Separate Forums

[SODsniper]

Mr Hanky:
Until we get separate forums, we have to share.


I am not trying to sound snooty here (really, I'm not... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/halo.gif)

But why was the decision made to lump all Video Game players into one forum?? As anyone can see by the latest confusion regarding demos and map editors, it seems to just create more problems and more work for the moderators.

Is this type of arrangement permenant?? If not, when can we expect separate forums??

[Dr34dn4ught]

There's no reason to have different platform forums because there's no differences to discuss. All we need is a place to discuss the game. All people need to do is be a bit more specific in their posts instead of making the laziest effort they can.

[killer-thriller]

oooooooooooooooo very good

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by Dr34dn4ught:
There's no reason to have different platform forums because there's no differences to discuss.

And therein lies the biggest problem that UBI has with putting out a quality PC FPS game...

In their mind, there is "no differences" between a PC FPS game and a Console FPS game.

You hit the nail directly square on the head..

[Mr.Hanky2005]

SOD, until the game is released, the same game information will be coming out. The same announcements, screens, videos, ext. Therefore, we don't need a separate forum if all the same information is coming out.

You will likely see separate forums at release, or closer to the release, when different information about patches and such will be released.

Also, it actually makes it easier for the moderators because it is only one forum. Instead of having to hop from forum to forum, we are just looking at one for the time being. Not saying we couldn't handle more, but that is just how it is ATM. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Thanks
-Mr.Hanky


EDIT: I just saw in another thread that someone (I think you, Sniper) said that it just shows how far down PC fell on Ubi's priority list. I wouldn't say that is even close to a reason as to why there isn't separate forums yet. IMHO, I think there will be separate forums in the future.

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
SOD, until the game is released, the same game information will be coming out. The same announcements, screens, videos, ext. Therefore, we don't need a separate forum if all the same information is coming out.

You will likely see separate forums at release, or closer to the release, when different information about patches and such will be released.

Also, it actually makes it easier for the moderators because it is only one forum. Instead of having to hop from forum to forum, we are just looking at one for the time being. Not saying we couldn't handle more, but that is just how it is ATM. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Thanks
-Mr.Hanky


First, thanx for the direct response. VERY much appreciated..

Having one forum for all platforms is certainly new. And I can see how it might make things easier in the short term for moderators. But it still seems that moderators will be putting out fires that didn't have to be started.

But you do have a valid point, to be sure.


Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
EDIT: I just saw in another thread that someone (I think you, Sniper)

Most likely.. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif


Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
said that it just shows how far down PC fell on Ubi's priority list. I wouldn't say that is even close to a reason as to why there isn't separate forums yet.

IMHO, I think there will be separate forums in the future.

I would think there would HAVE to be.

No offense to anyone here, but I really don't want to have to wade thru dozens of posts asking why the A Button isn't mapped THIS way or the X Button is mapped that way..

I mean, if I wanted to read about XBOX 360 issues or PS3 issues, I would read the appropriate forums..

As I mentioned earlier, I can see your point about having only one forum to monitor... But it seems to me that UBI is creating the potential for a rumor and innuendo explosion by lumping everyone together..

EX:
UBI Posts that there will be a VEGAS 2 DEMO soon... PC FPS forums go ape sheet about the new VEGAS 2 PC Demo... Then come to find out it's only an XBOX 360 Demo...

You see my point???

As a long time Rainbow fan and level designer I can tell you....

The sooner platform-specific forums are created, the less headaches for UBI...


Just my 2 cents....

[NPGoalie4Life]

What does IMHO mean. I know that IMO means in my opinion. but I don't know IMHO.

[Mr.Hanky2005]

No offense to anyone here, but I really don't want to have to wade thru dozens of posts asking why the A Button isn't mapped THIS way or the X Button is mapped that way..

And I'm sure the console users wont want to hear about the PC side of things, just because it wouldn't make all that much sense. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It goes both ways of course, and that is why I think Ubi will make the separate forums. It is just common nature.

Also, judging by the fact that 360, PS3, and PC got their own forums for Vegas 1, that suggests that they will probably do the same for Vegas 2. Atleast definitely seperating PC from Console.

[Dr34dn4ught]

Originally posted by SODsniper:
No offense to anyone here, but I really don't want to have to wade thru dozens of posts asking why the A Button isn't mapped THIS way or the X Button is mapped that way..
Yeah, that would cause a lot of confusion.. but we don't even know that stuff yet. There is no problem right now. When the game is released (or maybe when the demo is), we will need seperate platform forums and will most likely get them.

[Mr.Hanky2005]

Originally posted by NPGoalie4Life:
What does IMHO mean. I know that IMO means in my opinion. but I don't know IMHO.

In My Humble Opinion. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NPGoalie4Life:
What does IMHO mean. I know that IMO means in my opinion. but I don't know IMHO.

In My Humble Opinion. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What probably threw 'im is that there ain't nuttin' about me that is "humble".. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">No offense to anyone here, but I really don't want to have to wade thru dozens of posts asking why the A Button isn't mapped THIS way or the X Button is mapped that way..

And I'm sure the console users wont want to hear about the PC side of things, just because it wouldn't make all that much sense. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif It goes both ways of course, and that is why I think Ubi will make the separate forums. It is just common nature.

Also, judging by the fact that 360, PS3, and PC got their own forums for Vegas 1, that suggests that they will probably do the same for Vegas 2. Atleast definitely seperating PC from Console. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree, completely...

My point was that, with all previous titles, there were separate forums right from the get go. That way, UBI could receive input for each specific platform from the users of said platform.

Which seems to make the most sense if UBI is using the forums to obtain marketplace input as to what the fans want.

On the other hand, if the die is cast and UBI is just using these forums for announcement purposes and is not taking any input/feedback on the upcoming title, then a single forum does make the most sense..

Regardless, thanx again for the input. It's much appreciated...

[Mr.Hanky2005]

Originally posted by SODsniper:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr.Hanky2005:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NPGoalie4Life:
What does IMHO mean. I know that IMO means in my opinion. but I don't know IMHO.

In My Humble Opinion. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What probably threw 'im is that there ain't nuttin' about me that is "humble".. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I wanted to edit it so it stated "In My Humble/Honest Opinion", but IE was being stupid http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif

[Perseus_AWC]

hey sniper,
sorry for the threadjack, but I heard your clan has been playing COD4
what do you guys think of it?

[SODsniper]

Well, speaking only for myself....

I like it, with some caveats...

It seems too "run and gun"... There is no strategy involved.. I just run around and shoot enemies (and some friendlies http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif) until I die...

Now, to be fair... I am a noob at it. I don't know the maps well enough to be tactical at it.. So, it's entirely possible that I will grow into it...

But, it just seems to me that have 30+ people who don't know each other from Adam, in a confined space with guns and grenades doesn't lend itself to tactical play..

I would like to Level Design for it, but the editor is wanky with VISTA (what kind of bonehead move was that!!!???) so I am not sure how that is going to pan out..

I'll be on the SOD COD4 server tonight, if ya wanna watch me get me arse kicked.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

[UbiRazz]

As the game is essentially the same on both platforms, we will not be creating seperate forums for different platforms. Any platform specific news or information will be clearly marked with the platform in mind.

Post-release this may change from a feedback point of view but you guys are sharing for now. Lets make sure that the atmosphere is welcoming for everyone regardless of their platform background, yeah?

[SODsniper]

Hi Razz! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Nice ta see ya...


UbiRazz:
As the game is essentially the same on both platforms

I have to be honest here and say that this really disturbs me.

The PC Platform and the Console Platform are vastly different in their operation and in the quirks & attitudes of the groups that use them.

To try and force each group into the peg-hole of the other is really a disservice to both platforms and game quality will suffer.

Was this a cost-cutting measure?? Or is there someone at UBI who honestly thinks that there is no difference between a PC Game Platform and an XBOX 360 Game Platform??

Contrary to appearances, I am not trying to be argumentative here. I am sincerely curious as to the thought process that went into this bonehe.... ahem... unfortunate decision..

Again, nice ta see ya... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[UbiRazz]

It may disturb you that the game is basically the same on all platforms but that's the reality of the situation and you'll have to accept that. With this in mind, we have one forum for the game of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 regardless of platform.

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
It may disturb you that the game is basically the same on all platforms but that's the reality of the situation and you'll have to accept that.


Well, I acknowledge it..

But I can never accept it..


Originally posted by UbiRazz:
With this in mind, we have one forum for the game of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 regardless of platform.

Yea, I got that. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Thanx...

[Perseus_AWC]

Originally posted by SODsniper:
Well, speaking only for myself....

I like it, with some caveats...

It seems too "run and gun"... There is no strategy involved.. I just run around and shoot enemies (and some friendlies http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif) until I die...

Now, to be fair... I am a noob at it. I don't know the maps well enough to be tactical at it.. So, it's entirely possible that I will grow into it...

But, it just seems to me that have 30+ people who don't know each other from Adam, in a confined space with guns and grenades doesn't lend itself to tactical play..

I would like to Level Design for it, but the editor is wanky with VISTA (what kind of bonehead move was that!!!???) so I am not sure how that is going to pan out..

I'll be on the SOD COD4 server tonight, if ya wanna watch me get me arse kicked.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Ok, last threadjack..
do you guys have your server in hard core mode?

[Want2Snipe]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
It may disturb you that the game is basically the same on all platforms but that's the reality of the situation and you'll have to accept that

Wow, a bit condescending don't you think? Way to talk to your customers.

Just so I can understand this, do you mean to tell us that graphics quality will be the same for both platforms? Or that it won't have options for 4 to 5 mouse buttons? Is that what "Basically the Same" means?

[UbiRazz]

What "basically the same" means is that it's basically the same in terms of gameplay experience. Clearly the PC version will have functionality which is needed to make it work on the PC (mouse support, different graphical settings, etc) but it's essentially the same game.

[xoops]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
It may disturb you that the game is basically the same on all platforms but that's the reality of the situation and you'll have to accept that.

Wrong! I don't have to accept that.

As a matter of fact, I didn't purchase a single Ubisoft game since March 2004 as a direct result that your crappy company truly despise and disrespect ALL gamers whatever the platform, but ESPECIALLY the PC gamers.

Fortunately for you, your target customer (the Halo twit) is a real... well... twit... that couldn't care less about being fed with games that insult intelligence AND that are both buggy and unfinished. On the other hand, you've lost all your customers with an IQ higher than the outdoor temperature in Alaska.

[UbiRazz]

If you've not purchased a Ubisoft game since 2004 and clearly have no interest in our current titles, why are you posting here? That doesn't make any sense to me.

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by Perseus_AWC:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SODsniper:
Well, speaking only for myself....

I like it, with some caveats...

It seems too "run and gun"... There is no strategy involved.. I just run around and shoot enemies (and some friendlies http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/bigtears.gif) until I die...

Now, to be fair... I am a noob at it. I don't know the maps well enough to be tactical at it.. So, it's entirely possible that I will grow into it...

But, it just seems to me that have 30+ people who don't know each other from Adam, in a confined space with guns and grenades doesn't lend itself to tactical play..

I would like to Level Design for it, but the editor is wanky with VISTA (what kind of bonehead move was that!!!???) so I am not sure how that is going to pan out..

I'll be on the SOD COD4 server tonight, if ya wanna watch me get me arse kicked.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Ok, last threadjack..
do you guys have your server in hard core mode? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Beats the hello outta me... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[xoops]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
If you've not purchased a Ubisoft game since 2004 and clearly have no interest in our current titles, why are you posting here? That doesn't make any sense to me.

It is for the same reason than GSG_9_RAGE who has never stopped to be a moderator in these forums in spite of the dumbing down of the series. We love the true Rainbow Six! But you can't understand that kind of concept since your employer seems to have brainwashed you into cold accounting and economics.

[UbiRazz]

I'm certainly not brainwashed but more astounded that you would sign up to a forum and spent three years of your life making several hundred posts about something you clearly dislike. As a person I really don't get that.

[xoops]

Many of my posts were related to discussions of the R6 Council, or were related to discussions with smart posters like KungFu_CIA, MD_Sennet, TedSmith or Hoak_ - people that were able to provide ideas to make the game progress forward. Unfortunately, those people are not here anymore for obvious reason. Occasionnaly, there are still people who provide interresting ideas in this forum, like Antipersonnel or SBS_Operator, just to give two examples. These guys do not talk about the Vegas or Vegas2 <span class="ev_code_RED">*Edit*</span>, they talk about real CT tactics and how they could be implemented in a good game. That is the only interresting thing you can find in a UBI forum. Seriously, all what is related to Vegas 2 or Halo III, I couldn't care less, but when I find an interresting discussion about tactics that will likely be implemented in true tactical shooters like Ground Branch, Rogue Warrior, Arma2 or OF2, then that's interresting.

By the way, I have to make my pre-order for GB and RW... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[SODsniper]

The effervescence and pervasive quality that is "hope" would be my guess.. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

The ever dimming (apparently) hope that one day, UBI will re-embrace the platform and the people that made it the powerhouse gaming phenom that it is today..

But what seems to be happening is that, more and more, the PC crowd is being forced out in favor of the get-rich quick, cookie cutter, mindless entertainment that passes for Video Games these days...

Surely you can see why the PC crowd would be... ahem.. less than enthusiastic about being forced out, no??

[XyZspineZyX]

xoops do not bypass the forum language filter. I am sure you can post your view without resorting to doing so in every post http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

@ SODsniper - the problem I see with what you say is it presumes the console player doesn't want or cannot play a tactical game. You would be quite wrong in that assumption, contrary to the long standing fallacy there really isn't a great deal of difference between pc and console gamer when it comes to intelligence and interests

[xoops]

Originally posted by ms-kleaneasy:
xoops do not bypass the forum language filter. I am sure you can post your view without resorting to doing so in every post http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif


I can't... I used to be a terrorist working for Irena Morales... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

[SODsniper]

Originally posted by ms-kleaneasy:
xoops do not bypass the forum language filter. I am sure you can post your view without resorting to doing so in every post http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

@ SODsniper - the problem I see with what you say is it presumes the console player doesn't want or cannot play a tactical game. You would be quite wrong in that assumption, contrary to the long standing fallacy there really isn't a great deal of difference between pc and console gamer when it comes to intelligence and interests

I would have to differ with you on that, but am amiable to be proven wrong. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

My only contention is that there is a HUGE difference in the mechanics and game play between a PC Game and a Console game. What will work on a Console will fall flat on a PC. I think that was proven with both Lockdown AND Vegas...

But it's UBI's decision to make..

[XyZspineZyX]

I understand that concern but if I'm to understand razz correctly where mechanics get in the way adjustments are made to cater to the system in question so they shouldnt be a problem http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[xoops]

Originally posted by ms-kleaneasy:
I understand that concern but if I'm to understand razz correctly where mechanics get in the way adjustments are made to cater to the system in question so they shouldnt be a problem http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Maybe I'm wrong but it's not what sniper was talking about.

It is not a matter of porting the game from console to PC by getting rid of the auto-aim because mouse and keyboards work better than gamepad.

It is a matter of designing the game so that it truly takes advantage of the capabilities of the platform. You can't have a deep planning interface on a console because the gamepad has a limited set of buttons and no mouse. On a PC, you can. You can't switch between multiple teams and characters because your gamepad has a limited set of buttons. On a PC, you can. You can't have 8 operatives and 35 tangos on a map because a console has only 512 MBs of RAM. On a PC, you can. On a PC, you can make a game with a 2 kilometers draw distance because the high resolution monitors and the pinpoint accuracy of the mouse allow your sniper character to put the reticule on the right pixel. On a console with a HDTV and an analog stick, you can't. On a PC, you can provide a map editor and a complete SDK (with a C++ IDE and all) because the mouse and keyboard allow for easy use of these ''complex'' tools. On a console, you can't.

Sniper is right. PC and consoles have very different hardware and input peripherals. The only way to make a quality game is to design games separately and optimally for each platform. Of course, we all know that quality is the last concern of Ubisoft; low development cost and quick buck is the one and only rule.

All these things have been explained countless times in these forums. Of course, you remember only what fits the points you want us to swallow and carefully forget the rest.

[Want2Snipe]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
What "basically the same" means is that it's basically the same in terms of gameplay experience. Clearly the PC version will have functionality which is needed to make it work on the PC (mouse support, different graphical settings, etc) but it's essentially the same game.

How can you say that and believe it at the same time? You can not be that naive or PC challenged. Now, if you are saying it so new gamers to PC get enticed by it, I will understand it but that is not true.

Read what Xoops just posted above and you'll see one of the few reasons why that is just NOT TRUE!!!

[SODsniper]

While I would have been a tad more polite about it (just a tad) that is, in essence, what I was meaning.

The last several releases by UBI (if I recall correctly) were console ports. Or at least, not PC Optimized. And (again, if I recall correctly) they were disasters..

You cannot, simply CAN NOT, make a good quality game if you design it for ALL PLATFORMS and then simply tweak it to become platform specific.

It's simply NOT possible to do..

I would have thought UBI learned this lesson already... MANY times over...

Now, of course, if UBI is designing VEGAS 2 SPECIFICALLY FOR the PC and then going to tweak it to be XBOX 360 or PS3 compatible, then forget everything I just said. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

[athenian]

Originally posted by SODsniper:
.....UBI is using the forums to obtain marketplace input as to what the fans want.


Wow that is funny.

Lockdown= console port = flop on PC AND consoles
Vegas = console port = flop on PC/successful on xbox 360
Ravenshield/Athena Sword = Made for PC = Successful on PC AND consoles
Rogue Spear = Made for PC = Succesful on PC (not sure about consoles)
Rainbow Six = Made for PC = Successful on PC (not sure about consoles)

Vegas 2 = console port = (Think about it) on PC, probably succesful on consoles.

[bigrexxx]

Originally posted by ms-kleaneasy:
@ SODsniper - the problem I see with what you say is it presumes the console player doesn't want or cannot play a tactical game. You would be quite wrong in that assumption, contrary to the long standing fallacy there really isn't a great deal of difference between pc and console gamer when it comes to intelligence and interests

Well, since Vegas isn't really a tactical game, it doesn't matter what PC and console gamers WANT, it only matters what UBI is willing to give them. Vegas, and other recent UBI games are being developed with casual gamers in mind, who just want to start up the game and start killing people, that is not tactical or very thought provoking, mind numbing fun for sure, but not something that will keep peoples interest like R6, RVS(R63) and OGR did and still do, on multiple platforms.

But the similarity in the game doesn't mean that only one forum is required, because we also use these forums to community troubleshoot, and like Sniper said, PC users don't want to search through thousands of console threads asking about rankings and Xbox live and all the other console specific features and problems, and console users don't want to filter though the countless threads asking "will my machine run Vegas2?" or "what graphics card should I buy?".
Even in separated forums, it doesn't take long for a post to get buried, and questions left unanswered.

The game may be the same, but the platforms are sooo different and so are the communities for each. PC gamers (at least the ones willing to dish out the money for the monster rigs required to run Vegas smoothly) are generally older (average of 35, and many serving or retired military) , with the occasional youngster, and the console is mainly youngsters (18-25) with the occasional old fogey, so the general types of posts are completely different, after all, I've read some threads in the Vegas 360 forum and some of them are so slang filled and nonsense like 3Leet3 and noobtube, and Pwned, it gives a headache just trying to figure out the purpose of the post. We still get those type of threads in the PC forums, but they are much rarer.

So basically, one forum is fine for now, but please consider creating platform specific ones after release, it will be seen as a out reach to the PC community, who have been feeling disenfranchised for a very long time.

[athenian]

Originally posted by UbiRazz:
I'm certainly not brainwashed but more astounded that you would sign up to a forum and spent three years of your life making several hundred posts about something you clearly dislike. As a person I really don't get that.

Because in 1998 a game called Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six was made by Red Storm Entertainment, a company founded by Tom Clancy. It revolutionized the first-person-shooter genre and gave validation to the tactical shooter sub-genre and continued to do so with the release of Rogue Spear + expansions in 1999 and Ravenshied + expansion(s) in 2003. Unfortunately in 2005 with the release of a made for console title called Lockdown, the once great series became nothing but a strait to dvd hollywood action b-movie. This same concept has since continued with Vegas and its expansion pack called Vegas 2. Alot of us "old school" R6 fans still frequent these forums with a glimmer of hope that UBI will make a true Rainbow Six game again. In short:

Rainbow Six and its sequels defined the tactical shooter genre, forcing players to focus more time and effort on stealth, teamwork, and tactics rather than on sheer firepower.

Is not true anymore. Rainbow Six is nothing but a traditional first person shooter like the 100's of other out there.

You asked and that's my answer.

[SODsniper]

My reasoning for this thread was two fold.

One point was that PC and CONSOLE gaming are different enough to warrant their own community..

However, my bigger point was that, to the best of my recollection (someone please correct me if I am wrong) this is the first time that UBI has lumped all platforms into one forum. Especially this close to an actual release date....

To me, this signals the beginning of the end of the PC market insofar as UBI is concerned.

Now, we are being told that, upon release, there will be separate forums created for the various platforms. I accept that and time will tell.

But, the simple fact that we are a little over a month away from release and we are still all lumped here in the one forum... That represents a new and heretofore unheard of procedure...

I can think of no other reason for UBI to do this, other than to prepare the community for the "ONE PLATFORM TO RULE THEM ALL" concept...

As I said, time will tell...

[DreamMarine]

I read an articel about the sales figures of consoles vs. PC a short time ago. Though this might be nothing new for many of you, that article pointed out that consoles are a rapidly growing market. As far as I can remember, PC is on top only in a few countries (germany for example) any more. But even there the PC is loosing.

This tendency holds true for many genres. Only MMO, simulators, strategy games and a few others are primarly developed for PC for obvious reasons. All other genres are dominated by console gamers now.


I love games where I have to think and learn a lot. This does not seem to hold true for console games. They are primarly designed for people who just want to jump into the action and have some great fun without to much complexity. Console games also get adapted to those weird input input devices.

I personally love games, which I can control by a good old mouse and the keyboard... and where I have to think and learn a lot. The more you have to think in a game, the more freedom you have to play it your very own way. The minute I don't have to think and to learn in a game anymore I get very bored. And I don't want boring games.

If I put it a little bit philosophical: Isn't whole life about learning? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif


It's a little bit like with automatic and manual transmission in cars. Automatic is for lazy people while manual transmission is just much more sexy and effective in terms of performance. And besides, I want to have the feeling, that I am in control - not my car. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

What the game industry is doing is basically this: Since there are a lot of lazy people out there, the car industry focuses on cars with automatic transmission. But since they don't want to loose the manual fraction either, they decided to find a compromise between both of them...

They put a stick into cars, which do it automatically anyway! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[EddieDeath]

If they make so little money out of the PC players then why not release an unsupported patch that opens up the game limits and restrictions.

UBI has got us by the balls with this game. Without the xbox I doubt vegas 2 would exist.

I am sure the developers want whats best for the game and would love to take it to a higher level for the pc players. Question is how can we foster their attention and interest? What incentive do Ubi have to loosen their grip over the game and its developers?