap the controls the way we want? For example, if I want to use right mouse button to move forward, can I? I ask this because a lot of games recently don't allow you to do so (GTA 4, TR underworld, Dead Space...) so it's an important feature for me. |
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It's true But I can't say I've never pirated a game because back when I was in high school I did have copies of some games for the Apple IIe computers that I never paid for (given to me by friends). So I'm not altogether innocent. If you're ever in Western Washington State, look me up and I'll show you my computers and the original copies of every game on them |
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I think you'll find that many people will be buying this game just because of the no DRM stance for this release. I've never played a PoP game before, but if the gameplay trailers look awesome I'll be buying this ASAP just to support the decision. Once a patch for FC2 is released that nukes the activation requirement and removes the SecuROM installation, I'll be buying that one too. |
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I've never pirated a game, at all. Being in my mid 40s, I think you'll agree that's worthy of note at least. That being said, I'll be buying a copy of PoP for myself (and possibly one or two others, as it looks like a game that's right up my nephews' respective alleys). I recognize a few names from other game forums (Spartan, sblade, CDolphin) and as far as my experience goes, you can take them all at their word. As far as beer goes: if you're ever in B.C., I'll certainly be up for buying you a couple brews as well. |
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This is one of the best posts I've read in a while regarding DRM. I hold the same viewpoint and could never have said it better. |
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Are you referring to the retail version? Is it using activation? |
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I'm talking in general, not for this game because it doesn't require activation nor have limited install.
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I'd like to point out the Ubisoft doesn't get any of the money when you purchase something second hand. It's better then pirating I guess.  |
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Kudos guys, I just bought it.
I haven't played a platformer since the original Tomb Raider (unless you count ICO =). To me it's always been a genre of games that I like to play at a friend's but when I stood in front of rows and rows of games at the shop (or pages and pages of results at amazon) I always bought something different. I heard it's easy which is probably a good thing for somebody as rusty as me at these kinds of games =P |
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That's actually what he was implying.
Perhaps you were just emphasizing what he already said.
Nothing against you, but it's obviously better than pirating. Money flows in that circumstance, with 'piracy', it doesn't. If someone buys a used comic book, book or other creative work, most people are just fine with that. There isn't the developing stigma that doing so is somehow "wrong". Buying games secondhand is fine, completely legal and is within everyone's right to do so. That said, there is definitely something satisfying by purchasing a game from a developer/publisher firsthand and knowing that a part of the sale is helping fund future games. |
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Uh, I you're kind of misinterpreting the DRM argument, or at least characterizing it extremely inaccurately. The actual main argument is- "DRM doesn't stop pirates (at most delaying them one week), thus the only people affected by DRM are legitimate customers. Thus, if a company uses DRM, they don't are about their customers." THAT is the main argument. The secondary arguments are. "Since DRM doesn't prevent piracy, using DRM only costs the dev money in implementing it and troubleshooting problems caused by the DRM" and "Legitimate customers have no way of knowing whether DRMed games will actually work on their system, so they pirate to test them" or "With Securom activations, you're renting, not buying. Anytime the companies want to shut down the activations, they can, and legitimate customers are out their money with no recourse except piracy." and of course the Spore angle which is "John Riccitiello is a goddamn idiot, and we'll make Spore the #1 pirated game just to show we can, no matter how much draconian DRM EA puts in." |
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Ok from what I've understood theres no DRM but is there an online verification? Or can we install it out of the box with no internet required? If so I hope its the same for HAWX.
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This is awesome news. Although this is not what I would consider an official annoucement I have just purchased PoP on Amazon.com because of this news.
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I'm still waiting for my copy to arrive from Play.com. I ordered the version that gives you an alternative skin to use in the game. Can't wait to see what it looks like.
@CDolphin, sblade etc., this is StormHammer from the Bioware forums, btw. Glad to see you posting your support here. And for UbiSoft, if you continue a no DRM (or non-intrusive DRM) policy, I'll be back as a customer permanently. At the moment, though, I'm judging every game on its own merits. If it comes with SecuROM 7.xx, it's an instant NO SALE due to the problems I've had with that particular copy protection. SafeDisc or TAGES with a disk check and even a CD-key would be acceptable to me - although as others have indicated it achieves little to curb piracy. Now, if you'll just release a special edition of Far Cry 2 without the SecuROM (or even a new installer that will leave SecuROM on the original disk and not install it to the hard drive), I can get to buy and play that game as well... And just as a matter of interest, I'm 41 and haven't pirated any games over the past 25 years of PC gaming. My stance against SecuROM is purely due to the issues I've experienced with it on my PC, and I don't agree with limited installs etc., because I feel it artificially reduces the longevity of a game. |
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ubi.com Forums Prince of Persia Prince of Persia - General Discussion DRM in prince of persia (2008)
Forums Prince of Persia Prince of Persia - General Discussion DRM in prince of persia (2008)