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BP_Charlie
09-30-2010, 02:13 PM
I mean, really bad. You cannot win with them against a competent or above player. If you want to play them, use them in the early ranks, because later on they are essentially unusable.

All their units are really slow, quite expensive and have really short range. I mean, what is the effin point of tank destroyers with less range (yes, reconned) than the tanks they are supposed to destroy.

You have minimal ability to raid your opponents supplies early because even your "light" tanks go as fast as a tiger tank.

Your recon options are restricted, as there's nothing out of the barracks and your tanks are pointless beyond slightly mobile static defences.

Your airport costs $65 so that it a prohibitive start for early raids, and even if you do go that route, but the time you've researched anything useful (which also takes an age I might add), you have lost all your supply depots because you can't bring anything to bear fast enough.

And to top it all off, the best unit they have, the one I thought was the only one really worth going for - the prototype tank - can't even go toe to toe with a king tiger. Never mind a Maus.

Are they seriously supposed to rely on those bunkers they have? Which anyone with half a brain can recon and artillery?

I'll just have to keep giving away wins until I stumble into 5 unfortunate noobs, then I never need use this nerfed nation again.

aod125
09-30-2010, 03:47 PM
Originally posted by BP_Charlie:
I mean, really bad. You cannot win with them against a competent or above player. If you want to play them, use them in the early ranks, because later on they are essentially unusable.

All their units are really slow, quite expensive and have really short range.
wrong thy have the same range as any tank and they have the best medium tank and they are cheap
I mean, what is the effin point of tank destroyers with less range (yes, reconned) than the tanks they are supposed to destroy.
all of the french td have a range of 500 so how do they get out ranged

You have minimal ability to raid your opponents supplies early because even your "light" tanks go as fast as a tiger tank.
the h39 is very bad and slow u should never build it and it is slower than a tiger, also u need to use medium tanks for raiding

Your recon options are restricted, as there's nothing out of the barracks and your tanks are pointless beyond slightly mobile static defences.
they are not restricted in any way, shape, or form, they have 2 recons from 2 base one from the tank base and one from the protobase on the ground which is like most nations that only have two bases for ground units also if u think that they are pointless for their units tehn u dont know how to play france

Your airport costs $65 so that it a prohibitive start for early raids, and even if you do go that route, but the time you've researched anything useful (which also takes an age I might add), you have lost all your supply depots because you can't bring anything to bear fast enough.
why would u go air from the start as the french that is their weak point

And to top it all off, the best unit they have, the one I thought was the only one really worth going for - the prototype tank - can't even go toe to toe with a king tiger. Never mind a Maus.
wrong it is stronger than the kingtiger but no tank can beat a maus 1v1

Are they seriously supposed to rely on those bunkers they have? Which anyone with half a brain can recon and artillery?
no

I'll just have to keep giving away wins until I stumble into 5 unfortunate noobs, then I never need use this nerfed nation again.
if ur on they 360 ill show u how good the french are

Axe99
09-30-2010, 04:41 PM
I still have the Brits chalked up as the weakest faction, except against someone focussing on the air (in which case the Frogs struggle - badly - and, of course, better players know that the French are weak on AA and fighters).

In terms of Recon, build an armour base early - the French armour base costs the same as their barracks (25) and a Panhard is only 20, and has the same armament and armour as a Coventry Mk 1 or Greyhound (although it's significantly slower than a Greyhound).

In terms of tanks, I'd go the ARL44 over the FCM F1 - it's 27km/hr compared with 20km/hr, and does almost as much damage to enemy tanks. Like all heavy tanks, both have a range of 500 metres, as do all of the (very cheap) French AT except for the 25mm. Remember to make sure your tank destroyers out-number the enemy heavy tanks significantly.

The biggest problem you'll have is attacking, if the other side is getting planes in the air. If they're not, you've got a faction that's pretty strong on the ground, if no Germany/US/USSR. I'd probably try either building an airfield after spamming AA bunkers and getting a few admin buildings, or building a bunch of FCM1's, but if your opponent builds a stack of fighter-bombers, you'll get rogered.

Another option is tank rushing - build an armour base early, and punch out a couple of Panhards and some S-35's. For the starting 200, you can get 3 supply bases, an Armour base, a Panhard and two S-35s, or 2 supply bases, a Panhard and four S-35s. Keep your early RUSEs for Radio Silence and maybe Blitz, and you may catch them napping. But if you don't you're stuffed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.

What Aod says holds true as well. Although I still think that for advanced players, the French weaknesses are larger than the Brits or Italians - so you'll find it tougher than playing with the 'big three' (US/USSR/Germany). Good luck http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

Warforger
09-30-2010, 10:40 PM
Am I the only one who recognizes how much the Italians suck? First it was the Brits, now the French? I played through all the races, French was my favorite, but Italians was so bad it wasn't laughable. Offensively, they're ok, but defense they're a joke, most of their tanks are light and their armor base doesn't even build heavy tanks, just medium ones (it only builds one other unit, ARMORED RECON), you have to build the prototype base to get the heavy ones! Sure you get cheap tanks at the barracks, but the Italians are the only race with recon infantry! Whats the point of that? Jeeps can already go into forests and their armored recon can too.

In the end, most of the time it doesn't matter how the balance is in this game, its like Table top strategy games, its mostly the players skill with that race.

Axe99
10-01-2010, 04:46 AM
Totally agree about the Italians - the problem with the French, Brits and Italians is that (at least in a ranked game, where you've only got 25 minutes to put a reasonable force together), their strengths and weaknesses make them two-trick ponies, which in turn makes them relatively easy to counter.

All three have a reasonable 'Rush' option - the French with their early med tanks, Brits with Hurricanes and Italians with light tanks, but all three rushes can be shut down easily enough.

The Italians have got half-decent AT, on the by, _as long_ as your opponent decides not to arty them. But if they do that, it's all over.

I'd divide the game into three factions - the three that have a bit of everything (US, USSR, Germany), and the three that are hamstrung in one area or another (Italians, Brits, French). I'm still tossing up which of the top three are the strongest (Germany's the current favourite) and which of the bottom three are the weakest (it'd be the Italians for me here right now).

BP_Charlie
10-01-2010, 05:49 AM
Yeah, I started as UK as, well, I'm from the UK http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And in the early days as a noob and playing noobs it was ok. But it quickly became apparent that having air as a strength really isn't that good. The Churchill is expensive and doesn't survive against other top-tier tanks in the time it takes your fighter bombers to re-arm. And if the other guy has the sense to bring some rolling AA along, the whole thing gets very expensive and very messy for us Brits...

GunnersMate07
10-01-2010, 06:33 AM
Lol I do not understand all this love for Germany. At least for 1v1 ranked, its a faction thats too expensive to defend against agressive players. When I play german players, they are always always on the defensive because they simply cannot field enough units to defend all the harrassing done on the flanks. It just takes too much time to research and then build expensive units.

And to top it all off, there is always a hard counter to said expensive units. I welcome when a player puts so much resources into a Tiger, or even better a King Tiger. Just means way more expensive kills for my fighter-bombers and AT units.

The US in the current meta-game is OP. They just have no disadvantage, and while they are supposed to be a jack-of-all trades nation they have by far the best early game AA which allows you to not build an airstrip to defend against air starts, they inexplicably have one of the best advanced heavies in the super pershing, they have good armored artillery, and the uber fast 5 dollar jeep just makes it so easy for the US player to always know what counter is needed asap.

But yes, France completely blows and I don't think can really be buffed without a complete redesign. Their focus is on strong but slow units mixed with turtling defensive buildings. Not a winning combo in a game where mobility is necessary to make sure your units do damage before their hard counter is put in place, and defensive positions are so easily demolished by artillery.

I also disagree about Italians sucking. Specifically, their tanks suck when compared to their heavy tank counterparts in other factions. But so what? Don't ever counter heavy tanks with heavy tanks, even if you are germany. Counter heavy tanks with their correct counters. The Italians are fantastic at doing what every player should strive for in the early game, map control and depot harrassment. The Italians can just swamp the map with cheap and most importantly FAST units. And when the game gets into the middle ground, they have strong AT options, and they even get good artillery out of their arty base. Basically, the reasons why people don't like Italy on consoles, are the same reasons why they are unjustifiably enamored with Germany. They haven't figured out how ******edly easy it is to counter end-game expensive as all hell heavy units. And they probably don't understand how completely necessary it is to be aggressive from the moment the game begins.

DW_Khan
10-01-2010, 10:03 AM
I haven't tried playing against the AI with the French, but I have whooped a bunch of people online as them. I now choose them ahead of Germany even. I am 8-2 with them in my last ten matches (in the Bronze League, so I am not playing noobs).

I haven't really noticed a particularly weak faction. They all require slightly different tactics. Sure, if you match the units against each other mono e mono without tactics then certain nations have big disadvantages. ie. It's tough to win with the British if the match gets into later stages, but if you use your Ruses imaginatively and work quickly anyone can trip up anyone else.

Warforger
10-01-2010, 07:52 PM
Ok ok, I guess all races have their strengths and weaknesses, but like I said Italians are terrible are defense and good at offense, they specialize in speed, yah they can spam light artillery and it is effective, but that only goes so far, it isn't as fast as the rest of the units and it doesn't have that far of a range, meaning if you want to move forward, you have to move your artillery as well giving a gap of time for your enemy to destroy your forward force.

But in the end, all factions have their strengths and weaknesses, but the important part is the player and how they can adapt to different environments, different settings and surprises.

Axe99
10-02-2010, 02:43 AM
My issue with the Italians is that their advanced AT is very vulnerable to arty, as it can't be placed in forests and is, at best, with 15mm armour.

@Gunners - While the Germans have some expensive, silly heavy units, they've also got some relatively cheap, very good units on the way there. You can build a Tiger for the same price and less research than a Pershing, and the Panther is pretty damn good as well. The Panzer IV is a steal. Their air units are solid enough, and at $30 a pop, for the same amount of research as a Spitfire or Mustang, the Me-262 hardly breaks the bank. Their AT is great and not overpriced (and their TDs are nicely armoured), their infantry is phenomenal, they've got the equal cheapest (and second-fastest) armoured recon, which builds from the barracks, and their artillery is a little more expensive if you want to play the 'long artillery' game, but not so much so that it'll get in the way.

The mistake people make with the Germans is building the Maus (far too slow to make a difference unless the opposition is dopey - even the T-95 will dance rings around it) and tanking their top-end units with no thought to the counters.

Painthreshold
10-04-2010, 10:48 AM
I'm 10/12 as Germany in ranked and ive beat about 3 or 4 German players because the mistake they make is that just building king tigers will win them the game.... German Players usually think their tanks will win the day but its not the case, many dont use recon and AT can easily take them out.

I've always enjoyed playing as the French and they have some weaknesses but they are much more solid than Italians or Britain, i remember the last game i played the guy was France he built legionaries and AT guns.... My stugs and air recon ended that plan

Painthreshold
10-04-2010, 10:51 AM
10 out of 12 not 10 wins 12 losses my bad

GunnersMate07
10-04-2010, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by Painthreshold:
I'm 10/12 as Germany in ranked and ive beat about 3 or 4 German players because the mistake they make is that just building king tigers will win them the game.... German Players usually think their tanks will win the day but its not the case, many dont use recon and AT can easily take them out.

I've always enjoyed playing as the French and they have some weaknesses but they are much more solid than Italians or Britain, i remember the last game i played the guy was France he built legionaries and AT guns.... My stugs and air recon ended that plan

What makes you say france is more solid than italy or britain? I use random about a quarter of the time in my ranked matches and I so I use all the factions. And for me, france is by far the worst. They have only one unit that actually shines, the SAU-40. Its a mediocre medium tank, but it also doubles as a mediocre assault gun. After that, I cannot name a single french unit that is a necessity, but I can name quite a few that are horrifically overpriced. And all of this ignores how woefully awful france is at dealing with air assaults.

Brits while somewhat expensive, can really do damage and hold an opponent at bay with hurricane starts, and can actually do some steamrolling of its own if the brit player can last long enough to get fireflies+avre (hint, 5 hurricanes snipe depots very quickly, and really help slow down the other players' economy in the opening minutes).

And Italy is the best rushing nation in the game. Super quick cheap units that can swarm a map and deny an enemy depots. If you play italy correctly, you should win map control everytime in the first few minutes.

Painthreshold
10-04-2010, 01:48 PM
In my experience i believe they are the better of the three, i have played Italy and France both online and i prefer france any day of the week.

I've played Britain the most out of all the nations and even though they have some strengths, France i feel is more all round.

Italy may be a good nation for rushing however most people that i have played against at ranked have not utilised their strengths to their advantage, ive been successfully able to tank rush an italian player twice recently.

In the end its entirely down to each others opinion, and our playing styles

Joppsta
10-04-2010, 03:33 PM
Well, i'd say i'd rather play France over Russia too to be honest, i don't like how the USSR handles..

*shrug*

France are slow but their range makes up for it.. that's the key.

GunnersMate07
10-04-2010, 05:32 PM
What do you mean their range makes up for it? Range is standardized across factions for the most part. The max range of tanks, tank destroyers, and AT guns except the 88/90mm of italy/germany is 500m. Artillery is either 800m, 1600m, or 2.4km, and rockets are 1km. Does not matter what faction you play, all of these numbers are standard. The only units that have slight variability are the different tanks, specifically medium tanks have different ranges for each faction. (But the differences are usually only 50m).

And the key is that france is not a very good offensive nation because of how slow their units are. They revolve around turtling, and as mentioned many many times in other threads turtling only works on noobs.

And no its not about personal preference or style. There really is only one style that will work at high level play, and thats to be aggressive early and contest map control from the moment the game begins. If you are not doing this as any faction, you are not playing at a high level and will get stomped playing the top players no matter what faction you choose.

GunnersMate07
10-04-2010, 05:52 PM
Should also add that France has the absolute worst barracks opening of any other nation. They get zero recon from their barracks, a distinction only shared with brits. But the brits generally should use their cheap airstrip and no research air recon. France has the most expensive airstrip and underwhelming air options in the game. So no recon from the barracks hurts France especially hard.

And then add to that their heavy infantry is non researchable and costs $10 a unit. Infantry plays a huge role when you start playing better competition, and its completely impossible for france to keep up on the infantry front with other heavy infantry simply because they cost twice as much. The French foreign legion are tied with USSR heavies as best infantry in the game, but at twice the freaking cost.

And to top it all off, the one decent french unit, the SAU 40, has no machine gun. So heavy infantry spam is all you really need to handle an offensive french player thats not turtling.

Or lots of fighter-bombers since France is the only nation in the game without a mobile AA option (and the uber-expensive but lackluster airstrip).

x3Form
10-04-2010, 07:14 PM
Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
Should also add that France has the absolute worst barracks opening of any other nation. They get zero recon from their barracks, a distinction only shared with brits. But the brits generally should use their cheap airstrip and no research air recon. France has the most expensive airstrip and underwhelming air options in the game. So no recon from the barracks hurts France especially hard.

And then add to that their heavy infantry is non researchable and costs $10 a unit. Infantry plays a huge role when you start playing better competition, and its completely impossible for france to keep up on the infantry front with other heavy infantry simply because they cost twice as much. The French foreign legion are tied with USSR heavies as best infantry in the game, but at twice the freaking cost.

And to top it all off, the one decent french unit, the SAU 40, has no machine gun. So heavy infantry spam is all you really need to handle an offensive french player thats not turtling.

Or lots of fighter-bombers since France is the only nation in the game without a mobile AA option (and the uber-expensive but lackluster airstrip).

Only positive thing about barracks opening on France is you can get heavy inf from the very start, which is incredibly super awesome on that 2v2 map, "closing the pocket" where getting control of the city near you is fairly crucial. But you always need a recon so the best bet is to go 2 depots and get an armour base aswell. Sucks if he goes Air I suppose.

As for SAU40s you can be fairly succesful against anyone who is unfamiliar with them. But then that's not really any good at all when playing good players.


All in all, all the factions have strengths and weaknesses, so it is really hard to call one out as being the worst imo.

EDIT: I got the name of the map wrong!

x3Form
10-04-2010, 07:18 PM
Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
And the key is that france is not a very good offensive nation because of how slow their units are. They revolve around turtling, and as mentioned many many times in other threads turtling only works on noobs.


Kind of disagree on this, SAU40 is an incredibly aggressive unit.

It's just that as soon as the FBs appear you have to back off, get AA up and hope that you can maintain points advantage until the timer expires http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Sorry for the doppel post!

BP_Charlie
10-05-2010, 01:52 AM
Originally posted by x3Form:
All in all, all the factions have strengths and weaknesses, so it is really hard to call one out as being the worst imo.
Not when the weaknesses are more than most other factions and the strengths are less. If the other player goes for map control early, which most do at the higher levels, then you don't have a hope of preventing an early economic disadvantage because all her units are so slow.

GunnersMate07
10-05-2010, 06:10 AM
The French probably have the most glaring weakness out of any faction. They are ridiculously susceptible to air attack. No other faction has such a huge weakness.

So then you talk about strengths. The only strength I see is strong tanks, but this is wiped out by both how expensive they are, and most importantly how freaking slow they are. I guess you can also count the bunkers as a strength, although when playing good players they are more of a liability since its guaranteed points for the other player once arty hits the field (and its not like bunkers are going to get kills against a good player with recon).

BP_Charlie
10-05-2010, 05:37 PM
Despite France being crap, psx-yoshi (I think) is very high on the PS3 1v1 leaderboards and I just played him twice. Both times he annihilated me with France, although the second game I lasted a bit longer*.

So they must have something going for them... But damned if I know what it is.

*Although in my defence, I've just switched to using the US, who I have deliberately stayed away from until today. I still doubt I would have won though, even with Germany.


EDIT: psx-Yoshi is 5th on the leaderboard. LOL no one is elite yet, the nearest is level 56... probably because at this level you have to wait 5-15 minutes for a game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Joppsta
10-05-2010, 07:21 PM
Originally posted by x3Form:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
And the key is that france is not a very good offensive nation because of how slow their units are. They revolve around turtling, and as mentioned many many times in other threads turtling only works on noobs.


Kind of disagree on this, SAU40 is an incredibly aggressive unit.

It's just that as soon as the FBs appear you have to back off, get AA up and hope that you can maintain points advantage until the timer expires http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Sorry for the doppel post! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Could agree here.

To be fair, I've not used France in ranked matches, 1v1.... only 2v2.

I think so long as you get a good partner faction you can safely use France but it's a gamble otherwise.

Brenbed
10-07-2010, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
Should also add that France has the absolute worst barracks opening of any other nation. They get zero recon from their barracks, a distinction only shared with brits.


France has one of the best infantry Units in the game. The only other Infantry unit that can battle them head to head without losing is Russia's Gvardiya.

France is better at playing defensive early in the game. Grab some Depots and hold the territory. Fortified Positions and Maginot Bunkers can be helpful with defense. But that doesn't mean RELY on them..lol..AT 47s should also be used in conjunction...

If you have good defense in the early game you should be able to defend really well until you get access to the Panhard....which can give you recon and back up to the infantry Units..


But the brits generally should use their cheap airstrip and no research air recon.

Fortified positions can keep recon planes from spying on you. So again that can buy you some time to set up and get things going until you can get the Panhard recon from an armor base.


France has the most expensive airstrip and underwhelming air options in the game.

France likes to keep the fight on the ground, not in the Air...So they don't really need an Air strip in the early part of the game. But when you do get an Air strip make sure you get a Potez in the Air so ground units can see what's going on....



So no recon from the barracks hurts France especially hard.

Not Really, just a minor set back but nothing that really holds them back from kicking some butt..lol...


And then add to that their heavy infantry is non researchable and costs $10 a unit. Infantry plays a huge role when you start playing better competition, and its completely impossible for france to keep up on the infantry front with other heavy infantry simply because they cost twice as much. The French foreign legion are tied with USSR heavies as best infantry in the game, but at twice the freaking cost.

1.)Russia is a very offensive country, yeah, we all kind of figured that out when we first played the game.LOL http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

2.) But they also lack defense. Russia's infantry may be tied with France's infantry, but you have to remember that France has a much stronger defense against Russia's infantry. Russia doesn't have many ways to defend itself against Infantry units that get close to them.

They have no bunkers and those artillery positions can be easily destroyed by the Legionnaires. Russia's infantry will never stand a chance against just ONE Maginot Bunker..lol..it is very balanced if you look at it from all angles instead of just one...

3.) More doesn't always = Better...it is how you use your infantry. Besides, France has cheap Sau 40s that can keep a russia player occupied. You can use infantry to support them, and you also use infantry to set up in nearby cities.



And to top it all off, the one decent french unit, the SAU 40, has no machine gun. So heavy infantry spam is all you really need to handle an offensive french player thats not turtling.

Sau 40s should be used to gang up on Larger tanks. H39s and Legionnaires should be used to battle enemy Infantry. The H39 can shred them to pieces. You only need one H39 for every 5 or 6 infantry units...just don't put them near enemy tanks unless it is to support the Sau 40s. H39s do have AP and HE shells, so they can also be used against Armor as well.

P.S. Sau 40s do have Assault Guns http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


Or lots of fighter-bombers since France is the only nation in the game without a mobile AA option (and the uber-expensive but lackluster airstrip).

Fortified Positions can help. Try to set them up as you move your defensive line forward. Camels are pretty cheap so be sure to invest in plenty of them. Station about 3 of them in the area near where you build Fortified positions. If you are good on money Guppies and D520s can also help out in Air defense and the Guppies can even drop bombs...


Hope that Helps...France is awesome...And we haven't even spoke about their Prototypes..hahahaha


In fact you did say that France is the only country to not have Mobile AA right??? Then how do you Explain their FCM F1?? A super tank that can destroy Aircraft, Infantry and Tanks...

Looks like you underestimated France ...

BP_Charlie
10-07-2010, 02:59 PM
Yeah I've seen some top players play France really well.

I probably should have called the topic "France are BAD...for me" http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

GunnersMate07
10-07-2010, 05:43 PM
Brenbed, no offense but you really have no idea what you are talking about.

You say the French foreign legion are great, but they cost $10. They cost twice as much as other infantry. Therefore, in a head to head fight, you have to take into account that foreign legion will be outnumbered 2-1 against other heavy infantry, on average all else equal.

As for french defences, they are the biggest liability in this game. Seriously, you are arguing that turtling works? Its clear you do not play this game at a high level with some of your observations.

The reality is that the french cannot take map control against a GOOD player because their units are way too slow and expensive, and one of the faction's "strengths" are bunkers which NEVER pays off against a good player.

And seriously.... you think the FCM makes up for the lack of mobile AA? Seriously? A prototype tank that costs $55 after research, and only does the exact same air damage as a russian shilka... makes up for the lack of mobile AA?

My counter to the FCM... fighter bombers. And on top of that I have never lost a single fighter bomber to an FCM. What does that tell you about the FCM's anti-air capabilities?

Its one thing to theorycraft on a forum and point to theoretical reasons why a faction does or doesnt suck... Its another thing entirely to prove it in game. And yes I have played plenty of top french players. The number 2 or number 3 guy on the xbox leaderboard only plays french, and I have gotten a total victory against his french literally a dozen times. And everytime I am thinking the exact same thing "why does he keep insisting on playing this horribly designed faction".

France is the only nation you can ALWAYS safely start with an airstrip against. They do not have fast light tanks to really hurt you if you start with an airstrip, and they cannot spam infantry because of the cost. And on top of that, whatever units they do have that have anti-air capabilities really really suck at it. Add in the lack of cheap recon, and its a faction thats ridiculously easy to counter everything it does, and the French player constantly bleeds expensive units throughout the match to FB's,heavy bombers, and artillery (did I mention how much french artillery blows?). No other faction has such a glaring weakness as the french with their inability to competently counter air threats, and no other nation revolves so much around defensive play thats ridiculously easy to counter with arty.

Again, if you think defensive play works, that just shows how little you really know about this game.

Brenbed
10-07-2010, 06:17 PM
Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
Brenbed, no offense but you really have no idea what you are talking about.

None taken because I know that I know what I am talking about, France is my country..lol..


You say the French foreign legion are great, but they cost $10. They cost twice as much as other infantry.

Dude!! What is your point?? That fact was already stated...


Therefore, in a head to head fight, you have to take into account that foreign legion will be outnumbered 2-1 against other heavy infantry, on average all else equal.

No sh*t Sherlock!! Did you figure that one out all by yourself?? You must have Aced Math class... You obviously did not read the part where I said that France has other Defensive weapons that can even up the fight a bit even despite the smaller numbers...would you please read what I wrote before you go putting words into my mouth...


As for french defences, they are the biggest liability in this game.

Please explain how their defense is a liability?? It may not be as strong as other Armies but it is still strong enough to fend off attacks in the early part of the game....



Seriously, you are arguing that turtling works?

I know turtling works..lol..stop believing those bone heads online that say other wise. This game caters to a turtle a lot more than you think. I already know all the Hype online is that it doesn't..lol..stop believing what you read because that seems to be what you base your facts on...


Its clear you do not play this game at a high level with some of your observations.

'ASSUME'...nuff said...


The reality is that the french cannot take map control against a GOOD player because their units are way too slow and expensive, and one of the faction's "strengths" are bunkers which NEVER pays off against a good player.

You really do not know anything about playing with France...on that note...I am not even going to copy and paste anything more of what you said because talking to you would be of no further use...

x3Form
10-07-2010, 06:52 PM
I'm afraid turtling does not work in this game. It's not really fair to say "oh well turtling works against all the newbies online" because I can say the same for a Maus rush, or fast Crocodiles.

Also the H39 is the worst light tank in the game due to it's awful speed and there is no way you could use FCM F1s as mobile AA in a 1v1 against anything other than a cabbage!

France have incredibly strong tanks but are let down by their difficulty in countering enemy air!


Originally posted by Brenbed:
If you have good defense in the early game you should be able to defend really well until you get access to the Panhard....which can give you recon and back up to the infantry Units..

I don't think you can wait that long to get a recon. It should be one of the first units you build unless you are going for some funky air build.

GunnersMate07
10-07-2010, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by Brenbed:

I know turtling works..lol..stop believing those bone heads online that say other wise. This game caters to a turtle a lot more than you think. I already know all the Hype online is that it doesn't..lol..stop believing what you read because that seems to be what you base your facts on...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Its clear you do not play this game at a high level with some of your observations.

'ASSUME'...nuff said...
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where to begin.... Its obvious you are not playing top competition if you think turtling works. I don't base this off of "hype" or what others say. I say it because thats my experience in game, and considering I am on an 80 game win streak of only total victories and am at the top of the xbox 1v1 ranked leaderboards, I would like to think I know a little bit about how this game works.

This game revolves around two things. Using correct counters, and winning the economic battle. The first is pretty easy to do with any nation (except france when trying to counter air). The second can only be done by taking map control since you have to take more depots then the other guy to win the economic advantage. Admin buildings for reasons that have been talked about many many times do not cut it.

Therefore, turtling does not work simply because on the majority of 1v1 maps (except frontline), the other player will control more of the map by being offensive, and therefore have more income from depots. Thats as simple as it is for why turtling is not a valid option in high level play. If you turtle, you will not have as much income as an aggressive player, you will not get kills with your defensive buildings against a good player using recon properly, and eventually your bunkers will be artied without ever recouping their cost in kills.

But sure, I have no idea what I am talking about. Coming from the guy who in a separate thread today thought that B17's were a counter for armored tank destroyers.

Brenbed
10-07-2010, 10:04 PM
France is probably the most unique faction due to its ability to create strong units at the beginning of the match which conflicts with the ability to create some of the best defensive bunkers in the game. These factors give France the edge if attacked early in the game, especially if blitzed by Italy's weak units. Due to the expensive units and great defensive abilities, France is considered by most to be an expert Turtling faction.

Tips for use: As stated above, use a turtle tactic against your enemies. Opponents running a blitz will be easily destroyed due to the high powered units available to France at the beginning of the match. Also, build defensive bunkers early to help aide in the initial defense of your base and units. Be sure to build an Admin Building early and begin collecting money from supply depots because French units are just as expensive as they are powerful. Eventually, building a strong force behind your defenses will lead to victory. Wait for your opponents initial attack and deploy your forces against his after your defense has succeeded. Chances are most of his money is spent and units destroyed.

Things to watch: France can be seriously handicapped by opponents with strong artillery. Bunkers and anti-air units are very vulnerable to arty attacks, and those are the key to the French defense. Destruction of those units will result in an air and ground assault that will obliterate your forces. However, France has some solid arty of their own and will often win in a head to head match versus an opponents arty, so be sure to build a few artillery units to help in your defenses.

Keys to victory: Build defensive structures far enough from your base to incude a few supply depots. DO NOT build them so close to your base that they are ineffective. Remember, money is power in this game and is especially crucial for France. Build tanks, anti-air, and artillery. Station them near your bunkers. A safe plan is 4 anti-air per group of tanks. Use artillery for support against initial attacks. When initial attack has ended, take your remaining units and move in for the kill. Be sure to move arty up as well. If you feel your forces are too small to succeed, you're probably wrong. Chances are good your opponent is undefended and broke.

This is from Battle Strats...

http://www.battlestrats.com/games/_/r-u-s-e/

There is the link...looks like I am not the only person who can see what France is capable of...Click on the 'Factions' Tab to read...

This is my last response to this subject..

To the Original poster that had doubts about France...the link to the strategy guide should ease your doubts....

This is not about to become a senseless and baseless Argument so I will end the conversation with this link...Peace and Enjoy the Info...

Deton_van_Zan
10-08-2010, 12:39 AM
FREEDOM FRIES > french fries anyday and time

ihcsO
10-08-2010, 02:02 AM
The French can be very fun to play as but they have a few weaknesses and if the enemy knows how to abuse those weaknesses, you are in for a very hard time.

Those weaknesses are:
-very vulnerable to air -> often need to go air themselves to not get dive-bombed to death
-slow ground units -> you will often fight on your enemy's terms and early game his armored recons might slip through and harrass you
-infantry can become expensive pretty quickly (e.g. against US ball strat)
-their armored TD is expensive for its stats, leaving france with unarmored AT options only, which makes them a bit vulnerable to artillery

If the enemy plays you right on those weaknesses you'll have problems. When you play the french strengths well, you can manage to survive long enough so SAU40s can often punch through in mid game.

GunnersMate07
10-08-2010, 07:20 AM
Originally posted by Brenbed:
This is from Battle Strats...

http://www.battlestrats.com/games/_/r-u-s-e/

There is the link...looks like I am not the only person who can see what France is capable of...Click on the 'Factions' Tab to read...

This is my last response to this subject..

To the Original poster that had doubts about France...the link to the strategy guide should ease your doubts....

This is not about to become a senseless and baseless Argument so I will end the conversation with this link...Peace and Enjoy the Info...

So a site written for noobs that explains the factions in the most generic fortune cookie terms describes the French in a way thats completely obvious to everyone, therefore the balance of the French is a-ok? That's like citing wikipedia while doing research.

From the same site, three paragraphs up on the US.


There's nothing special about the United States faction, but nonetheless, it will probably be the most utilized faction in RUSE for the first few months. This faction is great for beginners or gamers who do not go in with a set plan for victory. The reason being that the US faction does not have any huge weaknesses or advantages and can usually adapt to situations as they arise. Their tanks and air units are the stars of their forces, but still can be defeated by an experienced player.

Tips for use: Not a faction of choice for experienced players, so be ready for some heckling before and after the match. However, if utilized correctly, USA can certainly win matches. Be sure to watch the enemy base to see where their focus lies, whether it be on a ground or air attack. Being able to build decent units for relatively low costs is your only strengths, so make sure units you're building contrast the look of your enemies direction. If your opponent is looking to turtle, and you're playing a faction that has strong units through cost or research, do not wait for them to build your forces. If they are able to build elite units, you will lose.


Considering the US is right now considered almost unanimously by the top players as the most OP faction, and contrary to descriptions like this one the US has many strengths over other factions. Its pretty easy to see that this site was written for people like you who have not actually played many multiplayer games to get a very basic overview of the game.

I am not dogging on France for sh*ts and giggles. I like playing random and using all the factions. I want to use the French! But as it stands with current balance, you are playing with one hand tied behind your back when playing the French because they are not as good as every other faction in a 1v1 due to basic design flaws.

Some noob going over a checklist of units the French has doesn't change that.

Axe99
10-08-2010, 03:33 PM
Gunners, I can't believe that description of the US!

However, my 2 cents on this is that the French are limited tactically in what options they can pursue, and have some obvious weaknesses. This opens them up (even more than the Brits, who are limited offensively but pretty solid defensively) to experienced players being able to exploit French weaknesses, while playing to strengths they know the French can't effectively counter (air's the biggy here - the FCM F1's AA is only as good as a Bofors, and it takes a lot of Bofors to blunt a large air assault).

Brenbed
10-08-2010, 04:28 PM
I wasn't going to reply to this thread again but since everyone keeps hitting it up..allow me to say this..

Theories look good on paper...action speaks louder than words...

All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..


But for now...the only thing that we can do is keep shouting theories at each other...which will do nothing. No matter what you say..I am going to disagree and no matter what I say you guys will disagree...

So How bout I agree to disagree..lol..

I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Wars fought on paper mean nothing..remember that...LMAOO

Joppsta
10-08-2010, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by Brenbed:
I wasn't going to reply to this thread again but since everyone keeps hitting it up..allow me to say this..

Theories look good on paper...action speaks louder than words...

All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..


But for now...the only thing that we can do is keep shouting theories at each other...which will do nothing. No matter what you say..I am going to disagree and no matter what I say you guys will disagree...

So How bout I agree to disagree..lol..

I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Wars fought on paper mean nothing..remember that...LMAOO A very ignorant statement. And it's very true about the French.. beat 2 frenchies playing as you say to on Handshake over the Elbe by aerial assault and tanks/artillery.

Sure .. could say these guys were noobs but damn .. they had about 30 AA/Maginots out there. They certainly got the eco mojo going but they played too defensively.

I think you are talking out of your *** for the most part, my friend, and it's sort of breaking down into a "nuh uh" arguement.


Sure, the French are solid if you know how to use them.. but they are still not 100% solid, like the US is... for example.

Brenbed
10-08-2010, 09:31 PM
Originally posted by Joppsta:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brenbed:
I wasn't going to reply to this thread again but since everyone keeps hitting it up..allow me to say this..

Theories look good on paper...action speaks louder than words...

All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..


But for now...the only thing that we can do is keep shouting theories at each other...which will do nothing. No matter what you say..I am going to disagree and no matter what I say you guys will disagree...

So How bout I agree to disagree..lol..

I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Wars fought on paper mean nothing..remember that...LMAOO A very ignorant statement. And it's very true about the French.. beat 2 frenchies playing as you say to on Handshake over the Elbe by aerial assault and tanks/artillery.

Sure .. could say these guys were noobs but damn .. they had about 30 AA/Maginots out there. They certainly got the eco mojo going but they played too defensively.

I think you are talking out of your *** for the most part, my friend, and it's sort of breaking down into a "nuh uh" arguement.


Sure, the French are solid if you know how to use them.. but they are still not 100% solid, like the US is... for example. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you say so..lol..are you done??

Brenbed
10-08-2010, 09:51 PM
they had about 30 AA/Maginots out there. They certainly got the eco mojo going but they played too defensively.

It's all about Balance, it seems you and all of the others skipped the part where I said Defense in the early game and assumed it meant the whole game.

This is not an "Uh uh" argument..lol..far from it...but that was a good one...Lmao... I am just saying there is no such thing as impossible when it comes to any specific player winning against another specific player. It comes down to the player. We can argue strategies and stats all day but in the end, everything in life comes down to the individuals...Intelligence beats Brawn any day of the week, so if that classifies me as ignorant then so be it...you insulting me on a forum doesn't bother me because "who are you?" .. lol .. anyways believe whatever makes you feel better...I'm going to go and kick some more butt with France...maybe I will run into you one day http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif who knows....

Joppsta
10-08-2010, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by Brenbed:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">they had about 30 AA/Maginots out there. They certainly got the eco mojo going but they played too defensively.

It's all about Balance, it seems you and all of the others skipped the part where I said Defense in the early game and assumed it meant the whole game.

This is not an "Uh uh" argument..lol..far from it...but that was a good one...Lmao... I am just saying there is no such thing as impossible when it comes to any specific player winning against another specific player. It comes down to the player. We can argue strategies and stats all day but in the end, everything in life comes down to the individuals...Intelligence beats Brawn any day of the week, so if that classifies me as ignorant then so be it...you insulting me on a forum doesn't bother me because "who are you?" .. lol .. anyways believe whatever makes you feel better...I'm going to go and kick some more butt with France...maybe I will run into you one day http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif who knows.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

"Intelligence beats Brawn"

Uh.. rich nations also rape poor nations... That's why playing defense early as the french would be counter-productive since they need money in order to be able to use their expensive units?

You see? You're arguement is full of holes to be picked at. How can you play defense, let your enemy get control of all the supply and expect them to keel over at a few maginots? Or wahtever you deploy..

If it's AT, i take out artillery. If it's artillery, i blitz your *** back to the stone age with bombers even if you got AA, hell, might bomb them for kicks.. or maybe i'll move my artillery up once their done getting spanked. You rush air? You get destroyed by fighters.


See? There's no way you can win turtling with France. Unless you push your lines up, get enough depots.. and get out the appropriate counters. You need to pressurise your enemy to provoke assault. Otherwise they'll just sit and laugh at the pet turtle .. maybe pet it a little before they stamp on it, crushing it's shell and devouring it's insides.

Brenbed
10-09-2010, 01:12 AM
Uh.. rich nations also rape poor nations...

Oh yeah you are right...I almost forgot how the USA raped the Vietnamese...


You see? You're arguement is full of holes to be picked at. How can you play defense, let your enemy get control of all the supply and expect them to keel over at a few maginots? Or wahtever you deploy..

If it's AT, i take out artillery. If it's artillery, i blitz your *** back to the stone age with bombers even if you got AA, hell, might bomb them for kicks.. or maybe i'll move my artillery up once their done getting spanked. You rush air? You get destroyed by fighters.


See? There's no way you can win turtling with France. Unless you push your lines up, get enough depots.. and get out the appropriate counters. You need to pressurise your enemy to provoke assault. Otherwise they'll just sit and laugh at the pet turtle .. maybe pet it a little before they stamp on it, crushing it's shell and devouring it's insides.

Again you put words in my mouth..pretty much everything you said in that last post were your words...not mine..go back and read all of what I said then I will give a response to that...

fattoler
10-09-2010, 03:50 AM
Originally posted by Brenbed:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Uh.. rich nations also rape poor nations...

Oh yeah you are right...I almost forgot how the USA raped the Vietnamese... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think he's referring to how the only way to win in RUSE is to acquire supplies faster than the enemy does, and considering how slow France are that's a bloody difficult task for them.

x3Form
10-09-2010, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by Brenbed:
I wasn't going to reply to this thread again but since everyone keeps hitting it up..allow me to say this..

Theories look good on paper...action speaks louder than words...

All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..


But for now...the only thing that we can do is keep shouting theories at each other...which will do nothing. No matter what you say..I am going to disagree and no matter what I say you guys will disagree...

So How bout I agree to disagree..lol..

I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Wars fought on paper mean nothing..remember that...LMAOO

You're the one theorising in all honesty matey. I would say add me on steam and let's go, but it's clear your on the xbox/ps3.

Add that Gunnersmate07 chap and have a 1v1 with him, best of five say, with you as France.

If you're not willing to put your money where your mouth is then you should just stop "trolling" this thread! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Joppsta
10-09-2010, 10:31 AM
Yep, just as i said. "Nuh uh".


You said play defensively early on. That means not going for map control. If you play defensively and go for map control, that is sort of an oxymoron you tool.

I guess these words are wasted upon you. You're trying to be a smartass and failing miserably.

Brenbed
10-09-2010, 10:35 AM
Originally posted by x3Form:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brenbed:
I wasn't going to reply to this thread again but since everyone keeps hitting it up..allow me to say this..

Theories look good on paper...action speaks louder than words...

All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..


But for now...the only thing that we can do is keep shouting theories at each other...which will do nothing. No matter what you say..I am going to disagree and no matter what I say you guys will disagree...

So How bout I agree to disagree..lol..

I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Wars fought on paper mean nothing..remember that...LMAOO

You're the one theorising in all honesty matey. I would say add me on steam and let's go, but it's clear your on the xbox/ps3.

Add that Gunnersmate07 chap and have a 1v1 with him, best of five say, with you as France.

If you're not willing to put your money where your mouth is then you should just stop "trolling" this thread! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again you obviously did not read what I was saying...


I can care less about who's right or wrong...I care more about who would win the war...

Meaning...lets have a match and let the win speak for itself...if you notice my last few post were not really even talking about strategies anymore...they have really just been replies to just say quit attacking me and just play me..

PSN = brenbed

XBL = brenbed (will have another Xbox soon)

Again you are doing nothing but attacking me without even reading what I am saying...in fact from here on out when the attacks come..I will just paste what wrote earlier to show how you are just reading what you wanted to read and not the whole thing...



All I can say is that I hope I get a chance to play against you guys one day...Then we would see what the REAL DEAL is..

You obviously can't read between the lines...as you can see I have already called out the competition..

Trolling is what you are doing...nothing you just sad was relevant to the conversation...you only attacked what I said..lol...

GunnersMate07
10-09-2010, 12:30 PM
I'm on xbox and I will gladly play anyone that wants a game. My username is Gunnersmate07. I normally only play 1v1 ranked, but apparently the matchmaking changes above level 61 and you can no longer get matched up without waiting for 20-30 minutes, so I would welcome the chance to get some fast 1v1 games up.

aod125
10-09-2010, 01:30 PM
hey gunner the reason we cant find games is because there are like 3 people in our league

BP_Charlie
10-09-2010, 02:42 PM
Yeah, I figured something like this would happen as there is a unique Elite leader board.

Brenbed, I'll add you on PS3 - not because I want to make a point about the French (although I'd love to play against you) - but because I'm looking for good partners. Especially if 2v2 ranked gets patched...

There's Axe, but his time overlap window is small as he's in Australia http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

EDIT: I sent you a friend request Brenbed, but you have zero RUSE trophies...? Do you have it on XBox, or have you just not synced trophies for ages? (Or maybe I got the wrong guy lol)

fattoler
10-09-2010, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by BP_Charlie:
Yeah, I figured something like this would happen as there is a unique Elite leader board.

Brenbed, I'll add you on PS3 - not because I want to make a point about the French (although I'd love to play against you) - but because I'm looking for good partners. Especially if 2v2 ranked gets patched...

There's Axe, but his time overlap window is small as he's in Australia http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

EDIT: I sent you a friend request Brenbed, but you have zero RUSE trophies...? Do you have it on XBox, or have you just not synced trophies for ages? (Or maybe I got the wrong guy lol)

I could partner with you, I will admit I'm not ALWAYS playing Ruse and I'm certainly not a master strategist but I would love to have a guy to play with or against when I am playing Ruse.

BP_Charlie
10-09-2010, 07:37 PM
Sure, add me...always good to have RUSE players on my friend list. PSN name is in my sig http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Brenbed
10-14-2010, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by BP_Charlie:
Yeah, I figured something like this would happen as there is a unique Elite leader board.

Brenbed, I'll add you on PS3 - not because I want to make a point about the French (although I'd love to play against you) - but because I'm looking for good partners. Especially if 2v2 ranked gets patched...

There's Axe, but his time overlap window is small as he's in Australia http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

EDIT: I sent you a friend request Brenbed, but you have zero RUSE trophies...? Do you have it on XBox, or have you just not synced trophies for ages? (Or maybe I got the wrong guy lol)

My bad guys...been gone for a few days

BP_Charlie I just added you a few minutes ago...You are probably sleeping at the moment because it is 4AM ..lol..

I asked who you were when I sent the message because I got on the PSN before getting on here...But I know who you are now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

The reason I don't have any trophies for it because I was originally playing on the PC and have not had it for the PS3 very long...But now I am mostly playin on PS3 now....

Let me know when you get online...I don't have many people to play with so it would be nice to add some fellow RUSE players

I am also looking for a good partner...


P.S. I never knew I had to Sync trophies,I thought they synced by themselves...LMAO...I haven't done that in a long while...I think I attempted it a few times recently, but it takes a while and I never have had the patience to wait...But I will do that now that you told me about it and put it too my attention...

Brenbed
10-14-2010, 02:21 AM
BP_Charlie are you in the States?? What Time zone are you in...I am in NYC so I am on Eastern Time...I usually get on at around 2 or 3 in the afternoon.

Brenbed
10-14-2010, 02:23 AM
Originally posted by GunnersMate07:
I'm on xbox and I will gladly play anyone that wants a game. My username is Gunnersmate07. I normally only play 1v1 ranked, but apparently the matchmaking changes above level 61 and you can no longer get matched up without waiting for 20-30 minutes, so I would welcome the chance to get some fast 1v1 games up.

Gunners...I also have a 360 but haven't picked it up yet..but when I get paid I'll pick up a Copy for XBox...

My XBL is also the same as my PS3 which is my name on here...

BP_Charlie
10-14-2010, 07:18 AM
No, I'm in the UK, but play with many Americans - especially on Fridays and Saturdays when I stay up later. At least you're east coast http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

P.S: your trophies will sync if you click on your profile, view your trophies, compare trophies, or press triangle on trophies and select sync.