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View Full Version : What's good for the goose is good for the gander---Jerry Brown



leitmotiv
01-31-2011, 08:10 PM
Since political threads are being run, I'll have one.

Governor Jerry Brown of California, our new-old governor (he did two terms 30 years ago), just gave his state of the state address, and announced, in effect, there will be a plebiscite on raising taxes in June---that the electorate will decide if taxes should be raised or if vast cuts will be made in state programs.

I think the move is brilliant. This is truly democratic with a small "d". Unlike the person in the White House and Democrats in Congress (much diminished), he is not going to make the mistake of ruling from the top down. Brown is the future of the Democratic Party, and could very well be a consensus politician.

Messaschnitzel
01-31-2011, 08:24 PM
It doesn't really matter who's in charge now, Leit. It's like swapping captains out after the Titanic hit the iceberg, and then everybody voting on who gets a seat in the limited amount of lifeboats. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

GoToAway
01-31-2011, 08:38 PM
I guess FNC must have run a piece on him tonight.

I'll have to watch the Daily Show to get a realistic picture of things. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Zeus-cat
01-31-2011, 08:49 PM
The did a poll here in Ohio about a month ago. People are dead set against services being cut and there is no way they will support a tax increase.

The problem is that people really do not comprehend the situation. Politicians have been sweeping the problems under the rug for so long the average Joe doesn't realize we can't go on the way it is. My guess is Governor Brown will hear more of the same; don't raise taxes and don't cut my programs.

M_Gunz
01-31-2011, 10:08 PM
The really amazing part is how much really big money there is in private hands that entirely benefit from a smooth running society or at least it runs smooth until the make-a-fortune-on-fire-sales people play their games.

Let's see now.. put some of the profits gotten from the way things were back into making things work better or get upset because someone who didn't rake it down might benefit off your back? After all, look how POOR the rising numbers of super-rich have gotten!

Ba5tard5word
01-31-2011, 11:33 PM
The did a poll here in Ohio about a month ago. People are dead set against services being cut and there is no way they will support a tax increase.

YUP. That is exactly what is going to happen in CA. Mark my words. Californians ALWAYS vote down tax increases then they ***** and moan when their services get cut.

Rejigger prop 13 so everyone pays their fair share in property taxes, repeal the three strikes rule so we aren't jailing hundreds of thousands of people for 50 years at $50,000 a year because they sold weed once, and cut down on some government offices which are unnecessary. This is the kind of thing that needs to be done and Californians will fight against it every step of the way while asking why the government services THEY use (libraries, colleges, public transit) are suddenly being cut.

Ba5tard5word
01-31-2011, 11:39 PM
Also he's not going to be holding a vote on raising taxes, it will be on whether to allow certain current taxes to expire like they are set to do. Kind of scary that the state is in such a financial hole and taxes are higher than they are supposed to be a few months from now. In any case the state pretty much always asks the voters to decide on tax increases, for the most part it seems mandated by the state's constitution, and again the voters pretty much always vote them down while voting for high spending on prisons. So while I like Brown I don't see him doing anything differently than Schwartzenegger other than that Brown is really good at being impolitical and honest in terms of getting policy enacted, something Arnie was terrible at and something most politicians aren't able to do--they just pander to their base and try to **** off the other side. Brown seems to just tell it like it is and try to get both sides to accept reality.

Messaschnitzel
02-01-2011, 03:10 AM
In addition to modifying Prop 13 to reflect the increased amount of taxes owed for current market value of properties in Ca, there could be an additional tax levied for individuals who rent properties of any type in the state. For instance, a flat fee of $500 to $1,000 per dwelling or unit per annum, as well as including a percentage of any local taxes, fees, or bonds voted in afterwards for essentials such as schools, services, pension funds, etc. I would think that would at least be a good start. Maybe even an additional state flat surcharge of maybe $5 on top of the normal taxes on the advertised price for any products purchased such as alcohol, tobacco, fast food, restaurant meals, movie theater tickets, etc. Paying an additional five bucks for something like a soda enough times might just fix Ca's problems. Also, any local city governments could get in on the action at the same time where in addition to the extra state fee (tax), something like a small and hardly noticeable extra-extra fee could be thrown on top of the state fee. Maybe something like an additional 5-7% of the final cost of the product after all taxes and fees are added up. (it wouldn't take but a few seconds to add the extra charge onto what would have normally been the final purchase price... but don't worry... the money you were forced to spend will stay in the community, heh heh. ) If the current money Ca receives from statewide sales, property, licensing, etc taxes isn't doing the trick, maybe the above would be just what the doctor ordered to get us on the road to 'fiscal recovery'! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

Even with all the malarkey above, it still wouldn't pull California's head out of its own debthole, especially with cr@p like the ever increasing amount of money that the Taxpayers are on the hook to pay for public employees past, present and future pensions for example. Every year my property taxes go up with nothing really to show for it. With all the school, police and fire dept bonds being passed almost every other year, I'd think that they would at least be able to keep their heads above water. Every year they come around with threats about having to get rid of essential services and public school teachers, and start the fear mongering process early, complete with flyers and mailers about how we all as citizens will suffer if the proposed bond measure doesn't pass. (don't worry, this time around your money will fix our problems for a long time to come, but only if you vote 'yes' for this measure!) The trouble with this is that the property owners are the main ones to foot these bills via property taxes to pay for these local and county municipal bonds, in addition to the taxes already owed to the state. Some folks might say that a $75 - $100 per year tax is a small price to pay for whatever services you will receive, but don't realize that property owners already be paying off a number of bond measures passed from previous years in addition to the currently proposed bond measure yearly amount would be. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Urufu_Shinjiro
02-01-2011, 06:25 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...1013236/m/8361056498 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2601013236/m/8361056498)