quote:

Originally posted by Dr__Cube:
You find and excuse or plot device, I don't care how ridiculous, to keep him going.

None of this would be neccesary if they didn't take the Hollywood approach Double Agent and Conviction, and instead opted for a traditional storyline instead. There could be at least 7 more games in the series before it starts to become ridiculous.

Continuing this soap opera episode of Sam's life with another cheap plot device? Bad. Ending the Sam Fisher saga and introducing a 'hip' new agent? Bad.

I still don't see how "developing" Sam's character was a good idea.

This makes sense! Now I understand why Sam acts the way he does: Ubisoft will KILL SAM FISHER! THAT is why he's angry. THAT is why he's projecting his anger onto poor terrorists. THAT is why he keeps killing everyone else, too. You think he's just going to lay down his RPG at the end and go, "I used to be a spy. Now I've just killed over a hundred people. I am Sam Fisher, and I'll feel a lot better tomorrow." No! He'll die a horrible DEATH! There is no way he'll live after running amok in the White House wearing submarine goggles and shooting people in the head pew pew pew! It is WRONG to think so. It's a government conspiracy; you don't just walk away from it even if you win! How do I know this? Because there will be a FOURTH Bourne movie! Sam is going down, HARD, and that's because Ubisoft is TIRED of Sam Fisher. They HATE Sam Fisher. They HATE his old beard. It's too GREY. They WANT young John Smithssonsson to take his place, and they will KILL SAM FISHER!

quote:

Originally posted by Chinese_Bookey:
This makes sense! Now I understand why Sam acts the way he does: Ubisoft will KILL SAM FISHER! THAT is why he's angry. THAT is why he's projecting his anger onto poor terrorists. THAT is why he keeps killing everyone else, too. You think he's just going to lay down his RPG at the end and go, "I used to be a spy. Now I've just killed over a hundred people. I am Sam Fisher, and I'll feel a lot better tomorrow." No! He'll die a horrible DEATH! There is no way he'll live after running amok in the White House wearing submarine goggles and shooting people in the head pew pew pew! It is WRONG to think so. It's a government conspiracy; you don't just walk away from it even if you win! How do I know this? Because there will be a FOURTH Bourne movie! Sam is going down, HARD, and that's because Ubisoft is TIRED of Sam Fisher. They HATE Sam Fisher. They HATE his old beard. It's too GREY. They WANT young John Smithssonsson to take his place, and they will KILL SAM FISHER!

/me flips you off

No, I think Ubi confirmed that Sam does not die at the end of Conviction.

I would really like to play as another character if it meant more proper Splinter Cell infiltration as operatives who have joined the team(s).

Of course Sam needs to be in the game, but playing as a new character could be a breath of fresh air, as long as we get to play as Sam again when he's called back into action during 2020 for WW III, which IMO is going to be the best Splinter Cell game as it can combine proper infiltration behind enemy lines to gain intelligence and it offers the opportunity for Sam to get trigger happy for all those action junkies that will hop on board for Conviction.

Obviously the new character needs to be younger than Sam, but only by about 10 years or so, so younger than 35 and we're losing track of ourselves. This new character could also be the co-op partner in the upcoming title or indeed be one of the two co-op people. He would need to be a solid character though and proper personality in his own right.

Raiden was uber ghey and MGS 2 suffered because of this.

On the note of Sam being a handler and taking the role of Lambert? I don't think so. It's no secret that he disdains politics and I can't see him in any other role than the world's stealthiest operative. His character would be wasted otherwise.

As for him training and instructing our new operative when he joins one of the Splinter Cells.

HELL YEAH!!

why kill off Sam?
its just gossip to get everyone's panties in a wad!
btw dont believe everything you read.

That certainly sounds plausible. It would follow Tom Clancy game tradition. After all, nobody lives forevor. Sam has already fought in four wars and prevented countless others. He needs to take a nap!

I wouldn't mind a break, but Sam should come back again.

I hope we can see in Conviction how Sam's character is changing. (Calm down, killing is not a solution)

quote:

Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:
No, I think Ubi confirmed that Sam does not die at the end of Conviction.

I would really like to play as another character if it meant more proper Splinter Cell infiltration as operatives who have joined the team(s).

Of course Sam needs to be in the game, but playing as a new character could be a breath of fresh air, as long as we get to play as Sam again when he's called back into action during 2020 for WW III, which IMO is going to be the best Splinter Cell game as it can combine proper infiltration behind enemy lines to gain intelligence and it offers the opportunity for Sam to get trigger happy for all those action junkies that will hop on board for Conviction.

Obviously the new character needs to be younger than Sam, but only by about 10 years or so, so younger than 35 and we're losing track of ourselves. This new character could also be the co-op partner in the upcoming title or indeed be one of the two co-op people. He would need to be a solid character though and proper personality in his own right.

Raiden was uber ghey and MGS 2 suffered because of this.

On the note of Sam being a handler and taking the role of Lambert? I don't think so. It's no secret that he disdains politics and I can't see him in any other role than the world's stealthiest operative. His character would be wasted otherwise.

As for him training and instructing our new operative when he joins one of the Splinter Cells.

HELL YEAH!!

Hmm... this doesn't sound half as bad when you say it. It may actually be workable and add an interesting new angle to the series. Just as long as the new guy is a likable character that has a similar view of things as Sam does, and not some trigger happy twenty something year old punk with an attitude, that would be a shame. But the way you explained it... I think I may actually like it.

quote:

Originally posted by QuikNsilnT:

quote:

Originally posted by Chinese_Bookey:
This makes sense! Now I understand why Sam acts the way he does: Ubisoft will KILL SAM FISHER! THAT is why he's angry. THAT is why he's projecting his anger onto poor terrorists. THAT is why he keeps killing everyone else, too. You think he's just going to lay down his RPG at the end and go, "I used to be a spy. Now I've just killed over a hundred people. I am Sam Fisher, and I'll feel a lot better tomorrow." No! He'll die a horrible DEATH! There is no way he'll live after running amok in the White House wearing submarine goggles and shooting people in the head pew pew pew! It is WRONG to think so. It's a government conspiracy; you don't just walk away from it even if you win! How do I know this? Because there will be a FOURTH Bourne movie! Sam is going down, HARD, and that's because Ubisoft is TIRED of Sam Fisher. They HATE Sam Fisher. They HATE his old beard. It's too GREY. They WANT young John Smithssonsson to take his place, and they will KILL SAM FISHER!

/me flips you off

You just hate me 'cause you ain't me. Leave me alone, has-been!

quote:

Originally posted by QuikNsilnT:
why kill off Sam?
its just gossip to get everyone's panties in a wad!
btw dont believe everything you read.

Well, Ubisoft seems to think that its franchises are successful through name recognition alone, so they keep changing characters (R6,GR). I wouldn't put it past them to think the same of Splinter Cell, even though that would be a huge mistke (remember how Halo 2 split the missions between Master Chief and the Arbiter...yeah that worked out).

BTW, I always buy my panties pre-wadded, thank you very much!

quote:

Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:

...

On the note of Sam being a handler and taking the role of Lambert? I don't think so. It's no secret that he disdains politics and I can't see him in any other role than the world's stealthiest operative. His character would be wasted otherwise.

...

I find myself agreeing with you on almost all your ideas, Shadow.

The part about Sam taking over Lambert's role reminds me of Kirk in the Star Trek series / movies. He loved being the captain of a ship going out doing stuff. He didn't care too much about politics (although he was willing to deal with it) and was unhappy as an admiral. When he was demoted back to captain, he was thrilled.

quote:

Originally posted by OniLinkSword:
I find myself agreeing with you on almost all your ideas, Shadow.

Call the doctor! I'm pretty sure he can give you a prescription for that!

quote:

The part about Sam taking over Lambert's role reminds me of Kirk in the Star Trek series / movies. He loved being the captain of a ship going out doing stuff. He didn't care too much about politics (although he was willing to deal with it) and was unhappy as an admiral. When he was demoted back to captain, he was thrilled.

Exactly. There are those characters that we love because they are born "do-ers" and have a no nonsense approach to their work.

It's that sort of approach that really does not lend itself well to a life interwoven with politics and bureaucracy, as they tend to be entirely about nonsense and B/Sing and very little doing.

If Sam is not in the next series of games or at least does not come back as a field agent, what I would like to see is the ability for the main character to be one you could make yourself. Design him from different ethnic backgrounds, name him or her yourself, create an age group and height and look and so on and then be able to download that same person into future games. I know you could do that with some of the older Armored Core games with your mech so why not the same with a Splinter Cell?

quote:

Originally posted by I_am_a_SC:
If Sam is not in the next series of games or at least does not come back as a field agent, what I would like to see is the ability for the main character to be one you could make yourself. Design him from different ethnic backgrounds, name him or her yourself, create an age group and height and look and so on and then be able to download that same person into future games. I know you could do that with some of the older Armored Core games with your mech so why not the same with a Splinter Cell?

That would be nice for the games Sam is not in. If Sam comes back in any other game, the storyline set for Sam would not quite go with the storyline set for random character A. Just a thought.

quote:

The part about Sam taking over Lambert's role reminds me of Kirk in the Star Trek series / movies. He loved being the captain of a ship going out doing stuff. He didn't care too much about politics (although he was willing to deal with it) and was unhappy as an admiral. When he was demoted back to captain, he was thrilled.

The post that Lambert has is very political. He has to deal with figures like the NSA director himself who is usually a 4 star General. That and dealing with Joint Chiefs and whatnot... That and the fact that it requires not dealing with ONE SC but with various SCs... knowing about technology, politics and others also helps. I don't think Sam would take a job that requires that.

On EndWar Grim takes Lambert's post, and I can't think of a better person than her since she's seen Lambert working in this field from up-close, she knows the details of the job inside-out and has the required intelligence and patience to do so. Sam, although intelligent and very much literate, doesn't exceed Grim in this. With the growing tools that require being tech-smart, I don't think Sam would take that job in a million years, LOL. That, and the probability of having her as his boss in a Splinter Cell game based on the EndWar storyline would be cool since I think that he prefers to have a familiar friendly voice in his ear than someone he barely knows.

Kirk had the ability to be a captain, to lead many people (actually most of the doers died... lol). Sam is a one man army. Regardless of Kirk's disinterest towards politics which is really similar to Sam, in Lambert's kind of job, politics are important since you're working closely with them, through them... and others. It's impossible to take Lambert's job without caring about politics, technology and others, but those two being of utmost importance.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SCSHADE,

Chinese_Bookey and QuikNsilnT, please mind what you post. Thanks!

quote:

Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:

quote:

Originally posted by OniLinkSword:
I find myself agreeing with you on almost all your ideas, Shadow.

Call the doctor! I'm pretty sure he can give you a prescription for that!

"Sam is dead." —Nietzsche

It would be kinda cool to see Sam in Lambert's chair.

quote:

Originally posted by drunkrepublican:
It would be kinda cool to see Sam in Lambert's chair.

Did you not read Shadowfox and Oni's posts?

quote:

Originally posted by OniLinkSword:

quote:

Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:

...

On the note of Sam being a handler and taking the role of Lambert? I don't think so. It's no secret that he disdains politics and I can't see him in any other role than the world's stealthiest operative. His character would be wasted otherwise.

...

I find myself agreeing with you on almost all your ideas, Shadow.

The part about Sam taking over Lambert's role reminds me of Kirk in the Star Trek series / movies. He loved being the captain of a ship going out doing stuff. He didn't care too much about politics (although he was willing to deal with it) and was unhappy as an admiral. When he was demoted back to captain, he was thrilled.

I totally agree with you guys. Sam is the 'get your hands dirty' kind of guy and I can't see him sitting around in an office all the time.

quote:

Originally posted by oO_ShadowFox_Oo:
No, I think Ubi confirmed that Sam does not die at the end of Conviction.

I would really like to play as another character if it meant more proper Splinter Cell infiltration as operatives who have joined the team(s).

Of course Sam needs to be in the game, but playing as a new character could be a breath of fresh air, as long as we get to play as Sam again when he's called back into action during 2020 for WW III, which IMO is going to be the best Splinter Cell game as it can combine proper infiltration behind enemy lines to gain intelligence and it offers the opportunity for Sam to get trigger happy for all those action junkies that will hop on board for Conviction.

Obviously the new character needs to be younger than Sam, but only by about 10 years or so, so younger than 35 and we're losing track of ourselves. This new character could also be the co-op partner in the upcoming title or indeed be one of the two co-op people. He would need to be a solid character though and proper personality in his own right.

Raiden was uber ghey and MGS 2 suffered because of this.

On the note of Sam being a handler and taking the role of Lambert? I don't think so. It's no secret that he disdains politics and I can't see him in any other role than the world's stealthiest operative. His character would be wasted otherwise.

As for him training and instructing our new operative when he joins one of the Splinter Cells.

HELL YEAH!!

http://www.gamespot.com/users/...ic_id=m-100-25613621
For awhile I assumed that was how Convictions would play you would play as reckless action Sam and then switch to this new guy and play a more traditional Splinter Cell game.