Hello,

My CM11 keeps declaring "draw by threefold repetition" when a position has only been repeated twice. How can this be fixed?

I believe you are wrong. Can you post an example?

Threefold repetition can be a bit tricky... here's what Article 9, Section 2 of Laws of Chess from the FIDE Handbook says aout it:

quote:

The game is drawn upon a correct claim by the player having the move, when the same position, for at least the third time (not necessarily by a repetition of moves):

a. is about to appear, if he first writes his move on his scoresheet and declares to the arbiter his intention to make this move, or

b. has just appeared, and the player claiming the draw has the move.

Positions as in (a) and (b) are considered the same, if the same player has the move, pieces of the same kind and colour occupy the same squares, and the possible moves of all the pieces of both players are the same.

Positions are not the same if a pawn that could have been captured en passant can no longer be captured in this manner. When a king or a rook is forced to move, it will lose its castling rights, if any, only after it is moved.

My guess is that what you're seeing is case b from above... Chessmaster has the move and is declaring the draw before the third move is actually made. But it would be nice if you could post an example.

how do I post a chess game? Do I just post the moves or can I post a saved game?

and then paste it here (Ctrl+V).

Chessmaster: Grandmaster Edition
[Event "Chessmaster: Grandmaster Edition Rated Game"] [Site ""] [Date "8-7-2009"] [Round ""] [White "Max"] [Black "Kenny"] [Result "1/2-1/2"] [ECO "c) U"]
1. b4 e6 2. †b2 ‡f6 3. e4 †xb4 4. a3 †e7 5. ‡f3 d6 6. ‡c3 e5 7. d4 †g4 8. dxe5 dxe5 9. ‰xd8+ †xd8 10. ‡xe5 O-O 11. ‡d5 †h5 12. †d3 ‡xd5 13. exd5 †f6 14. O-O ˆe8 15. ˆae1 ‡d7 16. f4 h6 17. †b5 ˆad8 18. †xd7 †xe5 19. fxe5 ˆxd7 20. c4 ˆde7 21. e6 fxe6 22. ˆe5 †g6 23. ˆfe1 †f5 24. ˆf1 g6 25. †d4 b6 26. †c3 exd5 27. ˆxe7 ˆxe7 28. cxd5 ˆd7 29. †e5 ˆxd5 30. †xc7 ˆa5 31. †d6 ˆd5 32. †c7 ˆd3 33. ˆf3 ˆxf3 34. gxf3 ‹f7 35. ‹f2 ‹e6 36. ‹e3 ‹d5 37. h4 ‹c4 38. †f4 h5
39. a4 ‹b4 40. †b8 ‹xa4 41. †xa7 b5 42. †d4 ‹a3 43. †c3 b4 44. †e5 b3 45. ‹d2 ‹a2 46. ‹c1 ‹a3 47. ‹d2 ‹a2 48. ‹c1 ‹a3 49. ‹d2 1/2-1/2
OK here's an example. It seems to me that the position was only repeated twice.

[Event "Chessmaster: Grandmaster Edition Rated Game"]
[Site ""]
[Date "2009.8.7"]
[Round ""]
[White "Max"]
[Black "Kenny"]
[TimeControl "1260"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO " "]

1.b4 e6 2.Bb2 Nf6 3.e4 Bxb4 4.a3 Be7 5.Nf3 d6 6.Nc3 e5 7.d4 Bg4 8.dxe5 dxe5 9.Qxd8+ Bxd8 10.Nxe5 O-O 11.Nd5 Bh5 12.Bd3 Nxd5
13.exd5 Bf6 14.O-O Re8 15.Rae1 Nd7 16.f4 h6 17.Bb5 Rad8 18.Bxd7 Bxe5 19.fxe5 Rxd7 20.c4 Rde7 21.e6 fxe6 22.Re5 Bg6 23.Rfe1 Bf5
24.Rf1 g6 25.Bd4 b6 26.Bc3 exd5 27.Rxe7 Rxe7 28.cxd5 Rd7 29.Be5 Rxd5 30.Bxc7 Ra5 31.Bd6 Rd5 32.Bc7 Rd3 33.Rf3 Rxf3 34.gxf3 Kf7
35.Kf2 Ke6 36.Ke3 Kd5 37.h4 Kc4 38.Bf4 h5 39.a4 Kb4 40.Bb8 Kxa4 41.Bxa7 b5 42.Bd4 Ka3 43.Bc3 b4 44.Be5 b3 45.Kd2 Ka2 46.Kc1 Ka3
47.Kd2 Ka2 48.Kc1 Ka3 49.Kd2 1/2-1/2

OK I did it the way you suggested, perhaps it is easier to read?

Position after 45.Kd2, after 47.Kd2 and after 49.Kd2 are the same (position of all the pieces is the same AND it's always the same side to move), hence it is a draw because the same position repeated 3 times. Nowhere does it say that it has to repeat 3 times in a row. It's enough if it repeats 3 times in a game, which it did.

It's a draw. No fault in Chessmaster here

Here is an example of wrong draw by 3-fold repetition claim on the highest level:


[Event "Moscow Tal Memorial"]
[Site "Moscow"]
[Date "2006.11.07"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Morozevich, Alexander"]
[Black "Carlsen, Magnus"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B33"]
[WhiteElo "2747"]
[BlackElo "2698"]
[PlyCount "92"]
[EventDate "2006.11.06"]
[EventType "tourn"]
[EventRounds "9"]
[EventCountry "RUS"]
[EventCategory "20"]
[Source "ChessBase"]
[SourceDate "2008.11.23"]

1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 e5 6. Ndb5 d6 7. Bg5 a6 8.
Na3 b5 9. Nd5 Be7 10. Nxe7 Nxe7 11. Bd3 Nd7 12. c4 b4 13. Nc2 a5 14. Ne3 f6 15.
Bh4 O-O 16. O-O Nc5 17. f3 Be6 18. Re1 Qb8 19. Bf1 Kh8 20. Re2 Rc8 21. Rd2 Ra6
22. Rc1 Rac6 23. Bf2 Bf7 24. Nd5 Nxd5 25. cxd5 R6c7 26. Rdc2 Be8 27. b3 Bd7 28.
g4 Kg8 29. Qe2 Nb7 30. Rxc7 Rxc7 31. Rxc7 Qxc7 32. Qa6 Nc5 33. Qa8+ Kf7 34. h4
h6 35. Bc4 Be8 36. Be3 Ke7 37. g5 hxg5 38. hxg5 Kf7 39. Kg2 Ke7 40. Kg3 Kf7 41.
Kg4 Ke7 42. Kh4 Kf7 43. Kh3 Ke7 44. Kg2 Kf7 45. Bd2 Qb6 46. Be3 Qc7 1/2-1/2


Even the experienced arbiter made a mistake and confirmed the draw. Can you see why the claim is wrong?


Here is the solution.