Stupid Union Does Something Stupid and Racist

Basically, they are sueing the school board because a lower percentage of black students are graduating on time versus white students. So the message they are sending is: "schools have to pass students even if they are failing their classes based on their race or else you will get sued."

No, not racist at all... Black students must be passed regardless of their performance in schools, but white students need to earn it. Well, of course Asian students need to earn it too even though we are minorities also, but who cares about those silly slant-eyes??? psshhhhh...

Does anyone else here think the ACLU needs to be disbanded and have all of their leadership dragged out into the street and shot? I sure do...

Oh my God. The ACLU is at it again! This pisses me off to no end.

More rightwing nutjob spin:

quote:

But the superintendent, who met with ACLU leaders a year ago about the issue, has suggested that the civil rights organization instead take aim at state legislators for insufficient classroom funding.

Unfortunately if you actually research the facts, funding for education has gone up, not down like the media likes to report... Oh well...

Not to mention, I don't see how lack of funding will only affect one race and not the others. Wouldn't it cause a general decline in passing rates evenly among all the groups? Meaning the percentage difference between the races would stay the same? So no matter what, this is a moot point... Unless you're suggesting that if we get funding, it should all be spent to help only one race succeed while ignoring white students?

But if you're a fan of the ACLU, that isn't a far fetched idea, lol. Affirmative action my ass. I'm a minority, I passed my classes, got accepted to colleges, and got scholarships all because of my merit, not my race, thanks, I don't need crutches because I'm not a moron. I think no matter what race you are, if you don't take your schooling seriously and you don't pass highschool or don't qualify for scholarships based on your merit, then boo-freakin-hoo, too bad, so sad, go collect my garbage because you're too much of a moron do be trusted with anything else.

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Originally posted by Demon_Mustang:
Not to mention, I don't see how lack of funding will only affect one race and not the others. Wouldn't it cause a general decline in passing rates evenly among all the groups?

That's pretty much what the ACLU is claiming. They also claim a disparity along racial lines, but the primary claim revolves around the district as a whole.

As for "funding for education going up", much of the increase is tied to specific programs. How the remaining funds are allocated to individual schools within the district would also affect the quality of education available to particular groups within the district. Unequal allocation of funds in Palm County isn't recent news.

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I'm a minority, I passed my classes, got accepted to colleges, and got scholarships all because of my merit, not my race

So? The real story is that some people aren't given the same opportunities as others. That many don't make good use of those opportunities is a separate topic.

Oh please, a funding problem will affect everyone of all races equally. And I was in a school with all races and the teachers and the opportunities open to us was equal to everyone. The classrooms had people of all races in it at the same time, you are saying the teachers are somehow communicating their ideas to white kids while magically keeping black kids in a bubble so they don't hear the same information? LOL

Get off this blame shifting, organizations like the ACLU find it so easy to blame a system or a group since you can change things at that level but they know they can't convince each individual student to behave differently, so they won't even bother trying. They never want the individual to take responsibility for his/her own actions, it's always someone else's fault. I think this is a result of projection, because most likely the members of these organizations are like that themselves. Whenever something doesn't go the way they want, it's someone else's fault. If he/she is speeding and loses control of the car and crash, it's because the road wasn't paved right, or the automaker didn't make the car safe enough, it's everything except for the fact that he/she was driving too fast. She burns herself with her coffee, and it's the fault of the restaurant for not making it clear that coffee is hot, even though common sense is that you order hot coffee, you're going to get it hot! And it's everyone's fault except for her's for being clumsy and spilling it on herself. He breaks into someone's home, and in the dark, he trips and lands on his arm, breaking it. It's the fault of the homeowner for not making his house robber-safe. It's the fault of society for not going out of their way to make him comfortable without any effort from him. It's everyone's fault except for his own fault for being an idiot and doing something illegal at his own risk.

We all have choices, if you CHOOSE to not try and fail a class, it's your fault, you're stuck in school, too bad. If you CHOOSE to try to solve your financial hardship by committing crime, it's your fault, you're going to jail, too bad. If you CHOOSE to drive like an idiot and end up in a canal and you can't swim, well, you're dead, too bad...

quote:

Originally posted by Demon_Mustang:
Oh please, a funding problem will affect everyone of all races equally. And I was in a school with all races and the teachers and the opportunities open to us was equal to everyone. The classrooms had people of all races in it at the same time, you are saying the teachers are somehow communicating their ideas to white kids while magically keeping black kids in a bubble so they don't hear the same information? LOL

If you'd bothered to read the second link you'd notice that the schools in that district are effectively segregated. Allocating funds to one school but not another is an effective way of depriving specific groups. Now, it's not just funding - turnover of teachers in some schools is also a problem. One that should have been addressed by the district.

But hey, let's not let facts get in the way of another rant about how *you* took advantage of the opportunities available to you. Opportunities that aren't available in the first place to many.

Um, yah, unfortunately I rely on personal experience since I've experienced it all. I've been to private schools, public schools, poor neighborhood schools, rich neighborhood schools, lived in middle-upper class neighborhoods, lived in poor neighborhoods, etc. etc. There's pretty little you can teach me about the different socioeconomic state I'm living in. The whole "segregation" you're talking to is the result of school zoning. The majority of the population of the highschool I went to was black. And yes, compared to the schools I've been to that had more white students, the school was in much worse condition.

Now was this some grand conspiracy scheme by the evil government to keep the black man down? I don't think so. The reason I say this is that for a while, our school got a lot of extra funding, and most of that went into fixing all of the broken **** that the STUDENTS broke. And I'm talking about big holes in the walls because apparently randomly breaking holes in the wall in the school you attend was a cool thing for these morons. Repainting the walls since there was graffiti everywhere. Replacing broken desks and chairs since the kids were throwing them around and breaking them on purpose, etc. etc.

The funny thing is, literally the day after they would patch up a hole in the wall, someone would break it again. And same goes for everything else. So all of the money they just spent on fixing everything up didn't last a day. So whose fault is it for the deplorable conditions of the school? Again, the INDIVIDUAL students who took it upon themselves to destroy school property because they can't succeed there scholastically, might as well succeed in destroying things right?

And any effort to buy more lab equipment or other teaching aide almost always led to those items being stolen or broken within the week.

In the middle-upper class suburban neighborhood schools I've been to, the condition of the school is always clean and pristine because you don't have idiot kids breaking holes in the wall, throwing desks out the window, or painting their wannabe gang signs on every wall. So I guess funding that goes there won't go to waste, it would probably go to buying more lab equipment, which won't get stolen like they do in the other school, or paying for more field trips, that won't result in public embarrassment when the students make a fool of themselves and commit crimes while we are guests to another facility during a field trip like would almost always happen in the other school. Again, all of this result in less equipment, fewer field trips, and more deplorable conditions, and whose fault is it all? That's right, the man's... oh wait, not it's not, it's the individual students that ruin it all for all of us.

Hell, even our dances almost always ended in a riot...

And about turnover rates among teachers? When you have kids that throw desks at you when you tell them to stop talking (or stop smoking weed in the classroom), I think you might consider going to a better school. Which just leaves us with teachers who either have a mission to help poor kids or teachers who have no other choice because they can't get hired at the better schools. And again, whose fault is it that the school is considered a "bad" school? Oh right, the individual students that don't get good grades... I see a pattern here.

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Originally posted by Demon_Mustang:
And again, whose fault is it that the school is considered a "bad" school? Oh right, the individual students that don't get good grades... I see a pattern here.

Yep, I see you once again taking your personal experience and extrapolating it to apply to everyone else.

What's that phrase again? "Three strikes and you're out"? Well, you've had three chances to respond with facts rather than spin your personal "story". I'm sure someone is interested in your tales of woe again, but I'm out.

Oh no, the conspiracy brother is out. Oh, pity us...

"The man is keeping us down!" lmao

And your so-called "facts" is a one-paragraph "study" that makes a pretty simple statement without even citing its sources. It looks more like a memo than anything else, which dozens of those are circulated through the DOE website... So hey, if I got "three strikes" to your standards, that's actually a compliment. Frankly, I wouldn't want your approval anyhow, that would almost be a statement of how wrong I would be...

Right on, Demon! I love how these left-wing moonbats cite statistics from some random web-site, that shows no sources for its conclusions...and insist that they are intellectually superior and have "the facts".

I grew up in similar circumstances as you did, with Junior High being the phase in which I lived in the "projects" and went to the schools being "deliberately underfunded by 'the man' just to keep us po' folk down". Yet, I still consistently scored WELL above my grade level in every subject on those standardized tests. So did the Asian kids (VietNamese in that area). Yet the other kids seemed to have the deck stacked against them somehow, even though we all lived in the same financial conditions at home, went to the same school, had the same teachers, read from the same books. My last two years in High School, my family was financially better off, so I was at a better-funded, mostly-white school. Yet, there were STILL multitudes of nimrods that could BARELY read at a 3rd grade level, and knew jack **** about math, science, or history...white, upper-middle-class kids no less. The bottom line is, what you get out of your education is a personal choice, its all about your attitude. Left-wingers seem to think that ANY problem can be fixed by throwing more money at it, and it has historically been proven to be untrue.

Oh...I hope he gives ME his approval. I have always wanted the approval of someone who claims to be one of those "critical thinkers", all while mindlessly spewing contradictory non-sense.

Hey, hey, don't you doubt conspiracy brother, we all know that everything is planned and executed by "the man."

If you are too stupid to graduate highschool, blame it on "the man." If you're too uneducated to get a good job, blame it on "the man." If you're too stupid to know how to make money legally, blame it on "the man." If that doesn't work, blame it on society. Just remember, it's everyone's fault except your own. Taking personal responsibility for your own actions is so lame...

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Taking personal responsibility for your own actions is so lame...

I know!!! What the hell have we been smoking, anyway, Demon?!!

"What the hell do you smoke this **** for anyway? To escape from reality? Me?! I don't need this ****. I AM reality."

Oh...and I want to sit on my ass and be guaranteed a good, living wage. I want free medical care too. I want...I want.


America? The free-market economy? Competition? Its not for everybody. Those who cannot handle these things are encouraged to seek life elsewhere. I will even do my civic duty of helping you pack your bags.

Freedom? Independence? What's that? Where's my free health care?

quote:

Originally posted by Demon_Mustang:
Hey, hey, don't you doubt conspiracy brother, we all know that everything is planned and executed by "the man."

If you are too stupid to graduate highschool, blame it on "the man." If you're too uneducated to get a good job, blame it on "the man." If you're too stupid to know how to make money legally, blame it on "the man." If that doesn't work, blame it on society. Just remember, it's everyone's fault except your own. Taking personal responsibility for your own actions is so lame...

It's sad how right he is...

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Originally posted by IguanaKing:
Right on, Demon! I love how these left-wing moonbats cite statistics from some random web-site, that shows no sources for its conclusions...and insist that they are intellectually superior and have "the facts".

I originally had a more sarcastic response, but instead I'll point out two things:

1) Demon posted his own anecdotal experiences with no supporting evidence whatsoever.

2) From the about page of eric.gov

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ERIC - the Education Resources Information Center - is an online digital library of education research and information. ERIC is sponsored by the Institute of Education Sciences (IES) of the U.S. Department of Education.

and from their Journal selection page

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The policy mandates a single standard - direct relevance to education. Journals meeting the standard must also meet a set of criteria focused on quality, sponsorship and editorial/peer-review process.

Despite this, I'm sure you'll continue ranting on about "left wing moon-bats". Rather than continue wasting time trying to persuade the rest of you that it's not a black and white world, I'll just wish you a nice day

So what is more reliable and more reasonable to affect your opinion of something? Personal experience or just something you've read online? So while "anecdotal evidence" might be based on personal experience, the only downside of that is because it is not a conclusion based on a controlled testing, but at least it's based on something. I've been to two separate schools considered "bad" schools and 3 schools considered "good" schools, and have made up my mind based on my observations on the way the individuals in those schools affected the way these schools are judged, while you're basing your entire argument over a one-page memo you saw online.

Hm, not exactly objective scientific evidence there either. But hey, if you think you're so smart that you can throw money at a school and expect that to magically make certain race groups to take education more seriously, then hey, anything is possible right?

Edit:
BTW, I see how tremendously impressed at yourself for that wonderful piece of research totaling a confounding 1 page, I have access to thousands of scientific journals, all of which far too long to be quoting here, through the local university. But there's not a single one that can conclusively prove that providing more funding to a school can get individuals who previously had no interest in learning or getting an education to magically change their minds. No matter what race you are, if you think you're a "rebel" or you think you're part of a "gang" where being educated is frowned upon, do you think having a school with a shinier paint job will result in you to all of a sudden decide to change your ways and actually pay attention in class? Is that what made you pay attention in class? How come I was a member of two (middle then high) of these so-called "under-funded" schools that were poorly maintained, yet I got great grades in all of my classes destroyed the SAT exam, got more scholarships than I needed (no race based scholarships, BTW, all merit based) which resulted in college to be not only free but pay me while I was there, and so did a great number of friends that also went to those same schools? Under your hypothesis, based on a one-page study/scientific journal/memo/sticky note, wouldn't that make it impossible for me to succeed since the state did not provide my school with adequate funding? I mean, am I superman's love-child and I don't know it or something? If you are really saying that I'm genetically a genius from birth, able to overcome these grand obstacles that stand before me, then hey, you know what, we don't need to argue anymore, I completely 100% accept your reality and thank you for the great compliment.

quote:

Originally posted by thegrommit:


Despite this, I'm sure you'll continue ranting on about "left wing moon-bats". Rather than continue wasting time trying to persuade the rest of you that it's not a black and white world, I'll just wish you a nice day

Well, that certainly is yet another contradictory statement from you. Its not a black and white world? Are you meaning that in a figurative sense, or are you applying that to race? Either way, you are contradicting everything else you said with that one statement. In a black and white world, everything is about race, lack of funding, poorly researched statistics that are not qualified, blah, blah, blah. It, in fact, is NOT a black and white world to me or anybody else who believes in personal responsibility. These problems cannot be fixed by simply throwing money at them.

But, then again, how the hell would you know? I'm betting that you have no personal experience to speak of in the area of going to an underfunded school. People who have never been there, ironically, always seem to think they know what's best for everyone else.

So, let's say that these schools are pressured by the threat of future lawsuits into graduating students "on-time". So, they just graduate them all, paying no attention to whether or not they have actually learned the material in their curriculum. Then, they get out into the real world (something you're not familiar with, apparently), and cannot hold employment because they graduated on time, but shouldn't have. Does the ACLU sue the schools again? I find it funny that they are basing this on some "Constitutional Amendment". I don't recall any Amendment that says the government is required to make every, individual student actually give a **** about their education.

All I have to say is

Maby dragged out and shot is a little harsh... but I do think that people need to get that the racial issues are not flunking students. I happen to have a class with the regulars community, and that one is more than I can stand and there are people from every walk of life in there. The ACLU or LULAC or whoever it is next needs to see that forcing kids of any color whether black, white, brown, purple, greeen, or orange will not improve this country, especially if they shouldn't have passed third grade.

Stupid people should be treated exactly as that, and give them a choice between citizenship or a cookie