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View Full Version : this sucks. ATI admits to cheats on 3D benchmarks



Hawgdog
06-15-2003, 07:01 PM
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20030526040035.html

says it all........time to delete 3D and find a better benchmark to test my stuff.
Sisoft Sandra...?

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Hawgdog
06-15-2003, 07:01 PM
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20030526040035.html

says it all........time to delete 3D and find a better benchmark to test my stuff.
Sisoft Sandra...?

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XyZspineZyX
06-15-2003, 08:11 PM
Hawgdog,

Read this second paragraph again:

-----------------------------------------------------------
"According to ATI's representative quoted by Beyond3D in their editorial over here, the 1.9% performance gain came from optimization of the two DirectX 9.0 shaders (water and sky) in Game Test 4. ATI rendered the scene exactly as intended by Futuremark, in full-precision floating point. Their shaders were mathematically and functionally identical to Futuremark's and there were no visual artifacts; according to ATI Technologies, the company simply shuffled instructions to take advantage of their architecture. ATI states that these were exactly the sort of optimizations that work in games to improve frame rates without reducing image quality and as such, were a realistic approach to a benchmark intended to measure in-game performance. However, ATI recognized that these can be used by some people to call into question the legitimacy of the benchmark results, and so they would remove them from their driver as soon as is physically possible. They expect them to be gone by the next release of CATALYST. "
----------------------------------------------------------

This was after Nvidia was caught not rendering the scenes properly outside the rails of the scene. Nvidia had in the vicinity of a 20% cheat in their drivers specifically designed for this benchmark.

The only reason ATI said anything about this "optimization" was to be straight up that with enough digging someone could accuse them of the same thing. Even though it was not even remotely the same thing. ATI even went on to say that they will be removing the optimization even though futuremark said what they did was exactly what they expect drivers to do for better gameplay without the loss of image quality.

You should use a benchmark from the games you play anyway. These are synthetic benchmarks and do not give a reliable outlook on overall playability and image quality of actual games.





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Hawgdog
06-15-2003, 08:29 PM
Hey Artjunky, long time no chat. What bummed me out was the coming clean before getting caught comment.
However I missed the part they will remove this "fix" with the next driver series.
I guess WE should have all assumed that both Nvidia and ATI would optimize the drivers to get high scores on 3D, it seems that is the temple of video card tests and its all over the net for comparisons....
That 3DMark03 is one serious test! If you are overclocked too far it will crash and burn!

ok, catch you airborne



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XyZspineZyX
06-15-2003, 09:43 PM
Ati came clean even though their "cheating" under certain definitions and semantics is "optimizing" while nvidia's underhandedness was clearly "cheating."

Their respons was much more valid and comendable than nvidia's.


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XyZspineZyX
06-15-2003, 10:15 PM
Just another nail in the coffin for ATI.

Kudos to them for keeping Nvidia on it's toes though.

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XyZspineZyX
06-15-2003, 10:36 PM
RayBanJockey wrote:
- Just another nail in the coffin for ATI.
-
- Kudos to them for keeping Nvidia on it's toes
- though.

Ray did you read that article....just curious....

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XyZspineZyX
06-16-2003, 07:16 AM
Bearcat99 wrote:
- Ray did you read that article....just curious....

LOL.

It's pretty obvious he didn't, as usual.

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Hunter82
06-16-2003, 10:29 AM
I didn't know ATI built coffins for Nvidia...... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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Hawgdog
06-16-2003, 01:12 PM
Hunter82 wrote:
- I didn't know ATI built coffins for Nvidia......


Yeah, its called Radeon




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XyZspineZyX
06-16-2003, 04:38 PM
Of course he didnâ´t read the article. Heâ´s a hardcore nVidia fanboy!!

XyZspineZyX
06-18-2003, 10:05 AM
my 8500LE gets such a low 3DMk03 score that I'm sure the cheating mechanism does not work /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

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XyZspineZyX
06-18-2003, 04:33 PM
Well to be honest both Nvidia can be called as "cheating" or "optimizing" or whatever in 3dmark 2003 among other benchmarks.

The last thing I have heard is that both ATI and nVidia got caught with using some application detection mechanism for the nature benchmark in 3dmark 2003 where the 5900 U dropped from 74 fps to 42 fps and the 9800 PRO from 66-42.
The same was found for the 5900 U in UT 2K3 among others.

Also installing the 330 patch caused a dramatic performance drop for the 5900 Ultra card which smells fishy.

Anyway the manufacturers goes to great lengths to fool us customers.