No and no.

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Originally posted by jasiek.rolnik:

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they need to be left alone to make the game they're making not what we want them to make.

Quoted Quoted Of The Week.

this may seem likea dumb question but im really confused here
when is this wonderful game coming out

Probably around May 2008

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Originally posted by jasiek.rolnik:
Probably around May 2008

I would say late March/ early April with probability to another Delay

Any chance of more than TWO guns? I love the series, but I don't think adding a variety of weapons would detract from the spy nature of the game. If this sounds stupid, it's cause I didn't read all about it.

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Originally posted by WesJanson:
Any chance of more than TWO guns? I love the series, but I don't think adding a variety of weapons would detract from the spy nature of the game. If this sounds stupid, it's cause I didn't read all about it.

Well if Sam is now a fugitive (not a spy) I don't think it will matter either way.

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Originally posted by WesJanson:
Any chance of more than TWO guns? I love the series, but I don't think adding a variety of weapons would detract from the spy nature of the game. If this sounds stupid, it's cause I didn't read all about it.

The focus used to be on not using your guns, period (basing that on the fact that they take all your bullets away on the harder difficulties...). I don't see the sense in more guns if you're not going to use them.

If you want lots of weapons, play Ratchet & Clank.

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Originally posted by CoastalGirl:

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Originally posted by WesJanson:
Any chance of more than TWO guns? I love the series, but I don't think adding a variety of weapons would detract from the spy nature of the game. If this sounds stupid, it's cause I didn't read all about it.

The focus used to be on not using your guns, period (basing that on the fact that they take all your bullets away on the harder difficulties...). I don't see the sense in more guns if you're not going to use them.

If you want lots of weapons, play Ratchet & Clank.

Or just buy a ICBM.

I cant believe the delay on this....Im dying to play it..

Oh, I see!!! NOOOOObody replies on any other forum, but as soon as there's a chance to gang up on the new guy for his stupid question, you guys are first in line!!! Ok, sorry! In rebuttal, I'd say that while the guns do subtract points and all, if Sam is a hobo (as judged from the art), then I think he stands a much better chance of buying or stealing a 9 mil handgun than finding a high tech sticky shocker in a 7-11. Sold in six-packs next to the blue Slurpee machine, I suspect.

New release date is probalby going to be 01-09-2008

The offical release date is June 3, 2008

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Originally posted by cezzanino:
The offical release date is June 3, 2008

If you posted a link to back this up, I *might* believe you. Anyhow, my guess is November this year.

In chaos theory, which was the best of the series, there were more guns, there was a shotgun, and a sniper attachment. I loved the sniper attachment, the shotgun was a little overboard with it's impact force, but the sniper...

Oh how I hope you'll be able to buy, or achieve the sniper attachment to use at your discretion, not the mission's discretion.

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Originally posted by JediWithASniper:
In chaos theory, which was the best of the series, there were more guns, there was a shotgun, and a sniper attachment. I loved the sniper attachment, the shotgun was a little overboard with it's impact force, but the sniper...

Oh how I hope you'll be able to buy, or achieve the sniper attachment to use at your discretion, not the mission's discretion.

Those were attachments, not other guns. I have CT, and was always irritated by not being able to pick up the guns guards dropped. Also, in an unrelated peeve, I always thought it was stupid that Sam couldn't turn off the walkie talkies the guards carried. They made noise, after all. If your hiding a body, make sure it doesn't make noise.

I hope for a blowgun with poison darts. Or a garotte. Yeah...

First, a covert agent does not use unsuppressed fire unless there is no other alternative.

The attachments were not technically other guns, but in reality, that's exactly what they were, they gave you a third weapon, either a shotgun, or an advanced sniper rifle. Neither of the attachments fired the same ammo as the main gun, so it was very similar to the republic commando style where you only have one gun, but that one gun is actually an assault rifle, a sniper rifle, a shotgun, and a missile launcher if I remember correctly.

Again, for anyone who doesn't know this already, highly trained agents do not use weapons they find in the field unless they have no choice, too much risk, unreliable weaponry, and you bring the proper amount of ammo and weapons upon insertion.

We don't want another shooter here, we already have tons of those.

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Originally posted by JediWithASniper:
First, a covert agent does not use unsuppressed fire unless there is no other alternative.

A covert agent doesn't get himself in a situation where he'd even need to use weapons, in the first place.

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Originally posted by JediWithASniper:
Again, for anyone who doesn't know this already, highly trained agents do not use weapons they find in the field unless they have no choice, too much risk, unreliable weaponry, and you bring the proper amount of ammo and weapons upon insertion.

Neither do soldiers because of the same reasons but then again, if you have no other choice...would you rather surrender and ask the enemy "Hey, can't we discuss that?" before he might shoot you or would you try to get his weapon (not necessarily in order to use it, but to at least disarm him)?

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Originally posted by Vth_F_Smith_:

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Originally posted by JediWithASniper:
First, a covert agent does not use unsuppressed fire unless there is no other alternative.

A covert agent doesn't get himself in a situation where he'd even need to use weapons, in the first place. :wink2

Do we have any evidence in favour of this? To me SC1 always seemed a tad more realistic than CT. Not in terms of lighting, but you could not just sneak up to enemies one by one and knock them out. In Splinter Cell sneaking up on someone was a gamble, as they might unexpectedly turn around like people do in real life. There were moments in SC where your gun was the best course of action, while still remaining stealthy. Example, Georgian Defense Ministry. You climb the lattice to the corridor with the elevators. You hide in the store room as the elevator descends, and use your optic cable to watch the two guards walk past. As soon as they are past, you silently step out, grab one, and while he is front of you protecting most of your body from potential gun fire, you take out your pistol and shoot the other in the back of the head. You then knock out the first and hide the bodies. Perhaps in a real life situation the agent might have used a less than lethal weapon, but I still see this as the most efficient way for an agent like Sam to silently take two (or more) guards out in this situation.

Staying completely unseen is much harder than portrayed in Chaos Theory and certain levels of the PC/360 version of Double Agent. I can't see real covert agent managing it without weapons, unless it was a quick snatch in and out of a restricted area. If you include infiltration and extraction, the margin for error is much too high.

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Neither do soldiers because of the same reasons but then again, if you have no other choice...would you rather surrender and ask the enemy "Hey, can't we discuss that?" before he might shoot you or would you try to get his weapon (not necessarily in order to use it, but to at least disarm him)?

Definitely agree on this one, but if you are in that close a proximity, then you should be able to not only disarm him, but place him in a state of unconsciousness, long before the decision to use his weapon against him. More likely is the idea of using his weapon to smash his face in, in order to knock him out.

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Do we have any evidence in favour of this? To me SC1 always seemed a tad more realistic than CT. Not in terms of lighting, but you could not just sneak up to enemies one by one and knock them out. In Splinter Cell sneaking up on someone was a gamble, as they might unexpectedly turn around like people do in real life. There were moments in SC where your gun was the best course of action, while still remaining stealthy. Example, Georgian Defense Ministry. You climb the lattice to the corridor with the elevators. You hide in the store room as the elevator descends, and use your optic cable to watch the two guards walk past. As soon as they are past, you silently step out, grab one, and while he is front of you protecting most of your body from potential gun fire, you take out your pistol and shoot the other in the back of the head. You then knock out the first and hide the bodies. Perhaps in a real life situation the agent might have used a less than lethal weapon, but I still see this as the most efficient way for an agent like Sam to silently take two (or more) guards out in this situation.

Well, I must agree with you on the difficulty of grabbing someone from behind as you illustrated, but I'm afraid that my opinion on the use of firearms differs slightly from yours.

Rather than see a full fledged combat system implemented, I would love to see them work a much more intricate array of stealth combat. For example, they have done very well to place the LT RT option when sneaking up on a guy, but as you said, there are many situations where you have 2 guys walking side by side, or in close proximity to each other, and in those situations, a simple LT RT move isn't gonna work, but at the same time, you can't have dead bodies, or you may blow your cover.

So what I would propose is a simple radius type solution, where if the guys are within... let's say a 10 ft. radius of each other, by using the controls properly, you can move into the more acrobatic types of attacks by simply locking on to both targets with a target lock system and then sneaking up on 1 of them and choosing your LT RT option. Now when I say acrobatic, I'm not talking about wolverine's revenge here, I simply mean Sam moves much faster, and dispatches them in multiple creative, yet realistic methods based off of his training.

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Staying completely unseen is much harder than portrayed in Chaos Theory and certain levels of the PC/360 version of Double Agent. I can't see real covert agent managing it without weapons, unless it was a quick snatch in and out of a restricted area. If you include infiltration and extraction, the margin for error is much too high.

I must agree with you here, while I do believe most missions you will be able to achieve pure invisibility, on others, you may have to use your weapon, I would love to see more missions where you only have your pistol, and no gadgets.

It would be nice if you could select your equipment for yourself, and depending on the weight, it affects your reflex abilities. I know for sure that his assault rifle weighs a good amount.