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BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 05:49 AM
I think that Academy is too strong compared to the others.
Six factions in a game - 1 weak(Necropolis), 1 strong(Academy), the others are equal. Too unbalanced, don't you think?
My arguments about Academy:
There are three shooters. One of them is in the beginning of the game, the second - in about the end of the 1-st month, and the last - after that. You all know them - gremlin, mage and titan. The moments they appear in the game seem to include the whole of it. Gremlins are great for taking mines and etc., mages are perfect for rare mines and treasures, but titans are the top of the mountain - they're good for beating VERY strong neutrals and even attacking enemies.
Except that - the genies appear too early and are too powerful. They might not be that good at fight but their ability to cast curses(and when upgraded - blesses) allows the shooters to finish the enemy.
Rakshasas take too much damage WITHOUT retaliation. And they're strong in defence too!
Titans - no doubt, they're strong. But they're the best 7-th level creature. Just think about it - they can shoot. Therefore they can get to every enemy stack. No other 7-th lvl creature can hit every stack. In Heroes 3 there were no limits for dragons but here it's quite hard to hit the enemy(only if you're lucky enough to place the dragon right in front of a large creature). And that's not all! Even when the Titan's shots are over he still can "shoot" by using the Call Lightning ability!
I think that in the next patch something should be done!

akrav
05-26-2006, 05:58 AM
I think the main issue with academy is that you can easily increase a titans dmg towards a 30 def unit by over 90% via mini-items.

+30% inititiave +10atk.

and necropolis isnt weak.

Oakwarrior
05-26-2006, 05:59 AM
But they're the best 7-th level creature. Just think about it - they can shoot.

What happens when a Black Dragon comes? BOOM.
If you don't have tactics and you're facing Black Draggies you're screwed. Titans usually get only 1 (!!!) shot in. Of course, you can haste, but the enemy flyers will just *bleep* up them.
Though the Titan has Call Lightning, it's not as half as good as they're melee attack.

And... Necro is NOT WEAK. Let's not turn this into a Necro imbalancedness thread though...
Let's see... Sylvan with Magic Resistance + Luck=Dead Academy.
Haven can beat them up pretty badly. Even 1 charge with your Paladins is excruciating.
Inferno gating=Toasted Academy http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Yes, I know that Academy can just counter most of this with their abilites, spells, and whatnot, but the last thing I'd think about them is being too strong..

And yes, they do have the Artificer thing, but they're not invincible because of that.

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 06:01 AM
Lol.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ok...u are right, that creature are strong but they MUST.. they are expansiv, the town buildings are expansiv (fort->citadel->castle, or reguirded lvl6 town for town hall and mage guild too).. But they aren't overpowered.. Gremlins are good but no too strong, djins's are good in offense but they can be easily killed, titans can be easily blocekd (coz large unit)...etc.I am suprised that u aren't talking about golems.. They are REALLY strong http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Rakshasa

BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 06:20 AM
Sylvan? Oh, come on!
Yesterday I played two games against my brother. Both times I was with academy and he - with sylvan. Both times I killed him in his castle in about the 3-rd month without taking any populations for 2-3 weeks...
And, Oak, noone places the titans in the middle of the field. I usually put them in a corner. Tell me - how is a dragon supposed to reach them when he just isn't able to do it? As I said - it would be just luck to place the dragon against the titan so that it could reach it. And don't forget - the Titan has no melee penalty...
P.S. Am I the only one who can't open Celestial Heavens (http://www.celestialheavens.com/)?

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 06:29 AM
Sure..but have low hp and low defense..he is not suposed to meele combat http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif And don;t forget that green dragon have initiative 14 and Titan without artifacts 10 http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif So 1 ranged attack titan will have..but not more.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 06:31 AM
So the dragon comes and what? Raksasas, Djins? Golems?
Academy - 3 shooters and the rest - guards.

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 06:40 AM
And druids? Master hunters? Unicorn.. Druids fireing.. PUF.. Master hunters fireing (if u are lucky- they will attack without luck) MEGA PUF PUF.. Ooou..where are mages? Gremlins? Or half of stack Rakshasa? And djins..Djins must only attack if the enemy wont retaliation.. Ou..he an cast on enemies..so he is castin.Ooops...resist http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 06:42 AM
I'd be glad if we could meet on the battlefield, me(academy) vs you(sylvan)

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 06:45 AM
Anytime dude http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif SO ..I am Academy/Dungeon player. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif But..i can play with sylvans http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I don't said it will be easy ..but i am sure Sylvan is a little bit stroger with same armies http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif a they rulez http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Malfurius
05-26-2006, 06:51 AM
Academy is fair, gremlins do sissy dmg. Titans can do a lot of dmg but just get a melee at him and he cant shoot. U need to kill their mages first. Raksjassa are their best unit

Undead arent weak either, my favourite and one of the most powerfull factions if used right.

Sylvian is unstoppable with leadership, light magic and luck too. Probably same for castle.

K_Tatsumaru
05-26-2006, 07:30 AM
From my hotseat experience, there is no strong problems with factions balance.
Each have it's own power and problems.
For example, Academy castle is hard to build, and truly show it's power only on the long run.
The only STRONG thing I saw with them is that they can completely obliterate another magic based hero with their counterspell ability.

Oakwarrior
05-26-2006, 07:35 AM
expansiv

BINGO! The key word. They're expensive.
BG_G, noone places the Titans in the middle of the field. But even when they're in a corner, Blackies/Emeraldies will get to them.

I think that your brother isn't doing very tactical moves if he's losing all of the time, or you are just better than him.

All-Devourer
05-26-2006, 08:46 AM
Acadamy has really nice shooters however i think Sylvan has better and cheaper units, And Dungeon has the best Heroes when it comes to spell casting.

RamzaBehoulve
05-26-2006, 08:56 AM
I have yet to see a huge imbalance between the factions in normal gameplay.

Yes, Duels over Ubi.com are not very well balanced, but during a normal game, I feel pretty much every faction has its pros and con.

And btw, if there is a faction that is far from weak, it's necros.

Lumaan
05-26-2006, 09:08 AM
If you take the wrong hero skill/ability with each faction then they are weak...


*off note* thats the biggeste problems when your not a hard-core HMM player, to get the right skills/abilities 1st time and then later getting your a** kicked...

phoenixzs
05-26-2006, 09:13 AM
Originally posted by xManiaCCCx:
Lol.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ok...u are right, that creature are strong but they MUST.. they are expansiv, the town buildings are expansiv (fort->citadel->castle, or reguirded lvl6 town for town hall and mage guild too).. But they aren't overpowered.. Gremlins are good but no too strong, djins's are good in offense but they can be easily killed, titans can be easily blocekd (coz large unit)...etc.I am suprised that u aren't talking about golems.. They are REALLY strong http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Rakshasa

Actually they are the same price overall with the other castles.Roughly to buy all upgraded creatures in a castle you have to have 30000gold plus-minus 1000gold.But their buildings are expensive for sure.By the way the black dragon titan thing is not so valid I suppose since the titan has also no melee penalty unlike other shooters.

But I dont think there is balance problem in Academy anway.The faction has many tactical opportunities and is not weak also.The other factions also have good creatures and variety of tactics(except necro http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif)

DarkMystery1979
05-26-2006, 10:21 AM
warlock worst hero, his irresistible magic destroys magic immunity on black dragon, while still not beeing able to cast beefs on them.

HORRIBLE!

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 10:39 AM
phoenixzs.. I agree that overall cost of towns are almost same ( except necro) butAcademy is expansive in another way.. HUGE differnce is, they need to build first Fort and then citadel.. or w8 until town become lvl 6 to build town hall and need mage guild too.. In the begining of the game, this is a huge must have investitions..

phoenixzs
05-26-2006, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by xManiaCCCx:
phoenixzs.. I agree that overall cost of towns are almost same ( except necro) butAcademy is expansive in another way.. HUGE differnce is, they need to build first Fort and then citadel.. or w8 until town become lvl 6 to build town hall and need mage guild too.. In the begining of the game, this is a huge must have investitions..
Okay I can agree with that http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.

Goke
05-26-2006, 02:52 PM
Lmao!!! That's crazy... All the enemy needs is like 30 imps and your 10 spellpower become all for naught... Oh well, whatever, with the current pathetic weakness of the destructive spells, it doesn't matter anyway....

DarkMystery1979
05-26-2006, 03:28 PM
get secrets of destruction(+2knowledge)

expert enlightment(random attributes, if lucky knowledge) + intelligence(+50% knowledge)

for Raelag, who is a campaign hero, just get the knowledge enhancers.

and for god's sake buy the knowledge artifacts in a dungeon town....

one must be VERY unlucky to have such stats on lvl18...

Szeryf_mg
05-26-2006, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by H5forem:
Well... if you have mana for it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/h5forem/war.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif Empowewed Spells & Warlock's Luck... for what? one lightning bolt ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

Ahahah now thats one useless hero http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

TheRider12
05-26-2006, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by phoenixzs:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by xManiaCCCx:
Lol.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Ok...u are right, that creature are strong but they MUST.. they are expansiv, the town buildings are expansiv (fort->citadel->castle, or reguirded lvl6 town for town hall and mage guild too).. But they aren't overpowered.. Gremlins are good but no too strong, djins's are good in offense but they can be easily killed, titans can be easily blocekd (coz large unit)...etc.I am suprised that u aren't talking about golems.. They are REALLY strong http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Rakshasa

Actually they are the same price overall with the other castles.Roughly to buy all upgraded creatures in a castle you have to have 30000gold plus-minus 1000gold.But their buildings are expensive for sure.By the way the black dragon titan thing is not so valid I suppose since the titan has also no melee penalty unlike other shooters.

But I dont think there is balance problem in Academy anway.The faction has many tactical opportunities and is not weak also.The other factions also have good creatures and variety of tactics(except necro http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
well,
isnt it cool than, that academy earns 4500 per day or 31500 per week and the other towns 4000 or 28000 per week. Who cares that they are little bit more expensive when they make more money than others, and with these additional 500 per day I succeed to build them faster than inferno for example. And one more point, no other fraction than academy can buy their whole week population from what they earn with capitol in the city. Only academy can do this.

TheRider12
05-26-2006, 04:22 PM
Originally posted by H5forem:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Szeryf_mg:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H5forem:
Well... if you have mana for it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif Empowewed Spells & Warlock's Luck... for what? one lightning bolt ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

Ahahah now thats one useless hero http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Now I have somme artefacts...

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/h5forem/war2.jpg

still no luck with knowledge... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I can remember for at least 5 knowledge crystals on the first 2 maps. what about visiting them?

TheRider12
05-26-2006, 04:32 PM
that's in life too :P

Val-Gaav
05-26-2006, 04:37 PM
Originally posted by H5forem:
I just want to say if you don't have luck you can't do anything... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

-Secret of destruction +2 knowledge (it's a must for warlock)

-Special building in dungeon +1 knowledge to all warlocks heroes

-Now u already habe 40 mana even if u are unlucky with leveling up ...

TheRider12
05-26-2006, 04:44 PM
have someone from you used dark ritual? in the campaign I never came out of mana, so never tried it (or I was close to wells or towns)

H5forem
05-26-2006, 04:44 PM
Don't have a pic but once I had a level 16 Demonlord with 3 attack !!!! 12 Knowledge and 5 spell power (0 defense)

that was really wierd... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
05-26-2006, 04:59 PM
To get back to the original topic.... :O)


Originally posted by BG_Guardian:
I think that Academy is too strong compared to the others.
Six factions in a game - 1 weak(Necropolis), 1 strong(Academy), the others are equal. Too unbalanced, don't you think?
My arguments about Academy:
There are three shooters. One of them is in the beginning of the game, the second - in about the end of the 1-st month, and the last - after that. You all know them - gremlin, mage and titan. The moments they appear in the game seem to include the whole of it. Gremlins are great for taking mines and etc., mages are perfect for rare mines and treasures, but titans are the top of the mountain - they're good for beating VERY strong neutrals and even attacking enemies.
Except that - the genies appear too early and are too powerful. They might not be that good at fight but their ability to cast curses(and when upgraded - blesses) allows the shooters to finish the enemy.
Rakshasas take too much damage WITHOUT retaliation. And they're strong in defence too!
Titans - no doubt, they're strong. But they're the best 7-th level creature. Just think about it - they can shoot. Therefore they can get to every enemy stack. No other 7-th lvl creature can hit every stack. In Heroes 3 there were no limits for dragons but here it's quite hard to hit the enemy(only if you're lucky enough to place the dragon right in front of a large creature). And that's not all! Even when the Titan's shots are over he still can "shoot" by using the Call Lightning ability!
I think that in the next patch something should be done!


First off, rating the Necropolis as the weakest faction is a joke IMO. Seriously, have you even PLAYED that town? It's a MONSTER. Necromancy is yet again one of the top 2 or 3 skills in the game. But I digress...back to the Academy.

Yes, there are 3 shooters. That is a nice bonus, but there are several things you have to take into account. First is of course the cost. This is one of (if not THE) most expensive towns to build and operate. The treasure cave certainly helps out, but you're still going to need TONS of gold and precious resources. That's a huge burden. But the Gremlins will help out on that front considerably. You can quickly form a small army that can clear out most everything from simply Gremlins and Golems. The repair ability of the gremlins is a HUGE plus and you should leverage it at every possible moment. I usually take ONLY Gremlins & Golems with me for the first 2 weeks or so....just running around the map scooping up the mines and loose resources. You'll be shocked at how few losses you'll take. But after that it get's MUCH more difficult to manage. Gargoyles are decent defenders but they still drop like flies against ranged/melee attacks. Mages, your second ranged unit, is VERY difficult to protect. You can't surround them because your ranged attack will kill your own turtled troops. So that means you must leave a firing line for them...thus leaving them vulnerable to melee attacks. The Djinn....*sigh*...it's quite simply one of the worst units in the game. Period. Thier spells are somewhat useful to be sure, but they are WAY too vulnerable to all attacks (especially considering their price tag). Rakshasas are a solid unit, especially with the no-retal ability, but they're not really much better than any of the other level 6 units IMO. That leaves the Titans. Yes, they're excellent troops. But Oakwarrior is correct. Thier ranged attack rarely gets used more than once per battle, so it's not THAT much of a bonus in H5. And Call Lightning is much too weak to be of much use. I'm not saying they're bad, they're not...quite the opposite, but they're certainly not the best level 7 out there.

Also in regards to expenses are the mini-artifacts that come via artificer. In order to really capitalize on this skill, it's going to be expensive. VERY expensive. The simple artifacts aren't too bad, but the ones that will really make a difference are horribly expensive. All of these expenses mean that it'll take much longer to fully develop when compared to other towns (some, not all). So keep that in mind before pumping out those mini-arti's. You really only want to do that once you've got the resources to spare. You need to build your town & dwellings FIRST (including full guild), buy your troops SECOND, THEN enhance with artis.

But that's just a small part of the picture for Academy. The biggest balancing factor to this equation is the Wizard. While the Academy troops look nice overall, once you put them with a hero who'll have relatively small Attack/Defense statistics, they'll pale against the stats of opposing factions troops. So that leaves magic. Because magic is so important to the Academy, the hero needs to capitalize on that, and in doing so he'll have to forgo the offensive & defensive skills compared to other towns.

So to say that Academy is overpowered is a HUGE overstatement. They're 'middle of the pack' at best.

BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 05:39 PM
The Academy's heroes are not Wizards for nothing. Expert Sorcery + Counterspell(I don't remember if counterspell required expert sorcery) and an expert in a magic school or two(for me dark + destructive magic rulz but that's my own opinion http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif) together with LOTS of points in Spellpower and Knowledge make the wizard unbeatable. First he negates the enemy's next spell and, if the other has no sorcery, casts two more spells. 2-3 days ago I freaked a guy with this tactic - I cast Frenzy at all of his creatures + mass slow and then just counterspell before very turn of his hero and that way he became completely harmless.
And yes, I must admit - I was wrong about the necropolis town. Maybe I underestimated them at the beginning but still - they're not the best faction...
EDIT:
Forgot to say about the gold - that's not so important. Gold matters only in the beginning, by a month(max 2) you should be having at least one more town or a gold mine(on a Very Big map of course, there are only two(or three) towns on Peninsula for instance http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif) and providing that you're marauding and pillaging with the army from the first 2 weeks money shouldn't be that hard to be acquired...

Vicheron
05-26-2006, 05:53 PM
Expert Light Magic and Master of Abjuration severely weakens Academy since expert deflect missile reduces ranged damage by 70% and with Master of Abjuration, it affects all your creatures. Expert Dark Magic is good too, Master of Mind can disable Gremlins and Mages, Master of Curses greatly lowers the offensive powers of Academy creatures, especially since Wizards have very low attack skill.

xManiaCCCx
05-26-2006, 06:40 PM
BG_Guardian .. Do u read what u wrote?? Or just u played only with academy?

together with LOTS of points in Spellpower and Knowledge make the wizard unbeatable
Wizards never have LOTS of Spellpower.. They have LOTS of knowledge (coz adrtificier) and decent Spellpower points..


Expert Sorcery + Counterspell(I don't remember if counterspell required expert sorcery) and an expert in a magic school or two(for me dark + destructive magic rulz but that's my own opinion )
Counterspell is great ability..but what against Knight or Demon Lord? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
And Dark + Destruction..? Ehm..Academy don't inclinate wor these two schools http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif


Forgot to say about the gold - that's not so important. Gold matters only in the beginning
That's not true..

And again.. Academy is EXPANSIV...really EXPANSIV.. Not in gold..in resources of all types.. That's the problem..

akrav
05-26-2006, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by Szeryf_mg:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H5forem:
Well... if you have mana for it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/h5forem/war.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif Empowewed Spells & Warlock's Luck... for what? one lightning bolt ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

Ahahah now thats one useless hero http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

welcome to the life of necropolis heroes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, its funny how in the other thread a guy claims necropolis heroes use raise dead at least twice in every single battle (most ppl know who im refering to)...

Final_Boss
05-26-2006, 07:09 PM
Academy is not overpowered, it´s even difficult to play well with this faction, and the abilities of some creatures harm themselves (magic attack hit your own troops and dash forces your rakshassa to spend a turn to move more turns...).

But I want to defend the djinns, they are not bad creatures! They deal HUGE damage, and if you construct a special building you can obtain +2 djinns per week (this building only cost 3000 gold pieces, and gives to you 500 per day!!). Besides they are fast and can cast great support spells. You only have to use them when any enemy stack cant retaliate, and then you´ll see your enemy crying!!

BG_Guardian
05-26-2006, 07:17 PM
Originally posted by akrav:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Szeryf_mg:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by H5forem:
Well... if you have mana for it... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/h5forem/war.jpg

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif Empowewed Spells & Warlock's Luck... for what? one lightning bolt ? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

Ahahah now thats one useless hero http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

welcome to the life of necropolis heroes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, its funny how in the other thread a guy claims necropolis heroes use raise dead at least twice in every single battle (most ppl know who im refering to)... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Um... Warlock? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
xManiaCCCx - of course I haven't played only with academy... Next time I play with Academy I'll take a shot of lots spellpowerhttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
Against knight or demon lord - is the enemy hero only going to hit my creatures and not cast even one spell? What if he's an expert in a magic school?

Ehm..Academy don't inclinate wor these two schools
Even though it might look so this isn't like Heroes 4 - a magic school for each castle. Even if it is so - there is a Library in Academy. Therefore the chances of getting a dark or destructive spell of the 5-th circle are much more increased - 1 light, 1 summoning and 1 dark or destructive. Happy now? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
And there are other ways of acquiring dark/destructive spells - capturing other towns, visiting altars and even getting the ultimate ability http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

akrav
05-26-2006, 07:19 PM
Originally posted by BG_Guardian:

Um... Warlock? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

was refering to the fact that most necromancers(necropolis hero) have 10 mana at lvl 15-20..so necropolis players are used to it, while it is strange for a warlock(dungeon) hero.

Final_Boss
05-26-2006, 07:35 PM
The only way to escape from having a necromancer hero with only 10 spell points is getting Enlightenment. These bonus to stats really help adding some extra knowledge if you are lucky. Besides Intelligence.

Surely this works with Warlocks too.

akrav
05-26-2006, 07:40 PM
I started using necropolis heroes who dont rely on mana and try to play without raise dead(practicing since you cant really rely on ever having mana for it).

only ways to ensure you have mana is
1-have over 50-60 mana for long fights in endgame, yes vs a decent foe you will need tht much mana.
2- get soul thingy, although you gotta be lucky to get it and its impact is tiny(only few mana from huge amount of damage).
3- hope to god the inferno player doesnt bring imps http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.

Vicheron
05-26-2006, 07:55 PM
It sucks how two of the three factions that have high spell power, Academy and Necropolis, don't get Destructive magic, while Inferno and Sylvan, who have low spell power, get it.

Goke
05-26-2006, 08:44 PM
Originally posted by Vicheron:
It sucks how two of the three factions that have high spell power, Academy and Necropolis, don't get Destructive magic, while Inferno and Sylvan, who have low spell power, get it.
Destructive magic is so pitiful in its present state that it's not worth using anyway... I mean, most of the time I do more damage just directly attacking with my hero... I f****** hate Ubi for this.

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
05-26-2006, 09:03 PM
Originally posted by akrav:
welcome to the life of necropolis heroes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, its funny how in the other thread a guy claims necropolis heroes use raise dead at least twice in every single battle (most ppl know who im refering to)...

First off, be fair. How often do you run across a necro hero that has only 1 knowledge? VERY rarely. Also don't forget about Spirit Link. I'm not kidding here, but by the time I reach about level 10 or so, I'm usually able to cast raise dead AT LEAST twice per battle. 3 or 4 times is more accurate though. But that's only if I HAVE to. And that in itself is a rarity. Once per battle is the most common use for me (or not at all).

C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s
05-26-2006, 09:06 PM
Originally posted by Final_Boss:
But I want to defend the djinns, they are not bad creatures! They deal HUGE damage, and if you construct a special building you can obtain +2 djinns per week (this building only cost 3000 gold pieces, and gives to you 500 per day!!). Besides they are fast and can cast great support spells. You only have to use them when any enemy stack cant retaliate, and then you´ll see your enemy crying!!

Hey, I want to defend them too. I'd LOVE to. But enemies tend to target them...frequently. And their low HP's and low defense makes them rather easy pickings. If they last long enough to attack second...yeah, they're great. But that's rarely the case unfortunately. Now if you get your hands on Resurrection...........*big grin*.

DarkMystery1979
05-26-2006, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by Final_Boss:
The only way to escape from having a necromancer hero with only 10 spell points is getting Enlightenment. These bonus to stats really help adding some extra knowledge if you are lucky. Besides Intelligence.

Surely this works with Warlocks too.

as i said before, warlock's are used mainly with dungeon, and those have easy access to artifacts one of them might boost knowledge...and their special building provides 1 knowledge, skill secrets of destruction +2 knowledge

necros have nothing of this.

akrav
05-26-2006, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by C_h_u_c_k_l_e_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by akrav:
welcome to the life of necropolis heroes http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, its funny how in the other thread a guy claims necropolis heroes use raise dead at least twice in every single battle (most ppl know who im refering to)...

First off, be fair. How often do you run across a necro hero that has only 1 knowledge? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

in nearly 80% of games I have on a certain map, my hero doesnt get more than 2 knowledge(1 from shrine, if the game isn't short and I go thru underground) and sometimes due to the mobs being really strong gaurds(casters..) I have 1 knowledge till much later.

thats when I play as the red player, I havent checked how it is for blue player.

velk
05-27-2006, 08:20 AM
Originally posted by akrav:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BG_Guardian:

Um... Warlock? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

was refering to the fact that most necromancers(necropolis hero) have 10 mana at lvl 15-20..so necropolis players are used to it, while it is strange for a warlock(dungeon) hero. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I can't say for multiplayer maps, but markal in the campaign had excess mana coming out of every orifice in my game..

H5forem
05-27-2006, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by akrav:
I started using necropolis heroes who dont rely on mana and try to play without raise dead(practicing since you cant really rely on ever having mana for it).

only ways to ensure you have mana is
1-have over 50-60 mana for long fights in endgame, yes vs a decent foe you will need tht much mana.
2- get soul thingy, although you gotta be lucky to get it and its impact is tiny(only few mana from huge amount of damage).
3- hope to god the inferno player doesnt bring imps http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.
I for one I never put my imps into hard battles...

anyway against neutrals +80% of battles(even on Heroic) are with no losses...

I use to buy a lot of demon heroes to have lots of imps(good for transporting units too... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

It's fun to see the other heroe with no mana and you cast mass weaknes,slow,sufering... all expert cast very fast http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

G_u_s
05-27-2006, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by Goke:
Destructive magic is so pitiful in its present state that it's not worth using anyway... I mean, most of the time I do more damage just directly attacking with my hero... I f****** hate Ubi for this.

now, there... that's a very big exageration to say the least... you need decent spellpower, specialize in Destruction, get the various masteries, and try to get enhancing artifacts (very easy to get, all minor iirc).

phoenix_reb1973
05-27-2006, 02:52 PM
It seems very strange for me that someone calls the Academy overpowered . I'd played several times with my favorite Dungeon against Academy on hotseat and I'd won ALL of them without serious problems . Everytime my main hero came to his territory on weak 4 or 5 and forced him seating in his castle , cause he hasn't any chance in field combat ( several times he tried and was crashed without mercy ).
We usualy play on hard difficulty , since the dragons and titans weren't built before our heroes fighting . The Academy hasn't any unit , which could be title the best for its tier . I even sometimes defeat him with only Blood furies , Assasins , Grim raiders and 4 stacks of Shadow Witches vs. all his 5 upgraded low levels and Rakshasa ranies . The djinns have big damage and good initiative and mobility , but the Blood furies are faster http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif and their first target is obviously its . The splited Shadow witches buff all my other stacks +9 attack and have yet 5 mana for slow or desrupt enemies , the buffed Grim raiders often comletely kill whole Rakshasa ranies stack cause Lizard charge ability . The Master gremlins and Obsidian gargoyles are numerous , but their damaging ability is very pitiful . Also warlock's Emproved spells + Warlock's luck ability are quite better than any 1-3 level spell , which Wizard can cast on week 4-5 .

swash_buckler
05-27-2006, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by G_u_s:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Goke:
Destructive magic is so pitiful in its present state that it's not worth using anyway... I mean, most of the time I do more damage just directly attacking with my hero... I f****** hate Ubi for this.

now, there... that's a very big exageration to say the least... you need decent spellpower, specialize in Destruction, get the various masteries, and try to get enhancing artifacts (very easy to get, all minor iirc). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree. With a decently high level Sinitar as my main Dungeon hero and the Trident of Lightning (+50% lightning damage) which I recieved as my RANDOM artifact bonus at the beginning and the Master of Storms ability, I was not only perma-stunning stacks but also doing 1300+ dmg per 3 mana Empowered Lightning bolt. I would have loved it if I got Chain lightning but alas.

Destructive magic can be freakin' deadly on a spellpower based hero who takes all the destructive magic skills.

DarkMystery1979
05-27-2006, 04:11 PM
djinns are VERY weak...the rest is ok, and the early combo of gremlins and golems is really nice.

but djinns should have more hp http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif