I think its cool to fly F-117s or B'2s
It's not that hard 2 control multi-crewed aircraft!!,like in MS flight Sim!!

yea but it wont be realistic since most info about stealth planes are still classified. So you can't model an accurate cockpit model. Besides, this game is based around the 80's, not modern times.

Then why are F117s in the game as non flyables ?

That’s because the F-117 has been in service for quite a while. It was first selected and delivered around 1977-1982 (during the time Lock On was based on) that is why it's in the game but the developers cannot create a cockpit for it because some info is still classified. It wouldn’t be realistic and accurate if it was modeled. The B-2 on the other hand was publicly displayed on Nov. 22, 1988; maybe it’s slightly ahead on the Lock On period so maybe that's why it’s not in the game. And enough talk about all this stealth planes, we all know most info on those birds are heavily protected. Even if it was in the game, it wouldn’t be fun anymore. It would be so cheap to “fire and forget.” We will no longer see any dogfight action if stealth planes were involved (like the F-22.) And a stealth bomber wouldn’t be fun either. You fly over the target, drop your bombs, and go home without the enemy even touching/noticing you. Wow that’s fun…

Quite right, not getting seen would be the point of stealth wouldn't it! The main idea of a stealth mission is to keep your radar signature to a minimum, you would have to carefully set waypoints to avoid enemy radar and visual contact, making a wrong turn or even banking the plane could get you shot down.
The people who would build stealth missions in LOMAC would include heavy SAM cover to make mission objectives as hard or as easy as they like - the same as someone building A10 missions can.Stealth missions would be more of a planning and stratagy game - but it sounds like your more into arcade type shoot em up stuff.I respect that the F117 can't currently be put into the game due to its unknown quanties, but when that changes I would love to see it as it would add a totally different aspect to a totally awesome game. But I guess because you and the Hitman dont want it everyone who does should shut up - yeah right -

Dude, I didn’t say that I didn’t like realism. This is all about thinking realistic. First point why F-117 is not flyable in the game is because they are CLASSIFED. Second point, most flyable aircraft in Lock On is mainly categorized as fighter/attack aircraft, not bombers. Even if the F-117 was declassified and modeled, it would not fit in the current game play of Lock On. An F-117 would be pretty good for a single player, but when it comes to multiplayer, it sucks. Imagine you are in an F-117 making your bomb run while the rest of us are in our Su-27/33 wondering where the hell you are. Having stealth on your side is basically turning on god mode. For a single player you could plan out your attack and waypoints, but in multiplayer, the map would not be designed especially for you and the rest of your stealth squadron to let you get in and get out alive, while the other side is like wtf? The whole point the developers made multiplayer is to let the players see some dogfight action. (So yes it may lean a little toward that “arcade” side) Basically, don’t expect the F-117 to come into Lock On unless the developers devised a way to make the game play fair to everyone. Maybe in another flight simulator, like Fighter Ops, the F-117 could be adapted. (if it becomes declassified by then) I would love to fly it, but for now I’m just making my point valid why it is not incorporated in Lock On)

Your right again!I don't 'expect' Stealth aircraft to become flyables in LOMAC.But this is the wishlist and that theme of game has always been a wish of mine.I also don't buy the arguement that stealth would be no good in multi player situations.
1. F117s are not completely 'invisible'
2. Missions could be designed where F117s clear a path to targets on SEAD missions etc to allow safe path for A10 or F15s or maybe one day F18s to safely drop their bombs(co-operative missions).
3. Its not all about dogfighting for everyone all the time.
4. Another sim dedicated to co-op total war situations including simultaneous stealth, AG & AA rosters would be fantastic but LOMAC is currently the best available so people will always want their wishlist to be put into a game like this even if it dosn't quite fit.No doubt Combat jet flight sims will only keep getting better over time - God Bless Them -

I think a way to make multiplayer with an F-117 fair would be to implement flyable AWACS and then people in fighters would do CAP around target sites... a flight of F-117 would try to bomb the target and the fighters would ytry to prevent this with the help of AWACS...

I dunno... just an idea.

true, night stealth missions would be great ...

It appears there is a resonable amount of information in reference to the flight behaviour, weapon payloads,& radar signatures of the F117a. Its cockpit details,& electrical systems etc that pose the unknown quantity.
Although some seem happy to fly an F16 with the cockpit of a Russian aircraft which detracts from realism. Odd.

There's nothing odd about it, if people wants to fly other flyables without the proper cockpits then so be it, they just kicked realism out the door. They minds as well play some arcade game then, but the pros stick to the planes ED provided.

It's not like everything in Lock On is hyper realistic. I can gaurentee that you wouldn't be able to fly a real Su-27 after playing Lock On.

I'm not a dog fighting pilot. I'm a ground attacker, a bomber. Jane's Combat Simulations did a great job portraying the F-117 in their USAF game. And it was damn fun to fly over Baghdad at night (through HUGE amounts of AAA mind you) and drop my TV-guided bombs through windows.

Just because you guys like to turn and burn, doesn't mean that EVERYONE likes to. I think the F-117 would be insanely fun in Lock On. The B-2 would also be great.

I am quite new to game and comunity but let me add my 3 cents (or whatever :P).

After reading of this thread I have mixed feelings. From one point of view addition of F117 would be nice. Why? Because it would add some 'realism' in wider plan. Computer is always a computer. Player is something else. Putting player in invisible aircraft may be quite interresting as it will give rest of the people that "wft" feeling to their flying. You have a target to protect and you have invisible enemy. Go figure.

On the other hand, that will be tipping the balance to one side. But isn't war about gaining advantage?

From my point of view, flying F117 would be damn boring. You start, set acourse, chose reasonable altitude and fly. Your trajectory of approach will be preplaned to avoid any major radar stations, so all you ahve to do is follow the patch, release bombs and be gone.

Now, if you will be detected - you are as good as dead. I am not an expert, but I heard once that F117 has a aerodynamical characteristic of the brick. If you knock out computer you are going down and hard. Thus, dogfighting must be a suicide.

So - if there is active defence, like a squadron fo Su-27 over the target flying around and looking for target, noone inteligent would send F-117 on a mission. First, air defence would be dealt with.

So... perhaps I am incorrect, but in my oppinion missions in F117, involving other crafts would be completely unrealistic. Idea of F117 is to sneak, kill and retreat. If enemy knows you are comming you may be as good as dead.

Ok... now I wait for experts to kill me

Salute!

So JANE's USAF is the best thing if I want to fly F-117?

Besides the more "sensitive" nature of technology like stealth, the limited mission profile of the Nighthawk may be why it isn't a flyable. Though I'd enjoy it as a plane, and as far as on-board avionics go I don't think it would require any major new programming because it doesn't have an air-to-ground mapping radar.

And the point of stealth is not to make the aircraft invisible- that's impossible at the moment. All it does is effectively reduce the range at which said plane can be detected. It wouldn't totally skew multiplay because the Nighthawk would be detectable, if not at long range, and because as soon as it is detected it is SCREWED by virtue of it being unmaneuverable, firmly subsonic, and having no air-to-air defensive capability whatsoever.

As for the time frame of the game, I'm pretty certain it's not the 1980s. Kuznetsov was commissioned in 1991, MiG-29S and Su-30 entered production in 1992, and the Su-25T and Su-34 in 1994 or 1995 if I'm not mistaken. Which still puts the B-2 and F-22 outside the scope of the game.

Also, the Challenger II MBT is featured in the game, is it not?! Anyway, the AH-64D Longbow Apache is in the game, and that was first fielded by Boeing in 1997!

Yeah! and the AMRAAM wasnt used in the 80s. At least not in an "full operation stage".

I know this is a ridicously late reply and so on, but I must say that LOMAC strikes me as a game set in present day, give and take a few years.
I base this opinion that nowhere in the game suggest the Cold War is still going on, which ended in 1990. It says "an explosive situation in the Black Sea Region threatens world peace...". Not counting the smaller wars like the first Gulf War and later Kosovo, 1990 till 1999 is relativley a peaceful period. And as we all know, B-2s were used in Kosovo.
I also think that an F117 is also equipped with a LANTIRN pod right? That can track ground targets...

As we all like to talk about LockOn being realistic or not,I think that it probably has a lot of realistic features but I wouldn't go as far as stelth-bombers and 1990s ect becose when it
comes to a battlefield being realistic!How?
Since the RADAR was invented and put to war,
form day one it's been placed on the ground for
detection of airborn threts.First it was used
to detect air threats than thru radio-
comunications network alert fighters and get
them airborn and a decade later it was used to
launch SAMs furthermore comunications between
ground forces,troops,ships and air have existed for some time and in modern air combat those comunications is essential tool and generaly speaking I would love to see that level of realism in the next add-on. I don't know about you guy but my liking is not to kill 10 plans and tanks but to fly simulative missions.

I tend to look at it from multiple angles of attack: First, the time period your game scenarios take place in should determine whether or not stealth aircraft should be used. Second, I look at the game as sort of a late '80s - early '90s scenario, so the closest I would come to flying stealth would be in an SR-71a. (Mach 3+, and with the radar profile of a hummingbird. That thing didn't need weapons!)

I think this whole debate depends on your own preferences, ultimately. I'm sure that one day, there will be a "FreeFalcon"-style patch for LOMAC, that will allow such models into the game. I personally think that only 8 aircraft is kind of gypping us, but when you look at how much detail is in the controls setup, and how much attention you have to pay to flying, it's worth it in the long run.

Cheer up! I'm sure that Ubisoft will one day hear and answer your prayers for stealth in an add-on for LOMAC. Until then, be happy with what you've got!