A Totally New DPL Or the Original One?

[Assaultmachine1]

I would want to see a new one because the one for the PS2 and Xbox wasn't very compelling for me. I didn't enjoy it much, even while it's much better than Driv3r. Not seeing Tanner or even any of the gameplay like Film Director was dissapointing for me. This game probably could've done better with Tanner and along the lines of the Driver series as opposed to being almost completely a GTA rip-off.

It would be very interesting to see NYC again along with an extention to NJ with Tanner and many new found gameplay. If the GTA games, on the PSP, were different than the console ones, why can't we see a different DPL and perhaps a much better DPL this time around? Would it hurt to recycle a lot of the gameplay found in the game?

If you simply saw a DPL game with Tanner, Film Director, driving physics as good as in Driver 1, gameplay as fun as D1 and more enhanced than both D3 and DPL, a soundtrack that's way more compelling, filled with many familiar songs in a wide variety of genres, great weapons, a storyline like the first Driver game, the great and intense driving found in the driver franchise, a greater deal of action and freedom, and vehicles that were very much like those of what we wanted to see (trains, boats, flying vehicles, and cars or just pick many of each type from the classifications that Driverman2006 listed in the D4 Wishlist thread), would you then appreciate what this game could do for Reflections in the future? If it was as polished and well done as most of the PSP games, with a good timeframe, and as much work put in to it as that of the GTA psp games, would it be a bigger game?

Please feel give yourself the time to discuss this topic as I think that it would be very fitting and certainly an interesting one. Imagine what Reflections could possibly do if they work on this game and it turns out a solid well build game with plenty of good reviews, making it better than the original DPL game. What would you have to say then?<form action="http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums" method="POST" name="VOTE">

[Driverman2006]

I'm not sure if I should vote. But I'll back myself up. I would love to have a Driver game set in NYC again with Tanner again. Having all vehicles operable, film director, minigames, money, vehicle customization, an awesome soundtrack and more. But if that's for the PSP only, I'm sure all of those console gamers would be disappointed. They'd be missing out. See, I think all games should have equal features, but come available on all systems. That way nobody misses out. However, your idea Assaultmachine1 sounds cool for the next Driver game. And I'm hoping that all of those ideas are the minimum of Driver 5's gameplay and features.


And thanks for mentioning my ideas for a roster of vehicles. That's VERY important for Reflections to read. We need to tell them that we don't want just all road vehicles. The fans now want trains, aircraft, boats, and more!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

My major Driver 5 wishes: Having the game set in the present times in 100% map accurate New York, Chicago, Las Vegas, Los Angeles, San Diego, and San Francisco; ALL vehicles drivable with the most realistic physics and damage ever (road vehicles, trains, aircraft, water vehicles, and more), awesome soundtrack from the 20th and 21st centuries with selectable songs in the game, no front-end menu, minigames, Tanner, very deep vehicle customization, LOTS of on foot action, and many other cool things! Please make my vision come to life Reflections.

[Assaultmachine1]

Yes, well said, Mr. Tanner. We need a game that could help be the build up for Driver 4/5 and quite simply, I believe that releasing DPL for the Wii, PC, and PSP with all new lengths of gameplay and other stuff that make it more of a Driver game and exceed many things of GTA (vehicle roster, weapons, etc.) could give Reflections the chance to take over the Free-roam genre.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The better game developers work, the harder that I will put any effort into my games.

[matt__jon]

The question is a bit confusing, because it presents two options, yet the answers you can choose from are not present in the question. But I know what you mean.

And really, what is the difference between the two? A few features added/missing from either of them. The main difference being which side of the law you are on. And really, I could care less about the story or missions.

The game needs to be centered around free roam, much the same way Halo 2 was mostly made for online multiplayer. Its all about the gameplay for me. I'll play the missions, but I'm not looking for an intriguing storyline, it would be nice, yes, but its not important to me.

I think if they take the story less seriously, it would be a good thing. What I mean is, make the story a spoof of action movies, even past Driver games, only intentionally stupid this time. Cheesy one liners, "If I came here to kill you, you'd already be dead". Look at Blues Brothers, good combo of action and comedy. Even better, Team America (best movie in years I might add). Team America is the ultimate parody of action movies, yet at the same time sticks it to the Bush Administration, and hippies. (F.A.G.)

But enough about that. Like I was saying, first off focus on making free roam fun, seeing as thats the main selling point of any free roaming game. I mean damn, for the past 6 years since GTA3 came out, everyones been copying them, but its almost as if everyone is trying to stay behind the curve, sure, some will improve on a few things, but thats the extent of it. Will someone other than GTA outdo themselves? Cause GTA, although a good game, just feels cheap and poorly put together everytime I play it.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

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Led Zeppelin ? Jimi Hendrix ? Pink Floyd ? Van Halen

[Assaultmachine1]

Originally posted by matt__jon:
The question is a bit confusing, because it presents two options, yet the answers you can choose from are not present in the question. But I know what you mean.

And really, what is the difference between the two? A few features added/missing from either of them. The main difference being which side of the law you are on. And really, I could care less about the story or missions.

The game needs to be centered around free roam, much the same way Halo 2 was mostly made for online multiplayer. Its all about the gameplay for me. I'll play the missions, but I'm not looking for an intriguing storyline, it would be nice, yes, but its not important to me.

I think if they take the story less seriously, it would be a good thing. What I mean is, make the story a spoof of action movies, even past Driver games, only intentionally stupid this time. Cheesy one liners, "If I came here to kill you, you'd already be dead". Look at Blues Brothers, good combo of action and comedy. Even better, Team America (best movie in years I might add). Team America is the ultimate parody of action movies, yet at the same time sticks it to the Bush Administration, and hippies. (F.A.G.)

But enough about that. Like I was saying, first off focus on making free roam fun, seeing as thats the main selling point of any free roaming game. I mean damn, for the past 6 years since GTA3 came out, everyones been copying them, but its almost as if everyone is trying to stay behind the curve, sure, some will improve on a few things, but thats the extent of it. Will someone other than GTA outdo themselves? Cause GTA, although a good game, just feels cheap and poorly put together everytime I play it.
The story for the game would need to be good, but it doesn't need to be perfect. If it's bad, I'll find it possible for the missions to be bad as well and that wouldn't be good. The missions and story have actually been great to me, but D3 and DPL didn't offer well on that, so only D1 and D2 were fit well for the missions and storyline.

Think of it this way: If you see a bunch of crappy missions and a crappy storyline, will the "go do whatever you want at any time" procedure do anything or even be anything enough for Driver? The way I see it, Driver has felt to me more like car chases with great missions and a great storyline put together. Now D2, D3, and DPL, while having some focus on free-roam gameplay, you couldn't say that the free-roam has ever been any better than the missions or storyline when there is a lot of limitation found as opposed to the GTA games, which stumble on far more free-roam to make it somewhat good as the missions and story. Even I can't say that I loved Driver's take a ride mode better than how well the missions and story have been put together. The missions really are the ones that put together a great replay value for the game nowadays because if you look at today's games, they offer far more in comparance to D1 and yet D1's missions and story make it so fascinating, it is considered a classic by most who've played the game. I never found TAR mode or any of the other modes to be as interesting or compelling as the story and missions.

To me, if you've looked at games of different genres and different concepts, I've always enjoyed the story and missions better because that level of gameplay helps you understand the game much better and even gives you more challenge as opposed to running around and doing nothing but fooling around. Fooling around may be fun in the GTA games, but it gets old soon enough and I find ways to enjoy the story and missions more than even the rest of the gameplay. While Free-roam is more about moving to the side as opposed to the story and your main objectives, I feel that mostly, you'll find games to have a more compelling storyline and missions as opposed to the side gameplay.

My most favorite games to look back at with great storylines and the most important objectives for beating the game are in that of Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, Super Mario Bros., Resident Evil rebirth, Resident Evil 2, The Lord of the Rings: Two Towers, and the list can go on.

Another thing that you might still expect to find is that when a game is non-linear, it doesn't mean that you won't come to some point in the game that isn't linear because you can never have a game that is fully interactive with making every particular things into weapons or even something that lets you pause on a mission and going to do something for fun for the time being because games do not have the power to do that (at least not yet).

No matter what you think, there will always be a majority of games at which are linear because they've been the biggest ones in the Video Gaming industry and there's way too small of a portion of free-roam titles to ever consider a chance of seeing it overcome the linear titles, unless developers start focusing on much newer concepts such as not being about crime (like GTA) and instead being set in either a medieval, B.C. period, or even a futuristic city and being different in the majority focus of the game. That's where most developers never have thought of moving to when they could've done that and made a much stronger impact in the lines of non-linear games (see I am smart after all).

One last thing. Everything within a game matters, so you can't go saying that you could still find a game enjoyable with something like Undercover mode or TAR mode because without it, there's much less point to the whole game itself. Every concept that's been established and put together for video games is very important. Now unless you can give an even bigger reason as to why you think not all concepts or elements of a game are not important, I'll be able to then agree with you, but if not, then I guess I'm right.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The better game developers work, the harder that I will put any effort into my games.

[matt__jon]

All rise, the Game Nazi has entered the building.

you couldn't say that the free-roam has ever been any better than the missions or storyline
Actually, I just did say that. I don't hate the missions, but why would you do missions when you can do whatever you want? It makes no sense to me. I just play the game to cruise around town and shoot stuff. I rarely delve into the minigames or film director when it was there. Its the way I play. Sure, missions are fun sometimes. And no, you do not need a good storyline for good missions.

The most the missions should be for is to show you creative ways of manipulating the enviroment (that can also be used in free roam), or to show you where certain things are (enterable buildings, etc). Sure, tell a story, why not. The only reason I play missions is to unlock stuff, after that its cheat codes and free roam for the rest of the time I play the game.

D1's missions and story make it so fascinating, it is considered a classic by most who've played the game. D1 is not known for its story at all. In fact, there was almost no story, it was mainly odd jobs. D1 was known for its gameplay, mostly for free roam, go anywhere you want. And good cop chases and physics sent it over the top.

(see I am smart after all). You call that smart? All you did was change the time period and make it not necesarily about crime. Any monkey could've thought of that.

And the only reason there are more linear games is because free roaming has only begun to take off in the past few years, because we have enough technology to do it now. On top of that, linear games are much easier to make, because they have greater control over what you can do and where you can go. Thats why so many free roamers suck, you can't half *** it like you can with a linear game, there are many more bugs to overcome. Development costs are large, payoff if you make the next big thing is even higher, but chances of that are slim.

One last thing, I never said storys or missions weren't important, I said I don't like them. So looks like you're wrong.. again.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

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Led Zeppelin ? Jimi Hendrix ? Pink Floyd ? Van Halen

[Getaway_Man]

Originally posted by matt__jon:
I think if they take the story less seriously, it would be a good thing. What I mean is, make the story a spoof of action movies, even past Driver games, only intentionally stupid this time.
Okay, I'm gonna have to say, um,NO. I mean, you can say what you wish, we are all entitled to our own opinions, and I don't wish to engage in an argument, but I just have to sayNO. I always enjoyed the Driver series, not only because of the amazing driving and damage engine, but because the story was somewhat intrigueing. Now Driver Parallel Lines story line was okay, but stuff was kinda random in the 70s part of the game, I mean, playing it for the first time, I found it was like GTA 3, no real story line was occuring. It was random, and I didn't much care for that, I mean, me and you see this in an opposite way, random you may like, I'm not saying you do, I'm just saying you sound like the guy who prefers to do random missions than follow missions that follow a story line.

Now, I'm not saying that Reflections shouldn't continue this game, but let's move on with like, Driver 4, this game seemed more like, well and game inbetween the two games, it's something nice to have when you want to just get away from following a story line, but I miss actually following a story line. It would really get me in the mood to find out what happened next, what happened to the main character, who was going to die, what was really going to happen next. It was always this that kept me on playing games.

Anyways, good pointers everyone.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/9776/sig3ne8.gif

[matt__jon]

Yea, I suppose Reflections isn't very good at humor, purposefully. A story can be cool, but gameplay should always come first. Lets see real quick, I'm gonna make a chart:

Game Component Hierarchy
1. Gameplay
2. Graphics
3. Good Music
4. Cool Missions
5. Cool Story

And replay value fits into gameplay, since they're the same thing, only with two different names.

I love a cool mission, but often won't remember anything about the story of the game. Maybe its A.D.D., but I don't like being forced into playing the game someone elses way<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

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Led Zeppelin ? Jimi Hendrix ? Pink Floyd ? Van Halen

[actiondreamer]

But a good story can also be more worth remembering, and a good story has to be interesting, or it isn't good. Of course, it is hard to remember the story when the gameplay don't completely connect with the story. A lot of games have trouble with that, I have noticed.

Music to me is just an extra spice to the game, but it's always good to have plenty to listen to and not the same old stuff over and over. Unless it is specially made for the game like Driver 1 and 2 music was.

If you don't mind me adjusting some things for my hierarchy:
1. Gameplay
2. Graphics
3. Interesting Story
4. Awesome Missions
5. Plenty of Good Music<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/5277/mustangbannercp3.png
Driving free, like a stallion.

[matt__jon]

No problem.

Anyway, as far as stories go, I just saw the movie Blood Diamond yesterday, damn good movie. If you're ever gonna get married, buy this for your wife, she'll never want a diamond again!<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

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Led Zeppelin ? Jimi Hendrix ? Pink Floyd ? Van Halen

[actiondreamer]

Lol. I'll keep that in mind.

I just got Crank on DVD, and slightly dissapointed on how short the car chases were. But they were pretty awesome while they lasted. Crank is also pretty damn funny in most parts.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/5277/mustangbannercp3.png
Driving free, like a stallion.

[Assaultmachine1]

Originally posted by matt__jon:
All rise, the Game Nazi has entered the building.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">you couldn't say that the free-roam has ever been any better than the missions or storyline
Actually, I just did say that. I don't hate the missions, but why would you do missions when you can do whatever you want? It makes no sense to me. I just play the game to cruise around town and shoot stuff. I rarely delve into the minigames or film director when it was there. Its the way I play. Sure, missions are fun sometimes. And no, you do not need a good storyline for good missions.

The most the missions should be for is to show you creative ways of manipulating the enviroment (that can also be used in free roam), or to show you where certain things are (enterable buildings, etc). Sure, tell a story, why not. The only reason I play missions is to unlock stuff, after that its cheat codes and free roam for the rest of the time I play the game.

D1's missions and story make it so fascinating, it is considered a classic by most who've played the game. D1 is not known for its story at all. In fact, there was almost no story, it was mainly odd jobs. D1 was known for its gameplay, mostly for free roam, go anywhere you want. And good cop chases and physics sent it over the top.

(see I am smart after all). You call that smart? All you did was change the time period and make it not necesarily about crime. Any monkey could've thought of that.

And the only reason there are more linear games is because free roaming has only begun to take off in the past few years, because we have enough technology to do it now. On top of that, linear games are much easier to make, because they have greater control over what you can do and where you can go. Thats why so many free roamers suck, you can't half *** it like you can with a linear game, there are many more bugs to overcome. Development costs are large, payoff if you make the next big thing is even higher, but chances of that are slim.

One last thing, I never said storys or missions weren't important, I said I don't like them. So looks like you're wrong.. again. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Then again, when you think about it, we're all entitled to say whatever we believe and none of our opinions may be wrong, so I'm sorry to have started an argument with you, saying that I'm right when there really is nobody who is right on an opinion.


Originally posted by Getaway_Man:
Okay, I'm gonna have to say, um,NO. I mean, you can say what you wish, we are all entitled to our own opinions, and I don't wish to engage in an argument, but I just have to sayNO. I always enjoyed the Driver series, not only because of the amazing driving and damage engine, but because the story was somewhat intrigueing. Now Driver Parallel Lines story line was okay, but stuff was kinda random in the 70s part of the game, I mean, playing it for the first time, I found it was like GTA 3, no real story line was occuring. It was random, and I didn't much care for that, I mean, me and you see this in an opposite way, random you may like, I'm not saying you do, I'm just saying you sound like the guy who prefers to do random missions than follow missions that follow a story line.

Now, I'm not saying that Reflections shouldn't continue this game, but let's move on with like, Driver 4, this game seemed more like, well and game inbetween the two games, it's something nice to have when you want to just get away from following a story line, but I miss actually following a story line. It would really get me in the mood to find out what happened next, what happened to the main character, who was going to die, what was really going to happen next. It was always this that kept me on playing games.

Anyways, good pointers everyone.
I have to agree with you on every point that you make, especially the fact that we haven't known very much else about the Driver series, except only that Tanner is alive and it would be great if we were to see more of what happened before any of the games or even what goes on in the future. If a story is not finished, what's the point of ending it?

Originally posted by actiondreamer:
But a good story can also be more worth remembering, and a good story has to be interesting, or it isn't good. Of course, it is hard to remember the story when the gameplay don't completely connect with the story. A lot of games have trouble with that, I have noticed.

Music to me is just an extra spice to the game, but it's always good to have plenty to listen to and not the same old stuff over and over. Unless it is specially made for the game like Driver 1 and 2 music was.

If you don't mind me adjusting some things for my hierarchy:
1. Gameplay
2. Graphics
3. Interesting Story
4. Awesome Missions
5. Plenty of Good Music
Excellent job on the adjustment, actiondreamer. It fits very well and I think that if Reflections is able to put everything together from one through 5 (like your list), we'll come to expect a lot of great things from the game.

Whether its linearity or non-linearity, you can always find ways to make the best fun out of those games and it doesn't matter on what kind of game you're playing.<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

The better game developers work, the harder that I will put any effort into my games.

[KORTECK]

Looks like they were able to retrieve some of the lost threads. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

[matt__jon]

Yea, all but mine.

[actiondreamer]

Yeah, I guess they had some problems. And I somehow got my banner and avatar back! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Well now that we have information on the PSP Driver 76, I hope to see a PC version!

[Assaultmachine1]

It's very interesting that before I even made this thread, we had no official confirmation on the game and I was thinking that maybe the PSP version is different partly because of the thread ending up with more votes for a new DPL game, but then again, there was word of a PSP version since the early time of 2006, so they must've thought of a new Driver game since then. It's good to see Sony have Driver 76' as an exclusive game for the PSP along with DPL itself, which probably means that Playstation is what Reflections is working to make the best of.

Anyways, we know that D76 is a new DPL, but we don't know if the DPL versions on the Wii and PC will have anything new. I sure would hope to see new things as it isn't fair that Sony gets an exclusive game and the other companies get the exact same DPL only with some very little modifications for them.

If Reflections, Sumo Digital Ltd. (the other team working on the PSP game) and Ubisoft want to make the next Driver PL versions better, they should've or even should be in the situation where they've changed what needs to be changed in order to make the game better. I certainly hope that the next Driver DPL ports and Driver 76 will not be any worse than the PS2 and Xbox ports of DPL.

[actiondreamer]

The better game developers work, the more willingly I will be on buying their freaking games. But yeah, I do agree. (Edit: Referring to your sig, I thought was a part of the post.)

My advise on making games is: to not take ideas or inspirations from other games if you have a creative mind to put your own efforts and ideas into. I mean Rockstar invented GTA, why should that stop other game developers from starting something else new?

There is endless opportunities for games... Mark my words.

[Assaultmachine1]

I understand the concept of when it comes to innovation and doing something big for society, so thanks, but I really already knew that before you even had the chance to tell me. And I do want to come up with newer concepts for all the genres in video gaming, but at the same time, I want to offer the same great gameplay experiences too.

And yes, the developers shouldn't stop doing something even newer than that or are you trying to say that they should stick with a similar formula as to that of the GTA games?

I don't mind seeing similar formulas being used in games, but it needs to be a whole lot more than just that. I think the problems of free-roam games is that developers are looking to make crime-based games now and they aren't capable of thinking far in the freedom that is given to a gangster in a video game as much as GTA. Now if free-roaming games were to expand and go further than what has already been done, which is having a crime-based modern city, then it will be very interesting to see how much further the genre will continue to evolve.

[actiondreamer]

I was saying that game developers need to start some new elements rather than follow the footsteps of GTA, or any other game for that matter. Many developers seam to act like they have to live by the shadows of GTA, which in my opinion, is a bad idea.

If a game doesn't have the utmost development to its own standards, the game isn't going to be such a great game. Or more likely to be a crappy game.
Many game developers who put their own effort, passion, skill and devotion into their work, is more likely to end up creating better games.

One important think I would like to point out about game development is...you shouldn't make a game for business. You should make a game as its own. And when the game is good, you will be rewarded with business. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


Note: I'm not trying to point out something specifically to you, Assaultmachine1. I'm just speaking my mind. I'm pretty sure I'm just talking old stuff you already planted in your head. But whatever, I think I made some good points.

[matt__jon]

Wait a minute, I never thought about the question that much first time around. When I voted for a totally new "dpl", what I meant was a completely new game in the series unrelated to DPL. DPL has come and gone, time to leave it alone and not dwell on it.

[Assaultmachine1]

Originally posted by actiondreamer:
I was saying that game developers need to start some new elements rather than follow the footsteps of GTA, or any other game for that matter. Many developers seam to act like they have to live by the shadows of GTA, which in my opinion, is a bad idea.

If a game doesn't have the utmost development to its own standards, the game isn't going to be such a great game. Or more likely to be a crappy game.
Many game developers who put their own effort, passion, skill and devotion into their work, is more likely to end up creating better games.

One important think I would like to point out about game development is...you shouldn't make a game for business. You should make a game as its own. And when the game is good, you will be rewarded with business. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


Note: I'm not trying to point out something specifically to you, Assaultmachine1. I'm just speaking my mind. I'm pretty sure I'm just talking old stuff you already planted in your head. But whatever, I think I made some good points.
I agree with you. The developers have a bad tendency to follow GTA's path and take it a little too far. When it comes down to that, they only show improvement in some areas of the gameplay, but not all of it and nor do they put together anything that is newer than what Rockstar North has done for its games thus far.

I will say that you're right with all the paragraphs and just incase you didn't know, I am already trying to get a development team to start work on an RPG. And from there on, I will work on an MMOG for where fee will come into play and that's how I plan to make my way into having my own business.