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Jeeguiguren
05-02-2012, 02:45 PM
Hello Ghosts!

As many of you have noticed, recent beta-tests have had the first confirmed "public" appearance of cheats used in GRO. First and foremost, we would like to reassure the community that battling cheating is a top priority for the team, and these disturbances are not going ignored - in fact we've had tracking methods in place for several betas that allow us to detect many of these incidents.

Our programming team has also been hard at work putting multiple-measures in place to secure the game against those cheats that are beyond detection. This is in fact one of the driving reasons why GRO relies on Dedicated Servers to operate the game-matches, allowing us to implement more robust verification of in-game actions by players. Of course - our other priority is to never let such effort interfere with the game-experience itself, or degrade the game-functionality when new security measures are implemented or enabled in a particular beta-build.

With this in mind - the planned rollout of security measures follows an incremental path, where you'll see more and more features on this front in upcoming patches, but with each step allowing us to thoroughly test the new functionality to avoid negatively impacting the game before activating the next measures.

Roughly speaking, our security work currently falls into three broad categories:



3rd party cheat protection software - this has been in on-going tests since our first Beta, to guarantee we will not impair the end-user experience when its full-feature set is enabled.


Server-side verification of in-game actions, this is again an on-going effort that balances in-game performance/experience, resource usage and accuracy of invalid actions performed by players.


General hardening of local-game binaries against typical intrusion attacks.


Tracking & analysis of potential cheats that aren't caught by any of the above - this is as much a technical exercise as it is training our GMs to understand what constitutes potential cheats and how to investigate when such occurrences are reported.



As part of this ongoing effort, the next Beta-period will come with a few countermeasures specific to hacks that have already been observed in the wild, as well as increased tracking of such activities. Additionally, we're targeting to start enabling functionality of our 3rd party cheat protection software sometime during this period as well.

The members of our Security Team are committed to making this game as grief-free an experience as possible, and work closely with other teams on the game to achieve this.

We here on the Ghost Recon Online team recognize that the fight against cheating is an ongoing war and look forward to your support in the upcoming battle.


Rok Erjavec
GRO Lead Programmer

Hex73uk
05-07-2012, 12:31 AM
This is very reassuring to hear especially as cheats in most online multiplayer games are now at the point to be considered 'the norm' and eventually end up killing the game for those who choose to play fairly. It is very disheartening to see a game you love get hacked and the devs do nothing towards making it harder to hack.

Please keep researching means of protecting the playerbase from cheats as you can only strengthen the community by doing so.

Also after some reading recently, I understand some of the more infamous 'undetectable' hacks are using a Javascript injection method to scan DX and then inject into the game code. Please look into this.

djdajay
05-07-2012, 03:50 PM
the last few days, the number of cheating players had grown enormously, take all the fun out of this game.

DodsonMC
06-20-2012, 05:17 AM
the last few days, the number of cheating players had grown enormously, take all the fun out of this game.

I agree with him... I got on today and either there was a wall glitch exploit, headshot immunity lags, or just plain hacking

Bob-Albion
06-20-2012, 02:44 PM
I agree with him... I got on today and either there was a wall glitch exploit, headshot immunity lags, or just plain hacking


the last few days, the number of cheating players had grown enormously, take all the fun out of this game.

Yes same today got so fed up i just quit the game as there is no point in playing, all this is going to do is get other players to think if i can't win ill join in the hacking. Its a shame some people just like to bring a good thing to its knees even before the game goes live .. shame on all you hackers

cirem
06-20-2012, 03:15 PM
Yep, Hackers! Everywhere!

Just learn how to play the game (it takes some time, you know) and stop calling everyone who's better than you a hacker. Please.

Klaue_
06-20-2012, 03:30 PM
Wowowow meric calm down please.
Not everyone who complains about cheaters is a blame-troll or bad player.

Although i also think espacially new players should stay calm and keep their fingers from cheater accusations because very much people dont get that "taking cover" does not mean you are invincible nor beeing invisible.

I have to mention that much people seem to have problems with 3D-vision and not familiar with lag, so watch your characters legs, shoulder and arms carfully if they stick out somehow. Even some obstacles are "soft".

Not to blame anyone. Just stay cool and dont give the troll a roll. ;)

cirem
06-20-2012, 04:17 PM
Wowowow meric calm down please.
Hm? I'm completely calm :)

DodsonMC
06-20-2012, 08:56 PM
I wasn't complaining about the cover, I know about how cover works it is just that my head is never i view when i am prone, but there are people who somehow are able to get headshots, not normal kills but headshot kills. I am ok with most players because I know they have skills, it is just the ones who think hacking is cool and easy. I thought this game was going to be fun, but if GRO doesn't get the hacking fixed, all the hackers are going to ruin the fun. I know the higher levels aren't going to have a problem. But there are lvl 1 players who are hacking and killing lvl 10s and others (it just doesn't seem right at all, especially if a whole team of lvl 1s defeat a team of lvl 5s and up

Surviock
06-20-2012, 09:45 PM
I wasn't complaining about the cover, I know about how cover works it is just that my head is never i view when i am prone, but there are people who somehow are able to get headshots, not normal kills but headshot kills.

That problem is an bug, other player perspective that managed make a headshot showing you were standing, that with low cover (such as walls, windows and...maybe cars) will absolutely ruin your chances. I did reported that bug during previous beta test, but it appears that they are still fixing that problem. It will sounds annoying but until then...you have to deal with that nuisance, for now. In the meantime, the team might need more video's and screenshots, although it will be optional since the team are aware of this.

Big_Ghost_Daddy
06-20-2012, 09:54 PM
I wasn't complaining about the cover, I know about how cover works it is just that my head is never i view when i am prone, but there are people who somehow are able to get headshots, not normal kills but headshot kills. I am ok with most players because I know they have skills, it is just the ones who think hacking is cool and easy. I thought this game was going to be fun, but if GRO doesn't get the hacking fixed, all the hackers are going to ruin the fun. I know the higher levels aren't going to have a problem. But there are lvl 1 players who are hacking and killing lvl 10s and others (it just doesn't seem right at all, especially if a whole team of lvl 1s defeat a team of lvl 5s and up

1. Higher leveled team does not mean better team (only better gear, but a good team can beat a bunch of solo players easily).
2. It's a peer to peer connection and sometimes there is a delay so it looks like you were killed in cover, but the person that killed you hit you when you were out of cover.
3. Record and report hackers. The devs are probably busy bug fixing (which I think is a bit more important since it's still closed beta). If you report, they can also see what kind of hack it is to figure out the leak faster. In addition, the hacker is most likely to get banned.


BigGhostDaddy

gatecrashermark
06-20-2012, 11:23 PM
Can the OP tell me if Ubisoft will actively persue the hacking websites aswell and take them to court to get them shut down if found to be actively selling hacks for this game?

DodsonMC
06-21-2012, 05:11 PM
That problem is an bug, other player perspective that managed make a headshot showing you were standing, that with low cover (such as walls, windows and...maybe cars) will absolutely ruin your chances. I did reported that bug during previous beta test, but it appears that they are still fixing that problem. It will sounds annoying but until then...you have to deal with that nuisance, for now. In the meantime, the team might need more video's and screenshots, although it will be optional since the team are aware of this.

Thank you for that information, I had no clue that they were already working on that problem. Next time I will check before I post...

Lesson Learned I gues....:)

Bob-Albion
06-21-2012, 05:35 PM
Yep, Hackers! Everywhere!

Just learn how to play the game (it takes some time, you know) and stop calling everyone who's better than you a hacker. Please.

Please don't miss quote me as i never said that :p ty

Klaue_
06-21-2012, 05:48 PM
...I know about how cover works it is just that my head is never i view when i am prone


Wrong

Klaue_
06-21-2012, 05:50 PM
That problem is an bug, other player perspective...

Thats right.
Go here, i explain the bug: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/662725-Beta-Impression-A-little-bit-of-Feedback/page2

Klaue_
06-21-2012, 05:51 PM
... persue the hacking websites aswell and take them to court to get them shut down...

Really?
Hello world.


...

gatecrashermark
06-22-2012, 12:58 AM
Look idiot stop being a fool all your life .

anyway heres the leak links you requested fool

http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?84706-Part-Of-PunkBuster-source-leaked-here!

http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1264084331

Klaue_
06-22-2012, 11:11 AM
Look idiot stop being a fool all your life .

anyway heres the leak links you requested fool

http://www.mpcforum.com/showthread.php?84706-Part-Of-PunkBuster-source-leaked-here!

http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1264084331


Obiousely someone is mad in here.

First link dont work.
Second link could be faked.
I work as a software developer myself and i would not name the "Author" as my Product and even spell it wrong.
Even hobby programmer wouldnt do that.


Can it be you still dont bring up nothing usefull? Sorry iam not blinded by rage like you are. Stay cool, bring facts or GTFO .. fool.
You wasting my time boy.

maybe bring up a statement of EB? I heared they confirmed the leak somehow .....

Klaue_
06-22-2012, 11:22 AM
Ah and before you come up with some **** from 09/10.
1: Software can be changed: even though i think EB still havent give a **** about it
2: The system PB uses to scan for abnormal executions or parts of the code can still be secure to a certain level, even if it is known how it works.
Iam not into detail with that, maybe if i feel the urge to keep fighting a ballte i gave up over 10 years ago ...

Surviock
06-22-2012, 10:45 PM
Thats right.
Go here, i explain the bug: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/662725-Beta-Impression-A-little-bit-of-Feedback/page2

I had to admit, that was good explanation, Klaue.

During previous beta test, I may managed to record FRAP video clip and put it on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z96AIWDZgdw

It is different, but this happened many times especially in different map. That with combination of peer-to-peer connection is considered...hellish flaw.

Bob-Albion
06-25-2012, 05:59 PM
Yep, Hackers! Everywhere!

Just learn how to play the game (it takes some time, you know) and stop calling everyone who's better than you a hacker. Please.


I had to admit, that was good explanation, Klaue.

During previous beta test, I may managed to record FRAP video clip and put it on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z96AIWDZgdw

It is different, but this happened many times especially in different map. That with combination of peer-to-peer connection is considered...hellish flaw.

So if im getting this right from my prospectve im in cover but from yours im standing with me pants around my ankles swinging my nut's in the breeze .. And could somebody tell me where the servers are based ie UK Liverpool Birmingham and so on or are they somewhere in Another Euro country ty :confused:

Klaue_
06-25-2012, 06:57 PM
During previous beta test, I may managed to record FRAP video clip and put it on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z96AIWDZgdw

It is different, but this happened many times especially in different map. That with combination of peer-to-peer connection is considered...hellish flaw.

There was a discussion some time ago, i think the "problem" is the prediction technique they used:


As in the most game, i guess they use a interpolation algorithm for the transfered data and maybe an extrapolation for incoming data at the client to smooth out the displayed motions and actions.
More specific explanations would also include to explain some kind of how they distribute the data.


One thing i noticed that, even with very bad latency, you got a very smooth feeling and good hit recognition on your end of the line. On the other hand, if someone got a real bad ping, you see them warping alot almost without any movement expect of changing orientation.

The thing is, too much "trust" in client data(from the server/coordinator point of view of) leads to the also well known issue that you get killed by a hit after you just reached an obstacle like a wall and just think "how he did this ... -_-". :)


BB


It has some disatvantages like "lag-kills", but also some advantages like smotthing out motions. A little discussion about that over here: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/664247-Devs-on-the-Forum/page2

cirem
06-25-2012, 07:16 PM
So if im getting this right from my prospectve im in cover but from yours im standing with me pants around my ankles swinging my nut's in the breeze .. And could somebody tell me where the servers are based ie UK Liverpool Birmingham and so on or are they somewhere in Another Euro country ty :confused:
Right. Have a look at my YT channel (http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG0_KJMZ2xbQVOmGJFJvPqA). I recorded a few of these ”incidents”...
The servers are somewhere in the Netherlands. Don't know where exactly but they are there somewhere :)

Klaue_
06-25-2012, 07:32 PM
Right. Have a look at my YT channel (http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG0_KJMZ2xbQVOmGJFJvPqA). I recorded a few of these ”incidents”...
The servers are somewhere in the Netherlands. Don't know where exactly but they are there somewhere :)

From a developer point of view, that looks like a hit-box problem. Even though it is up to or even more nasty, it is technically a very different problem to the lag-kills problem.
And i never experieneced such a problem in over 80h auf playing. And as far as i know is the cover you are using not a soft one.

I experienced a bug sometimes, where the hit-marker was just off the opposite direction, even though it was almost everytime while i was on the move and turning. But here we can cleary see the enemy infront of you.
Hm, never had that one before.

cirem
06-25-2012, 08:30 PM
I have that kind of standing bug all the time. When I'm behind a small cover I just have to wait a few moments. At least one guy of the other team is seeing me standing behind cover. And every 2nd match or so I kill someone behind cover because I see an enemy standing too...

On the other hand I did not suffer from lag or the resulting "be killed later, when already behind cover"-bug yet.

Bob-Albion
06-25-2012, 08:42 PM
Thank you for your imput gentlemen much appreciated .. and may i ask for somebody to put a newbie guide to servival .. int's and tips to help us less skilled .. don't want you to give your best tips away just helpful nod in the right direction ty once again ;)

PS i do get kicked from the server at times thats why i asked where the server are as im on a 50mb connection i just put it dow to the fact that it's still beta

Big_Ghost_Daddy
06-25-2012, 10:40 PM
Thank you for your imput gentlemen much appreciated .. and may i ask for somebody to put a newbie guide to servival .. int's and tips to help us less skilled .. don't want you to give your best tips away just helpful nod in the right direction ty once again ;)

PS i do get kicked from the server at times thats why i asked where the server are as im on a 50mb connection i just put it dow to the fact that it's still beta

Check my signature

Big_Ghost_Daddy

Bob-Albion
06-25-2012, 11:11 PM
ThanX B-G-D :cool:

Klaue_
06-26-2012, 09:09 AM
Thank you for your imput gentlemen much appreciated .. and may i ask for somebody to put a newbie guide to servival .. int's and tips to help us less skilled .. don't want you to give your best tips away just helpful nod in the right direction ty once again ;)Your welcome.If you like, check out our Tip 'n Tricks Topic here: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/666565-Tips-n-tricks (http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/666565-Tips-n-tricks) (see signature)You will find there hints for new and advanced players, both GRO dependet and commonly useable stuff./edit: whoopsie, should've read the whole topic ... ;)

Big_Ghost_Daddy
06-26-2012, 09:53 AM
Your welcome.If you like, check out our Tip 'n Tricks Topic here: http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/666565-Tips-n-tricks (http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/666565-Tips-n-tricks) (see signature)You will find there hints for new and advanced players, both GRO dependet and commonly useable stuff./edit: whoopsie, should've read the whole topic ... ;)

I was one step ahead of you as always, Klaue_. Looking forward of melee killing you this afternoon (if we happen to encounter each other).

Big_Ghost_Daddy

Klaue_
06-26-2012, 10:12 AM
OffTopic:
The **** will hit the fan in T -6.5. :D
This will end up in a fisting session. ;)

Looking forward to see all the crazy folks again. =)