This thread is for general Driver discussions. Don't worry about going off topic. If you want to comment on another person's post, go right ahead. If you want to bring up a new subject, then bring it. If you bring up something of interest, we'll discuss it at length. If it's not interesting, well... at least you got to bring it up.
Hopefully matt jon and Driverman will grace this thread with their driver lists.

Driver's four greatest assets in my opinion are (or were):

1. Free Roaming. Large cities, and destructible environments.
2. Film Director. Possibly the most innovative and important feature in previous games, ridiculously discarded in DPL.
3. Great Car Handling. Again, downplayed in DPL.
4. A Sense of Realism. Driver used to feel like a real world adventure game until DPL came along as a cartoon ripoff of Grand Theft Auto!


I'll be glad when Driver76 is finished. Not because I want to play it, but because I want DPL to be H.I.S.T.O.R.Y.
Then Reflections can get back to the real "roots" of Driver.
As much as I've loved the Driver series, this is Driver's absolutely, positively, last chance as far as I'm concerned.
If they don't get it right with the next game (not D76, I mean the next real Driver game) then I'm sooo done with it!
Driver will take it's place in my personal hall of fame games, never to be enjoyed as a continuing story again.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: KORTECK,

Good thread.

Amen to the whole spiel on D76, a game which should not come out for 140 years (going by the order of numbering sequels that is).

Although I have not read up on it, I believe D76 is not being made by Reflections, instead its probably being made by some new, small development studio. Reflections is definately working on the real next Driver game, because they're definately not working on Stuntman, which is sad, but saves them some time.

Here's hoping you're right about Reflections.
I'd also love to play a new Stuntman, but honestly, I'd much rather play the next Driver. So that's good news to me.

*matt jon, I wish you and Driverman would consider copying your lists to this thread.
It would give us a good base to start with.

...and where the hell is actiondreamer?

quote:

Originally posted by matt__jon:
Good thread.

Amen to the whole spiel on D76, a game which should not come out for 140 years (going by the order of numbering sequels that is).

Although I have not read up on it, I believe D76 is not being made by Reflections, instead its probably being made by some new, small development studio. Reflections is definately working on the real next Driver game, because they're definately not working on Stuntman, which is sad, but saves them some time.

Actually, the other developer, Sumo Digital ltd., is working along side Reflections to work on the game because it would make no sense to include Reflections' name as the developer(s) working on the game. For instance, both Ubisoft Paris and Redstorm worked on GRAW (Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter).

And about those opinions, I'd say that I only agree about 2,3, and 4 because free-roaming was never ever made any better than GTA's, so it would be unfortunate to call its free-roam gameplay fun. Hell, I didn't think of it fun at all from how little there was for you to do in D2, D3, and DPL. It is a dissapointment as to how the free-roaming gameplay has turned out to be and quite francally, it isn't something that's needed for the driver series. Calling the Driver franchise as being in the setting of a city doesn't mean that it should automatically offer total freedom for the player when it could just be focused strictly on driving instead. That would've been better if Reflections was restricted to free-roam gameplay and instead turned its entire focus on the hollywood styled car chases and the driving.

Why should Reflections waste it on the driver franchise with the free-roam gameplay when it has often been getting out of hand and when it could ruin the driver series as it did with D3 and DPL. Therefore, if Reflections wants to work on free-roam gameplay, I think that the best idea would be for Reflections to start from scratch on that and have it be something completely new. If they start from scratch, they could possibly come up with the best concepts available in gaming and others that haven't been thought of yet, so why don't they do that instead of boreing us with the GTA gameplay and not very new for any game to come?

Isn't it true that Rockstar North may focus on an MMOG, ever since we heard of that one game that David Jones was said to be working on (it isn't Crackdown)? They're probably going to push the freedom experience way further than that is seen so far, even in any MMOG, and I don't find very much that can be done to change this.

Maybe Reflections could even work on different kinds of driving games or work on a driving franchise that focuses broadly on every single aspect that is known for driving. It would be awesome to do racing, stunts, or even jobs for when it comes to crime, would it not? This is the kind of experience I want Reflections to expand on as they are known for loving cars and vehicles, so much. Not to mention, they want to make the driving experience as best as possible, so why not go with a variety of different jobs and experiences for the player to see when it comes to driving?

quote:

Originally posted by Assaultmachine1:
free-roaming was never ever made any better than GTA's, so it would be unfortunate to call its free-roam gameplay fun. Hell, I didn't think of it fun at all from how little there was for you to do in D2, D3, and DPL.

Driver 1 was one of the first (maybe even the first) free roam, open world games I ever played.
It may not be a front runner in that department today, but it certainly was once.
I never had a boring moment with D1 & 2. Being able to lead the cops on those insane chases, anywhere through the map I wanted, kept me entertained for hours on end.

Okay. I can understand what you're saying, KORTECK, but what about the other paragraphs? You don't think that I'm right about how Reflections should work on driving games that allow for different jobs and experiences for when it comes to the driving?

Of course you're right. Absolutely they should.

Hey, btw... there's no need to cap all the letters in my nick. Lower case is fine.

Sure, the series was better way back before they got into more gameplay than just driving, but thats no reason to completely limit the gameplay just to driving. If they did that, they'd need to do one hell of a job on it to sell people. Not that they shouldn't try to do the best job ever, but they also need to focus on other gameplay elements than just driving, to improve the longevity of the game.

It's not that they must do it. They could do whatever they'd like.

Heck, if DPL was a very different game from the Driver series and still ended up better than D3, I don't see any reason why changing the next Driver games and having them only focus on driving would lower the franchise.

The key to making a good game is knowing the genre well, highering the best kind of people suited for the job, and making sure to do well on both pre-production, during production, and after production. If Reflections does all of this the right way, they will be able to succeed no matter what happens.

Actually, I admit that I would like to see Reflections be doing free-roam gameplay too, but if Reflections screws up the free-roam gameplay in D4, I will say then that the driving is the only thing that should stay in the driver franchise.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Assaultmachine1,

As in my thread from the Atari forums, I wouldn't hate the next game if it was only driving, heck, I still play D1 on PC from time to time. Driving is what Reflections is good at, and apparently, nothing else is (sorry Reflections), though a variety of gameplay is important, I feel. When I play Driver 1, I get tired of just driving, and since thats all there is to do, I just quit the game.

It seems like Reflections still haven't realised the importance of other gameplay or how to execute it. Mostly I think they just look at GTA and put a weak verion of whatever the newest game has into Driver without thinking into what would be cool to do beyond what GTA has already done. They try to emulate what GTA has already done because thats whats popular, but they don't realise that they could do something they thought of and pull it off if they did it the way they wanted it.

quote:

Originally posted by matt__jon:
As in my thread from the Atari forums, I wouldn't hate the next game if it was only driving, heck, I still play D1 on PC from time to time. Driving is what Reflections is good at, and apparently, nothing else is (sorry Reflections), though a variety of gameplay is important, I feel. When I play Driver 1, I get tired of just driving, and since thats all there is to do, I just quit the game.

It seems like Reflections still haven't realised the importance of other gameplay or how to execute it. Mostly I think they just look at GTA and put a weak verion of whatever the newest game has into Driver without thinking into what would be cool to do beyond what GTA has already done. They try to emulate what GTA has already done because thats whats popular, but they don't realise that they could do something they thought of and pull it off if they did it the way they wanted it.

You make a strong point and I must say that you're right. It doesn't seem right that Reflections doesn't ever thinking of putting together anything they ever thought in the right way because they think that they aren't capable of doing it, but they may actually realize that they are. Reflections works their butt off only to wind up with elements that aren't very new of any free-roam games and that possibly came from the GTA games.

Maybe it's simply because Reflections isn't working as best as it can. If Reflections was to work harder and longer than before, I'm sure that we'd see a much better Driver game.

As seen in D3, the longer you work on a game deosn't necesarily mean it'll be better. There comes a time when you gotta **** or get off the **** pot.

Humm.

Driver needs more action! Improve the car chases at least to the Driver 1 level where they actually chased you ad didn't lose you, keep the traffic from DPL, add more destruction, vehicular and other, and improve the on foot so we can do so much more, with more on foot abilities and a much more interesting city, use your instinct, just add stuff that logically should be in the game, leave no part empty.

quote:

Originally posted by matt__jon:
As seen in D3, the longer you work on a game deosn't necesarily mean it'll be better. There comes a time when you gotta **** or get off the **** pot.

Yes, that's simply true, but it usually only accounts for games that are licensed and what I mean by that is that they are being merchandised or used in some other ways for entertainment. For example, there is said to be another Duke Nukem game, which has been in the works for quite a while now, and there's going to be a movie adaption of it too, so the developer is probably trying to help out with the film in some way and when you work on several things at once, there's a chance that it may screw you up.

Driv3r, I can make an honest guess on why it did poorly. I should say that it's the Run The Gauntlet's fault. Reflections shouldn't have done anything to the franchise that makes it stray somewhat from the game. If they were to forget about the Run the Gauntlet and be able to work through the game instead of going through an agreement of having a clip be made for the game, it would maybe have brought more time for them and allowed them to make a much better job. Also, you can say that it's the game testers fault for not looking too well on the bugs/glitches and that Atari was rushing Reflections. Therefore, a lot of problems could result in an even bigger one.

Now that Ubisoft is willing to put the Driver franchise to great use, I'm hoping that they will not give any big problems for Reflections on their games. Also, I hope that we do not see another Run The Gauntlet, as they usually suck, and that the newer people that they hire won't be of any trouble to the game(s) that they are working on.

quote:

Originally posted by matt__jon:
Driver needs more action! Improve the car chases at least to the Driver 1 level where they actually chased you ad didn't lose you, keep the traffic from DPL, add more destruction, vehicular and other, and improve the on foot so we can do so much more, with more on foot abilities and a much more interesting city, use your instinct, just add stuff that logically should be in the game, leave no part empty.

I agree. Reflections must expand the gameplay and the concept of the Driver franchise as best as possible, so that we can rely on them better and be able to expect a great game out of it.

RTG is not the work of Reflections. Its the work of Atari. And yes it was stupid, there wasn't even that much excitement to be found in watching it, a car sped around for a few blocks and then there was a big explosion. The money they spent on making it would have been MUCH better spent fixing glitches in D3, though I'm not sure how much it would've done since it was so late in the games creation, the best thing they could've done is gone back and started the code from scratch. They'd already have the levels done, pretty much every graphical aspect should've been done by then. They could've added more cars, secrets, interaction. But instead Atari decided to waste their money on a commercial because they knew the game sucked, they need to make it look better by associating the action seen in a commercial with the game that they were gonna rush out because they were going bankrupt and needed the money. I hope they learned rushing a game doesn't pay off. They were thinking it was gonna sell 10 million copies too. I think it was more like a 5th of that and a lot of copies were returned or set on fire.

So I finally saw Bullit yesterday. Well, I saw the chase between the Mustang and the Charger. Pretty sweet chase, but it got me to thinking
(a)we definately need San Fransisco in the next game
(b)They need to make a lense filter that is optional but makes the game look like a movie made in the late 60's or 70's

quote:

Originally posted by matt__jon:
RTG is not the work of Reflections. Its the work of Atari. And yes it was stupid, there wasn't even that much excitement to be found in watching it, a car sped around for a few blocks and then there was a big explosion. The money they spent on making it would have been MUCH better spent fixing glitches in D3, though I'm not sure how much it would've done since it was so late in the games creation, the best thing they could've done is gone back and started the code from scratch. They'd already have the levels done, pretty much every graphical aspect should've been done by then. They could've added more cars, secrets, interaction. But instead Atari decided to waste their money on a commercial because they knew the game sucked, they need to make it look better by associating the action seen in a commercial with the game that they were gonna rush out because they were going bankrupt and needed the money. I hope they learned rushing a game doesn't pay off. They were thinking it was gonna sell 10 million copies too. I think it was more like a 5th of that and a lot of copies were returned or set on fire.

Yes. It was a real shame to see Atari go ahead and do that. I hope that Ubisoft won't be that stupid as Atari.

Reflections/Ubisoft: "Edge of your seat, fast paced Driving Action". That's one thing that will make Driver 5 a hit. One way to achieve that is with more camera views, closer to the action, like the interior dash view, hood or close 3rd person vehicle views. Same goes for on foot, including FPS controls and over the shoulder.

Cameras make a big difference is how players experience the game. Zoom too far out, and it detaches some of the excitment; "Spider-Man 2" as an example.

I was bored so I drew this.

http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u90/Drivergrl/?actio...w¤t=lola-1.jpg

I messed up a bit but good enough.