Unit Strengths and Weaknesses, take #453

[Exzeebo]

Okay, so this is clearly not the first time this topic has been discussed, but it is a matter I am still confused about. I am in the Xbox 360 leaderboards top 100, yet I still do not quite understand some of these:


Riflemen:
according to the combined # of Attack and Defense upgrades, JSF Riflemen should be the best. My rank 3-6 JSF Riflemen are completely upgraded, yet still seem unable to take down other Riflemen. It is possible that the enemy Riflemen are Legendary, but the sheer number of times my outfitted Riflemen have lost excludes this argument.


Transports:
according to the number of upgrades, SGB Transports should greatly outmatch any other Transports. Yet my JSF Gunships survive a heck of a lot longer against Russian Transports than they do against EFEC Transports. In fact, I have yet to find a unit other than a decked-out Tank that CAN survive EFEC Transports.

Gunships:
JSF Gunships suck. Fewest Attack and Defense upgrades. So much for American airpower...



Do EFEC infantry move faster than JSF/SGB infantry? I know they have a Mobility upgrade that helps with the speed of uplink capture/upgrade, but it sure seems like move their little European legs much quicker as well.


Tanks:
Russian tanks seem quite weak. At least weaker than their reputation claims them to be. They are perhaps the SGB unit I fear the least. EFEC Tanks: like kids dressing in Dad's clothing.

Artillery:
SGB Artillery does live up to its reputation.



All of the above are battlefield observations. Opinions--especially from SGB and EFEC players-- are most welcome.

[Exzeebo]

Okay, so this is clearly not the first time this topic has been discussed, but it is a matter I am still confused about. I am in the Xbox 360 leaderboards top 100, yet I still do not quite understand some of these:


Riflemen:
according to the combined # of Attack and Defense upgrades, JSF Riflemen should be the best. My rank 3-6 JSF Riflemen are completely upgraded, yet still seem unable to take down other Riflemen. It is possible that the enemy Riflemen are Legendary, but the sheer number of times my outfitted Riflemen have lost excludes this argument.


Transports:
according to the number of upgrades, SGB Transports should greatly outmatch any other Transports. Yet my JSF Gunships survive a heck of a lot longer against Russian Transports than they do against EFEC Transports. In fact, I have yet to find a unit other than a decked-out Tank that CAN survive EFEC Transports.

Gunships:
JSF Gunships suck. Fewest Attack and Defense upgrades. So much for American airpower...



Do EFEC infantry move faster than JSF/SGB infantry? I know they have a Mobility upgrade that helps with the speed of uplink capture/upgrade, but it sure seems like move their little European legs much quicker as well.


Tanks:
Russian tanks seem quite weak. At least weaker than their reputation claims them to be. They are perhaps the SGB unit I fear the least. EFEC Tanks: like kids dressing in Dad's clothing.

Artillery:
SGB Artillery does live up to its reputation.



All of the above are battlefield observations. Opinions--especially from SGB and EFEC players-- are most welcome.

[BlademagePSN]

it depends on whatever your strategy is moving out to be, regular riflemen in cover and devistate most enemy riflemen out of it(especially with marksman(+1) and granade launcher/scorp munitions at close range) also storm building will kill most enemy riflemen units entirely

transports i normaly use to defend engineers or artillery because of enemy gunships doing hit and run tatics, but yes it is useful

gunships should never see transports ever

tanks are slow but can pack a hell of a punch guarded with drones or transports

[Pal87]

in a 1 vs 1 fight of riflemen in cover trying to kill one another, i've realized 2 things.

1 jsf riflemen don't seem to have any advantage.

2 the side with marksmen win.

tanks take forever to take out riflemen in cover. granted,they don't take to much damage, but they need like 1 1/2 -2 minutes to kill said riflemen.tanks vs engineers is a slaughter. tanks are slowly finding their way out of the combat chain. being replaced by artillery in my opinion.

EFEC commanders observation

[Pal87]

btw blademage, i'll gloat later gotta work now. GG

[FMAylward]

I have not actually played online I don't know how useful this will be.

Riflemen are all about cover and upgrades but they can't kill much except other riflemen or engineers (and maybe gunships but I am not sure on that)

I have not had any problems taking out transports with my own tanks and even less of a problem is I used an ability on them.

Gunships are about the only counter to artillery are the other units are to slow to get all the way across the battlefield or don't do enough damage once there. They are also good at hit and run attacks against infantry out of cover and tanks.

No idea about infantry speed I normally use transports or order and forget until I get a report saying they have secured the objective.
All factions' tanks do the job (killing transports) they are expected of when I use them.

Only used SGB artillery once and they have less firing range then others or there was a bug in the firing order.

[BlademagePSN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FMAylward:
I have not actually played online I don't know how useful this will be.

Riflemen are all about cover and upgrades but they can't kill much except other riflemen or engineers (and maybe gunships but I am not sure on that)

I have not had any problems taking out transports with my own tanks and even less of a problem is I used an ability on them.

Gunships are about the only counter to artillery are the other units are to slow to get all the way across the battlefield or don't do enough damage once there. They are also good at hit and run attacks against infantry out of cover and tanks.

No idea about infantry speed I normally use transports or order and forget until I get a report saying they have secured the objective.
All factions' tanks do the job (killing transports) they are expected of when I use them.

Only used SGB artillery once and they have less firing range then others or there was a bug in the firing order. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
yah the AI is frendly compared to most ppl, riflemen can take out arty if they are stealthed the whole way through then assault, also other artillery with a UAV scout/hunter-killer vs unprotected arty
upgraded riflemen in hard cover can kill most anything besides tanks and arty at long range

JSF riflemen only have better acc making their atk upgrades worth what it is(just wish i had the dam add on from the PS store so i can give another defence upgrade to my riflemen -.-)

[FMAylward]

Was that upgrade actually from the PS store or is it the one you get for linking your PS3 to your ubi account? And if they were both different what did you one from the store give you?

[AwYea]

As a SGB player I agree with everything you said. The problem with the SGB Transports, Gunships and Tanks also is they're not really much till fully upgraded. The EFEC especially at early levels seem to be the best transport units in the game.

The SGB RF's have 3 defense upgrades compared to 1 for the other 2 factions. I will say my RF units can take one hell of a beating.

In my opinion the best SGB units in Descending order is...

1-Artillery
2-CV(it practically takes an act of GOD to kill this thing plus it has AA defense)
3-RF
4-Transports
5-Gunships
6-Tanks
7-Engineers

According to the strat guide the Gunships and Transports should be the best units, but until they're fully upgraded they're actually less at early to middle rank imo compared to other factions at early and middle ranks.

[Exzeebo]

Thanks, AwYea. That is exactly the kind of insight I am looking for.

[Exzeebo]

To match your list, AwYea, I would say that JSF falls like this:

1. Tanks
2. Engineers
3. Riflemen
4. Artillery
5. Command Vehicle
6. Transports
7. Gunships


This is not based on any "scientific" evidence, but rather the "feel" of the battles I have fought. My Tanks are not even fully upgraded yet they seem to dispatch both Russian and EFEC Transports without batting an eye, and in Tank duels, hold there own if not overcome Russian Tanks as well (kinda hard to believe, but hey, it has happened quite a bit).

Just like the Tanks, JSF Engineers, again, have no special claim to fame yet seem to dispatch other units much quicker than their OpFor counterparts.

JSF Gunships utterly suck. Perhaps it is because everyone I play always upgrades them first, but JSF Gunships always, always, always, die first in a straight up Gunship v Gunship duel, regardless of the situation.

[WildBill1337]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AwYea:
As a SGB player I agree with everything you said. The problem with the SGB Transports, Gunships and Tanks also is they're not really much till fully upgraded. The EFEC especially at early levels seem to be the best transport units in the game.

The SGB RF's have 3 defense upgrades compared to 1 for the other 2 factions. I will say my RF units can take one hell of a beating.

In my opinion the best SGB units in Descending order is...

1-Artillery
2-CV(it practically takes an act of GOD to kill this thing plus it has AA defense)
3-RF
4-Transports
5-Gunships
6-Tanks
7-Engineers

According to the strat guide the Gunships and Transports should be the best units, but until they're fully upgraded they're actually less at early to middle rank imo compared to other factions at early and middle ranks. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

personally, i would swap the transports and gunships.

[AwYea]

^^^ Yea you could do that and you could probably swap the order or the CV and RF also.

Okay, here is the total Attack, Defense, and Speed upgrade levels for each faction assuming veteran units with all the upgrades for all 7 units from the strat guide.

EDIT: It's getting late, Here are the ability levels also. These are mostly for the CV and Infantry units, beides the SGB transport firing holes and JSF ability for artillery to detect mines.

SGB
Attack-32
Defense-27
Speed-5
Abilities-12 Total=74

EFEC
Attack-28
Defense-25
Speed-15
Abilities-15 Total=83

JSF
Attack-30
Defense-21
Speed-11
Abilities-14 Total=76

NOTE: The EFEC has 2 mobility upgrades, 1 for engineers to capture uplinks quicker and 1 for riflemen to capture and upgrade uplinks quicker. The JSF has 1 mobility upgrade for engineers to capture uplinks quicker. The SGB has none of these. These were included in the speed ratings above. I don't think these actually increase foot speed, just capturing and upgrading speed. The Defense numbers don't differenate between Shields and HP.

[Superpower34]

Playing as the EFEC, personally I love the Arty. The MLRS barrage is devestating to infanty. I dont know what others have but it just rips em up.

A upgraded EFEC Rifleman in cover is like a squad of rambo's.

I played Copenhagen with a guy who transported his ** Rifleman to Lima and left. They fought off a squad of Rifleman, transports and later on a tank and only lost half thei health. I love the EFEC Transports. They are pretty bad *** as well.

I am not feeling the tanks so much, but Erwin Rommel I am not. So its possible I may not use them right. I am sorta indifferent on the gunships. The hot missles/area effect missles are really nice for tanks/infantry/buildings.

[The.Harlequin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> A upgraded EFEC Rifleman in cover is like a squad of rambo's.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agreed. Usually in a conquest map I'll have an infantry unit at each uplink that i want held but don't want to commit too many units to it. And for the rest of the game i don't really have to worry about those uplinks, the only thing that will get my infantry off them are either 1) arty which is usually occupied with my main assault or is already dead due to aggressive gunship scouting.
or 2) A WMD.

The rest of the game I just use a combination of Tanks and Transports with the odd piece of artillery or gunships thrown in. Personally i love the European combination of Transports and Tanks, it works so well for me, mainly because the transports are fast enough that you can have them out of range of the enemy tanks, but they can get to the enemy helicopters before they can do much damage.