weapons for US and Units

[PFCWarsaw]

I was curious what weapons the US forces will be using (please god, not the XM8) and what units (i.e. marines, army, special forces) will be used.

[Aj6627]

Um... AFAIK, this will be an RTS, not a FPS.

[PFCWarsaw]

who said anything about an FPS? I know this game is a real time strategy, i was curious about the US Forces in the game. The question still stands.

[Aj6627]

Ok. It just sounded to me like you thought it was an FPS.(from the comment about the XM8)

Sorry, my bad.

[PFCWarsaw]

np, i realized that usually weapon specifics dont matter in RTS's, but this one is different. I really hope the XM8 is not used in it, because that is unrealistic.

[pettyofficerj]

Originally posted by Aj6627:
Um... AFAIK, this will be an RTS, not a FPS.


http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif


Typically, RTS's cover weapon classes...

By that I mean rifle, smg, rocket launcher, etc...

what I rarely see, besides from the comprehensive ww2 games, are different models with any given class, for a given team. We know that each side will have their own model of assault rifle ( this is a clancy game, c'mon), but whether or not a side will have multiple assault rifles with different characteristics to load you guys out with, has yet to be determined...

It would be a nice feature if they incorporate some sort of range, accuracy, damage system for each model within each class. The same would go on for submachineguns, sniper rifles, rocket launchers, etc. For example, my ak47 would have a higher rate of damage and would be able to penetrate more structures and cover, than your m16 ( just an example based on current day weapons).

Then, weapons will have a huge impact on the game and people would want to know which ones would be in the game. That's what happens in the FPS world.

If this game takes another approach and just gives us units with generic weapons with the same range limitations, damage, and so forth, along with no choice when it comes to outfitting them with other firearms, well..that wouldn't be so revolutionary now would it

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

[PFCWarsaw]

thanks for the detailed reply, but all i want to know is, WHAT rifle each side will use (basicly, I want to make sure its not th XM8, which it seems to be, because the Army cancelled that weapon and it would be obsolete in 20 years anyway) and what classes you will use, such as soldier, marine, army ranger, etc.

[pettyofficerj]

ease up thurr space cowboy...dont be so sensitive

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

This is the future but I can...PRETTY much assure you...that the weapon the US Joint Strike Farce will be using...is.....

The M1 Garand, Semi Automatic, .30-06...

brand new and only dropped ONCE..

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

[atacms]

As GRAW 2 had the MULE and this is set further in the future than GRAW2, I'd like to see other aspects of the Future Combat System like the ARV(A) that basically the armed assault version of the MULE.

Here's a link:

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/data/assets/12822.pdf

[PFCWarsaw]

I would much rather use garands in this game than XM8's. If it takes place in the future, at least give the Infantry some sort of modified SCAR or something (which the special forces start using later this year).

[Inquisitor_Zeal]

Umm from looking at the EGM article, it looks like there is some kind of futuristic LMG or rifle and sadly to say something that looks like the XM8 but its really hard to tell... but who knows they could have redone the XM8 so its not the one that was scrapped, XM8 mk2...Also in the background in the 1st pic there is a guy with what looks to be a huge rocket launcher, there is a portible chaingun that a soldier is carrying. And there is a neat looking new Abrams like tank, a comanche by the looks of it and a osprey. Also it looks like the russians are still using Hind's for helos.

[PFCWarsaw]

I am hoping the screens of the Army with the XM8 are of a different army. It would be stupid for the US to use a version of a weapon we denied now, in the year 2007, in this game which takes place in the future.

[PFCWarsaw]

yeah I thought i saw an osprey as well which leads me to believe that marines will be used, but the infantry we have seen so far looks like the US Army's future force warrior.

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by PFCWarsaw:
yeah I thought i saw an osprey as well which leads me to believe that marines will be used, but the infantry we have seen so far looks like the US Army's future force warrior.
that doesn't mean it won't be the marines, if the army's future force warrior program works out what's to say that the marines won't use similar equipment in the future
as for the guns they use, it may just look like the guns you are thinking of, or the guns in the game may be a futuristic improved version

[atacms]

Originally posted by PFCWarsaw:
I am hoping the screens of the Army with the XM8 are of a different army. It would be stupid for the US to use a version of a weapon we denied now, in the year 2007, in this game which takes place in the future.

I have to agree with you, I think it is an M8.Guess you have to remember when they were developing this at the time, it may have looked like a sure thing that the M8 was going to go into production. For me, it makes more sense that they would use the XM-29 with airbursting grenades. That way, it's set far enough in the future that they would have worked out the kinks.

[PFCWarsaw]

It would be coolest if regular infantry had modified SCAR-L and Special Forces had some crazy new gun.

[SkyRaptorRUS]

Form the Trailer I can say that US will have
Comanche
ABRAMS
OSPREY
AA Similar from BF2
DPV buggy
new F-22 Raptor (from screens)


And for Russia I only a tank that I think is a BLACK EAGLE.

[zsorrell]

Originally posted by SkyRaptorRUS:
Form the Trailer I can say that US will have
Comanche
ABRAMS
OSPREY
AA Similar from BF2
DPV buggy
new F-22 Raptor (from screens)

I think it's actually an f-35 joint stike fighter since they are already about to drop the f-22 for that.


And for Russia I only a tank that I think is a BLACK EAGLE.

[atacms]

Originally posted by zsorrell:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SkyRaptorRUS:
Form the Trailer I can say that US will have
Comanche
ABRAMS
OSPREY
AA Similar from BF2
DPV buggy
new F-22 Raptor (from screens)

I think it's actually an f-35 joint stike fighter since they are already about to drop the f-22 for that.


And for Russia I only a tank that I think is a BLACK EAGLE. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where's your suggestion or comment?

[Greywolf109]

wel from what i ave seen in the video it seems that the russians are using the A-91 Groza(extremely good weapon)

[Victorc232]

id like to see marines in the game but the problem with that is if they put marines in, it would just be unfair for the other sides

[atacms]

For the US, we're working on drones and missile and vehicles that will begin to imitate nature. it's a new area the military is pushing called biomimicry.

It involves biology, nanotechnology in some cases and chemistry along with some other fields. The point is to develop systems and weapons that imitate nature as a way of leapfrogging advances by imitating/shortcutting millions of years of evolution.

Here are some examples:
morphing planes/drones
http://news.ufl.edu/wp-content/uf-news-post-images/web/169.jpg

http://news.ufl.edu/image/72/


ground robots that imitate geckos
http://nanoarchitecture.net/article/?c=biomimicry



http://nanoarchitecture.net/images/362.gif


etc etc

[pettyofficerj]

Originally posted by Victorc232:
id like to see marines in the game but the problem with that is if they put marines in, it would just be unfair for the other sides

says who?

you're implying that the other sides don't have equivalents to the "us" marines?

[dyeguy91]

No I think he means that the Marines are so bad *** that nobody would satnd a chance. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[UberGoose23]

nice one victor http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

But yeah the good old Corp. will probably be taking a back seat in this one. To be honest the Marines never really were important in any Tom Clancy game...http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif. I think the weapons will be similar to what GRAW, Splinter Cell saw being used. I am just very curious as to why two cancelled DoD projects (RAH-66 Comanche, XM8 Assault Rifle) are being used in the game... I have a feeling they are being left in the game for the sake it's the "Tom Clancy" universe and whatever looks cool and is semi-realistic is fair game to use. But I would like to see the AH-64 being put to play. But because someone who made Total War games is being in charge I think it will be very simple. Decent sized map, both sides know exactly where the other guy is, fight. I hope it will be more complicated though because as fun as Total War was it was usually numbers and unit level that won the games...

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by UberGoose23:
nice one victor http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I am just very curious as to why two cancelled DoD projects (RAH-66 Comanche, XM8 Assault Rifle) are being used in the game...
well even though the XM8 was canceled, H&K is continuing to developing it on it's own

[pettyofficerj]

Originally posted by UberGoose23:
nice one victor http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

But yeah the good old Corp. will probably be taking a back seat in this one. To be honest the Marines never really were important in any Tom Clancy game...http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif. I think the weapons will be similar to what GRAW, Splinter Cell saw being used. I am just very curious as to why two cancelled DoD projects (RAH-66 Comanche, XM8 Assault Rifle) are being used in the game... I have a feeling they are being left in the game for the sake it's the "Tom Clancy" universe and whatever looks cool and is semi-realistic is fair game to use. But I would like to see the AH-64 being put to play. But because someone who made Total War games is being in charge I think it will be very simple. Decent sized map, both sides know exactly where the other guy is, fight. I hope it will be more complicated though because as fun as Total War was it was usually numbers and unit level that won the games...

talk about misinformed...

for one..the camera will be primarily fixed on one of your units. When you change units, the camera moves accordingly. You are supposed to only be able to see what they see. So, in essence, you will not know where the enemy is. For all you know, they could be behind you, and for you to know, you would need to position one of your units so they are watching the six.

You will have a commander option which lets you zoom out and have a broader view, but you still won't know where the enemy is unless you actually see them with one of your units.

[dirrydude]

Originally posted by PFCWarsaw:
I am hoping the screens of the Army with the XM8 are of a different army. It would be stupid for the US to use a version of a weapon we denied now, in the year 2007, in this game which takes place in the future.

I'm not bashing your idea and I kinda sorta agree with you but lets not forget that the U.S. military denied the ar15 and m16 long before they accepted it as the new standerd issue weapon. So it's not unlikely that the U.S. could accualy accept the gun in the years around 2020. Just sayin you never know.

[snapkracklepop]

I would rather see the mr-c or the SCAR then the XM8.

[atacms]

Originally posted by snapkracklepop:
I would rather see the mr-c or the SCAR then the XM8.

I'd rather see the OICW with airbursting grenades. They had in in one of the Ghost Recon games when you played the Lone Wolf mode.

[atacms]

I'd like to see the PEP or PIKL. Usually known as the Pulsed Energy Projectile, it's a rheostatic weapon, in other words like the phasers in Star Trek, you can adjust its potency from stun to kill.

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/smallarms/Moore.pdf

http://www.atk.com/Customer_Solutions_MissionSystems/cs_ms_w_fp_pep.asp

http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/pep2.jpg

Alot of the cool stuff in directed energy is being develope by the US, unfortunately due to game balance issues, it seems like weapons like the Active Denial System and tactical lasers are being "given" to the Europeans for the sake of balancing the game. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif

[www.twhq.org]

I have to agree with you, I think it is an M8.Guess you have to remember when they were developing this at the time, it may have looked like a sure thing that the M8 was going to go into production. For me, it makes more sense that they would use the XM-29 with airbursting grenades. That way, it's set far enough in the future that they would have worked out the kinks.

The XM-29 was in the trailer.

And also you can see these soldiers (I believe they're American) are using a futuristic rifle that looks like a heavily updated and modified bersion of the M8.
http://xbox360media.ign.com/xbox360/image/article/790/790983/endwar-real-time-armageddon-20070522062920131.jpg

[MSG_Urban]

Just to get up to speed on things:

-no the russians were not using Grozas, although that was one of my first guesses. The Russian guns look like the lovechild of a chinese Type 95 and an Israeli Tavor.

-The XM-8 Project was cancelled in 2005, but HK continues tweeking with the design, since they own the rights to the internals (stolen right out of a G36 no less)

- Game Magazines and a developer interview claim that you'll be able to upgrade your units (and of those "500 upgrades", I'd have to imagine some would be scopes, under barrel attachments, or even a longer or shorter range standard rifle.)

-The Comanche Helicopter (featured in the trailer) was cancelled. It was designed as a Recon and Light Assault Helicopter, but the role of recon is being filled by UAVs and the Apache and Cobra are doing a good enough job of filling the attack role, so the project was cancelled.

- Ospreys are not only attached to the Marines. Every branch of service in the US is planning on buying them.

There. Now that I've caught up with the posts, heres some new input. Take a look at what the US will be using as their ingame superweapon since nukes are gone: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_bombardment

Also, the original poster asked what units will be available. From the looks of it, your platoons will have preset archetypes, such as Mechanized Infantry, Support Platoon, etc. but the make up of the platoon will be decided upon by the player, for instance I may put my mechanized platoon in Bradleys with some Abrams tanks as back up (as seen in the trailer) because of the increased armor protection and firepower, but you might favor making your mechanized platoons ride in humvees, sacrificing safety for speed.

[assassin2793]

what i am wondering is how they will encorporate all of the european weaponry.
As there are alot of different country's which use different kinds of weapons and veichles so are they just going to use a select few?

[Delta085]

there is nothing wrong with the the m8 with its ammo capacity of 35 rounds a clip, moderate range, and its adaptability are perfect for urban combat.

[snapkracklepop]

except for being 5.56, not very modular, and not all that much of a forward looking design. KNow what would be a good weapon for the U.S., the Magpul Masada.

[atacms]

http://www.technologyreview.com/files/11588/fly_robot_x220.jpg

A Harvard scientist with funding from DARPA has made a micro UAV the size of a fly that actually CAN fly.

This is a trend that has only accelerated with the ubiquitousness of drones in Iraq and Afghanistan. Hand held drones like the Raven and Dragon Eye have helped many soldiers avoid ambushes and to catch fleeing enemies.

It would be interesting to see these as an addition to the US ground units to recon inside buildings. There have even been papers to arm such small contraptions with either small explosives or a poison injection.

You can read more about this in Technology Review
http://www.technologyreview.com/Infotech/19068/

Regarding the arming of micro UAV's you can check out this paper:
http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/cst/csat29.pdf

Let me know what you guys think. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

[LordTenacious]

http://www.1up.com/do/slideshow?pager.offset=4&p=&g=&tr=&mt=0&cId=3158955
Nice action screenshot of US forces. Notice the man in far right side taking potshots from a balcony.

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by atacms:
Let me know what you guys think. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
There is one problem
http://www.kiz.com/campnet/html/supplies/sullivan/SWATTER2.gif
Other then that it sounds cool,
Look a fly...wait... that isn't a fly http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif the government is spying on me!

[atacms]

Originally posted by PrinceCaspian5:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by atacms:
Let me know what you guys think. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif
There is one problem
http://www.kiz.com/campnet/html/supplies/sullivan/SWATTER2.gif
Other then that it sounds cool,
Look a fly...wait... that isn't a fly http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif the government is spying on me! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Lol, http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gifI guess they'll have to build it with a destruct upon being swatted mode.

[TFCC]

I think it is an M8 they are using in the video and just like someone said even though it is scraped now, it might come back down the road upgraded and tweaked.

As well, they might just use the M8 as the standard issue gun, but will allow you to upgrade your men to a SCAR later that way you don't get the best weapons first or something (its just an idea).

As for decideing what European weapons to use I think they will proably end up basing most of it on the best of the French/English/German equipment, not to say other countires equipment won't be used, just that most of it will be based on "The Big Three", in a way.

[Delta085]

SCAR is maid for tacticle room clearing operations it is a formidable weopon but is very expensive to manufacture however like i said before the M8 has amazing adaptability example, lets say there is a small platoon of me made up of infantry, snipers, and support gunners each weapon has a diffrent type of ammunition

SAW:5.56 Belt(100 shells)
M4/M16:5.56 magazine(30 shells)
M21:20 cal. Magazine(10 shells)
all this ammo is heavy and must be organized which takes time however the M8 series rifles only use 1 type of ammuntion

M8 standard:5.56 AP mag(35 shells)
M8 support:5.56 AP mag(100 shells)
M8 sniper:5.56 AP mag(35 shells)

[TFCC]

I agree, I like the M8 alot, though in a screenshot I have set as my background, there is a US Infantry Unit in front of the screen and one of them is definatley (spelling) carrying the SCAR, so perhaps he is upgraded or he is special forces, or perhaps they will just use that gun.

[Delta085]

true it's also possible that the unit whith the SCARs are the GHOST team UBI soft said that they would be an elite ground unit in ENDWAR

[TFCC]

Its possible, but it seems as though the whole group of about 9 or 10 soldiers has SCARs perhaps I am mistaken, but either way I like the M8 and SCAR, the M8 was featured in the trailer and the SCAR in the screenshot, so which ever is fine by me.

[Delta085]

Originally posted by atacms:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zsorrell:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by SkyRaptorRUS:
Form the Trailer I can say that US will have
Comanche
ABRAMS
OSPREY
AA Similar from BF2
DPV buggy
new F-22 Raptor (from screens)

I think it's actually an f-35 joint stike fighter since they are already about to drop the f-22 for that.


And for Russia I only a tank that I think is a BLACK EAGLE. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

f-35 is the newest version of the raptor dude

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by Delta085:
f-35 is the newest version of the raptor dude
no, i don't think the f-35 has anything to do with the f-22

[Crimson96]

It does appear to be some other not yet developed aircraft in the trailer. Which is just plain wrong. The only fixed-wing combat aircraft available to US forces at that time should be, F-35, F-22, F-18E/F, E-18, and possibly the A-10. High altitude bombing is apparently no longer a viable option as part of the whole missile shield thingy.

Unless we start requisitioning a new type of aircraft tomorrow, there is no was anything else would be ready in time.

Armor is another problem, there appears to be some new kind of tank. Since we are only just now getting around to getting all the Abrams up to M1A2, we will be lucky to have them at the M1A2 SEP with the TUSK Urban assault package by 2020.

FCS wouldn't have been ready by 2020 even without Afghanistan, Iraq and Katrina. The fact is that in 2020 the US military won't look much different than it does today, cosmetically. The real difference will be in information gathering, deployability, and networked systems. Most of which simply bring the Army up to the point where you can move units by clicking and dragging, like in an RTS.

Increased UAV capabilities and number of platforms, everything from infantry platoons with their own UAV or UGV scouting on point, to the replacement of rotary-wing attack and scouting aircraft with UCAV's.

There could possibly a new artillery system, or just increased reliance on MLRS.

Fundamentally, the US Army will still be the Bradley-Abrams-UAV-Stryker-HMMWV-SF-11B fighting force you know and love. These systems will just work together even better.

Going down the list of unit types given by Ubi:
Rifleman - Infantry Platoon, Rangers, SF
Engineers - Engineer Platoon, Bridging Units, Combat Engineer Platoon
Transport - M2, M3, Stryker, HMMWV, 5ton, UH60, CH-47, V-22
Helicopter - RAH-70, AH-64D, UAVs galore
Artillery - Paladin, MLRS, M6, Avenger
Command Vehicles - M7 FiST, M4 C2V (both Bradley variants), Stryker Command Variant

[Delta085]

yaeh ur right it doesn't mi bad i did some research on it and found out i was wrong sry dude

[Crimson96]

By the way, since UBI made the mistake of showing infantry soldiers using miniguns, lets do the math: http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

GE XM214 Minigun in 5.56mm

1) It weighs in at 30lbs and produces 11kg of continuous recoil at only 1000rpm. A .50 caliber rifle produces 16kg of recoil per round. Problem solved, the soldiers apparently had some kind of "steady-cam" mount along with exoskeletal enhancements for the weight.

2) Miniguns require batteries to operate. With current technology you could fire about 1000 rounds before you need a battery change. The batteries require between 3-4 hours to recharge. Fortunately they only weigh around 7lbs for 1000 rounds.

3) Ammo weight - 35 lbs for 1000 rounds of 5.56mm. Not to mention that even if a soldier has some kind of exoskeletal weight reduction system, at this point the sheer volume of the ammunition becomes a concern.

For 2 seconds of weapons fire the total weight cost would be 114 lbs, and you would have to stop mid way through to change batteries. The poor machine gunner is a bullet magnet who can't crouch, go prone, or enter buildings because doorways won't fit his massive "ammo-battery-gun-gun mount-exoskeleton" assembly. For each addition 1 second and 1000 rounds to fire add 42 lbs of weight.

Save the miniguns for vehicles, aircraft, and movies.

[BTS_Thor_2]

What about the MRAP's! They are said to start to replace the HUMVEEs that are getting shot up. They will deffiantly be in full deployment by 2020.

Check them out they're already being deployed in Iraq today.

http://www.defense-update.com/products/c/cougar.htm

[Delta085]

hell yeah i was watching the military channel one day it said an I.E.D. barley did anything 2 it

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by Crimson96:
By the way, since UBI made the mistake of showing infantry soldiers using miniguns, lets do the math: http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

GE XM214 Minigun in 5.56mm


2) Miniguns require batteries to operate. With current technology you could fire about 1000 rounds before you need a battery change. The batteries require between 3-4 hours to recharge. Fortunately they only weigh around 7lbs for 1000 rounds.

3) Ammo weight - 35 lbs for 1000 rounds of 5.56mm. Not to mention that even if a soldier has some kind of exoskeletal weight reduction system, at this point the sheer volume of the ammunition becomes a concern.


you say that with current tech a battery is good for about 1000 rounds, but this is 2020, right now i have heard of battery cells that get up to 3-4 volts, so that is a lot better then the 1.5-1.6 you get with today's batteries
the solution for the ammo is simple, you just get a MULE to drive along behind you carrying ammo and extra batteries

[Crimson96]

Why not then simply mount the weapon on the MULE and have a soldier fire it via remote control? Wouldn't that be more effective, more accurate, and safer for the soldiers?

My point isn't that Miniguns have no use, its that they have no use for dismounted infantry soldiers. A MULE can't follow you in a building or up the stairs, and in many European cities it likely wouldn't even fit down the narrow alleyways soldiers would have to utilize.

The BUFFALO and COUGAR are great ideas and will save lives, but it was developed entirely due to threats encountered in combat zones that never existed in the EndWar story - where Iraq and Afghanistan never happened.

[Delphrea]

Originally posted by SkyRaptorRUS:
Form the Trailer I can say that US will have
Comanche
ABRAMS
OSPREY
AA Similar from BF2
DPV buggy
new F-22 Raptor (from screens)


And for Russia I only a tank that I think is a BLACK EAGLE.

FYI - The comanche was dropped from development when the US Military redid it's budget.

[PrinceCaspian5]

Originally posted by Delphrea:
FYI - The comanche was dropped from development when the US Military redid it's budget.
that has already been pointed out, but it is in the game

[Mattyg1493]

in the new trailer the us are using scars with acog scope and grenade launcher

[jdsteef]

is it just me but XM8's look like a g36c than anything else.

[The_Real_Azrael]

Originally posted by jdsteef:
is it just me but XM8's look like a g36c than anything else.

ummm..... somewhat, but the XM-8 has a much more "futuristic" look to it. Also somewhat more like a toy, or a Halo-assault rifle copy..... whereas the G36C tends to stick to the angular design function. It looks like the g36c in the same way that 1985 Mustang 5.0 looks like a 2005 BMW 325i

http://www.analogstereo.com/images/om/bmw_3.jpg
http://www.allfordmustangs.com/photopost/data/500/medium/Car_0011.jpg

They have some similarities, but not really.

Btw, thank you Mattyg1493 for using the search feature and posting your comment in the APPROPRIATE thread....as opposed to others who just start their own because they're lazy.