O.k. nearly all of you are better pilots then me, but it all goes horribly wrong every now and then for everyone right?

I managed to scrape abit of online play which I thoughally enjoyed. I actually improved and even managed 3 kills and a landing without dying! XD I'm getting a feel for dogfighting and stuff and it's incredably rewarding. My question is... What do YOU do when it all goes abit wong? I found when I was on top I knew what I was doing, but every now and then some one would bounce me and I'd end with no energy. My initial instict is to dive, but that isn't always possible and as I learnt (the hard way) when playing Humans isn't quiet as effective as I'd hopped. Oh and BTW, all you Tempest pilots out there... Don't try and dive away from a P-47, that ends badly. Like, floating half way across Normandy badly.

Anyway, what would you do when someone is behind you with more energy then you have?

I do have one secret maneuver I made up and it works quite well.

I cant tell you guys anymore about it.

We all know that trick. Ctrl-E aint that secret

No, its not that.

Pray to "il2 god".

Seriously, low and slow, with enemy coming in fast, go for a vertical scissors with some jinking, it will throw their aim off at least. Always do what they wont expect.

I actualy never find myself pushing Ctrl-E!

Firstly, why would you dive away from a P-47 - in a Tempest?

Secondly, if you are bounced by someone with higher E state, do execute some maneouver that he can't follow or shoot at you. Knowing your and enemy plane is imperative.

Example - if you are in a Spit and are bounced by a diving 109 - turn hard. His controls will be locked at high speed so he won't be able to follow your maneouver.

If you are in a 109 and bounced by a diving spit, dive nearly to your dive limit - he won't be able to follow since spits have lower break up speed compared to 109s.

well you could always..............

I expect you to die Mr. Bond....


No, but seriously, if I end up low and slow with someone comming right up me empanage at high speed I just do a large barrel roll and most of the time they fly right past, after that though I don't know cause I'm still low and slow and they come back and I die, lol.

quote:

Firstly, why would you dive away from a P-47 - in a Tempest?

+1000

I think you should try at the very least flying in the "Skies of Valor" SoV Server

-cockpit always on and realistic planesets

it's a pretty mature band of pilots

except for the occasional [kid?] that constantly bombards the chat bar and refuses to go comms

I would dive away from a P-47 in a Tempest...the two should be close by all accounts. But I wouldn't make it a flat dive...it'd be a spiral dive. Difficult to follow such a dive even if its two of the same type.

If I really get into trouble (low and slow) and I'm not damaged then I do my darnedest to regain speed. At that point speed is more important than altitude because WWII fighters have to trade most of their speed for any altitude so the goal at that point is to build your speed reserve that you can translate into a climb in an emergency.

Aside from that its the "simple" things like turning into attacks, changing height and direction to throw off pursuit, or if the situation dictates then trimming for flat out acceleration and dive to treetop level. If you do get bounced I like to pull into the attack and then I roll opposite and do rudder skid while presenting the least possible cross section. Makes for a very difficult target as you're presenting your thinnest profile while moving at a 90 degree angle while changing position horizontally.

None of this is fool proof. In a bad situation you can try and make it better but its very hard.

You should follow the basic rules of air combat that have been in place since boelke's dicta in WWI.

Oswald Boelke and the Eight Rules of Air Combat

Air combat has changed dramatically since World War I. Basic tactics and rules established by Oswald Boeleke in 1916, however, have stood the test of time well. He gave new pilots eight rules of air combat to help them survive and win.

1* Try to secure an advantage before you begin your attack. This advantage could be altitude, position, or surprise.

2* Always carry through with an attack once you've started.

3* Fire only at close range and when your opponent is properly in your sights.

4* Always keep your eye on your opponent. Don't be deceived by ruses.

5* Always attack from behind your opponent.

6* When attacked, turn into the attack; don't try to evade. Always be on the offensive.

7* When over enemy lines, never forget your own line of retreat. When your fuel and/or weapons are low, start thinking about how you're going to get back to base.

8* Attack in groups of four or six.

There are at least a half dozen maneuvers you can do to elude an attacker, but it will rely more on your skill and timing when to use them.

For now i would practice and keep in mind the following two fundamentals:

Combat flaps help extend the flight envelope to allow for a sharper turn.

If you are slower than your attacker, you can turn sharper before blacking out.

so practice more and watch what your opponents do when you have the advantage.

I find that the most effective way to rid myself of an attacker is as follows:

High speed bouncer: a bit of a dive to pick up speed and then a sharp turn, when he's just about in range, won't be able to follow the turn because of higher speed

Someone faster catching up to me: combat flaps, turn around, go head on. If in a FW 190 do a head on attack, if in anything else I go head on and then pass him from his underside.

If the attacker is coming in for a B&Z attack and so has a very great speed advantage i prefer to do a Split-S. Since high speeds realy hampers roll-rate this is a sure way to spoil the attack.

If you manage to do a properly timed linking of two or more maneuvers attacker wont probably shoot at you at all. Doesn't matter even if he shoots, he wont hit .
Say... you fly Yak and are jumped by Bf-109. Start your level turning, smart 109 will descend dive at full throttle at your level or even a bit below you. As soon as he enters effective gun range straighten your aircraft from turn and pull hard up vertically... he can only watch and cry as he doesn't have rudder big enough to compensate that . Plus you are showing him only your profile, the smallest possible area to hit.
Note that, if you do that too soon, you will be a perfect target drone .

If you on the other hand sit there in your plane and calculate the best time to start maneuvering, chances are high you're gonna be hit if the other guy is good .

BTW you cannot compare tactics on locked pit/no externals with something easier i.e. locket pit externals on etc.
Those tactics are very different.

Just one example, on realistic server no one can track you when you do negative G maneuver under his nose (simple, he can't see you ), many times you will actually escape (by split s or something, attacker loses sight on you, you jump to nearest cloud and you're saved).
On the other hand that wont work at all on open pit etc.

WoW! I leave you alone for a couple of days and look. Amazing responsess guys (Y) even if the initial ones were a tad confusing Hehe

Thank you very much thats given me allot to think about, and, God some of you realy know what your talking about eh? XD I'll read over them a couple more times and try and put them into practice againt AI and hopefully, eventuly, agains humans. Thank you very much, you guys are great

And BTW I was on Skies of valour when I dived fromt the P-47 and I did it becasue I was unfamilier with it's dive capabilities and was always told that the Tempest was absolutly fantastic in a dive. lol

quote:

Originally posted by Freiwillige:
You should follow the basic rules of air combat that have been in place since boelke's dicta in WWI.

Oswald Boelke and the Eight Rules of Air Combat

Air combat has changed dramatically since World War I. Basic tactics and rules established by Oswald Boeleke in 1916, however, have stood the test of time well. He gave new pilots eight rules of air combat to help them survive and win.

1* Try to secure an advantage before you begin your attack. This advantage could be altitude, position, or surprise.

2* Always carry through with an attack once you've started.

3* Fire only at close range and when your opponent is properly in your sights.

4* Always keep your eye on your opponent. Don't be deceived by ruses.

5* Always attack from behind your opponent.

6* When attacked, turn into the attack; don't try to evade. Always be on the offensive.

7* When over enemy lines, never forget your own line of retreat. When your fuel and/or weapons are low, start thinking about how you're going to get back to base.

8* Attack in groups of four or six.

This advice is pure gold. Fancy manuevers are a poor substitute for situational awareness and forethought before engaging an enemy.

Indivudual aircraft performance is not nearly as important as the relative energy state of the aircraft involved.

Learn to recognise when you are losing a fight, you need to disengage well before your adversairy has latched onto your six.

Things like superior dive/climb performance are a great advantage but do nothing to outrun bullets.

All that aside the best single defensive manuever to learn well is the rolling scissors.
Properly executed the rolling scissors is all about you maintaining as much energy as possible while forcing the trailing aircraft to burn his trying to close the gap.

http://www.combataircraft.com/tactics/scissors.aspx

Dont fall into the temptation of popping your flaps every turn or dropping your gear to force an overshoot, it will only work vs. novice pilots and is a poor habit you will have to unlearn as your skills advance.

quote:

Originally posted by SILVERFISH1992:
I actualy never find myself pushing Ctrl-E!

What did you re-assign it to?