A few points I want to touch on, that I hope will encourage and spark up interesting ideas mainly, but also awareness for the dev teams aswell as discusion and debate amoungst fans and forum goers:

1) With ''fully emersive environments'' will there be calculated gravity and/or wind for travelling bullets?

One of the greatest things about OPERATION FLASHPIONT and off of its official repackagings is the gravitational pulldown and limitlessness of the distance of a travelling bullet.

FarCry 2 boasts a fully emersive lanscape with a choice of engagement, so... will i be able to engage an area that is within the bullet trajectorys capacity? (possibly up to a 1.5km/1mile with a sniper rifle? Will wind affect it? If not... there is little skill or mastering to be done.
In OpFlash, Skilled snipers would learn to mark and calculate distance and compensate for it accordingly. This make a successful sniper kill from a safe distance 10 times the worthywhile.
Definitly worth a consideration.

2) If the above does apply... perhaps an option to ''ZERO the sights'' by the gamers own calculation of a rough distance. This would be epic and very rewarding.

3) Detail clipping planes (grass/foliage etc). More of a problem when playing online VS or Lan... but Im curious how you will deal with level of detail (LOD) issues when immersed in such a vast environment. (Again this may just be a multiplayer issue). Here is the problem scenario; In game i am hidding in thick foliage, but some guy a mile off can blatently see me as the deatil settings are low and clippiong planes only circumference his POV by whatever his PC can handle. (Oblivion suffered this problem massively).

4)Boiling Point: Road to hell was one of the most promising and anticipated games ever, only to fail so monumentally due to its buggy nature and non aethestic gameplay. I know this will never happen to FC2 but the games are similar and I wonder if FC2 will have as an ambitious storyline side as Boiloing Point attempted.
There is a great juxterpose and feeling of power to be had in fps games when there is the ability to blend back into the surrounding civilization and amoungst the locals and engage the story, action aside.
A great example of this is in STALKER, where you come back into the city/populated district and trade, chat, find out info, train, make contacts etc, but not limited to this, as you can start a war in the city.

5) locals.
Are there locals who are indiffernt to you? Or is it basically the same plot as FC where the island itself is evil.
ASSASSINS CREED does a great job of letting you reemmerse back into the guise of society and normality.

6) Indoor and outdoor.
Other posts have touched on this here: But basically can any one balance the door to door combat of COD4 and RAINBOWSIX VEGAS with the front line open war engagment like OpFLASH, QUAKEWARS and BATTLEFIELD? I dont think this is the game to do that, but whoever does do this successfully WITHOUT loadtimes, wins over the fps market.

7)AI enemy reconition in games has almost always been 0-1 (on or off instantaneously) and it is simply unrealistic and off putting. The reality is that the human condition ''normally'' would rather find the most hassle-free possibility and probe rather than put your life on the line.
These subtleties can distinguish the ''run&gun'' from the quality games.
For example: CRYSIS;... I have a friend who made the ''OBLIVION Quake mod'' in 2000 and worked on Counter-strike amoungst other games who felt some kind of apathy for the first time ever when taking out an AI character. That was no small statment coming from him.

8)This JUST poped into my head...
Every magazine should KEEP the amount of bullets in them. People should get pro and skilled at subconsciously knowing how many rounds they have left and relaoding efficiently. REAL.

9)Anyone who suggested ''REST TIME'', ''HEALING TIME'', ''RECUPERATION TIME'' or ''SLEEP TIME'' is a total idiot of the first order.
Go play an RPG.

You will lose enough sleep as it is playing this game... its an action game, you dont have to sleep. If you want to sleep so badly, just go to sleep in real, wake up... and unpause the game.
(thats just had to be said) lolz

10)Silencers; what effect?
Silencers look cool in every game, but hardly do they make a differnce. They should allow you to sweep a whole town (with skill) without alerting a single enemy. COD4 has handled this brilliantly and righteously. Will FC2 have this capability?

Another consideration is that the stopping power of the weapon is greatly reduced.

For the sake of fun gameply, I love the fact that for RAINBOW SIX VEGAS they just decided on silencers for ALL weapons... again, the FC2 setting doesnt really account for any justification of this.

Ideally, depending on weather one uses a silencer or not, one should be able to approach any scenario with at least 2 outcomes; getting busted, or not (regardless of living or dieing).

On the flip-side, silencers are a bit 'high-tech' and dont necessarily fit into the 'lost in the wild' gritty feeling I get when looking at those epic screenshots.

11)Kill or be killed and nothign in between...
Something that simply isnt done enough:
Disarming an enemy. Not in the METAL GEAR fashion, but if you shoot and hit someones gun directly, it normally springs out of thier hand or breaks. This should be a very rare but realistic intricate occurance but I understand that technically its a headache.

Therafter comes all the dozens of ideas that come with a disarmed enemy. They run, they fight, they taunt you, they plead, hostage, human shield, suicide, backup weapon etc etc?

Many many ideas. But this may limit the action rather than hype it if its done badly.
Ideally you should be able to get a bad shot in, and dismantle thier weapon or get it to spring from thier grip and move on. Ultimately just a detail in the background.

12)Me againtst the world.

Lastly I just want to throw out a quick note or discussion on how many non-linear, fully immersive games are very; 'me against the world' and lack depth and feeling towards any singluar person... especially when mowing down hundreds of enemies.
One idea is that each base or area of men would have a ranking soldier...and targeting and killing him will throw the AI organizational skills and team working abilities into more disarray.
So you have the choice to bust in guns blazing or target the top 3 ranking men, then the rest.

Then there is the whole notion on HOW to recognise thier rank. Is there a notable insignia, or perhaps thier behavior? Is someone saluting another? Does he salute yet another? Or does one have a most expensive weapon? A gold AK perhaps...etc etc

Just a potential talking point.

Anyway, I suppose thats it for now. Im sure I will add more soon. I hope Ive inspired some talking points, especially to the dev team.
If any developers do find thier way here, please let us know as its extermely rewarding to know that your actively looking outside of the facility for ever more ideas.

Massive respect for your talent and work!
PK

All excellent points. I agree the key to making an excellent game is having everything based on realism. One realism aspect that must and will happen in future shooters, is in multilayer mode being able to hear other players as they chat over team speak just as you would hear them in real life. So the closer you get to them, the more you can here them chatting to team mates and while their voice would attenuate the further away you are. So when in a cat and mouse situation, players would actually be contentious of talking at you're machine due to the possibility of a player on the opposite side hearing you if they are close.

I have yet to play an online game that does this. People can just grabber away with no interaction of the other team.

CL

Loads of good points there mate, bit of a headache to read it all though...

I am right there with you on the bullet trajectory. They've said that wind will not affect bullet tragectory, but there's always hope. Anyway, I will say this: If the devs integrate a realistic long distance shooting simulation into FC2, I will masturbate ceremoniously.

Oh boy. You may have to wait for a mod for realistic gunplay. It's just a question of whether you can you hold out for that long, TorsionFracture. It'll probably be worth it.

Yeah, they did say no wind effects on bullets, but I can't remember, did that include RPGs? I think they only arc due to gravity, at least I hope they do that.

Hocking said that wind doesn't affect bullet or grenade ballistics.

And I can hold out as long as I have to, thank you very much. One day, one sweet day...

quote:

Originally posted by Chunky_Lover:
All excellent points. I agree the key to making an excellent game is having everything based on realism. One realism aspect that must and will happen in future shooters, is in multilayer mode being able to hear other players as they chat over team speak just as you would hear them in real life. So the closer you get to them, the more you can here them chatting to team mates and while their voice would attenuate the further away you are. So when in a cat and mouse situation, players would actually be contentious of talking at you're machine due to the possibility of a player on the opposite side hearing you if they are close.

I have yet to play an online game that does this. People can just grabber away with no interaction of the other team.

CL

Well, try and play Far Cry Instincts, that game had it, even when you zoom in with binoculars, the more you zoom in at an enemy the better you can hear them. And i don't think realism is very important to a game cause, if it's to realistic it would be very boring( these days most soldiers never killed anyone)

serious failure by everyone on this forum to give me an answer on anything besides the NO GRAVITY answer... to question 1.

Where is the love? where is the discussion.
I think 99% of people on this forum ar enot intellectual enough to ENGAGE it.

Bring on the developers and programmers and story designers... etc...
COME ON.

Hows this:

1> No
2> Not applicable as answer to 1 is "no"
3> Aimed at devs - so only a dev could provide an answer.
4> It offers 'open gameplay', going off recent Play.Com Live video - Im bordering on "yes", but only a dev could answer accurately.
5> See above
6> *looks to devs*
7> Not a question, more of a statement, which again would require a dev to answer
8> FC1 supported this for MP, would be cool as option in FC2 SP - but not forced on people - some people prefer 'arcade' action to 'realistic'.
9>
10> * looks to devs for silencer effect *
11> Would be cool - not a clue if it will be in FC2
12> See #11 ^

Lastly, theres plenty of love

response to silencer topic: I hope they can do that. Players could have even more options
A: Run in with guns blazing
B: Snipe from afar, then move in and do what needs to be done
C: Sneak in at night, silently eliminate patrolling guards with silenced pistols and melee, and then get the Flamethrower out....
mwahahahahahahaha Seriously though that would be awesome, and that's only a few possibilities.