Here are the two posts where I supposingly have been so disrespectfull and said that this community is ungratefull and stupid.







And here is the one where chessumastahexa lies that I have gone bezerk and that i'm deleting everything from left to right.


Now judge for yourself who is telling the truth here.

Again that lie about only removing his own posts. He removed entire threads that numerous people had posted to. He did this by removing only his own posts, but he knew that if the original post was gone the rest of the posts would go too. Heck, the forum software probably gave him a warning to that effect when he deleted them. If he'd wanted to keep these the forum software would have probably allowed him to split off the posts into new threads, but he didn't do this. He just deleted his post and let it delete the entire thread because he couldn't care less about anyone else's posts.

If Ebutaljib didn't remove any posts but his own, where's mine from yesterday (in the chessfm lectures stickied thread) where I asked him to behave responsibly with a moderator's restraint? Where's the one from Cmcdarris asking where the chessfm lectures could be found? These posts and many others are gone.

Yes, the threads that I have started were deleted as a whole. I never denied that. But I couldn't prevent that either. It's collateral dammage.

disrespectful
insulting
disrespectful
insulting
disrespectful
insulting

boring
infantile

quote:

Originally posted by ebutaljib:
Yes, the threads that I have started were deleted as a whole. I never denied that. But I couldn't prevent that either. It's collateral dammage.

Another bald-faced lie. You could easily have prevented it. Even if the forum software doesn't allow you to split off posts you could have prevented it by the simple act of deleting the TEXT from your posts rather than deleting the entire post. That would have preserved the thread while removing your contribution to it.

quote:

Originally posted by ebutaljib:
Yes, the threads that I have started were deleted as a whole. I never denied that. But I couldn't prevent that either. It's collateral dammage.

probably I can now safely consider myself as one of the still active oldest forum contributors here (beginning from CM10), and it was nice to see ebutaljib around here now and then.

I didn't know it was he himself who uploaded those Chess FM lectures, man, that's a GREAT amount of work, and believe me, those lectures are doing me and probably many people a lot of good. same with the service pack. I have seen him tell people he could make opening books using the CM9 he has and e-mail them back to people who want. who does these kinds of things anymore in any community?

it's sometimes really hard to maintain your patience, especially when you are one of the mor e experienced people in this forum to answer most of the questions. I've deleted many sarcastic posts and retyped them with patience and intent to help here. it really gets difficult with time, believe this guys. and I too have lost it eventually. (against that person who cannot make a few more clicks and calls something a bug just for this reason).

Ebutaljib is right, there ARE many stupid questions. And hey, there ARE a lot of stupid people around the world, and why do we have to act like all people are the smartest?

the problem was, that some of the stupidity of the questions asked here could be related with the age of the poster (who could possibly be a child, and we all have the responsibility to act patiently and make ourselves clear to them, IF we reply to their posts.), or the very little computer experience the poster has, which I experience all the time with many of my elders, they all act like stupid people.

so, one has to keep in mind these two facts while making sarcastic remarks about questions asked here, however, I find it TOTALLY NORMAL to somehow lose your patience, since some questions were asked by grown-up adults and probably with fairly well computer experience, AND they were stupid.

so, when people ask ebutaljib to maintain the solid and polite helpful character he is (meaning the way he acts in this forum, because I don't know him personally) ALL THE TIME, those very people should also be patient with him too, and especially with him. I wish he'd come back.

quote:

Another bald-faced lie. You could easily have prevented it. Even if the forum software doesn't allow you to split off posts you could have prevented it by the simple act of deleting the TEXT from your posts rather than deleting the entire post. That would have preserved the thread while removing your contribution to it.

Beeryus, you're not being nice here. I'm sure you KNOW ebutaljib isn't the type of person to sabotage this forum intentionally. probably he just didn't think of it at the time, or there is something else.

quote:

Originally posted by diskamyl:
so, when people ask ebutaljib to maintain the solid and polite helpful character he is ALL THE TIME, those very people should also be patient with him too, and especially with him. I wish he'd come back.

Wise words, BUT... there's a difference between what we should expect from a veteran member of the forums and what we should expect of a moderator. A moderator has a responsibility to go the extra mile. I don't think Ebutaljib does that. Heck, I'm not a patient man, but if a new member comes along I give him the benefit of the doubt until he's settled in. Two new members joined this week (the ones I've mentioned before) and after their very first posts Ebutaljib responded with sarcasm and ridicule. They have not posted since. That is no way to run a forum - unless we want to run it into the ground. As I see it Ebutaljib is one of the worst moderators I've ever seen. He might be a credit to the community in terms of his other contributions, but he's incompetent - even harmful - as a moderator.

Again, forum moderators should be welcoming towards new members, not sarcastic and dismissive. If he wasn't a moderator I might be convinced by your words, but he is a moderator and moderators should be held to a higher standard.

quote:

Originally posted by diskamyl:
Beeryus, you're not being nice here. I'm sure you KNOW ebutaljib isn't the type of person to sabotage this forum intentionally. probably he just didn't think of it at the time, or there is something else.

I've been a moderator on a number of forums and I've never known a forum not give a warning when I was about to delete a first post in a thread. It doesn't take a genius to figure out ways to keep the thread intact if you really just want to delete the first post. At best what he did is grossly incompetent. At worst what he did is malicious. I've seen moderators banned from forums for doing what he did.

A member may remove any or all of his contributions. A moderator should not remove material that is useful to forum members - even if it's his own stuff. Ebutaljib did not act in the best interests of the forum. He acted out of spite and he hoped to pin the blame on me and Cmcdarris.

Anyway, I really don't want to stay involved with this nonsense of Ebutaljib's. What's done is done.

quote:

Originally posted by Beeryus:

quote:

Originally posted by diskamyl:
so, when people ask ebutaljib to maintain the solid and polite helpful character he is ALL THE TIME, those very people should also be patient with him too, and especially with him. I wish he'd come back.

Wise words, BUT... there's a difference between what we should expect from a veteran member of the forums and what we should expect of a moderator. A moderator has a responsibility to go the extra mile. I don't think Ebutaljib does that. Heck, I'm not a patient man, but if a new member comes along I give him the benefit of the doubt until he's settled in. Two new members joined this week (the ones I've mentioned before) and after their very first posts Ebutaljib responded with sarcasm and ridicule. They have not posted since. That is no way to run a forum - unless we want to run it into the ground. As I see it Ebutaljib is one of the worst moderators I've ever seen. He might be a credit to the community in terms of his other contributions, but he's incompetent - even harmful - as a moderator.

Again, forum moderators should be welcoming towards new members, not sarcastic and dismissive. If he wasn't a moderator I might be convinced by your words, but he is a moderator and moderators should be held to a higher standard.

I agree that being a moderator, he should have been more patient and welcoming. but this shouldn't have gotten to the point where he leaves in the midst of an ugly debate. gratitude is really underestimated. no one is to kneel before him or anything, but has to respect all those patient hours of work here, and show some empathy.

check out the CM10 forums, where every newcomer asked the same questions listed in the FAQ, with a big READ THİS FİRST!!! sign near it.

it was like default, people would join and ask them, it was real crazy! we are no super humans here, when ebutaljib makes a sarcastic remark -which I hardly remember from before-, just make the appropriate helpful post yourself, and he'll know.

he's not a troll or something, and I think you've had enough encounter with him to realize that.

quote:

Originally posted by diskamyl:
I agree that being a moderator, he should have been more patient and welcoming. but this shouldn't have gotten to the point where he leaves in the midst of an ugly debate.

There was no ugly debate. I simply asked him to act with more restraint (I also berated the guy - Cmcdarris - who was arguing with him) and the next thing we knew half the threads on the forum were gone.

Let's have this done for peace.

ebutaljib,

1. Repost all the links you took down.
2. Delete this thread.

Everyone, myself included,

1. We'll forget this thing ever happened and we'll move on.
2. We'll all try to be more patient.

Take care,

Reuben

I am a new visitor to the forum and the one who posted my first message to which Ebutaljib responded with rolling eyes to insinuate I was stupid. He later said that my question was stupid.

I just started playing chess a few months ago and recently bought ChessMaster. I saw his post on the forum and clicked on the link to see that it took me outside the forum to another website. His thread also began, "Yes, chess is an old game ... (don't recall the rest b/c he deleted it) which seemed to indicate that he was responding to someone's question. I also knew that CM had a lot of games in its database and did not know if this somehow related or analyed those games. I merely ask about the linked games.

In response, he said, "Oh boy (wingding with rolling eyes), maybe you should ignore this thread." Another member then answered my question.

He then responded back telling me how stupid my question was. In my opinion, most of the people visiting this forum are here to learn. (I doubt that Bobby Fischer or Gary Kasporov visit here). As a Moderator of the forum, I would think that all kinds of questions would come in and a Moderator should expect that. It should be the Moderator's job to try to respond and not belittle people.

Chessmastahexa suggested that this be forgotten and move on. I think Ebutaljib is in control of that. As a Modderator he needs to change his attitude, especially with new users like me.

I wanted to stay out of this, but I have to add my two cents.
I am a newish user to the forums and chessmaster, I was myself suprised at the sarcastic patonizing attitude of ebu too and for that reason I have not been very active on this forum.
That is not to say that ebu drove me away, just that I was dissapointed that a moderator would have such an attitude towards members asking genuine questions, yes to some they may have been obvious but once upon a time we all had to learn everything from sending an email to installing programs, for this reason we should treat those asking "obvious" questions with some respect, if you cant answer their questions then dont berate them for not knowing,I saw both threads the above poster was talking about and I felt sorry for the responses he/she got, they were uncalled for.

In ebus defense, I also quickly saw just how much work he has put into these forums and had planned to download the lectures which sadly have now been taken off the site, this seems deliberately spitefull towards all members of the forums, we are all being punished for a situation that has ot out of hand and in all fairness would not have come about if ebu had not been sarcastic and patronizing.

I can see how members have become dissatisfied by ebus posts, a moderator should be protecting from the forums problems and not contributing towards them.I spend a lot of time on many forums and wouldve been an active poster here but it is very quiet here and I am not fond of forums where the moderators do not act in the manner of which a moderator should.
I also understand that patience does run out sometimes and think that this situation could be resolved with a bit of tolerance and maturity from all those directly involved.
Ebu should return on the basis of how much work he obviously has put into the forums by way of general maintaining to the very helpful stickies which I deeply regret not grabbing earlier now.
However I feel that ebu should certainly try to not be quite so blunt towards the new members as it does not give a good reflection to those who have just joined like myself.
Personally I feel that ebu has been a little too defensive of actions where a brief apology wouldve stopped this esculating on the scale it has,and I feel that removing all the stickies is quite harsh on the 99 percent of members who have had no direct dealing in this situation.

If the stickies returned and ebu returned with an altered approach I would be inclined to stay on these forums and contribute, but if this does not happen then this will be my last post here, this is not a threat as nobody will really care if I stay or go, nor will my decision affect anybody, it is simple truth, I will have no reason to stick around.

I have tried to offer my thoughts, they are mine alone and it was not my intention to offend ebu or anyone but as the effect on newbies was mentioned I thought I would state how it affects this newbie.

Regards.

Pigface

Hi Folks,

Probably only CMX Unser know me, but I would like to tell ebu that you did a great job as a moderator in our good old forum. Although I didn't participate much recently I almost always read your posts and saw this forum develop nicely. Of course it's a shame that all the lectures, tutorials and puzzles disappear, but if that was your choice I very much appreciate it and hope that you still have a good time. Maybe you want to play on the Fritz server or whatever...

Good bye and Good luck ebu!

You've made a good point. From a new user's perspective, Ebutaljib's reactions may have appeared to be bit harsh.

However, how about Ebutaljib's perspective? He made several good contributions to this forum, answered the same questions over and over again (few people bothered reading the post named "FAQS - Read This First" before posting the simplest questios), and for this, he got very little gratitude in return.

So while Ebutaljib could be a bit sarcastic at times, I tried to see his point of view, too.

I guess it doesn't matter now. But I'm surprised that many people here feel cheated that Ebutaljib removed his posts and download links -- what did they expect?

quote:

Originally posted by Pigface1973:
If the stickies returned and ebu returned with an altered approach I would be inclined to stay on these forums and contribute, but if this does not happen then this will be my last post here...

I believe that once a forum post is gone, it can't be retrieved. At least that's how it worked on every forum I moderated.

quote:

Originally posted by KHollister:
...I'm surprised that many people here feel cheated that Ebutaljib removed his posts and download links -- what did they expect?

Yeah, 'cos that's what I do whenever I'm told to amend my tone - I fly into a rage, remove every post I ever made and call the person who berated me an ungrateful backstabber.

Now I see how what he did makes total sense.

Beeryus tried to humilliate me in the same way, he and some other fellows like Khollister tried to maliciously attack me in an extremely brutal manner by accusing me of a theif lol But unfortunetly for them I am not as emotionally breakable like others such as ebutaljib

And now they have successfully managed to humilliate the innocent and most helpful member of this forum, ebutaljib

hahahhaha. i just started reading this forum the other day and read the whole thing between ebutaljib, beeryus and cruel knights. i must say at the time ebutaljib seems like an ass, but he did post a lot of things that i came here to download and now they're gone! i'll live without them but hey, everyone makes mistakes ya know? who would have thought such drama would be unfolding on the chessmaster forums. hahahah. it's pretty funny if you think about it. no, beeryus wasn't maliciously attacking anyone, yes ebutaljib was being a smartass and yes cruel knights is a pirate. oh well! don't worry, be happy