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Madmax and I were discussing the pros and cons of the host/admin of a server being able to ban players but that thread was locked because it was a repeat of another HAWX 2 thread.
Pros: Abusive users can be permanently removed. The "admin" of any server should be allowed to ban as they see fit, it's their server. Cons: Less servers for abusive payers to play on. (or is that a pro too?  )While there *are* some abusive (or perhaps for some it's ignorance) admins that currently kick because they think others are cheating or they're poor losers most players would want to avoid those servers anyway. The "less servers" argument doesn't really fly (no pun intended) if they're kicking you anyway because you can't play on a server you're being kicked from. The benefit of being able to permanently remove abusive players, imo, outweighs any possible downside. Admins *should* have every right to set the rules however they see fit, including bans, loadouts and attitudes. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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you start a game, then it's your game to do as you see fit.
If you dont like that, start your own. one time, i got kicked by the host on my own team, i sent a msg asking why i was kicked, he informed me he noticed nobody else could kill anything. smoke ldogg |
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Way to be unbiased as an introduction post...
Is it really "your" server? It isn't as if you were hosting a dedicated server. It is just a room that uses Ubisoft's servers to allow others to join your game. With that being said, you aren't even the "admin". You are just the host, you get to pick the server settings and that should be enough. (Of course, having more in-game settings would be nice.) Do you really need kicking? I can only think of one situation when kicking in-game would be somewhat fair. That would be when playing versus someone that lags. Yet, usually gently asking them (OMG communication within the game ?!?) to re-join or quit works fine. But wait, there's more! You've got Mr.Hacker in your room?! You are lucky, I've only manage to see two hackers since the release. What do you do? You beat the crap out of him and laugh of his stupid hacks. You don't even need to kick them out! Why would you need to ban a lagger? There's no reasons, it could simply be a bad connection for a single hour. Why would you ban an hacker? There's no reasons, you can simply own him or take him as some uber boss to defeat! Why would you ban some disrespectful players? There's no reasons, you can simply own them in the game and they will leave anyway. Besides, it isn't as if the text is really getting in your way while flying. You can totally ignore it.Banning will simply give less servers to those who are skilled, because you know newbie hosts will ban instead of kicking. You have to remember, when you kick someone, he doesn't get the experience he has collected since the start of the game. (NOT the round, but the game.) In-game kicking shouldn't even be allowed. And by the way, you can play a server from which you just got kicked. You simply rejoin the server. Of course, the host will probably re-kick you, but at least, you can ask the host why he kicked you. You can also change name and come back within the game. PMing on the PC version doesn't exists. -- H.A.W.X. - Plane Finder (Ubisoft's mirror) Find a plane with the features and weapon packs you want. |
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  "It's amazing how much panic one hypocrite can spread among a multitude of honest men." |
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Exactly...
Of course I'm biased, I think it's a good idea and I wasn't trying to be unbiased, I just wanted to continue the debate. Yes, if I'm the host then it's my server until I quit. Furthermore we were talking about the HAWX 2 wishlist and there could be dedicated servers (and I hope there are) for HAWX 2. Yes we need kicking *and* banning, I thought I had made that desire clear. As to the "why" question, see landon's quote above. No, if they follow the rules then the "skilled" shouldn't be kicked nor banned and I have ZERO sympathy for those that can't follow the rules. As for the "admins" that might abuse kick and/or ban, as I already said, most players wouldn't want to play on that kind of server anyway... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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One time, I got kicked by my own team member. When I asked why, he said I was taking all the kills and nobody else was having any fun.
LOL. Being kicked should not rob you of experience. Crap, nothing should since you need so damn much to get your last jet. I don't understand why someone would want to rejoin a game that they were kicked from. If they did so repeatedly, then that would be just to bother the host. What a sad life. But yeah, banning pilots from games should be included I think because the above mentioned people are out there. Smoke, Ldogg |
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I can think of several scenarios where bans would be appropriate and warranted. The lack of bans is a 4chan wet dream...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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Go ahead and list out your reasons why banning is needed. I'm curious to see why an host would really need banning or even kicking.
Once the host set the settings, the players have no choice but to follow those rules. With that being said, you can't kick for not following the rules. He is forced to do so by correctly setting up the game. Landon, I have explain why someone would want to rejoin a game from which he got kicked out of no where. On the PC, you can't PM someone. The only way to ask is to rejoin the game. About 4chan, do you really think they would "zerg" a game of 8 players, in which only 7 could join? If H.A.W.X. becomes an MMO, maybe. Do you really need kicking and banning to enjoy a game? -- H.A.W.X. - Plane Finder (Ubisoft's mirror) Find a plane with the features and weapon packs you want. |
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It can be argued that banning in and of itself is alright. The problem is in WHO bans. As we all know, stupid people ban people for stupid reasons and abuse the hell out of the "feature." Implemented banning almost implies responsible player use, which we all know is a farce.
_______________________________ http://www.myspace.com/nonesonon http://www.youtube.com/adnihilis - HAWX videos. PSN: Adnihilis-II HAWX Callsign: Black |
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I'm not sure the moderators want me to list some of the scenarios and the word filter would prevent me from listing some of them too. I have certain rules, that I've enforced on every game server I've ran since the mid-90s that don't include server settings. If the player was kicked as a warning, then they could rejoin and ask why, assuming that they're not just playing stupid and really don't know why. If the player, however, has been kicked several times and just won't take the hint (another reason for bans) that they're not wanted on that server then they could be rejoining just to be a...jerk...or a 4channer.  Yes, I think that 4channers *love* the idea that they can't be banned so they can do/say virtually anything. I've seen them on other small servers too so 8 players isn't an issue. I have enjoyed the game, without bans, but there are cases where it would be more enjoyable WITH bans. Hope that helps... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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I would rather see a persistent player that kept rejoining than abusive hosts that bans for no reasons. If you get the choice between kicking or banning while BELIEVING the other player is hacking. You will ban. Even if in reality, the player was simply using a TOP and can have 8 flares instead of 3...
Since the hack protection is so weak, nonexistent would be better, players tend to quickly accuse of hacking when they can't understand a given situation. That leads to major abuse. Right now, it is limited to kicking and that's enough. Banning would be giving too much power to players that probably does not correctly understand the game. As for 4chan, we don't have bans right now and you ain't seeing them "zerg" servers. I get your point that some players might be able to do "what ever" they want, but they would still be limited by the game settings. (If we get more controls on the game settings, I don't see what other settings/behaviors could be needed.) I guess it is a matter of experience. Did you get kicked often from a multiplayer game out of nowhere? I did and many times. I even got kicked because the host believed I was using an aim-bot... For some reason, I have yet to be accused of wall-hacking... Don't know why... -- H.A.W.X. - Plane Finder (Ubisoft's mirror) Find a plane with the features and weapon packs you want. |
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I would rather be able to kick and ban and not need it than to need it and not have the ability. As for the persistent rejoiner, that's a good reason to ban and if the player doesn't like it they can join another server or host their own. Regardless of the in-game protections or lack thereof, the "admin" should *always* be free to kick and ban...for any reason. It's not "zerging" that's the problem and that's not the only disruption caused by retarded 4channers. I have been kicked and banned from other games for just being better than the admin and I always thought it was not only acceptable but I actually preferred to be banned so I wouldn't accidentally join that server again at a later date. While *I* don't kick/ban for getting killed the admin has the right to run the server and make the rules as they see fit and if I don't agree with a certain server's rules I'll go elsewhere. I don't pretend that I have a right to ignore the admins rules and do/say/act however I want. I'm not a socialist... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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I'm not talking of another game, I'm talking about H.A.W.X. where, if you can find a single server, you are lucky. Being banned by the newby host because he doesn't know rockets exist, would be really fun... The host is not the best judge of who have the right to play the game online or not. Creating your own server when there's 6 players online and 5 in another game will not help your case.
-- H.A.W.X. - Plane Finder (Ubisoft's mirror) Find a plane with the features and weapon packs you want. |
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The whole admin power thing is just fodder for ego and personal comfort. The ability to exert some sort of "control" over the game is an absolute necessity for some people. If the can't take the ball with them, they don't wanna play.
It's a disease in online gaming. It would be really nice if there were good controls and centralized non player servers for all online games. That's what we REALLY need, not more options of control for the megalomoniacal segment of our populace. |
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1) We weren't talking about HAWX in the other thread, we were talking about features we'd like to see in HAWX 2. 2) I don't care how few servers there would be (if they added bans to HAWX), an admin still should be able to ban, for any reason and possible abuse is no excuse, imo. Do you come from a socialist country or a liberal city by any chance? The "admin" is the *only* one that should judge who can or can't play on their own server. Players have the right to follow the rules on my servers, that's it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It's amazing how much panic one honest man can spread among a multitude of hypocrites." -- Thomas Sowell |
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