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Realjambo
02-13-2007, 10:40 AM
I've built a new PC for a friend today and we've come up against a problem.

The fans whirr and all appears well. The problem I have is when you go to boot up, the monitor just says "No signal" when you use the mobo socket, and just a blank screen when you use the Gfx card socket.

The Gfx card was PCI Express, which we've (ahem) learnt won't fit but I had an old AGP card and the new mobo has PCI and AGP sockets.

The new spec:

Intel Core 2 Duo E4300
Arock 775 I65G Mobo
(Using an old Geforce 5700LE just for now as the Asus 7300 GS PCI EXPRESS didn't fit the mobo and needs to be returned for a PCI non Express one)
New PSU 600w

RJ would be very grateful for any help, this is all very embarrasing! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Minoos
02-13-2007, 10:56 AM
...
Did you connect both 20pins and 4pins power cables?
Try to start with just the video cable ( no keyboard/mouse ) connected, only the power switch + power leads on the mobo and nothing else.

Be sure that CLRCMOS0 jumper is open.

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 12:29 PM
Did you connect both 20pins and 4pins power cables?


Hi Minoos. The mobo looks like this, I'm confused about the extra 4 pin power cable, I can only see the 20pin socket. The small 4 pin socket (top right of picture) won't accept the seperate 4 pin plug, and neither will it reach anyway, as the main power cable is sleeved and cable tied from the factory. Am I missing something obvious here? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v642/antsmith/mikesmobo.jpg

Minoos
02-13-2007, 12:36 PM
Check the picture from the link bellow, 4pin PSU cable is on the left.
http://www.extremeoverclocking.com/reviews/cases/images...c_TPII-480Blue_9.jpg (http://www.extremeoverclocking.com/reviews/cases/images/Antec_TPII-480Blue/Antec_TPII-480Blue_9.jpg)

Edit, strange that the 4 pin cable is so short...

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 12:44 PM
Aahh! So the 4 pin socket that is top right on the mobo needs a diffferent 4 pin plug - NOT the one that is able to slide on and click onto the 20 pin plug? Is that right?

Is this a quirk of Intel boards? I've only ever built (3) AMD based PC's before.

I'm going to check the bundle of wires now, I have the PC next to me here....

Minoos
02-13-2007, 12:57 PM
I'm not sure about that last part... just make sure that your 4 pin cable has the right cable colors: Black/Yellow. If it is the wrong connector then the shape won't match to the mobo's connector.

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 01:13 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif

Minoos - At the SH World Meet I owe you a beer. Would you believe the correct 4pin plug had hidden itself behind the DVD writer internal bay, and the cable was hidden by the ribbon from the DVD writer.

God do I feel stupid http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Now I'll attempt a boot up. Thank you very much indeed! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 01:28 PM
Update.

Removed the Gfx card, plugged monitor into mobo, powered up...I get the flash of white text saying 'Windows detected new XYZ etx etc'...Then get "Sorry, Windows seems to have stopped due to a problem last ime, choose your option to boot" prompt.

I leave it on 'Boot to Windows Normal' and it runs this in cycles, it won't get past this stage - But we've made progress!

Hmmm - what now my fellow Kaleuns? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

Should I install the old gfx card and see if that'll help - perhaps the mobo is set to use a gfx card as oposed to on board gfx, but surely that wouldn't stop it booting to desktop?

Stuntcow
02-13-2007, 01:42 PM
Not sure but if I am understanding everything correctly. Did you reinstall the OS after getting the new system connected? If not, then you will have to reinstall the OS.

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 01:52 PM
Did you reinstall the OS after getting the new system connected? If not, then you will have to reinstall the OS.


Er, No. *Whincing* I just plugged his hard drives (2) straight into the new mobo (I've always done this myself and got away with it, guess I've been lucky)

Oh. I'm in trouble now aren't I? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

He doesn't have a windows disc, the old PC was bought from a UK company similar to Dell (Tiny) about 5 years ago. I have a windows disc, and he does have the key code for his copy of windows on a sticker on his old tower.

But would a fresh install wipe everything from the hard drive I put XP on to again? He wasn't / wouldn't be prepared for that.

Now I'm stumped.

....And he just happens to be my Boss.

Realjambo
02-13-2007, 02:09 PM
Can I do a 'repair' XP install?

Obviously now I'm worried I'll lose stuff off his hard drives by doing a complete fresh install.

Minoos
02-13-2007, 02:26 PM
Repair install won't delete personal files, all programs will require a re-install. Make sure to enable windows firewall and check windowsupdate site. If windowsupdate does not see more than 20 security updates, apply service pack 2.

Good luck RJ.

Edit: I forgot the obvious, all drivers should be installed too.

TheRealPotoroo
02-13-2007, 04:03 PM
Before going so far as to reinstall XP I'd try booting in Safe Mode. Since all graphics cards these days have SVGA built in you should be able to get in and uninstall/install things like graphics drivers as necessary.

Kaleun1961
02-13-2007, 04:07 PM
I would love to have a hidden microphone in Jambo's house when he works on systems. I bet I could learn a few new swear words.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 12:17 AM
OK, I have to get this sorted today. Are we all agreed that repairing or re-installing XP will NOT erase his photo's and iTunes?...That's all he's concerned about keeping.

Attempt a boot in Safe mode 1st
Then if that fails attempt a repair
If that fails attempt a re-install

Could I take the hd of his and put it in my PC as a slave and burn all his music and photo's onto DVD - would my PC see his hd in my PC?

Any last takers?

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by Realjambo:
OK, I have to get this sorted today. Are we all agreed that repairing or re-installing XP will NOT erase his photo's and iTunes?...That's all he's concerned about keeping.
A repair won't. A reinstall could cause problems with security access. Is it XP Home or Pro? Either way, if you reinstall XP and recreate userids then their underlying security id (which you cannot see or access directly) will be different. IOW, user Potoroo has a security id of 68BC3B9C-15B4-4FD4-8B4B-9A711D02613B. If you reinstall XP and recreate user Potoroo then it might have a security id of AEAA85FB-B8A5-4D03-9AB5-5E01B5424232. To you it looks like user Potoroo is fine but many things won't work because as far as Windows is concerned they're two completely different users.

You can recover ownership and change security if you run as an Administrator and have the Take Ownership and Change Permissions privileges.


Could I take the hd of his and put it in my PC as a slave and burn all his music and photo's onto DVD - would my PC see his hd in my PC?
I see no inherent reason why it shouldn't work. You may have to go into XP's Disk Administrator to enable the disk but that should be about it.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 02:10 AM
Could I take the hd of his and put it in my PC as a slave and burn all his music and photo's onto DVD - would my PC see his hd in my PC?


I see no inherent reason why it shouldn't work. You may have to go into XP's Disk Administrator to enable the disk but that should be about it.


You think that would work Potoroo? Thanks for replying. He says all he's concerned with is the photo's and the music, so if I can save that I can do a fresh install and not worry.

May I ask what the XP disk Administrator entails? and what I'd have to do?

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 02:16 AM
.....And would you be online about 1pm UK time? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 06:01 AM
Originally posted by Realjambo:
May I ask what the XP disk Administrator entails? and what I'd have to do?
Logon as an Administrator.

Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Computer Management > Storage > Disk Management.

You may not have to do anything, I'm working from memory here. But if you need to enable the disk you'd do it there.

VikingGrandad
02-15-2007, 06:27 AM
When I added my second hard drive, it didn't appear under 'My Computer' (even though Device Manager listed it) so I had to assign its driver letter using the Disk Management tool. It's fairly straightforward.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 06:49 AM
Ok, thanks guys. This is starting to hurt my head!

I'll try and keep this simple (for my benefit more than anyone elses!)

His PC will not boot to windows or even as far as getting into the BIOS. I get the 'Windows was interrupted during last boot...Please select how you wish to boot: Safe/Safe with Networking/Safe with prompt command' or whatever the wording is. None of these options works. I've tried all of them. They just go round in circles.

I took his HD that has all his music and photo's on and plugged it into where MY slave HD goes in my MY PC - Hoping I could just burn to DVD all his stuff. No joy. For some reason my PC is assuming his HD is the main HD and asking me to validate his copy of windows (I do have his XP Key) but it won't find my broadband connection to activate it.

I'm stumped. I'm considering giving in and taking to a PC shop that I know. Anyone offer any ideas before I resign myself to failure?

EDIT: I had a thought - I could put his HD's back into his old PC and save all the stuff of the HD that way onto DVD, then format the HD and install into the new PC (Er, like I probably should have done in the very 1st place I guess!)

I'm seriously considering hitting my 'Special' key which I've never used before amd seeing what happens.....
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v642/antsmith/PanicKey.jpg

Minoos
02-15-2007, 06:54 AM
With his HD in your computer, can you try to boot using the Bios boot menu?
You can select which drive to boot from ( your own ) ...

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by Realjambo:
His PC will not boot to windows or even as far as getting into the BIOS. I get the 'Windows was interrupted during last boot...Please select how you wish to boot: Safe/Safe with Networking/Safe with prompt command' or whatever the wording is.
You've got it the wrong way around. The BIOS comes before the Windows boot loader. If you're getting that far you're past the BIOS stage.

Booting into Safe Mode can actually be very slow, since Windows not only has to work out what it can load, but it has to make sure it doesn't load all the "unsafe" stuff. You can sit at the screen for quite a while before the Windows desktop will appear.


For some reason my PC is assuming his HD is the main HD and asking me to validate his copy of windows (I do have his XP Key) but it won't find my broadband connection to activate it.
For God's sake, don't do that. His copy of XP is trying to reactivate because all its hardware has changed. Ignore it. Just swap cables around and fiddle with the BIOS boot order until you get to boot again with your own HD. If it's SATA you could even boot first and plug it in after, since SATA is hot swappable (special case: you cannot swap out an SATA drive if it's the boot disk).

VikingGrandad
02-15-2007, 07:07 AM
EDIT: I had a thought - I could put his HD's back into his old PC and save all the stuff of the HD that way onto DVD, then format the HD and install into the new PC (Er, like I probably should have done in the very 1st place I guess!)

That sounds like a reliable (and achievable!) plan. That way he also gets a fresh install of Windows.

Maybe use Ghost to take a disc image when it's up and running? (I've learned a lot of good PC housekeeping stuff in these forums! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)

Also, I advise you to take more than one DVD copy of the music and photos - just to be safe.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 07:31 AM
OK Cool. All very valid and helpful points! I'll try the BIOS switch in my PC (Don't know why I missed that last time) 1st.

Will the jumper settings on his HD matter?

Thanks all once again http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

VikingGrandad
02-15-2007, 07:35 AM
From what I understand of your situation, his HD needs to be set to 'slave' when in your PC (if your HD is still in place) and 'master' when you put it back in his PC.

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 07:37 AM
Originally posted by Realjambo:
Will the jumper settings on his HD matter?
Most probably (there are rare exceptions but I doubt they apply here). The physical position on an 80-pin IDE cable must correspond to its logical status. IOW, a Master disk must be at the far end of the cable (black connector) and a Slave disk must be on the intermediate connector (grey). Set jumpers accordingly if you're not using Cable Select (not supported by all disks).

Minoos
02-15-2007, 07:41 AM
I guess that recent hard drives are set to Cable Select ( IDE ), you can plug them without changing the jumpers. Bios should boot from the 1st device with a valid boot sector + active partition. The order is Primary Master, Primary Slave then it switches to the next channel.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:09 AM
OK, I'm posting this using my laptop. I've put HIS HD on the grey connector, and my HD is on the black connector.I'm pretty sure I have the correct HD of mine (I have 2)connected that should boot.

What do I need to change in the BIOS? Could someone post a logical flow thingie i.e. BIOS>BOOT UP>...then what?

OK, Just booted and something is wrong, it's asking me validate the XP again. I'll just swop which HD of MINE I'm booting on. Oh Gawd.

I am very grateful for your help! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:13 AM
Ok swopped my HD I was connected to on the black.Looking at BIOS here is what I see:

MAIN

Primary IDE Master = None
Primary IDE Slave = None

BOOT>BOOT DEVICE PRIORITY

1st = CD ROM
2nd = Removable
3rd = HD
4th Disabled

Does this help explain my waffle in the previous post?

Minoos
02-15-2007, 08:16 AM
Does the BIOS setup screen show both HDs ? If so, check the boot order listed in the BIOS... (advanced settings?)

Edit: OK check for each HDD jumper settings.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:16 AM
OK, Now I get 'Boot Disk Failure, Insert Sys disk and press enter' http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Minoos
02-15-2007, 08:20 AM
Cross-posting won't help us much here..
Keep your HDD as Master ( Black ).
Put the other HDD in Slave mode ( jumpers ).

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:22 AM
Does the BIOS setup screen show both HDs ? If so, check the boot order listed in the BIOS... (advanced settings?)

OK I'm in BIOS>Adanced Settings...What am I looking for here Minoos?

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:24 AM
No, cross posting won't help I agree. All stop! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I am looking at the jumper setings on the HD's. I'll do this now before doing anything else. Bear with me.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:27 AM
Minoos - His HD has NO jumpers on it, just ten bare pins. Mine has a jumper (But in theory all I've done it remove my slave and plug his in?)

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 08:43 AM
What make and model are:

1. Your motherboard
2. Your HD
3. His HD

If we have some solid information we might start getting somewhere. Most manuals are available in pdf format these days.

My guess is that his HD is using cable select (hence no jumpers) but there's some sort of conflict which is why the BIOS isn't reporting any disks at all. You could try using the jumper off your slave HD on his to force it to slave status.

Minoos
02-15-2007, 08:44 AM
RJ, check your PM.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 08:48 AM
1.
Your motherboard
2. Your HD
3. His HD

Thanks Potoroo

My Motherboard is an Asus A8V XE
My HD is a Western Digital 250gb ATA
His HD is a Western Digital 120gb ATA

His HD is definitely on the grey connector, and mine is on the black.

Messervy
02-15-2007, 08:58 AM
May I join in?

There is one thing I would like to point out before it`s too late

If you can get to a BIOS and see the drives listed you can set up a boot priority.

1. Set your WD250 to primary boot device and save the setings, then boot your PC. (WITHOUT HIS HD)

If your residential copy of OS works it`s good.

2. If not (it happened to me once when this incredible marvell of windows decided on his own to swap boot disk partition to another disk) then there is a real chance that both of you will have to reinstall the OS.

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 09:25 AM
Well a huge thanks to all of you who helped. It's sorted now and his HD is slave in my PC so I can copy off his stuff before reformatting his HD and installing XP shiny fresh and new.

Oddly, my BIOS wasn't seeing any HD at all, but popping a jumper cap on his HD changed all that and now it all works.

A huge thanks to Minoos who very kindly took time out of his day to help me via MSN http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif

Right! We can all get on with racking up some tonnage now! Thanks again, I'm very grateful to all of you.

VikingGrandad
02-15-2007, 09:36 AM
RJ - you can now reward yourself by pre-ordering the SH4 Deluxe Edition http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 09:43 AM
Originally posted by VikingGrandad:
RJ - you can now reward yourself by pre-ordering the SH4 Deluxe Edition http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
Too late - the last one went 5 minutes ago. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 09:44 AM
Originally posted by Realjambo:
Oddly, my BIOS wasn't seeing any HD at all, but popping a jumper cap on his HD changed all that and now it all works.
Cool. You owe me a beer since that was my suggestion. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Realjambo
02-15-2007, 09:59 AM
@ VG - Oh yes you are not wrong there!

@ Potoroo - I do indeede, come and see me at the SH World Meet - I'll happily buy you that beer, and the rest of you that helped too!

Minoos
02-15-2007, 10:02 AM
SH World meet... an undisclosed underwater location? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

TheRealPotoroo
02-15-2007, 10:09 AM
Originally posted by Minoos:
SH World meet... an undisclosed underwater location? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif
Yes. BDU will radio you the grid in due course.

Realjambo
02-16-2007, 05:46 AM
AHA! You thought this one had gone away! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

I'm after some help with formatting my friends HD ready to install XP on it again.

His HD is in MY pc as a slave drive. Windows won't let me format it. It says it can't and that I must check to see if any disk utility programs are running and then try again. I can disable anti-virus...but what else does Windows mean?

Secondly, I tried running the XP disk. I can see I can start an install, but won't that just head for MY main HD not HIS hd? Would it give me an option? I thought you could use the XP to format HD's - but I couldn't see that option.

Naturally I'm being cautious as I don't want to touch anything on my main HD....Can you imagine?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Thanks for any takers on this. These are the last 2 steps and then I'm done with his PC!

EDIT: I'm trying to format his HD using my PC as I can't even get into the BIOS to change boot priority on his PC to read the XP disk - In case you were wondering why I'm trying to format his HD in My pc http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Minoos
02-16-2007, 06:18 AM
Download this boot floppy creator that contains Testdisk.
http://www.freepctech.net/files/wpartnfix.exe
With testdisk, wipe/delete the partition record of his disk

Realjambo
02-16-2007, 06:42 AM
OK I've progressed somewhat.

I have his HD back in his machine, and feel much more comfortabkle about that - and managed to get into the BIOS, change the boot to the DVD drive! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif

How do I format his HD now? The options I have are:

Set up XP now

Repair XP(I have the XP disk and key here)

Quit without setting up
Thanks again!

Minoos
02-16-2007, 06:49 AM
Begin setup stage from the CD and Delete the existing partition...
Check the screens for help:
http://www.windowsxpprofessional.windowsreinstall.com/i...oldhdd/emulation.htm (http://www.windowsxpprofessional.windowsreinstall.com/installxpcdoldhdd/emulation.htm)

Realjambo
02-16-2007, 06:58 AM
It's OK I think, I see if you select Install it gives you the option of formatting a few steps later on, which I'm doing now. Phew!

So far so good....Thanks Minoos!

*Why! Why did I ever offer to do this for my boss, of all people! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif*

Realjambo
02-16-2007, 07:08 AM
OK, No I have a black screen and it says 'Press any key to boot from CD....Error loading operating system'

I see the guide you linked to Minoos says 'DO NOT press any keys, let setup bypass the CD boot.' but the screenshot in the guide doesn't have the second part of the message appearing, as in 'Error loading operating system'

Should I reset the PC and start again? or press a key, see what happens?

danurve
02-16-2007, 07:37 AM
Have I got a deal for you guys;

http://huntny.us/images/ole0.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

Realjambo
02-16-2007, 08:56 AM
Danurve - My office, now.