After trying for weeks to do anything in this wonder plane besides down newbies and b-17s in QMs and running like h**l from every other plane that can out maneuver me (ie, every other plane) I've decided I agree with the soviets:

"The FW-190 burns just as well as any plane, and it's easier to hit."

This is not because I am a n00b, I ain't, don't let the number of posts fool you. I can fly fine.

I patiently await a rain of large caliber insults.

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:
After trying for weeks to do anything in this wonder plane besides down newbies and b-17s in QMs and running like h**l from every other plane that can out maneuver me (ie, every other plane) I've decided I agree with the soviets:

"The FW-190 burns just as well as any plane, and it's easier to hit."

This is not because I am a n00b, I ain't, don't let the number of posts fool you. I can fly fine.

I patiently await a rain of large caliber insults.

Yeah but in the A series that big chunky semi bullet-proof engine does make it a bit easier to park behind bombers and pump them full of 20mm goodness at convergence though.

quote:

Originally posted by WTE_Galway:

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:
After trying for weeks to do anything in this wonder plane besides down newbies and b-17s in QMs and running like h**l from every other plane that can out maneuver me (ie, every other plane) I've decided I agree with the soviets:

"The FW-190 burns just as well as any plane, and it's easier to hit."

This is not because I am a n00b, I ain't, don't let the number of posts fool you. I can fly fine.

I patiently await a rain of large caliber insults.

Yeah but in the A series that big chunky semi bullet-proof engine does make it a bit easier to park behind bombers and pump them full of 20mm goodness at convergence though.

True. Even at 600m you can easily down bombers.

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:
don't let the number of posts fool you.

Dont worry it dosent fool anyone.

quote:

Originally posted by steiner562:

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:
don't let the number of posts fool you.

Dont worry it dosent fool anyone.

+1


And BTW chunkydora... you may have some interest to watch this track, features me and Brain32 killing 7 allied aircraft on WarClouds in one sortie in FW-190D's (I regard that plane as uber noob plane BTW );
http://www.esnips.com/doc/7ae9b33a-f7df-4a2b-b644-edd81...naFW190D-3xEA-WC-405

...while you're at it, be sure to check a nice JG27*CRASH track, he shot down four allied aircraft;
http://www.esnips.com/doc/eb104508-04ed-4d3e-bafe-76d9e...ASHFW190A-4EA-WC-408

...and just to be noted - these tracks (FW killing multiple E/A in one sortie) aren't hard to find at all .
And on WarClouds you mostly aren't up against newbies...
So pardon me for not understanding WTH are you talking about .

Come on DKoor... I fly the 110 all the time on Warclouds and I have a lot of tracks where I down 4 or 5 enemy aircrafts per sortie. It's not the plane, it's the pilot. And the team play.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: tragentsmith,

quote:

Originally posted by tragentsmith:
Come on DKoor... I fly the 110 all the time on Warclouds and I have a lot of tracks where I down 4 or 5 enemy aircrafts per sortie. It's not the plane, it's the pilot. And the time play.

basically

The more evenly matched the plane, the more it's about the pilot. I am not saying that it isn't a good (even "uber") plane, but only in the right hands. In my hands, it's a horrible plane. In your hands DKoor it's a great plane. But don't take an insult to your favorite plane personally. IL-2 is a very realistic game, and in a way you can 'feel' the plane. The 190 and I vibrate on different wavelengths. That's all I'm saying.

quote:

Originally posted by tragentsmith:
Come on DKoor... I fly the 110 all the time on Warclouds and I have a lot of tracks where I down 4 or 5 enemy aircrafts per sortie. It's not the plane, it's the pilot. And the team play.

I bet you wont find so many tracks of P-51D killing 4 or more per sortie, no matter the pilot or the plane...
Sure thing, there are some pilots who achieved 6 or more kills in P-51D @ WC (these are more exceptions to the rule ), but everyone and their mothers knows that FW is the ultimate killing machine in IL2.

That has nothing to do with the pilot, but rather the fact that you have 4x20mm and that kills everything by just looking at it.

So yes, I see that I obviously disagree with you.

There is a sea of difference in Fw190 chances of succsess in 1v1 (starting with same E level, or even with a bogey on its tail) or on closed pit, externals off, populated server where you can indeed bag multiple unwary bogies per sortie.

So, DKoor and Chunky, you are both actually right, just probably not discussing the same thing.

chunkydora, the 190 is a different sort of aircraft and needs a different train of thought when flying. Using its vastly superior roll and timing your manouvers just right so you can bring that ****nal to bare. Working in a pair is also something that the 190 excels in. In a pair you only actually need fear a higher P47 (5000m+) or pair of.

quote:

Originally posted by DKoor:

And BTW chunkydora... you may have some interest to watch this track, features me and Brain32 killing 7 allied aircraft on WarClouds in one sortie in FW-190D's (I regard that plane as uber noob plane BTW );

Its not a n00b plane, its just really damn good and has everything a fighter pilot could wish for (View+firepower+speed+harmonized controls). The real plane was really well designed and the IL2 version is very well modelled to that design.

quote:

Originally posted by DKoor:
I bet you wont find so many tracks of P-51D killing 4 or more per sortie, no matter the pilot or the plane...

I got 6, 5 Fockes and a 109G6late on Spits vs 109s all alone, in a P51B... Only one of them was a "silent" kill (he made it back to home with some holes in the airframe). I also have 5 kills of it on a track, I stopped the track on final approach but you can see the to-be-come 6th diving to me.

Anyone?

****

About the FW190... Chunkydora, try flying it with a mate or two in voice comms.

I suggest you start flying biplanes if you want to be sure of 'outmanouvering' the other aircraft rather than outrunning it.

quote:

Originally posted by Jaws2002:

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:

This is not because I am a n00b, I ain't, don't let the number of posts fool you. I can fly fine.

So what you are saying is that all this gazillion n00b questions you bobmbarded the forum with in the last few weeks, (that many people went out of their way to help you with), were just for your amusement?
So you just wanted to get atention pretending you are a n00b?

If yes, then you do suck!

?

I've only owned 46 for a couple months.

Before that I was still with the original IL-2 that I've been playing for a long time.

My memory isn't that good, but if I remember right I asked for tips with some new aircraft I encountered, with help finding a good new stick, and some others. Please bring the gazillion noob questions to my attention, I can't remember them. I appreciate all the help people gave with me with whatever questions I asked. I asked them all in complete sincerity.

Sorry if I have come across incorrectly.

quote:

Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
I suggest you start flying biplanes if you want to be sure of 'outmanouvering' the other aircraft rather than outrunning it.

I don't want to outmaneuver them.

I want to maneuver.

Well, nobody forces you to survive. So have all the fun maneuvering you want

quote:

Originally posted by chunkydora:

quote:

Originally posted by Xiolablu3:
I suggest you start flying biplanes if you want to be sure of 'outmanouvering' the other aircraft rather than outrunning it.

I don't want to outmaneuver them.

I want to maneuver.

In the British report on the FW190, they came to the conclusion that 'The FW190 is more manouverable than the Spitfire V, except in turning circles, where it is easily outturned by the Spitfire.'

Turning circles is only one part of being manouverable.

The RAF found the FW190 incredibly manouverable.

quote:

Originally posted by Xiolablu3:

In the British report on the FW190, they came to the conclusion that 'The FW190 is more manouverable than the Spitfire V, except in turning circles, where it is easily outturned by the Spitfire.'

Turning circles is only one part of being manouverable.

The RAF found the FW190 incredibly manouverable.

If Brits had been flying Oleg's fw-190, their conclusions would be quite different. In the game, fw-190, the only way to go is "drive by shooting" and hunting in large packs, anything else borders suicide. It's laughable how even the P-47, the 7 ton monstroc
sity feels so light and nimble compared to focke. Tempest, which had turning performance similar to fw can run circles around the fw.

There is literally no manuever focke can do to outfly it's opponent unless it has large e advantage. Roll rate is too high at low speeds (not the part of the envelope you'd wan't to be in fw), and too low at high speed (where it counts).

Engine is weak and anemic, even at low alt acceleration is attrocious, pulling a loop almost shuts down the engine (just watch those RPMs drop).

It turns worse then real life FW tested by soviets (crashlanded, very crudely repaired and fitted with a Stuka prop)
I could go for 2 pages writing about how focke has been misrepresented in the game.

3 good points are:
fast at low alt, level speed is rather good, however, it 's acceleration is poor, so you better have some separation, or you'll get caught by planes which have lower max speed-

Good guns, no argument there

Better then late Bf-109s which are next to useless over 400 km/h (the myth of inpossibly stiff controls) and have very low amount of ammo for it's nose howitzer.

Basically, "Oleg" had the idea of FW-190 being huge, heavy gunship, only good for shooting down bombers and Bf-109, only good for setting climb records on short distances. So they made it like that. It doesn't mean they flew like that.

P.S. when I say FW-190, I mean Anton. Dora is what FW-190 should be (notice that it is also easily outturned by Spits, Ponies and just about anything with the red star that managed to get off the ground)

quote:

Originally posted by Bewolf:
Well, nobody forces you to survive. So have all the fun maneuvering you want

Yeah, at least we Würger pilots have good humour but no surprise here: we have all the time in the world to invent new jokes on comms while we are running away, full throttle towards friendly flak, you know... at the exact moment just after the first failed pass

Have you looked at the powerloading and wingloading for the FW, ie RL numbers? It is not particularly powerful for its weight, and it has the highest wingloading of any WW2 fighter except perhaps the Lightning. While these two parameters do not by any means tell the whole picture of performance, they prob explain ~80% of the observed performance.

Tempest has equivalent powerloading to A model 190s and considerably lower wingloading, it should run rings around the A model 190s in the turn.

Considering the British report it has been suggested that the manuevering envelope where it showed all of these advantages may have been well 'over the top' for a spit V. Say 400k and up, at these speeds the 190 will outclimb and outaccelerate the spit. However I can't recall if this was ever substantiated.

Guess I just get a little tired of beefs without data or even a basic grasp of RL parameters and how they relate to RL performance. My grasp is only 'basic', however just a few simple RL numbers suggest to me Oleg is not so far off.

Our ingame tactics are not at all like RL. Our combat is with good SAwareness, sound tactics (BFM and ACM), no fear, and plenty plenty practise. With these conditions do not expect a plane with raw numbers as in wingloading powerloading as in FW to be other than HnR....

My 2c

Thanks guys for the info

A PS to what jaws said: my numerous and frequent posting have not been in any way to draw attention to my self. I see how they may have been annoying to people, and how I may have taken more liberty with my posting than is acceptable. If that is at all the case, I apologize most sincerely.