http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localn...dition2.4d725e4.html

Oil is a curse we can`t do without. Apparently 85% of the land is offlimits to companies looking for more oil.

I wonder, will they lift those limits for more oil eventually?

"Rising crude prices"


Um, what? Everything I've seen says it's going down....

In the past and present oil companies have justified high prices and profits by saying they needed it for further oil exploration. Well apparently the only thing they have been exploring with the billions is buying back their own stock and lining their share holders pockets with it.

For what it's worth, ExxonMobil has at least $3 billion in refinery upgrades/expansion on the books right now with the EPC contractor I work for and there's more on the way. Between various other producers we have over $12 billion of the same work either in house right now or nearly signed.

--Outlaw.

quote:

Originally posted by Outlaw---:
For what it's worth, ExxonMobil has at least $3 billion in refinery upgrades/expansion on the books right now with the EPC contractor I work for and there's more on the way. Between various other producers we have over $12 billion of the same work either in house right now or nearly signed.

--Outlaw.

"Exxon Mobil announced a record quarterly profit Thursday – earnings of $11.68 billion for the second quarter."

well with nearly 12 billion in one quarter alone I believe they can afford it.

found this article kind if interesting outlaw.

Exxon CEO: Refinery expansion
can meet U.S. petroleum needs

quote:

Exxon Mobil Corp. Chairman and CEO Rex Tillerson said on March 21 that creeping refinery capacity expansion would keep up with growing U.S. demand for refined products without the need to build a new refinery.

Paul Weissgarber, head of the oil and gas practice for management consulting firm A.T. Kearney, Dallas, who heard Tillerson speak at the National Petrochemical and Refiners Association annual meeting in Salt Lake City, told NPN MarketPulse, “The issue is that it’s very, very difficult to cite a new refinery in the U.S. Nobody wants a refinery in their backyard.” The public has accepted the locations of existing refineries, Weissgarber said. For that reason, expansion projects at those locations seem likely to face less resistance. “The public’s gotten used to them being there,” Weissgarber said.

Increasing capacity through expansion costs far less than building from scratch, Weissgarber added. “The economics are such that it makes more sense to continue to expand the existing refineries. Some of these expansions are as large as the typical refinery used to be in the U.S.”

Asked whether expansion would add capacity sufficient to meet growing U.S. demand, Weissgarber pointed out that Big Oil “is generating huge sums of cash. Everybody’s got capital projects either planned or already in progress. My perspective is that they’re going to add more capacity than what we’re going to see in the way of demand increases over the next three to five years.”

A new refinery has not been built in the United States since 1976.

Last year, President George W. Bush encouraged companies to build new oil refineries on old military bases to meet growing demand for gasoline and diesel, but so far none have planned to do so, Reuters reported in its coverage of the NPRA meeting.

"We don't have any plans for a greenfield refinery in the U.S., primarily because we don't think there is a need for one," Tillerson told reporters at the meeting, according to Reuters.

Tillerson said U.S. refiners should be able to maintain the average annual 2-percent expansion in crude oil refining capacity to keep up with demand.

U.S. markets will also rely on imports, he said.

"We've been able to add 2 percent per year for the past 10 years and we would expect to continue to make those capacity additions," Tillerson said. "We still have a lot of potential for expansion in existing sites."

A day earlier, the U.S. Energy Information Administration said U.S. fuel production capacity is expected to grow at about that rate in the remaining years of the decade as companies invest in expansion.

EIA analyst Joanne Shore said an additional 1.7 million barrels per day of capacity was expected between 2005 and 2010 and that the burst of refining capacity could allow the United States to "keep up with demand growth for a while."

Shore also said that historically refinery expansions tend to exceed the capacity additions originally planned.

In the past year, U.S. refining companies have revealed plant expansion plans totaling more than a million barrels per day, adding to expansion projects already on the books, according to a Reuters survey.

Experts have said, however, the planned expansions will not be enough to keep pace with demand growth, leaving the United States.

In other words Exxon has been offered a site for a new refinery and turned it flat down saying their increases would keep up with demand???

Ya that is why prices are spirling out of control.

Lets face facts. The oil companies years ago found out that limiting production was the way to huge profits. Some very profitable refineries have been even closed to accompolish this.

It is always the old song and dance..

quote:

“The issue is that it’s very, very difficult to cite a new refinery in the U.S. Nobody wants a refinery in their backyard.”

Then you see this..

quote:

"Last year, President George W. Bush encouraged companies to build new oil refineries on old military bases to meet growing demand for gasoline and diesel, but so far none have planned to do so, Reuters reported in its coverage of the NPRA meeting.

"We don't have any plans for a greenfield refinery in the U.S., primarily because we don't think there is a need for one," Tillerson told reporters at the meeting, according to Reuters."

What utter rubbish..

You will be happy to know outlaw I don't blame the run up in prices solely on Exxon and the oil companies.

I really blame it much more with the big mutual fund oil and gas speculators...

You aren't one of those are you..?

Don't worry. Obama's gonna give us back the evil oil man's profits.

Obama's oil rebate plan

quote:

Originally posted by han freak solo:
Don't worry. Obama's gonna give us back the evil oil man's profits.

Obama's oil rebate plan

In other words, he has no plans to address the source of the problem. The rebate plan sounds like a simple redistribution of wealth package that will make him popular with "the little guy" and do nothing to address our dependence on foreign oil (and oil in general).

quote:

In other words Exxon has been offered a site for a new refinery and turned it flat down saying their increases would keep up with demand???

Ya that is why prices are spirling out of control.

Gasoline prices are up because crude oil prices are up. Refineries are actually running quite a bit below capacity at the moment. They are making very little, if any, profit on gasoline.

quote:

Lets face facts. The oil companies years ago found out that limiting production was the way to huge profits. Some very profitable refineries have been even closed to accompolish this.

US refinery capacity has increased steadily. From a low of 15 million barrels a day in summer 1994 to 17.6 million now. That's at the same time US oil production has declined, from 6.7 million barrels a day in 1994 to 5.1 million now.

quote:

Originally posted by hop2002:

quote:

In other words Exxon has been offered a site for a new refinery and turned it flat down saying their increases would keep up with demand???

Ya that is why prices are spirling out of control.

Gasoline prices are up because crude oil prices are up. Refineries are actually running quite a bit below capacity at the moment. They are making very little, if any, profit on gasoline.

quote:

Lets face facts. The oil companies years ago found out that limiting production was the way to huge profits. Some very profitable refineries have been even closed to accompolish this.

US refinery capacity has increased steadily. From a low of 15 million barrels a day in summer 1994 to 17.6 million now. That's at the same time US oil production has declined, from 6.7 million barrels a day in 1994 to 5.1 million now.

hop/

quote:

Gasoline prices are up because crude oil prices are up. Refineries are actually running quite a bit below capacity at the moment. They are making very little, if any, profit on gasoline.

and crude oil prices are up because 70% of the oil market have been and are being controlled by oil future speculaters from banks and mutual funds limiting the market and driving the price way way up.

hop let me ask you a obvious question. If oil refining is right where it should be with plenty of supply as you say what has driven up prices so much then? After all it's a demand driven market isn't it?

You might want to add to your spin version of the truth that the demand is down right now for oil and gas and the refining has been cut back because the huge price increases have driven people to drive much much less.

I believe you ahh..forgot that little small detail.

You did say one truth. Refiners make very little off the market. It's a well known fact. Big Wupp. Did I say it was the refiner's profits that have driven up oil?

now you can go back to your job as a spokesperson fot the oil and gas industry..

found this interestying article that appears strangely to disagree with you hopps..

Oil Industry Scales Back Refinery Plans

By H. JOSEF HEBERT
The Associated Press
Sunday, June 17, 2007; 7:26 PM

WASHINGTON -- A push from Congress and the White House for huge increases in biofuels, such as ethanol, is prompting the oil industry to scale back its plans for refinery expansions. That could keep gasoline prices high, possibly for years to come.

With President Bush calling for a 20 percent drop in gasoline use and the Senate now debating legislation for huge increases in ethanol production, oil companies see growing uncertainty about future gasoline demand and little need to expand refineries or build new ones.



A push from Congress and the White House for huge increases in biofuels such as ethanol, is prompting the oil industry to scale back its plans for refinery expansions. That could keep gasoline prices high, possibly for years to come. (AP Photo/Ric Francis, File) (Ric Francis - AP)




Oil industry executives no longer believe there will be the demand for gasoline over the next decade to warrant the billions of dollars in refinery expansions _ as much as 10 percent increase in new refining capacity _ they anticipated as recently as a year ago.

Biofuels such as ethanol and efforts to get automakers to build more fuel-efficient cars and SUVs have been portrayed as key to countering high gasoline prices, but they are likely to do little to curb costs at the pump today, or in the years ahead as refiners reduce gasoline production.

A shortage of refineries frequently has been blamed by politicians for the sharp price spikes in gasoline, as was the case last week by Sen. James Inhofe, R-Okla., during debate on a Senate energy bill.

"The fact is that Americans are paying more at the pump because we do not have the domestic capacity to refine the fuels consumers demand," Inhofe complained as he tried unsuccessfully to get into the bill a proposal to ease permitting and environmental rules for refineries.

This spring, refiners, hampered by outages, could not keep up with demand and imports were down because of greater fuel demand in Europe and elsewhere. Despite stable _ even sometimes declining _ oil prices, gasoline prices soared to record levels and remain well above $3 a gallon.

Consumer advocates maintain the oil industry likes it that way.

"By creating a situation of extremely tight supply, the oil companies gain control over price at the wholesale level," said Mark Cooper of the Consumer Federation of America. He argued that a wave of mergers in recent years created a refining industry that "has no interest in creating spare (refining) capacity."

Only last year, the Energy Department was told that refiners, reaping big profits and anticipating growing demand, were looking at boosting their refining capacity by more than 1.6 million barrels a day, a roughly 10 percent increase. That would be enough to produce an additional 37 million gallons of gasoline daily.

But oil companies already have scaled those expansion plans back by nearly 40 percent. More cancelations are expected if Congress passes legislation now before the Senate calling for 15 billion gallons of ethanol use annually by 2015 and more than double that by 2022, say industry and government officials.

"These (expansion) decisions are being revisited in boardrooms across the refining sector," said Charlie Drevna, executive vice president of the National Petrochemical and Refiners Association.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...0.html?tid=informbox

quote:

by oil future speculaters

thats the second time these guys have been mentioned in this thread with little explanation of who or what they do.

I only mention it because the first time I had ever heard of these guys was just yesterday on the public access style radio station we have here.

It wasn't a long discussion and I was focused on traffic, but isn't some politician proposing to do away with these guys?

Speculators flooding oil futures market
Associated Press
Article Last Updated: 06/23/2008 07:20:00 PM PDT


WASHINGTON — Lawmakers continue to blame large investors for their role in propping up oil prices, pointing out Monday that speculation in crude futures has nearly doubled since 2000.

Pension funds, Wall Street banks and other large investors that have no intention of taking delivery of fuel have increasingly pumped money into contracts for oil and other commodities as a hedge against inflation when the dollar falls.

After more than a half dozen hearings in Congress on the issue, Democratic House lawmakers said they intend to tighten restrictions on pension funds, investment banks and other large investors that they blame for driving up fuel prices.

Many Republicans, analysts and regulators, however, say soaring oil prices are a reflection of macro-economic factors, including the falling dollar, unrest in the Middle East and increased demand from countries like China and India.

Oil prices rose $1.38 to settle at $136.74 a barrel Monday on the New York Mercantile Exchange on disappointment over Saudi Arabia's modest production increase and concerns that output from Nigeria will decline.

Saudi Arabia said Sunday it would add 200,000 barrels per day in July to a 300,000 barrel per day production increase it first announced in May. But that pledge at the meeting held in the Saudi city of Jeddah fell far short of U.S. hopes for a larger increase.

"Make no mistake about it, the excessive speculation in commodity


markets is having a devastating effect at the gas pump that is rippling through our entire economy," said Rep. Bart Stupak, D-Mich., who chaired the hearing of a House Energy and Commerce subcommittee.

But Rep. Joe Barton, R-Texas, said insufficient supply is the main driver behind rising energy prices. He called for increased domestic production of oil, natural gas and coal.

Speculators have increased their share of oil futures contracts on the Nymex to 71 percent this year, up from 37 percent in 2000, according to figures released by Stupak's office. At the same time contracts held by traditional oil users have fallen to less than 30 percent from over 60 percent.

House Democrats on Monday suggested a range of remedies, including: higher margin requirements and stricter position limits on investors.

The Commodity Futures Trading Commission Acting Chairman, Walter Lukken, cautioned lawmakers that higher margin requirements could drive traders out of the U.S. markets.

Some Democratic lawmakers made it clear they were willing to take that risk to lower fuel costs.

"I hope that you can appreciate the titanic effect that even a small reduction in oil prices would have compared to the relatively small effect of losing some speculative business," said Rep. Jay Inslee, D-Wash.

Nymex CEO James Newsome pointed out that traders who use the exchange are already subject to limits on the number of contracts they can hold.

The London-based ICE Futures Europe does not have such restrictions, and many experts have accused traders of using the foreign exchange to pile up excessive shares of the commodity markets.

ICE Chairman Sir Robert Reid tried to assure lawmakers his exchange does not tolerate excessive speculation, even if it doesn't have strict rules to prevent it.

"We know the positions of each of the people trading on our markets and if they look unusual then we call them in and as them questions," Reid told the subcommittee.

Lawmakers have cited the pain prices are causing airlines, trucking companies, farmers and consumers in calling for restrictions on speculative trading. At the pump, gas prices dipped less than a penny overnight to remain at a national average of over $4.07 a gallon, more than $1 above the year-ago average, according to AAA and the Oil Price Information Service.

A panel of analysts and oil industry experts told lawmakers that the recent influx of institutional dollars has disrupted the futures market's traditional function as a tool for the buying and selling of commodities.

Panelists said pension funds, sovereign wealth funds and other large investors have taken advantage of loopholes that let them bypass speculative limits imposed by U.S. regulators.

In the last five years, investments in index funds tied to commodities grew to $260 billion from $13 billion, according to testimony from Michael Masters, managing member of the Virgin Islands-based hedge fund Masters Capital Management.

Sen. Joe Lieberman, I-Conn., has floated a proposal to ban pension funds and other institutional investors from futures exchanges altogether.

Northwest Airlines Corp. Chief Executive Douglas Steenland endorsed that idea Monday, and also urged lawmakers to close loopholes that allow traders to dodge U.S. speculation limits by trading on foreign exchanges or through over-the-counter transactions.

"Our highest priority is to tackle the overall price of fuel which is now 40 percent of our cost pie," Steenland told lawmakers. "Addressing excessive speculation is the most immediate remedy Congress could deliver."

The debate over oil speculation spilled onto the campaign trail over the weekend with presumptive presidential contenders Sens. Barack Obama, D-Ill., and John McCain, R-Ariz., sparring over who would be tougher on policing energy futures markets.


SV/ Not surprising you haven't heard about this Joe. It is apparently being kept out of most the media news sources for some strange reason.

quote:

Speculators have increased their share of oil futures contracts on the Nymex to 71 percent this year, up from 37 percent in 2000, according to figures released by Stupak's office. At the same time contracts held by traditional oil users have fallen to less than 30 percent from over 60 percent.